Capt/non-traditional applicant

[MoosePilot]

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I'm an Air Force C-17 Pilot/Capt that is trying to reapply as a non-traditional applicant to USUHS. I'm in the AMCAS submission process, waiting on my April MCAT retest results, and trying to build my application with volunteer work. I'm really worried about my "letter of permission to apply", given how my career field manning is, but I'm dedicated to trying anyway.

I know this is not a pre-med board, but I hope nobody minds if I say hi and ask if anybody has gone through a similar process or has good advice for a USUHS applicant.

Chris

 

[Spang]

Chris:

I was a Navy C-2/C12 pilot and got out 2 years ago to do civilian medical school on a 3 year HPSP. I got accepted to USUHS but decided to go civilian instead. Regret that a little, but anyhow....

I know that USUHS is BIG on MCAT scores. I went down to talk to them even before I interviewed and took along a Navy ROTC guy from Notre Dame. I had a 31 and he had gotten a 28 or 29 and they made a big deal to the effect that my score was so much better than his (?!?). I interviewed in the first group of people on the first day on interviews and got my acceptance back before I had even interviewed anywhere else. The rest of my application was not that impressive, average GPA, some volunteer work at a hospital etc. My point is no research experience or even a science BS, so I guess my military background and my MCAT are what got me in.

My advice is to talk to them and re-emphasize your desire to go there, maybe after you get your MCAT back. If it doesn't seem likely I would seriously consider getting out and doing the HPSP route. Depending on your financial and family situation, and where you go to school, the change is quality of life is not that bad.

Let me know if I can help in any way.

Spang

 

[Heeed!]

As a prior 15E WSO, I have experience in this area. The first thing I did was call my detailer in San Antonio and receive permission to be released if I was accepted into medical school. I did, however, need my supervisor to call and gently remind them of my situation, which was I could separate prior to taking another assignment in the Strike Eagle. If they didn't give me the "permission to apply" letter, I would end up going to med school as a civilian. If they did give me the letter, I would still serve in the AF. So, I was in the driver's seat. But either way, I wasn't going back to the jet and my supervisor worked w/ the detailer to help them come to that realization. I did, however, have a year of flying commitment left for my instructor upgrade which they tacked onto my payback as a doctor. But it worked out in the end.

Where are you with your commitment? If you have the option to go civilian, I'd take it. I interviewed at USUHS and didn't get accepted. But I'm glad I'm at a civilian school because I seriously doubt I'd be able to support my family of 5 on 2LT pay. I have a much better life as a civilian than I would at USUHS. Plus, the big doctor bonuses come when you sign multi-year contracts w/ the government after your commitment is up. That 7 year obligation from USUHS will put off the big bucks for a while.

In conclusion, I would seriously consider other options available to you if you can't get the permission letter. I wear scrubs everyday and had a goaT for a while. A four year civilian tour in the middle of a military career is actually pretty fun...! PM me if you want more info.

 

[flighterdoc]

As a prior 15E WSO, I have experience in this area. The first thing I did was call my detailer in San Antonio and receive permission to be released if I was accepted into medical school. I did, however, need my supervisor to call and gently remind them of my situation, which was I could separate prior to taking another assignment in the Strike Eagle. If they didn't give me the "permission to apply" letter, I would end up going to med school as a civilian. If they did give me the letter, I would still serve in the AF. So, I was in the driver's seat. But either way, I wasn't going back to the jet and my supervisor worked w/ the detailer to help them come to that realization. I did, however, have a year of flying commitment left for my instructor upgrade which they tacked onto my payback as a doctor. But it worked out in the end.

Where are you with your commitment? If you have the option to go civilian, I'd take it. I interviewed at USUHS and didn't get accepted. But I'm glad I'm at a civilian school because I seriously doubt I'd be able to support my family of 5 on 2LT pay. I have a much better life as a civilian than I would at USUHS. Plus, the big doctor bonuses come when you sign multi-year contracts w/ the government after your commitment is up. That 7 year obligation from USUHS will put off the big bucks for a while.

In conclusion, I would seriously consider other options available to you if you can't get the permission letter. I wear scrubs everyday and had a goaT for a while. A four year civilian tour in the middle of a military career is actually pretty fun...! PM me if you want more info.

You mean that service members (such as you) who are accepted into USUHS are demoted?

That just sucks.

What about prior service officers (say O3/O4) who go into the military for residency? They're busted back to O2?

Glad I'm too old for USUHS, if thats the case. I had a lot of fun as an O3, but I wouldn't want to be one again.

 

[Heeed!]

Back to the butter bar! I'll end up being a 2LT for a total of 6 years during my career. When I come back on active duty, though, I'll get 1/2 my total active duty time in grade. (8 years total = 4 year Captain). So, I'll be maxed out on the pay scale and will make Maj shortly thereafter.

I guess it's just the price that had to be paid to cross over into that promised neverland that is medicine....

 

[Heeed!]

You don't get "demoted" (technically) and this how prior service folks get into civilian HPSP. I had to give up my regular comission, separate from active duty, and the next day be sworn into the reserves as a 2LT.

I guess paying my tuition AND Captain's pay is just too steep of a price for a lowly med schooler. Apparently, though, I didn't work hard enough as a negotiator to get favorable terms for my HPSP scholarship per another thread on here! I didn't get ANY free gear!!!! Well, I still have my g-suit...does that count?

 

[flighterdoc]

You don't get "demoted" (technically) and this how prior service folks get into civilian HPSP. I had to give up my regular comission, separate from active duty, and the next day be sworn into the reserves as a 2LT.

I guess paying my tuition AND Captain's pay is just too steep of a price for a lowly med schooler. Apparently, though, I didn't work hard enough as a negotiator to get favorable terms for my HPSP scholarship per another thread on here! I didn't get ANY free gear!!!! Well, I still have my g-suit...does that count?

Hmm. I suppose a survival vest would be useful on rounds.....

 

[pilotdoc]

Moose Pilot-

I'm an Army UH-60/C-12 pilot with 9 years of active duty, and I will be attending USUHS this August. I also got an HPSP and was accepted to other schools. It was a no-brainer for me, my residency and obligation (7 years) will take me to retirement - HPSP would have had me going to a minimum of 16 years of AD, so I probably would have retired anyway. That said, getting paid and keeping medical benefits for my wife and daughter is great. I do take a demotion to 2LT, but it is alot better than 1100/month stipend with no benefits for my family. Also, the years in school will count for pay and retirement when I hit 20 years (at 20 years, you retire with 24 - another 10 percent). I was in your exact position last year, and my branch allowed my release (contingent upon acceptance) to USUHS/HPSP very easily - it was my biggest concern as well, but they must figure you're getting locked in for an even longer haul. If you owe any time for flight school, etc., they will just add it to your USUHS obligation - the service agreement you sign will specify the exact number of years, months, and days from previous obligations which you will pay back as a physician. It can be a very good deal for the military! Good luck.

 

[r90t]

Navy had you do a conditional letter of resignation, i.e. if I get accepted I want out, and if not, let me keep my job.

Heed, I think I have you beat...three time O-1, two time O-2, three time O-3 and a one time O-4.

I have so many different shoulder boards in my gear bag that it is becoming ridiculous.

I'm with heed, I was at the Naval Academy for 4 years+ 8 years active duty. Going to a civilian program was a nice break from the military. If you have a family, however, the pay and benefits for wife/kids are worth going to USUHS.

 

[MoosePilot]

Thanks for the responses. I've been dying to talk to other military guys that are doing this, because it's actually been somewhat difficult to get really firm details.

I have a 10/11/11 MCAT from '95, waiting for April 04 scores. My science gpa is low (3.0ish) and my overall gpa is 3.3ish. I shadowed a flight doc for a week during some leave and now I'm trying to volunteer at Madigan w/ Red Cross. I'm a C-17 instructor aircraft commander, so while my MCAT/gpa combo make me look lazy, I'm hoping they understand that my aircrew qual shows that I know hard work.

I definitely want to stick with USUHS. I'm gung-ho to be a military doc if they'll work with me enough for it to happen. Also my wife has some medical problems that make health insurance a must-have.

Unfortunately, my career field is so tight that getting my LOA looks as like every bit as big a hurdle as getting accepted. My comittment is done in Oct 2006, so I'm asking them to let me out of about a year and a half of it, understanding I'll pay it back as a doc. If they don't give me my LOA this year, I'm hoping next years app cycle, since I'll only have a few months left.

Anyone have a magic way to get personnel to let go? : )

Thanks again, let me hear what you all went through...

 

[Heeed!]

MoosePilot, I PMed you.

 

[BoneDriver]

All,

Looks like I found the right thread.

I'm an O-4 Bone Driver taking the MCAT in Aug '04 and am looking for the HPSP for a civilian med school in 'O5.

Anyone have intel on the timelines for late (not having taken the Apr '04 MCAT) applicants and the HPSP boards. In particular, my doc buds have said I may be wait-listed. I don't have SA on how being wait-listed works with regards to applying for a scholarship--any words? Does one have to have an acceptance to a school prior to applying?

Is there a separate application process for AF active duty members? Any words of wisdom?

Thanks!

 

[pilotdoc]

Bonedriver-

Call an HPSP recruiter now - they can do all the paperwork in advance (...and there is ALOT), just wait on your MCAT scores. Last year a 29 MCAT and 3.5 GPA got you an "automatic acceptance "(you still have to do the whole application, but unless something is bad, you are in - what this really means is that you can go to the board without already having an acceptance to a medical school - normally you have to have an acceptance before you can be boarded). With the Army at least, you want to be in the first round of applications. That will avoid the whole waitlist thing.

 

[Heeed!]

As an active duty B1 type, you need to talk w/ Sharon Restivo:

(800) 531-5800
[email protected]

She is your point of contact for everything. You don't deal w/ recruiters if you're active duty. You meet a different board than civilians applying for HPSP. You only compete against other AD folks not the HPSP pool at large. Yes, you need to be accepted to a med school prior to submitting your application to the AF. But you can have the paperwork filled out and ready to submit. There is alot of it. Also, pick out the schools you want to apply to, write your essays, etc., and send your application into AMCAS and/or AACOMAS. They'll send your file to the schools you select once your MCAT scores come back.

If you have any ?'s, PM me. I have a pretty good handle on the application process.

 

[BoneDriver]

PDoc and Heed,

Thanks for the gouge. I'll try Sharon on Monday and get my paperwork wired tight quickly.

I'm doing (STS) TX schools only and just happened to run into a pre-med this morning who is going to SW Texas who explained Texas reveals the match on 1 Feb to provide equal opportunity to all players (read: late applicants).

I partially completed the TX application process (short of the letters of recommendation and my personal essay) which included two painful hours of tediously typing in all my coursework (undergrad and grad) with associated grades. Was as much fun as stabbing a pencil in my eye... Am hoping the application dudes like my grad school grades better as my undergrad Mech Engr GPA is in the crapper (2.85). Will be counting on the "life experiences" aspect and however the MCAT goes for getting through the interview process.

For anyone else who follows this thread, I found this website this morning which may help: http://ci.afit.edu/cimj/default.asp

Of particular interest is the section with forms and regulations. They're as much fun to read as any reg but did provide some insight into how the HPSP stuff in being handled.

Thanks!

 

[Heeed!]

Are you only applying to Texas schools? No USUHS? Any DO schools?

 

[BoneDriver]

Heeed,

Just looking at Texas schools. I've in included the Ft Worth Osteopathic school in my list. Am very interested in San Antonio due to its proximity to Wilford Hall for a possible follow-on ER residency. Have also entertained the pilot/physician end but don't know if that's realistic at this point. The San Antonio billet will keep the fam in one place for several years. May even be able to serve out my remaining time to 20 without moving again. I'm too close to finishing the retirement to not stay and will readily admit, I love the Air Force. Hey, might even stay longer if "they" will give me a regular commission again to go beyond 20. But hey, if not, then CHA CHING!

Oh, as far as USUHS goes, the commitment is too long (7) and combined with my previous time in service (12 on entry) , I would have to take a civilian residency.

Cheers,

 

[Zappa]

Bonedriver (and other AF types),

Sharon Restivo no longer works in this department; I was on the phone looking for her on Friday. I ended up talking to a Ms. Geiger that seemed to know what's up... I only got her on the third call to that office after being refered to an AFI to read.

I, obviously, am currently active duty AF and am investigating hpsp vs. usuhs...Hopefully that will be a choice I get to make!!!

Good luck everyone!

 

[MoosePilot]

No more Sharon Restivo?! Oh, no, she was really good.

I hope the new lady is as good. Good luck everyone, be sure to check in with additional info as it comes available.