2. CMS vs other Chicago/US schools
Chicago Med has always gotten a bad rap in the chicagoland. I personally dont believe its based on solid proof or foundation. Im not saying RUSH or UIC school is worse, they produce very smart students that match well. However, CMS gets a bad rap for a few reasons:
a) Yes, we were on probation a few years ago - reason = high cost of tuition that was rising every year. I'd have to say that its expensive compared to state schools like UIC. On cost alone, I'd have to chose UIC. I dont know about Rush so Im not even going to comment on it as it would be misinformed. However, our school is no longer on probation...... but tuition is still a bitch since its a private school.
b) Location - It is true that CMS is in North Chicago and its no metro city. But its near a rich area around 5 mins south local drive from the school. I'd try to compare it to Evanston, IL which is another sub of chicago but Im not familiar with that area. I'd say its like Pomona or Riverside in relation to Los Angeles or parts of Long Island is to NYC. Its about 40 mins from downtown Chicago with no traffic/off peak times which I would say is like the distance of the other examples above. The reason I give those two examples is because I've lived in both areas of NY and Los Angeles and can comment on them. As far as north chicago, yes, there are no night clubs around, no real real cool bars, no 5 star places to eat but most of the time, us students are studying anywayz and grabbing a quick bite. Its only on the weekends that ppl travel down to chicago and go out and drink, party, eat, etc etc. All in all, I think it wasn't horrible to live in as when I wanted to party, I went with my classmates to Chicago, when I wanted to chill, I ate at cheesecake, olivegarden etc around the area (20mins away) and hung out with classmates playing Halo or watching movies etc etc. Its not like life is so remote that you're bored. And, I think the location is quiet enough that you end up focusing on school the first two years which is reflected in our board scores = ave my year was 225 or so. (I dont know what Rush or UIC is so Im not going to compare) Would I have rather lived in the metro part of Chicago, ya, who wouldnt? Was it that bad...not at all. I would say the worst part was the cold weather but I think all us Cali ppl hated Chicago in general.
c) Third - why some attendings or chicagoland doctors might look down on CMS.... I think this part can be easily explained. First, it is well known that CMS take a lot of students from California, not because these students are horrible students that couldnt get into their own state (well somewhat), but that california is so difficult to get into for medical school. Everyone in Cali wants to stay because of the cheap tuition and the well known reputation. UCLA, UCSD, UCSF, USC (private thou). These are all top name schools known throught the country both in research and education. Look at US world report rankings, all of them are top school. What happens is that there are so many top students in California already not to add the thousands of applicants that want to do Medical school in California from out of state (like Columbia, Cornell, Harvard etc etc). Since UC are NOT preferential to their own state, they take OOS. Thus displacing many californians to other schools....one being CMS which is Cali friendly. Now, after medical school, all us Cali kids want to return to the sunny warm weather for residency. Hence, we apply and match back home. What this does is two things: 1. We become attendings in Cali and thus there are more doctors in Chicago from Rush, UIC, Northwestern, UofC and those attending back up their schools. So there are less CMS grads to defend CMS. 2. CMS students train at the some of the same hospitals as UIC, Rush.... ie Cook County Hospital, Mount Sinai Hospital, Advocate Christ-Luthern-Masonic system. So essentially we get the same education. But what happens after is that there is a mass exodus of CMS grads away from Chicago to NY, Cali... for various reason as described above. Those Hospital systems have been looking down at CMS because of this because they spend all this time training us as students to their system, spend time teaching us and few of us stick around for residency. Why does it matter? Well, some hospital (like Sinai) have to take foreign grads in the residency programs, thus, they train us and then none of us stay and essentially, they lose out on the 100K that the hospital gets for US grads. Now, if you train someone for a job in your company and they left after training for something better, wouldn't you be pissed off (thats similar to what is happening)....
d) US new and report rankings - if you know anything, you know that most of this is crap. Okay Harvard is Harvard, etc etc. Why is CMS near the bottom.... very little NIH research. Why? Well first, there is no undergrad students for the professors to hire or recruit little peons and lab techs to do the dirty work...so research is slow and usually done by the PI or grad students (which there are few of) but its not elaborate or producting cutting edge new research. CMS is not a hard core research institute so it doesnt pull in millions from the NIH. Does this affect medical education....nope! Do I think we should be ranked up where harvard is? Nope. I think the problem lies with how USNWR ranks schools. Does it consider USMLE scores? is there a way to even rank the quality? or is it only subjective? or based on research money etc etc. I think its too hard to really rank schools accurately so Ranks are useful only to a point. Probably no difference or little btw the 90th and 105th school etc etc so take rankings with a grain of salt
Now the positives:
1. Match list - Look at my years match 2008. A lot of us are going back to Cali, and for us, that is a good thing because thats what we all wanted. We have a fair share of top notch matches ortho, neurosurg, Mayo clinic for Neuro, Childrens hospital in LA for peds, Derm, Radiology (somewhere in the teens). Is it better than this or that school? I cant say....but uh I dont think comparing match lists is accurate. There are too many variable in why ppl end up choosing where they go. Some decide based on location, some on big name institutions, some on research etc. I ended up ranking a high caliber name in ER lower than one that was in a better location. I mean, I never even heard of some of these top name places that this or that student talks about online, not because the program is bad, but I dont know programs in that area. Henry Ford in ER? I've heard of it NOW but less than 6 months ago, I was like where the hell is that? Everyone just assumes big name = best match list. I know ppl who ranked Yale ER low on their list (it went unmatch this year) even with the big name of Yale. Why? Because many ppl may not like the location even with the big name or perhaps they didnt see enough trauma there. I dont really know why but my roommate interviewed there and he loved the program, but not the location, hence, ranked it 10th or so. Anywayz, back to the point, I think our match list did well.
2. Professors - they are awsome. I loved my Physio, Anatomy, Path Class. Our path instructors are the ppl who write BRS path that many ppl use to review for boards. Ask any doctor the review book they used for path and most will say BRS path by Santos and Schneider, then go to a university book store and look up the book....CMS professors. Both MD. Now, am I saying CMS is so great and better than every medical school out there who probably have professors that wrote this or that book....No. My point is that CMS has good faculty and professors and you will get a solid foundation for the rest of your medical career.
3. Board scores - Step 1 ave was 225ish, MCAT was 32, GPA 3.4 or something like that. All very solid. Shows the high caliber of students here. Im not even going to compare schools as this is so pointless. Just look at scores and if you are applying and think its okay, apply, go for the interview, check the school out. Thats all I'm saying. Choose the school that fits you
Addendum: I read a post about Step 2 score.... comparing that is crap. First, I matched 4 days ago. I havent taken my Step 2 yet. Its not a big factor for matching. Do I give a crap now after the match....NOPE. Im just studying to pass. Thus, comparing Step 2 score btw schools is crap as most of us know, unless you take it early in 4th year, it doesnt count into the match process so many students across the nation are just aiming to pass. Who takes it early? Well, our school and probably most school inform ppl that if they scored high 230s, NOT to take step 2 till late in season. If its low <200 or something like that, take it early to help improve chances of matching, OR if you are trying something competitive with lower scores than needed, take step 2 early. As for the rest of the class, we could care less as just to pass....unless its for fellowship or something, which doesnt apply to all of us. Thus comparing step 2 scores btw schools is BS. Second, I dont even know my schools step 2 average for the past 5 years so how the hell can anyone else know whos not even from CMS. Pure speculation. I dont know UIC or Rush average step 1 or 2 either so.... ppl like to brag too much about this or that school...whatev. Its all hearsay, just commment on your own schools please....
Okay, I cant think of anything more to say off the top of my head... I'll add more if I do. Mostly, this post is not to brag or bash any score or say this school is better blah blah blah. That shiz is all BS. I just wanted to post my thoughts on the last few years and try to tell others why ppl say this or that. Keep in mind that I am about to graduate from CMS so take it as you will. But I think I gave a honest review of my school in terms of all the questions and doubt out there currently for pre-med students. This is mostly directed toward them so they can make a informed decision.
These past four years have been a humbling experience, getting scuted out by residents, yelled at by attendings (especially gsurgeons) for crap that honestly was so stupid. As 3rd years, students know nothing yet are expected to know everything. What is the correction factor of Ca for low albumin? asked a attending on the first day of rotations. Like I learned that 2nd year...S***....if it wasnt on step 1, I didnt know! I know it now thou, why, because he pimpped me like crazy. It was both a stressful yet rewarding experience that only someone who has gone thru it would know. Anyways... school 1>school 2>school 3... so STUPID. Unless you go to like Harvard or something, your school will always be >>>>> (less than) another school, and even then, its just your OWN ranking system and not someone elses. just my 2 cents...
peace out,
TheKoman
You have to be at the top of your class to get the match results you want. Good luck getting a good spot. The pass rate was released somewhere, don't know where it was you will have to look it up.
