CCOM vs NSU-COM vs KCUMB

[JimmyB123]

Ugh, sorry for making another one of these threads. I just need some help deciding among these schools. This is my brief opinion of the schools:

KCUMB: This school is the lowest cost wise, which is great. Also probably the strongest pre-clinical years curriculum. But I'm really not a big fan of living in Missouri. Clinical rotations are, I believe, not as strong as NSU or CCOM. I liked the school but I think CCOM or NSU would be better bets.

CCOM: The clinical rotations seem the strongest here out of the three schools I'm comparing. Being able to rotate at Cook County, Advocate Christ, Advocate Lutheran, etc. is an amazing opportunity. But what I really dislike is the fact that there are no lecture recordings during pre clinical years. Huge turn off!

NSUCOM: Location, location, location. Curriculum wise I think it is weaker than CCOM or KCUMB, but the strength of curriculum of pre clinical years is not really important for me - but recorded lectures are important, which this school has! Also, clinical rotations are quite good too. You get to rotate at Broward Health, Florida Hospital Orlando, and hospitals in the Miami-Dade area.


Currently, I think my decision will be between CCOM and NSUCOM (if anyone has opinion on KCUMB to spice up the matter, be my guest). For a while I thought, "Wow, CCOM clearly has superior clinical rotations!" But I don't know anymore. I've been using USNews to figure out the strength of the hospitals/rotation sites, but I realized that it's not always an accurate measure. For example, I live in a city that houses Hospital X and Hospital Y. Hospital X is a big name academic hospital. Hospital Y is a large, trauma-heavy inner city hospital. I've spoken to medical students that have done rotations at both hospitals and I've gotten the impression that Hospital Y has been a more exciting, educational experience for them. Now if you go to USNews and look these hospitals up, Hospital X has some nice rankings while Hospital Y is unranked. So that's why its difficult to really compare the hospital/rotation sites between CCOM and NSUCOM because unless you're actually from the area (which I'm not), it's hard to get a gauge on the real strength of these clinical sites.

So yeah, I'm pretty torn between CCOM and NSUCOM as you can tell from my long rant. Please help me decide!

And oh yeah, COA between CCOM and NSUCOM is the same.

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[AlteredScale]

I choose CCOM because I think there's more research opportunities there no?

 

[JimmyB123]

I choose CCOM because I think there's more research opportunities there no?

Hm, good point. Theres also a research elective you can do at CCOM. Not sure if the schools has "more" research opportunities than KCUMB or Nova, but then again, you're also in chicago where you are surrounded by a plethora of medical institutions that are also conducting research.

 

[Bokeh]

Cost and no recorded lectures at CCOM. No thanks.

 

[JimmyB123]

Cost and no recorded lectures at CCOM. No thanks.

Yeah, well cost-wise NSU-COM will be similar unfortunately. But the absence of recorded lectures is definitely a bummer...does anyone know if this is changing at all in the future at CCOM?

 

[Bokeh]

CCOM has no plans as of yet as far as I know. NSU all the way.

 

[AlteredScale]

Hm, good point. Theres also a research elective you can do at CCOM. Not sure if the schools has "more" research opportunities than KCUMB or Nova, but then again, you're also in chicago where you are surrounded by a plethora of medical institutions that are also conducting research.

KCUMB is doing a lot for research, many of the students go to UMKC and KUSOM for collaborative research. I'm trying to do a research fellowship at WashU.

 

[ananasmed]

Yeah, well cost-wise NSU-COM will be similar unfortunately. But the absence of recorded lectures is definitely a bummer...does anyone know if this is changing at all in the future at CCOM?

Students I met at CCOM seemed to be advocating for change, but it sounds like the administration/professors aren't making it easy. I did meet plenty of students who don't attend lectures... CCOM provides you with note packets for all the lectures, so I suppose those notes plus other resources (and maybe some help from classmates who attend lecture) make it possible to succeed.

How much does location matter to you? It's already snowing in Chicago lol. Being from the area, I do get the distinct sense that CCOM is a "known entity" here and attending will help you to launch your career in Chicago.

 

[Bokeh]

KCUMB is doing a lot for research, many of the students go to UMKC and KUSOM for collaborative research. I'm trying to do a research fellowship at WashU.

Yeah, KCUMB is pushing heavily forward with research from what I understand.

@JimmyB123 Some people are just die hard Chicago fans. If you want to practice in Chicago, then I might go to CCOM. I personally don't like the city. I also don't like their lecture structure.

@NekoBeats and @NeuroLAX may be able to provide some insight into NSU.

 

[JimmyB123]

KCUMB is doing a lot for research, many of the students go to UMKC and KUSOM for collaborative research. I'm trying to do a research fellowship at WashU.

Nice. Would that require you to take time off from medical school?

 

[JimmyB123]

Students I met at CCOM seemed to be advocating for change, but it sounds like the administration/professors aren't making it easy. I did meet plenty of students who don't attend lectures... CCOM provides you with note packets for all the lectures, so I suppose those notes plus other resources (and maybe some help from classmates who attend lecture) make it possible to succeed.

How much does location matter to you? It's already snowing in Chicago lol. Being from the area, I do get the distinct sense that CCOM is a "known entity" here and attending will help you to launch your career in Chicago.

I don't neccesarrily "need" to practice in Chicago. But Chicago is definitely a cool place. Location wise I like Nova more, but I think career wise being in Chicago may be more wise?

 

[AlteredScale]

Nice. Would that require you to take time off from medical school?

Idk yet, with what the MS-I's are saying about only having a month off for summer break I feel like I might need to either wait until after boards or basically take time to do the research while in school during ms2.

It's all dependent on IF I'm able to get that project going with the person I know here at Ucsd.

But back on your concerns id say besides not having recorded lectures CCOM offers some very strong resources.

But I've also heard NSUCOM being a great place as well. Don't they rotate at some university hospitals too?

 

[ananasmed]

@AlteredScale not trying to rain on your parade or anything but you know that WashU is in St. Louis, not KC... right?

 

[AlteredScale]

@AlteredScale not trying to rain on your parade or anything but you know that WashU is in St. Louis, not KC... right?

You didn't just make it rain..but you made it SNOW (get the joke?!)

Jk of course I do haha. Again the only way it would work if I was to conduct it during MS2 would be within a collaborative process (eg if I need a specific mouse model from WashU that I can perhaps transfer over to KCUMB..idk).

 

[ananasmed]

You didn't just make it rain..but you made it SNOW (get the joke?!)

Jk of course I do haha. Again the only way it would work if I was to conduct it during MS2 would be within a collaborative process (eg if I need a specific mouse model from WashU that I can perhaps transfer over to KCUMB..idk).

Thinking outside the box, I like it!

 

[Bokeh]

I don't neccesarrily "need" to practice in Chicago. But Chicago is definitely a cool place. Location wise I like Nova more, but I think career wise being in Chicago may be more wise?

I don't think choosing between any of these schools is any wiser than the other. You've got solid options. Can't go wrong.

 

[DocWinter]

CCOM is the obvious big name there, but I wouldn't touch it personally because of the exorbitant cost and big cities like Chicago isn't my style. If it's your style, consider it.

Put more thought into where you would like to live, location-wise and cost-wise, because a medical student that is comfortable with their situation financially and can see family or hit the beach if they want is a better student than the one that makes decisions on what would look best or what is highly touted and doesn't really care for it in a day to day life.

 

[Bokeh]

How's that? Tuition is at least 12K more a year at CCOM and COL is higher in Chicagoland.

I have several friends at CCOM. The recorded lecture idea is being tested by individual professors, atm. Still, you can just have a friend record lecture for you if you really want it. My friends does it daily.. It's pretty easy to do.

CCOM has a fantastic reputation in the city and has a massive alumni base (~13-14% of all practicing DOs have come from CCOM, same for KCUMB). If money is of no concern to you I would go to CCOM.

Video recordings and voice recordings are two different things. They are still behind the times. There isn't much else to say in this thread. If you want to practice in Chicago, then you should go to CCOM. If not, I'd consider NSU if you'll be happier there. KCUMB is strong, but you have the least interest in that one overall.

Edit: To the OP: For what it's worth, I have nothing against CCOM. I had the opportunity of going there myself. As @ChiTownBHawks mentioned, it offers a solid reputation. My point is that nobody is going to look down on you when they see you attended NSU (or KCUMB for that matter, I know a very good physician that graduated from KCUMB). It, too, is an excellent program. Also, as mentioned above, tuition at CCOM is about 12-13k per year more. That additional 50k will turn into 6 figures after interest if you need to take loans out. If money isn't an issue, then I'd really look into where you will be the happiest because it will make your life so much better during these next several years. Good luck!

 

[NekoBeats]

Ugh, sorry for making another one of these threads. I just need some help deciding among these schools. This is my brief opinion of the schools:

KCUMB: This school is the lowest cost wise, which is great. Also probably the strongest pre-clinical years curriculum. But I'm really not a big fan of living in Missouri. Clinical rotations are, I believe, not as strong as NSU or CCOM. I liked the school but I think CCOM or NSU would be better bets.

CCOM: The clinical rotations seem the strongest here out of the three schools I'm comparing. Being able to rotate at Cook County, Advocate Christ, Advocate Lutheran, etc. is an amazing opportunity. But what I really dislike is the fact that there are no lecture recordings during pre clinical years. Huge turn off!

NSUCOM: Location, location, location. Curriculum wise I think it is weaker than CCOM or KCUMB, but the strength of curriculum of pre clinical years is not really important for me - but recorded lectures are important, which this school has! Also, clinical rotations are quite good too. You get to rotate at Broward Health, Florida Hospital Orlando, and hospitals in the Miami-Dade area.

...

So yeah, I'm pretty torn between CCOM and NSUCOM as you can tell from my long rant. Please help me decide!

And oh yeah, COA between CCOM and NSUCOM is the same.

Yeah, KCUMB is pushing heavily forward with research from what I understand.

@JimmyB123 Some people are just die hard Chicago fans. If you want to practice in Chicago, then I might go to CCOM. I personally don't like the city. I also don't like their lecture structure.

@NekoBeats and @NeuroLAX may be able to provide some insight into NSU.

Pre-clinical is alright at NSU. We do have recorded lectures with 2x speed which has saved many of our butts/grades. The majority of classes are also not mandatory (not sure if this is going to change soon though). For the most part, our professors are very knowledgeable and enthusiastic about teaching. There are a *few* exceptions, but you can always stay after class or schedule an appointment with a professor and get further explanation. Your class dynamics will also vary, but my class is non-gunner and pretty chill. We share study guides, inform each other if an important point was made in lecture, etc.. The upperclassmen are also awesome mentors and share their old notes and give us advice for exams/boards/life. It feels like a big family. There aren't that many cons with the school, nothing too major anyway. I would still choose NSU over my other acceptance (AZCOM), which was wayy closer to home.

The clinical years are supposed to be solid at Nova. The upperclassmen I've talked to have had pretty good things to say about their rotations. It sounds like they're learning a ton and have some great physician mentors. I'm sure NeuroLAX can comment more on that since he's an M3.

I'm not going to lie- KCUMB and CCOM are also solid schools and I don't think you could go wrong with going to either of them. I personally love Chicago, more so than Ft. Lauderdale, and CCOM is a very well-established medical school. If you can deal with the lack of recordings (or if they're going to fix this), then I would say go to CCOM over NSU. However, I would also understand it if someone went to NSU over CCOM because of family ties in Florida/hates Chicago/ or really benefits from recordings, etc. My point is, you want to go where you'll be happy and where you'll exceed academically. Some things to take into consideration: curriculum & scheduling, attendance policy, classes other than the sciences, surrounding community, where you want to practice, how you learn best, cost, transportation, study spots, student satisfaction, time for board prep/help with board prep, and class dynamics. I'm sure there are other things, but this post has already gone on for too long and I need to get back to memorizing some MSK lectures. I hope all that made sense. Good luck.

 

[chizledfrmstone]

NSU-COM looks interesting right about now with the 21 degree weather in KC.

 

[ToKingdomCome]

I'd pick kcumb and ccom if you can afford it. Chicago is awwsome.

 

[JimmyB123]

Thanks for all the replies. Honestly I can end up in the same place at the end of my career from any of the 3 schools. A DO school is a DO school at the end of the day!

 

[Seth Joo]

Ugh, sorry for making another one of these threads. I just need some help deciding among these schools. This is my brief opinion of the schools:

KCUMB: This school is the lowest cost wise, which is great. Also probably the strongest pre-clinical years curriculum. But I'm really not a big fan of living in Missouri. Clinical rotations are, I believe, not as strong as NSU or CCOM. I liked the school but I think CCOM or NSU would be better bets.

CCOM: The clinical rotations seem the strongest here out of the three schools I'm comparing. Being able to rotate at Cook County, Advocate Christ, Advocate Lutheran, etc. is an amazing opportunity. But what I really dislike is the fact that there are no lecture recordings during pre clinical years. Huge turn off!

NSUCOM: Location, location, location. Curriculum wise I think it is weaker than CCOM or KCUMB, but the strength of curriculum of pre clinical years is not really important for me - but recorded lectures are important, which this school has! Also, clinical rotations are quite good too. You get to rotate at Broward Health, Florida Hospital Orlando, and hospitals in the Miami-Dade area.


Currently, I think my decision will be between CCOM and NSUCOM (if anyone has opinion on KCUMB to spice up the matter, be my guest). For a while I thought, "Wow, CCOM clearly has superior clinical rotations!" But I don't know anymore. I've been using USNews to figure out the strength of the hospitals/rotation sites, but I realized that it's not always an accurate measure. For example, I live in a city that houses Hospital X and Hospital Y. Hospital X is a big name academic hospital. Hospital Y is a large, trauma-heavy inner city hospital. I've spoken to medical students that have done rotations at both hospitals and I've gotten the impression that Hospital Y has been a more exciting, educational experience for them. Now if you go to USNews and look these hospitals up, Hospital X has some nice rankings while Hospital Y is unranked. So that's why its difficult to really compare the hospital/rotation sites between CCOM and NSUCOM because unless you're actually from the area (which I'm not), it's hard to get a gauge on the real strength of these clinical sites.

So yeah, I'm pretty torn between CCOM and NSUCOM as you can tell from my long rant. Please help me decide!

And oh yeah, COA between CCOM and NSUCOM is the same.

I think if you work hard and pro-active you can do research anywhere. I heard NSU students rotate with U of Miami MD students, so you got research opportunity there too. I think a huge plus would be to live somewhere warm and sunny, and not have to shovel snow to get to school or rotations.

I think they are all good schools, I probably would not even look at KCUMB, would not want to be in Kansas City.

 

[RavenclawMed]

I think if you work hard and pro-active you can do research anywhere. I heard NSU students rotate with U of Miami MD students, so you got research opportunity there too. I think a huge plus would be to live somewhere warm and sunny, and not have to shovel snow to get to school or rotations.

I think they are all good schools, I probably would not even look at KCUMB, would not want to be in Kansas City.

The bolded is definitely true. I have a friend who's an MS1 at Miami and he sees NSU students at the hospital all the time.

 

[NeuroLAX]

Can't go wrong with any of these COMs, honestly. All three are strong schools.

Clinical sites are solid at NSU-COM: some are better than others, which is probably the case at many institutions. Broward Health is where the largest percentage of our students rotate for M3 clerkships. Broward Health just announced a partnership with FIU to bring more ACGME residency spots. I'm not sure how much of a problem this will be, if at all, for Nova students wanting to rotate there. I don't think it will be a problem, but we will have to see how this plays out. FIU already has a presence there. Memorial and Mt. Sinai are the other hospital systems that take a good number of our students, and they also have relationships with other schools. Memorial says they would also like to add residencies. In short, there will be GME growth in the coming years.

NSU-COM is currently working with Plantation General Hospital to get 200 beds and research facilities moved to Nova's campus. Research facilities have already been under construction for some time. Obviously I don't go on campus much anymore so I don't know how it looks since the last time I had to come back, but it looks like they are making a lot of progress.

Outside of Broward County, NSU-COM has relationships with sites across the state (Miami, Naples and Orlando, etc.) and out-of-state like New York and Georgia, to name a couple. There are more and the clinical ed department is always open to forging new relationships.

One thing to keep in mind with NSU-COM is the required several months of rural and underserved rotations. Some may see this opportunity as a plus, but to me it sounds like it could be a headache because of the potential to interfere with audition season. Just some food for thought. I don't see there being any changes to this any time soon.

 

[Seth Joo]

I think four years in South Florida would easily beat living in Chicago or KC for four years. Medical school is stressful already, shoveling snow, and driving to school in the snow to me would be very unpleasant. Some of my classmates complain about being in a desert and Arizona, I do not see much of a problem, because air conditioning solves a lot of problems with living in a hot place.

 

[100111]

Whats the deal with NSU's attendance policy? I cant get a clear answer.

if no mandatory attendance, it would be my number one osteopathic school choice.

 

[JimmyB123]

Oh one more thing I have noticed while looking through residents at various residency programs. You don't really see CCOM grads outside of the chicago area. Interesting.

 

[Elevencents]

KCUMB will save you close to $100k. That'd be my choice.

 

[Bill Brasky]

Whats the deal with NSU's attendance policy? I cant get a clear answer.

if no mandatory attendance, it would be my number one osteopathic school choice.

It is currently up to individual course directors to decide if their class has an attendance policy. Right now, there are two lecture classes with an attendance policy and they are both once per week. Labs are almost always mandatory, as you'll find at any other school.

As for what the future holds, we aren't sure. The push for mandatory attendance comes from what I understand was EXTREMELY poor lecture attendance and an abnormally high number of remediations for M1s last year. My first year class seems to have good attendance for the most part, and we'll see in May how many people remediate or repeat. The Dean did tell the M2s that universal mandatory attendance has been shelved for a minimum of one year. My guess is that we don't have it for M2 next year, but beyond that I can't say.

 

[Awesome Sauceome]

Oh one more thing I have noticed while looking through residents at various residency programs. You don't really see CCOM grads outside of the chicago area. Interesting.

Yea it does seem like a lot stay... some end up at MCW and UW though. I personally know several CCOM docs up here.

So if you like the cold, CCOM is for you! jk... but seriously

 

[Bea5T]

Yea it does seem like a lot stay... some end up at MCW and UW though. I personally know several CCOM docs up here.

So if you like the cold, CCOM is for you! jk... but seriously

why do people act like Chicago is in the middle of Siberia? The humidity in SouthFl isn't to pleasant either. Or the mosquitoes for that matter

 

[ananasmed]

why do people act like Chicago is in the middle of Siberia? The humidity in SouthFl isn't to pleasant either. Or the mosquitoes for that matter

*Chiberia, I'm sure you meant.

 

[user3]

It is currently up to individual course directors to decide if their class has an attendance policy. Right now, there are two lecture classes with an attendance policy and they are both once per week. Labs are almost always mandatory, as you'll find at any other school.

As for what the future holds, we aren't sure. The push for mandatory attendance comes from what I understand was EXTREMELY poor lecture attendance and an abnormally high number of remediations for M1s last year. My first year class seems to have good attendance for the most part, and we'll see in May how many people remediate or repeat. The Dean did tell the M2s that universal mandatory attendance has been shelved for a minimum of one year. My guess is that we don't have it for M2 next year, but beyond that I can't say.

this is an utterly stupid excuse. If that is a problem, they should only require students to attend classes if they are in danger of failing (like, averaging < 75%).

 

[ArtOfWar]

Oh one more thing I have noticed while looking through residents at various residency programs. You don't really see CCOM grads outside of the chicago area. Interesting.

This is true but the reasoning behind this is that you are rotating at some of the best sites in the country in a variety of fields. You're not going to pass up EM at Cook County so that you can do a "less prestigious" residency in some other state. Basically, you are more likely to get a better residency spot in Chicago than if you were to travel outside, that being said there is nothing stopping people from leaving the area. CCOM matches students virtually everywhere, however considering the density of hospitals in Chicago most people find it easier to just stay in the area after med. school, once again if you want to leave it is completely do-able.

Regarding lecture recordings, it really is a non-issue unless that is how you learn. At most you are going to miss one question on an exam by not attending lecture, virtually everything you need to know is located in the note packets. The note packets + powerpoints give you more than enough study material to figure out everything on your own.

 

[JimmyB123]

This is true but the reasoning behind this is that you are rotating at some of the best sites in the country in a variety of fields. You're not going to pass up EM at Cook County so that you can do a "less prestigious" residency in some other state. Basically, you are more likely to get a better residency spot in Chicago than if you were to travel outside, that being said there is nothing stopping people from leaving the area. CCOM matches students virtually everywhere, however considering the density of hospitals in Chicago most people find it easier to just stay in the area after med. school, once again if you want to leave it is completely do-able.

Regarding lecture recordings, it really is a non-issue unless that is how you learn. At most you are going to miss one question on an exam by not attending lecture, virtually everything you need to know is located in the note packets. The note packets + powerpoints give you more than enough study material to figure out everything on your own.

That's good to hear. In undergrad I had classes that didn't have lecture recordings, and if you didn't go to class, it would be nearly impossible to get anything above a B+. So that's what I was afraid of at CCOM

 

[Seth Joo]

why do people act like Chicago is in the middle of Siberia? The humidity in SouthFl isn't to pleasant either. Or the mosquitoes for that matter

South Florida at least does not get snow, I think medical school is already hard enough without having to drive on icy and snowy roads to school or your clinical rotations.

I have classmates of mine who actually complain about the heat in AZ. That is why AC exists.

 

[JimmyB123]

I'm sorry for reviving this thread but this decision has given me so much stress the past couple days. I can't eat, enjoy life, exercise, etc because I'm so scared of making the wrong decision.

Do you all think it's okay for me to just consider location, cost, and gut feeling to decide between ccom and nova? I'm 22 y/o and I have no idea where I want to practice and eventually settle down in the future. Ccom is one of the original five DO schools. I guess what I'm trying to ask is if it is career suicide if I turn it down?

Edit - do you all notice any noticeable differences in match lists between Ccom and nova?

 

[67552931811]

I'm sorry for reviving this thread but this decision has given me so much stress the past couple days. I can't eat, enjoy life, exercise, etc because I'm so scared of making the wrong decision.

Do you all think it's okay for me to just consider location, cost, and gut feeling to decide between ccom and nova? I'm 22 y/o and I have no idea where I want to practice and eventually settle down in the future. Ccom is one of the original five DO schools. I guess what I'm trying to ask is if it is career suicide if I turn it down?

Edit - do you all notice any noticeable differences in match lists between Ccom and nova?

Comparing match lists is such a futile exercise. So many relevant variables are unknown.

Consider what you want in a school and roll with it, man. Examine your pro/con list and decide which negative factors you can deal with and which positive factors are most important to you.

 

[AlteredScale]

I'm sorry for reviving this thread but this decision has given me so much stress the past couple days. I can't eat, enjoy life, exercise, etc because I'm so scared of making the wrong decision.

Do you all think it's okay for me to just consider location, cost, and gut feeling to decide between ccom and nova? I'm 22 y/o and I have no idea where I want to practice and eventually settle down in the future. Ccom is one of the original five DO schools. I guess what I'm trying to ask is if it is career suicide if I turn it down?

Edit - do you all notice any noticeable differences in match lists between Ccom and nova?

I don't think so. If you want to practice in Chicago or simply the northern region of the US then you will have an easier chance doing so at CCOM since you will have a chance to network through your clerkships, electives, and sub-I's. Same goes for Nova if you wish to practice in FL.

 

[Bokeh]

I'm sorry for reviving this thread but this decision has given me so much stress the past couple days. I can't eat, enjoy life, exercise, etc because I'm so scared of making the wrong decision.

Do you all think it's okay for me to just consider location, cost, and gut feeling to decide between ccom and nova? I'm 22 y/o and I have no idea where I want to practice and eventually settle down in the future. Ccom is one of the original five DO schools. I guess what I'm trying to ask is if it is career suicide if I turn it down?

Edit - do you all notice any noticeable differences in match lists between Ccom and nova?

This is something you should definitely consider. Think about how you felt when you were on each campus and your interactions with students and faculty. Where did you feel most comfortable?