Caribbean

[sixty8]

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Has anyone considered going the Caribbean route to get on with their life sooner? As an (older) nontrad, I am all about the opportunity cost. I haven’t attempted an application cycle in the US (yet), but the thought of starting med school as soon as next year is appealing. At this point in my life, starting med school is more appealing than “losing” 2-3 years of my life trying to boost my stats (and still only getting a 50% or less chance at admission at that point).

I know that this route comes with huge risks, but hearing some success stories is making me feel optimistic. The biggest risk I fear is not matching. But, reapplying sounds like a viable option.

Am I crazy for considering this?

 

[M&L]

Have you taken Mcat yet ? Also , what is your gPA ? (I am trying to see how far you are from where you need to be).

 

[deleted480308]

Has anyone considered going the Caribbean route to get on with their life sooner? As an (older) nontrad, I am all about the opportunity cost. I haven’t attempted an application cycle in the US (yet), but the thought of starting med school as soon as next year is appealing. At this point in my life, starting med school is more appealing than “losing” 2-3 years of my life trying to boost my stats (and still only getting a 50% or less chance at admission at that point).

I know that this route comes with huge risks, but hearing some success stories is making me feel optimistic. The biggest risk I fear is not matching. But, reapplying sounds like a viable option.

Am I crazy for considering this?

If you understand risk? Yes this is a bad decision

 

[M&L]

If you understand risk? Yes this is a bad decision

Yeah especially now that step 1 will be pass fail - you can’t stand out the way that you could before .

 

[penpenclown]

At this point in my life, starting med school is more appealing than “losing” 2-3 years of my life trying to boost my stats (and still only getting a 50% or less chance at admission at that point).

Does that sound better or worse than 50% chance or less of getting into a residency when you're 200k+ in debt?

 

[Davidfromcali]

Terrible idea; with the addition of so may many new DO schools and increasing class sizes across US schools, we’ll see more and more US students in the match squeezing out IMG’s and FMG’s. Add a P/F step 1 to make things even harder.

It all makes for a risky and stressful experience that could leave you with nothing but 200k in debt. IMO, not worth it.

 

[deleted610572]

Put your mcat and gpa and we can give you GOOD advice on how to proceed. Also, what is older to you? How old are you?

 

[Dral]

Practicing physicians are generally a risk averse group. Start playing the part now.

 

[Goro]

Has anyone considered going the Caribbean route to get on with their life sooner? As an (older) nontrad, I am all about the opportunity cost. I haven’t attempted an application cycle in the US (yet), but the thought of starting med school as soon as next year is appealing. At this point in my life, starting med school is more appealing than “losing” 2-3 years of my life trying to boost my stats (and still only getting a 50% or less chance at admission at that point).

I know that this route comes with huge risks, but hearing some success stories is making me feel optimistic. The biggest risk I fear is not matching. But, reapplying sounds like a viable option.

Am I crazy for considering this?

Impulsive behavior is on the differential Dx list for residency Program directors as to why they don't like interviewing Carib graduates. I can just hear the Carib predators salivating at yet another desperate mark.

 

[sixty8]

Have you taken Mcat yet ? Also , what is your gPA ? (I am trying to see how far you are from where you need to be).

Put your mcat and gpa and we can give you GOOD advice on how to proceed. Also, what is older to you? How old are you?

513 + 3.6/3.7 - But, I believe my experiences are holding me back right now, very limited clinical experience. Average community service hours. And feel very cookie-cutter overall. Someone who is familiar with my state's med school told me I'd need at least two solid years before I apply and be competitive there.

To add to the above, by the time I think I'll be competitive (with more clinical exposure), my MCAT will have expired. Not looking forward to repeating the test...I am in my early 30s.

 

[sixty8]

Impulsive behavior is on the differential Dx list for residency Program directors as to why they don't like interviewing Carib graduates. I can just hear the Carib predators salivating at yet another desperate mark.

Interesting. It's the first time I'm hearing of this.

 

[Leahjoos]

Has anyone considered going the Caribbean route to get on with their life sooner? As an (older) nontrad, I am all about the opportunity cost. I haven’t attempted an application cycle in the US (yet), but the thought of starting med school as soon as next year is appealing. At this point in my life, starting med school is more appealing than “losing” 2-3 years of my life trying to boost my stats (and still only getting a 50% or less chance at admission at that point).

I know that this route comes with huge risks, but hearing some success stories is making me feel optimistic. The biggest risk I fear is not matching. But, reapplying sounds like a viable option.

Am I crazy for considering this?

I have but I’m also from the Caribbean so we are able to go into med or dental directly after highschool & my gov covers 60-80% of the tuition however it is very tough but I know many doctors & specialists that have graduated from those schools. It seems like it not a good option for American citizens though from reading these threads and the way they talk about them (costs, matching, stigmas etc)

 

[ThetisAntithesis]

513 + 3.6/3.7 - But, I believe my experiences are holding me back right now, very limited clinical experience. Average community service hours. And feel very cookie-cutter overall. Someone who is familiar with my state's med school told me I'd need at least two solid years before I apply and be competitive there.

To add to the above, by the time I think I'll be competitive (with more clinical exposure), my MCAT will have expired. Not looking forward to repeating the test...I am in my early 30s.

Just because "someone" said it, doesn't mean it applies to everyone or even you.
Have you actually applied and have been rejected?

Going the Caribbean route is taking the easy way out (in your particular situation I think - its a hard decision for some others) If you're going to be a physician, you're going to have to put in the work (whatever that may look like for you). If you've applied MD and DO for at least 3 cycles (or so I've heard), then and only then can you consider the Caribbean.

 

[LunaOri]

You have decent stats. What have you got to lose by applying at least once to MD/DO schools? Don't listen to "someone"; have a conversation with the admissions office at your state school. You can work on improving your application and apply MD/DO next year. The Caribbean isn't going anywhere, and the "big 3" have classes starting several times a year, so there is no rush to take that risky route.

 

[Mkif586]

513 + 3.6/3.7 - But, I believe my experiences are holding me back right now, very limited clinical experience. Average community service hours. And feel very cookie-cutter overall. Someone who is familiar with my state's med school told me I'd need at least two solid years before I apply and be competitive there.

To add to the above, by the time I think I'll be competitive (with more clinical exposure), my MCAT will have expired. Not looking forward to repeating the test...I am in my early 30s.

*jaw dropping sound*
you have excellent chances of getting into USMD let alone DO!!!

 

[sixty8]

Does that sound better or worse than 50% chance or less of getting into a residency when you're 200k+ in debt?

My thought when posting this was...by the time I'd be applying to US schools (in 2 years, given the circumstance I provided above), I'd be halfway, if not more, through med school in the Caribbean.

Match rates aren't nonexistent. From what I have read so far, 59% match rate for recent grads. Although, I understand that this could drastically decrease with recent USMLE changes. I suppose that if I don't get in the first time, I'd work harder to improve and reapply.

 

[sixty8]

Just because "someone" said it, doesn't mean it applies to everyone or even you.
Have you actually applied and have been rejected?

Going the Caribbean route is taking the easy way out (in your particular situation I think - its a hard decision for some others) If you're going to be a physician, you're going to have to put in the work (whatever that may look like for you). If you've applied MD and DO for at least 3 cycles (or so I've heard), then and only then can you consider the Caribbean.

Just to clarify that "someone," he is credible and is involved with admissions, though not part of the adm committee itself.

I disagree with the notion that Caribbean route is the easy way out. The truth is that I will need to work quite a bit harder than US med students to prove my worth. You already know it won't be "easy" when US residency program directors have the (unwarranted) perception that Goro mentioned above.

 

[sixty8]

So, where would y'all suggest apply with limited clinical experience? Adcoms in other threads balked at the idea of others applying with limited clinical exposure caused by COVID.

 

[Mkif586]

So, where would y'all suggest apply with limited clinical experience? Adcoms in other threads balked at the idea of others applying with limited clinical exposure caused by COVID.

Get clinical exp and apply in june

 

[deleted610572]

My thought when posting this was...by the time I'd be applying to US schools (in 2 years, given the circumstance I provided above), I'd be halfway, if not more, through med school in the Caribbean.

Match rates aren't nonexistent. From what I have read so far, 59% match rate for recent grads. Although, I understand that this could drastically decrease with recent USMLE changes. I suppose that if I don't get in the first time, I'd work harder to improve and reapply.

That’s 41% (if the numbers are 100% accurate, which they aren’t) that are >200k in debt with no way to pay that off. You will be a shoe in to many DO schools if you are adamant in starting now, just get clinical experience between now and the next cycle. You do have an USMD app if you take the time to do the extracurriculars

 

[M&L]

Look, if you are looking for someone here to tell you “sure, go to Caribbean “, it’s probably not gonna happen . We are giving you an honest perspective on what is happening . Btw my stats were way worse than yours , I improved my things (got more hours ), and got into 4 great MD schools . With YOUR stats I wouldn’t even consider Carib route at all .

 

[candbgirl]

513 + 3.6/3.7 - But, I believe my experiences are holding me back right now, very limited clinical experience. Average community service hours. And feel very cookie-cutter overall. Someone who is familiar with my state's med school told me I'd need at least two solid years before I apply and be competitive there.

To add to the above, by the time I think I'll be competitive (with more clinical exposure), my MCAT will have expired. Not looking forward to repeating the test...I am in my early 30s.

Over a year ago (2/19)you were employed as a CNA and seemed to have plans to do that for a year or more. What happened to that plan? How many hours did you accrue? Covid didn’t interfere with that timeline. With your stats you really should try at least one cycle of US applications. Plan to apply next June. That gives you at least 9 months more to build your application.

 

[sixty8]

Look, if you are looking for someone here to tell you “sure, go to Caribbean “, it’s probably not gonna happen . We are giving you an honest perspective on what is happening . Btw my stats were way worse than yours , I improved my things (got more hours ), and got into 4 great MD schools . With YOUR stats I wouldn’t even consider Carib route at all .

I'm not waiting for that response. Far from that, actually. Just responding to those that have chimed in. I started this thread to see if current nontrads shared the same thoughts.

 

[sixty8]

Over a year ago (2/19)you were employed as a CNA and seemed to have plans to do that for a year or more. What happened to that plan? How many hours did you accrue? Covid didn’t interfere with that timeline. With your stats you really should try at least one cycle of US applications. Plan to apply next June. That gives you at least 9 months more to build your application.

That plan did not go through as planned. A family member suffered a medical incident/emergency literally a few weeks after getting that job. I had to drop everything to move back home to assist (resulted in family member being disabled). The rest of the 2019 cycle was partially spent as an unpaid caregiver to the family member. (Does this count toward my application?) The other half of my time, I worked in retail overnight stocking shelves.

Due to my current living situation (I don't want to put my current housemates at risk), the soonest I'd be able to get clinical experience would be in January when I move out. Realistically, it'd be closer to 4-5 months. Is this enough for the 2021 app cycle?

 

[gyngyn]

It's the first time I'm hearing of this.

...and yet it is true.
The rest of the DDx is also pretty off-putting.
Do what is needed to put together a strong US application. It will pay off.

 

[mspeedwagon]

Yes, you are completely crazy for considering it. I have a few friends that went the Caribbean route (SGU mostly). They would have killed to go to U.S. MD program. They talk about 25% of people from their class vanishing after the first semester and the life on the island being expensive and awful compared to the U.S. Things like reliable internet and electricity can't be taken for granted. There are nice beaches but that they aren't able to take advantage of because of the need to study.

I also know people that failed out of Caribbean med schools (honestly, just go on YouTube and type "failed out of Caribbean med school"). Thankfully, more and more of these students are posting videos about their dismissal and this gives you a more complete picture. $100k-$200k with no degree with only classes completed in Caribbean is not going to get you far.

Based on your stats, you have a shot at a U.S. M.D. program. Start on the shadowing, volunteering, getting solid recs etc. DO NOT consider the Caribbean at all unless you have been rejected from M.D. schools at least for two cycles and D.O. schools once.

To give you some idea:
- My girlfriend went to a U.S. M.D. state school. Only ONE person did not make it to graduation in four years out of her entire class. More than 99% of her classmates graduated in four years. There were lots of matches into extremely competitive specialties. My girlfriend matched general surgery although, given her grades and board scores, could have gone into derm and probably would if she could do it again.
- I went to a D.O. school. There were about 5 of us, including me, that either left or were dismissed. Another quarter of my class did not graduate in four years (but did graduate in 5 or 6 years). So the percentage that completed within four years of my entering class was about 75%. Most of the matches were IM/FM with an occasional competitive match.
- A close friend of mine who went to SGU said that after the first semester 25% of his class vanished. Then after second year another 25% (you have to pass a mock USMLE exam to sit for the real thing). And, by graduation, about 50% of the people were there. He made it but it was an uphill journey with very little support. Seeing people dropout and fail out left and right is demoralizing. This was at the "best" Caribbean school. Now, given his stats, he had no shot at a U.S. program whatsoever. He's grateful to SGU for the chance. But, he had already applied for two cycles to U.S. schools and on his third try went to the Caribbean.

In all likelihood, you are going to be over $200k in debt. So do you want a 99% chance of graduating in four years (U.S. M.D.) or less than a 50% chance for the exact same amount of money. That's not even factoring how many doors you will close by going to the Caribbean. It is meant to be a last resort. Spend the year improving your app and get into a U.S. program.

Am I crazy for considering this?

 

[sm1760]

Has anyone considered going the Caribbean route to get on with their life sooner? As an (older) nontrad, I am all about the opportunity cost. I haven’t attempted an application cycle in the US (yet), but the thought of starting med school as soon as next year is appealing. At this point in my life, starting med school is more appealing than “losing” 2-3 years of my life trying to boost my stats (and still only getting a 50% or less chance at admission at that point).

I know that this route comes with huge risks, but hearing some success stories is making me feel optimistic. The biggest risk I fear is not matching. But, reapplying sounds like a viable option.

Am I crazy for considering this?

Has anyone considered going the Caribbean route to get on with their life sooner? As an (older) nontrad, I am all about the opportunity cost. I haven’t attempted an application cycle in the US (yet), but the thought of starting med school as soon as next year is appealing. At this point in my life, starting med school is more appealing than “losing” 2-3 years of my life trying to boost my stats (and still only getting a 50% or less chance at admission at that point).

I know that this route comes with huge risks, but hearing some success stories is making me feel optimistic. The biggest risk I fear is not matching. But, reapplying sounds like a viable option.

Am I crazy for considering this?

I would suggest you do what is best for you and your family. I am an older nontrad also and generally will hear from much younger people on what is best for me and my family. I would say do your research and check sites like the nrmp.org they have Main Residency Match data that might shed more light on your probability to getting into a residency. One thing I initially did when I started my research is when people said the match rate of a given Caribbean school is 50% I believed them even though they have no data to back up those claims. The data for IMG's will include all international medical school students from all international medical schools and do not give numbers on specific schools. Lastly, when you dive into the data make sure you check the specialty you are looking for and the match rates based on the stats of those IMG's in that specialty. Once I did that the match rate is much higher that 50% for IMG's that performed moderately well or better. I learned to tune out baseless negativity and focused on the data and weighed my options and I suggest you do the same.

 

[mspeedwagon]

The numbers are not baseless. It's actually really easy to find out the exact match rate for the Caribbean med school. Take this document: https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/upl...tional-Medical-Graduates-Revised.PDF-File.pdf. Go to Pg. 28. Look at Grenada for U.S. IMGs. That is the actual match rate for SGU since it is the only med school on Grenada. I picked a random year. 534 matched and 258 did not match. That is of the people that made it to apply to match and did not drop out or get dismissed before that. So the number of 50% of people make it that SGU grads quote to me seems extremely accurate.

I would suggest you do what is best for you and your family. I am an older nontrad also and generally will hear from much younger people on what is best for me and my family. I would say do your research and check sites like the nrmp.org they have Main Residency Match data that might shed more light on your probability to getting into a residency. One thing I initially did when I started my research is when people said the match rate of a given Caribbean school is 50% I believed them even though they have no data to back up those claims. The data for IMG's will include all international medical school students from all international medical schools and do not give numbers on specific schools. Lastly, when you dive into the data make sure you check the specialty you are looking for and the match rates based on the stats of those IMG's in that specialty. Once I did that the match rate is much higher that 50% for IMG's that performed moderately well or better. I learned to tune out baseless negativity and focused on the data and weighed my options and I suggest you do the same.

 

[GreenDuck12]

I'm not waiting for that response. Far from that, actually. Just responding to those that have chimed in. I started this thread to see if current nontrads shared the same thoughts.

For nontrads, like you and I, being conservative is a more appropriate response. While going to a Caribbean program to start earlier may seem conservative by saving time and income potential, but the fact that there is even a question mark about whether you make it to graduation and residency with a $300k price tag makes it a reckless choice. At your age, and that debt level, you would not get out from under it. Best case scenario is 20 years of IBR while your principal snowballs leaving you with a massive tax bill when your loans are forgiven.

Im 30 and in my first year at a public MD program. There is a good group of us that are 30s-40s. My .02 is take the time to get into a program that leaves you with a 95%+ chance of being a physician.

As an aside, you could likely apply DO and be just fine.

 

[sm1760]

The numbers are not baseless. It's actually really easy to find out the exact match rate for the Caribbean med school. Take this document: https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/upl...tional-Medical-Graduates-Revised.PDF-File.pdf. Go to Pg. 28. Look at Grenada for U.S. IMGs. That is the actual match rate for SGU since it is the only med school on Grenada. I picked a random year. 534 matched and 258 did not match. That is of the people that made it to apply to match and did not drop out or get dismissed before that. So the number of 50% of people make it that SGU grads quote to me seems extremely accurate.

Again I mentioned performance of the IMG in my previous post. If you look at the same document and check individual match rates based on performance during medical school in a specialty like internal medicine. You will see a much larger number of students got matched that performed well on the Step 2. I omit step 1 since this will become pass/fail soon. If a person struggles to do well in science classes in undergrad then they may not perform well in a Caribbean school, so I do agree on things like that. When I refer to baseless I am not speaking on facts, I am talking about experiences from people that never went to a Caribbean med school but precede to say its a bad idea for various reasons. I will always say going to Caribbean or American depends on a persons personal aptitude and life experiences especially for a non-trad. We generally have many more factors to think about when choosing a medical school than a traditional (younger) student.

 

[GreenDuck12]

Once I did that the match rate is much higher that 50% for IMG's that performed moderately well or better. I learned to tune out baseless negativity and focused on the data and weighed my options and I suggest you do the same

Bruh, your argument that gambling 300k in loans, which cannot be discharged, is baseless negativity because you found a match rate above 50% is... I’m not sure I know what the word(s) would be for that. Let’s assume for a second that there isn’t any attrition during the program and 534 matched to *true residency slots and not transitional year programs* and 258 did not. That is still only a 68% match rate as a high water mark. That’s not great.

 

[sm1760]

Bruh, your argument that gambling 300k in loans, which cannot be discharged, is baseless negativity because you found a match rate above 50% is... I’m not sure I know what the word(s) would be for that. Let’s assume for a second that there isn’t any attrition during the program and 534 matched to *true residency slots and not transitional year programs* and 258 did not. That is still only a 68% match rate as a high water mark. That’s not great.

So I keep referring to performance but for some reason the responses gloss over that and are focused on total student body. Check match rates based on performance and let me know what you find. Also it is pretty well known if you do well in a Caribbean school you have a good chance of getting matched and if you do not then you most likely won't which is backed by stats. I am not contesting that. Again I am talking about performance not total student body so please do not respond with another comment regarding total student body which includes students that did not do well.

 

[GreenDuck12]

So I keep referring to performance but for some reason the responses gloss over that and are focused on total student body. Check match rates based on performance and let me know what you find. Also it is pretty well known if you do well in a Caribbean school you have a good chance of getting matched and if you do not then you most likely won't which is backed by stats. I am not contesting that. Again I am talking about performance not total student body so please do not respond with another comment regarding total student body which includes students that did not do well.

This reminds me of something one of our admins told us during our first week of classes. He said “it is guaranteed that 50% of you will be in the bottom half of your class but 90% of you believe that you won’t be one of them.” This same concept seems to apply here as well... Something like “32% of you who make it to graduation won’t match but x% believed that won’t be you.”

 

[sm1760]

This reminds me of something one of our admins told us during our first week of classes. He said “it is guaranteed that 50% of you will be in the bottom half of your class but 90% of you believe that you won’t be one of them.” This same concept seems to apply here as well... Something like “32% of you who make it to graduation won’t match but x% believed that won’t be you.”

I totally agree. Self awareness is very important in life as well as choosing a medical school. Gotta be realistic about your abilities and make decisions accordingly.

 

[mspeedwagon]

Ok that makes more sense. I thought you were saying the warnings were baseless. The warnings I got to not go to the Caribbean were from SGU grads. Based on the stats the OP posted with a year of building his application he can get into a U.S. M.D. program with over a 99% chance of being successful and to match into whatever he likes. I think we can both agree that the odds from a Caribbean school will be lower than that. Each person has their own risk tolerance, but if I was out $200k+ growing at 6-8% per year with no degree and no immediate way to pay it back I likely would likely be suicidal and if an extra year assured greater than a 99% chance to not be in that situation, I would jump at it. But, some people like to take the path with more risk.

Again I mentioned performance of the IMG in my previous post. If you look at the same document and check individual match rates based on performance during medical school in a specialty like internal medicine. You will see a much larger number of students got matched that performed well on the Step 2. I omit step 1 since this will become pass/fail soon. If a person struggles to do well in science classes in undergrad then they may not perform well in a Caribbean school, so I do agree on things like that. When I refer to baseless I am not speaking on facts, I am talking about experiences from people that never went to a Caribbean med school but precede to say its a bad idea for various reasons. I will always say going to Caribbean or American depends on a persons personal aptitude and life experiences especially for a non-trad. We generally have many more factors to think about when choosing a medical school than a traditional (younger) student.

 

[Medisaint]

The biggest risk I fear is not matching

There's you answer right there. Not matching to residency is Sooooo much worse than never getting into medical school at all.

Look at it from a worst case scenario perspective. Would you rather do retail now for the next 2 years while trying to get into medical school or that same **** job 4 years from now while trying to reapply to residency?--only now with 300K in debt + growing interest. I mean would you buy an airplane ticket if the landing was not guaranteed upfront? Sir, we'll see how good you are as a passenger and then determine if you're eligible to land.

The key thing to remember is that the term "unmatched doctor" is an oxymoron. Take this from a US IMG who didn't match the first time around. Without a residency you can't work as a doctor and your fancy diploma and the "MD" next to your name mean nothing except that you are an older and poorer version of your pre-med self. The key is finding the best path into a residency and that, as you can see from a wide variety of data and personal stories, is not likely to be though the Caribbean. This is especially important if you are an older applicant. You don't have your 20's as a buffer to recover from mistakes and you may also have other priorities in life like starting a family. If medicine isn't going to work out you'll want to know ASAP and as cheaply as possible.

As several people above have said, a DO school would be a perfect fit for you.

If you decide to drop the Caribbean plan you're welcome to start a separate thread on how to beef up your US application.

 

[deleted480308]

Just to clarify that "someone," he is credible and is involved with admissions, though not part of the adm committee itself.

I disagree with the notion that Caribbean route is the easy way out. The truth is that I will need to work quite a bit harder than US med students to prove my worth. You already know it won't be "easy" when US residency program directors have the (unwarranted) perception that Goro mentioned above.

It’s not unwarranted. A us citizen going carribean is risky decision making and would make me question your judgement if you applied at my residency

 

[Faha]

513 + 3.6/3.7 - But, I believe my experiences are holding me back right now, very limited clinical experience. Average community service hours. And feel very cookie-cutter overall. Someone who is familiar with my state's med school told me I'd need at least two solid years before I apply and be competitive there.

To add to the above, by the time I think I'll be competitive (with more clinical exposure), my MCAT will have expired. Not looking forward to repeating the test...I am in my early 30s.

Your stats are competitive for all DO schools. Have you considered applying to DO schools in the next month ? What are you clinical employment or volunteering hours ?

 

[deleted610572]

The problem is with a 50% chance it’s not much different than taking 300k and throwing it down on black in Vegas. If you have high performing student that’ll increase your odds But to what extent. If it’s not >90% I wouldn’t take those odds. High scoring will increase your odds to scrape through to a program that DOs will match being much less competitive (the vast majority of the time. There will be those rare university programs in certain specialities that would rather have a Carib grad than DO). That’s the issue there. Your app is USMD quality aside from extracurriculars that will launch you into unlimited specialty options. 4-5 months is absolutely enough time to gain enough clinical experience to apply to DO and be successful. If you can go without a job and try to pump out research and volunteer (medical and non-medical) then it can be doable to create a USMD application extracurriculars wise. Your numbers are strong enough that imo as long as you amass enough clinical hours to demonstrate you know what you are getting yourself into then you will be success for DO.

 

[deleted610572]

Your stats are competitive for all DO schools. Have you considered applying to DO schools in the next month ? What are you clinical employment or volunteering hours ?

And then like this you could potentially apply to DO this cycle if you have some kind of clinical hours. The DO cycle goes longer and you don’t have a late application until December. Granted it would be rough to scramble to throw LoR and an app together. It would be easiest for us to give recommendations if you laid out your extracurriculars hours wise us

 

[Goro]

That plan did not go through as planned. A family member suffered a medical incident/emergency literally a few weeks after getting that job. I had to drop everything to move back home to assist (resulted in family member being disabled). The rest of the 2019 cycle was partially spent as an unpaid caregiver to the family member. (Does this count toward my application?) The other half of my time, I worked in retail overnight stocking shelves.

Due to my current living situation (I don't want to put my current housemates at risk), the soonest I'd be able to get clinical experience would be in January when I move out.

While I disagree with them, according to the AAMC, it actually might.

Realistically, it'd be closer to 4-5 months. Is this enough for the 2021 app cycle?
Yes.

 

[El-Rami]

I echo the idea that you should just apply to MD and DO schools and avoid the Caribbean. Your GPA is competitive for MD, and your MCAT is above the matriculating average for MD. Lack of clinical experience can be fixed, just go get some clinical experience. Apply to some scribe jobs. Depending on where you live, I would just go out and get the experience.

You can't get in if you don't apply. There is some leeway being given to applicants due to the pandemic in terms of extra-curriculars. I do not mean that in an absolute sense but more of a relative sense. I would say forget the pandemic and just get the experience so you can be more competitive. Schools aren't necessarily forgiving about this.

Based on your stats, you would be highly competitive for DO since the top osteopathic schools have MCATs in the range of 506-507. It is always good to be above-average!

 

[OSU-COMbound]

You can apply NOW to DO schools with your stats for fall 2021 admission. I applied quite late in the cycle (October 2019) and I started school in August. You certainly don't need to wait two or three years to apply, no matter what someone told you.

 

[ForeverDad]

I totally agree. Self awareness is very important in life as well as choosing a medical school. Gotta be realistic about your abilities and make decisions accordingly.

Can you please clarify?

 

[treezie85]

According to 2020 NRPM data, residency match rate is 30% lower for Caribbean schools than US schools. And with the merger of DO/MD residency programs, doesn't look like that number will go up.

 

[El-Rami]

You shouldn't ask about the Caribbean on SDN. You are just asking to get flamed/trolled. That said, don't go unless you have no other choice. Ignore people that claim you don't deserve a residency offer because you went to SGU ("You made a poor choice!" Sometimes people have no other options, so a "poor choice" might be the only choice). Obviously, you can get a residency in the US if you go to SGU or Ross, but it makes things a lot harder than they would otherwise be if you just went to a US school.

With that said, I can understand why people choose to go to these places. Someone from a low SES family might have no other options because everything in the med school admissions process requires $$$. So I won't judge you, for what it's worth.

I have a friend who went to SGU and is taking a gap year because of board scores (you have to score about 20 points higher than American students). The horror stories are real. I also know another SGU student who can recall every single sentence from First Aid. He scored 260 on Step 1. Do you think you could be that guy? Who knows? Not likely, though.

 

[sm1760]

Can you please clarify?

I was referring to a student being aware of their ability to excel in science heavy courses. This can be may be easy to gauge based on the their performance during undergrad or any programs after. Since based on the most recent data from nrmp.org, going Caribbean will require you to be above average through every major step test to have a real shot a residency. An example is for IMG interested in internal medicine had about an 80%+ match rate that scored 231 or above on the step 2 CK exam. So if a student did not do well in science courses nor properly learned to study then Caribbean may not work out as well. Not saying they wont do well, they just may have a harder time.

 

[deleted480308]

You shouldn't ask about the Caribbean on SDN. You are just asking to get flamed/trolled. That said, don't go unless you have no other choice. Ignore people that claim you don't deserve a residency offer because you went to SGU ("You made a poor choice!" Sometimes people have no other options, so a "poor choice" might be the only choice). Obviously, you can get a residency in the US if you go to SGU or Ross, but it makes things a lot harder than they would otherwise be if you just went to a US school.

With that said, I can understand why people choose to go to these places. Someone from a low SES family might have no other options because everything in the med school admissions process requires $$$. So I won't judge you, for what it's worth.

I have a friend who went to SGU and is taking a gap year because of board scores (you have to score about 20 points higher than American students). The horror stories are real. I also know another SGU student who can recall every single sentence from First Aid. He scored 260 on Step 1. Do you think you could be that guy? Who knows? Not likely, though.

Not true, I was broke.

 

[EM hope]

I have close friends who made it through the Caribbean schools (matching gen surg, IM, anesthesiology). If I had to choose between taking X years to strengthen app vs start in the Caribbean right away, knowing it worked out for them, I might’ve picked the Caribbean.
You have to know yourself and honestly evaluate why you’re in this situation and whether it’s right for you. The attrition rate is high for reason—many underestimate what it takes.

 

[GreenDuck12]

The attrition rate is high for reason—many underestimate what it takes.

The attrition rate is high because thats the business model of Caribbean for profit medical schools: accept under qualified applicants by preying on their hopes, and charge a significant premium relative to US MD/DO programs, fully knowing that the curriculum won’t get many/most of them to graduation and residency (but that’s cool since the school and shareholders make money). Then, instead of investing said money in addressing the inadequacies of the curriculum, the schools rebrand poor outcome numbers to show the grit and determination of some students as a selling point to program directors and use that to recruit more students. Seriously, Caribbean for profit schools are super abusive entities that should not operate with such poor outcomes.