Challenges of working with underserved/rural populations

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Do you also use bactrim most in the treatment of UTIs? That and cipro seem to be the favorites, at least the prescribing docs near me.
(A lot of people seem to have sulfa allergies too)
Depends on the patient. Cipro and bactrim are best to penetrate kidney too. Macrobid is a good choice as well. I have been seeing lots of drug resistant bugs in symptomatic elderly women lately. Very scary. Many can only be treated with macrobid or IV abx. I culture everyone.

It's not just E. Coli UTI anymore. It's Klebsiella, Citrobacter, Enterococcus too
 
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While working as a pharmacy tech, I've definitely noticed the trends with dentists prescribing clindamycin. Another common one seems to be Keflex, have you noticed that at all in your practice?
Yes, have to look at costs and compliance and allergy profiles. Either work well. We start with how we are trained.
 
If you want to look at real challenges of rural health care. I currently work on the Oregon coast where a lot of people vacation, etc. I had an elderly lady with RA and another autoimmune disease. On Methotrexate and hydroxycholoroquine (reaching memory here) which are immunosuppressive drugs. She is allergic to EVERY oral abx except cipro. Gets bad UTI's. I gave her the cipro and crossed my fingers waiting for the culture to come back in 3 days (my cultures get sent 100 miles away to Portland). So the culture comes back MDRO Klebsiella that is ONLY susceptible to IV abx. I call the patient who at this time is across the state of Oregon on the other side of the Rocky Mountains. She states she hasn't gotten any better since seeing me three days before. I worry she is going septic. I call the nearest hospital to her, talk to the ER co-ordinator about the issue. Fax all my labs to that ER which is 300 miles from me, Call the patient back who agreed to go to the ER. She got admitted for further treatment.

I was unable to get hold of her own doctor in California because the MA at that office refused to pull the doctor out of a room and put her on the phone with me!! I filed a formal complaint with the patient liaison but never heard back.

Rural medicine can be logistically challenging but equally rewarding at the same time.
 
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@cabinbuilder So there are many problem solving opportunities in your work? Having to make due James Herriot style is intriguing.

Why did you decide to practice in Oregon? Was there a specific draw to that area?
 
@cabinbuilder So there are many problem solving opportunities in your work? Having to make due James Herriot style is intriguing.

Why did you decide to practice in Oregon? Was there a specific draw to that area?
I don't practice in Oregon. I do locums in TX, OR, WA, and NV. I go where they need help.
 
Ah yes, I see the "rent-a-doc" thing now. Why do you practice that way, if you don't mind?
I get paid by the hour, no one owns me. I take what vacation time I want. I have the choice of what sites I go to. I can leave if I hate it. I don't have to go to any meetings. I don't have to "play by the administration rules". "They" can't tell me how many patients I "have" to see in a day. I am the relief help therefore the site should be happy that I am there, if not and they give me any grief I move onto the next site.

I will tell you that I have total control over my life. I work as much or as little as I want. I make my own schedule. I don't have to ask for vacation time. I get minimum 10 jobs a day via phone or email. Locums is never going away. I make minimum 100K more than your average FP. I don't pay housing, travel, rental car, or malpractice costs. When I travel I reap the benefits of airline miles and hotel points. They add up quickly.

I carry my own health insurance and do my own 401K. My husband stays home at our base with my teenage daughter. They are busy. They are used to me being gone.
 
I get paid by the hour, no one owns me. I take what vacation time I want. I have the choice of what sites I go to. I can leave if I hate it. I don't have to go to any meetings. I don't have to "play by the administration rules". "They" can't tell me how many patients I "have" to see in a day. I am the relief help therefore the site should be happy that I am there, if not and they give me any grief I move onto the next site.

I will tell you that I have total control over my life. I work as much or as little as I want. I make my own schedule. I don't have to ask for vacation time. I get minimum 10 jobs a day via phone or email. Locums is never going away. I make minimum 100K more than your average FP. I don't pay housing, travel, rental car, or malpractice costs.

I carry my own health insurance and do my own 401K
Like a boss lol! That's great doctor. Thanks!
 
I get paid by the hour, no one owns me. I take what vacation time I want. I have the choice of what sites I go to. I can leave if I hate it. I don't have to go to any meetings. I don't have to "play by the administration rules". "They" can't tell me how many patients I "have" to see in a day. I am the relief help therefore the site should be happy that I am there, if not and they give me any grief I move onto the next site.

I will tell you that I have total control over my life. I work as much or as little as I want. I make my own schedule. I don't have to ask for vacation time. I get minimum 10 jobs a day via phone or email. Locums is never going away. I make minimum 100K more than your average FP. I don't pay housing, travel, rental car, or malpractice costs. When I travel I reap the benefits of airline miles and hotel points. They add up quickly.

I carry my own health insurance and do my own 401K. My husband stays home at our base with my teenage daughter. They are busy. They are used to me being gone.
Something I am sincerely trying to avoid in the future. This set-up sounds like something I would love to do. Could this way of practicing be done by all specialities (hopefully not a horrendous question...)?
 
Something I am sincerely trying to avoid in the future. This set-up sounds like something I would love to do. Could this way of practicing be done by all specialties (hopefully not a horrendous question...)?
There are locums positions for nearly every specialty. Primary care is the hot commodity right now especially if you are versatile and are willing to just "fill the void" without too many demands. FP, ER, IM, PEDs, Anesthesia, Hospitalist are the big ones right now.
 
There are locums positions for nearly every specialty. Primary care is the hot commodity right now especially if you are versatile and are willing to just "fill the void" without too many demands. FP, ER, IM, PEDs, Anesthesia, Hospitalist are the big ones right now.
Thanks, doc. 🙂
 
Guys... I'm back stronger than ever!
I was just gonna quit sdn but I think I'm addicted to it now. I'll stay on for a little more until I have things to do. And i think my posts give some laughter or something to wait for, for some people.
and thanks @AlteredScale for that link. Now it makes some people on this website more authentic/whotheysaytheyare.

I read all of your criticisms and ridicules. And i see the point in many of them. and cabin it seems like @cabinbuilder is a good (if not great) physician (food, shower, cab.. etc). Some of you guys are pretty funny, to say the least.
However, my views/thoughts/opinions do not change. Maybe it is my stubbornness? But you guys are pretty stubborn also...
I get that you have to generalize. That how most of us learn new things. We learn the general things and then learn the specifics in most cases. Sometime it's the reverse. Don't you agree?
But how do some of you not see the problem with saying "Treat with clindamycin at any sign of facial swelling.". How more blatant can someone say something?
(and I have no idea whey cabin changed abx back to clindamycin but...)

REALLY, I get the point of generalizing.
If someone has a right lower quadrant pain, it's generally something wrong with the appendix. Agree? Generally (I'm sure you can thing of many more things wrong in the RLQ). And we will order a CT of the abdomen.
But what if that person had an appendectomy in the past? It may be "rare" or it may be unlikely that a person who had an appendectomy will have RLQ pain but do you just go ahead and put them through radiation just because in most cases/in most people it's something wrong with the appendix? (not saying cabin doesn't look at patients' histories.)
Do I make myself clear?
I'm not saying you should question a physician ordering a CT to rule out an appendicitis but question him/her if she hasn't even looked at the person's history.
Am I so wrong to say you should consider things by case by case basis?
Cabin was generalizing patients with a symptom but giving out a specific method to treat a symptom.

As rude/bad/sarcasm as Dr. House may seem, he asks his members for opinions and thoughts on most, if not all cases (yes, he shoots most of them down but...). Even if he or someone thinks it's a common symptoms for a disease/ailment, he doesn't just jump to conclusion (I know this is a made up TV series...).

Some of you guys seem to live in some kind of a hierarchy society or something. Sure, what cabin said has much more value and insight in to medicine than what I had said. And maybe I am being nitpicky about what she said. Maybe I was just picking out that 1 "wrong" things (at least in my point of view, and some of you did agree in some sense) out of 1 million "right" things she said and went "extreme", which I do not think so because I was just pointing out that you can't just assume someone is not allergic or has bad reaction to (which is basically being allergic) a SPECIFIC antibiotic she mentioned to use in ANY circumstance involving facial swelling in a patient with dental pain.

"Antibiotics do not fight infections caused by viruses like colds, flu, most sore throats, bronchitis, and many sinus and ear infections. Instead, symptom relief might be the best treatment option for viral infections.
Get smart about when antibiotics are needed—to fight bacterial infections. When you use antibiotics appropriately, you do the best for your health, your family's health, and the health of those around you."
- http://www.cdc.gov/features/getsmart/
Yes, I know clindamycin is an appropriate abx in the cabin's situation and tooth pain isn't a viral problem but I saw a problem in the way she said to use a SPECIFIC abx quickly and many patients can become septic. More relevant things on the link. Not to mention overprescribing abx has lead to superbacteria/drug-resistance bacterias (along those lines...) becoming more common. That's part of evolution.

And the whole, taking things to extreme with giving out pain medication like candy. Do you guys not get sarcasm... I mean look at my avatar...
Not to point out that overprescribing pain medication is a HUGE problem in medicine.

"In a period of nine months, a tiny Kentucky county of fewer than 12,000 people sees a 53-year-old mother, her 35-year-old son, and seven others die by overdosing on pain medications obtained from pain clinics in Florida.1 In Utah, a 13-year-old fatally overdoses on oxycodone pills taken from a friend’s grandmother.2 A 20-year-old Boston man dies from an overdose of methadone, only a year after his friend also died from a prescription drug overdose.3
These are not isolated events. Drug overdose death rates in the United States have more than tripled since 1990 and have never been higher. In 2008, more than 36,000 people died from drug overdoses, and most of these deaths were caused by prescription drugs."
- http://www.cdc.gov/homeandrecreationalsafety/rxbrief/

I saw a problem in what cabin said and point out a problem that I thought would add to the conversation.
But you guys are the one who took things out of proportion and to extreme to say I am telling cabin how to practice. I'm wasn't and I'm not.
However, I would rather be stingy with pain medication (or any medications) and try to help patients otherwise.
Where did A.T. Still's philosophy go? Aren't most of us on this forum going to be OSTEOPATHIC physicians? Don't we learn that there is more to it than medications and surgeries?

Did I ever say you shouldn't learn how to splint? or you shouldn't use xray to r/o constipation? I didn't because I didn't see a problem in that. But I saw a problem in generalizing everyone to be the same and a problem about "not being stingy" with pain medications. I am sure I could have worded my original post to make it sound more appropriate.

I'm not trying to fight with you guys. And I'm sorry if you guys thought I was trying to be "that" pre-med. Trust me, I wasn't and I could do better if I wanted to.
I'm not here to tell physicians how to practice.
But I believe we all have the right to voice our opinions and thoughts. In an online setting, things don't reflect one's thought as accurately. I think we all know that.

Let me just finish my point with this EXTREME example that may or may not be relevant (this is going extreme).

Hundreds if not thousands of little kids are sexually molested by adults (even Catholic priests) every year. But (at least from what I know/read/heard) many of them never mention it or say something to anyone else because they believe what is done to them is okay since the molesters were older/"higher" than them.
They don't speak out and many of them are afraid to. They remain silent until it's too late to punish the molester.

Now, many of you guys will say "wtf? is he joking? what is wrong with iwilloneday?"
But please read between the lines.
My point is, just because someone is "higher" than you, has more experience, older, or has more authority doesn't mean you can't question them or point out wrong things.
I don't want my future colleagues, coworkers, staff, attendings, or students to think they can't voice their thought. Just like how you guys try to go against the requirements that hospitals put on you or your parents put on you.


Let the ridicules begin.
I will accepted constructive criticism but please READ it before you respond. and can we be more "civil" about this? Come on, seriously? You guys are just going to jump on the bandwagon?
What has this thread turn into...
This is almost like cyber bulling... 🙁

download.jpg



Thanks for reading. Love you guys. :kiss:
 
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Guys... I'm back stronger than ever!
I was just gonna quit sdn but I think I'm addicted to it now. I'll stay on for a little more until I have things to do. And i think my posts give some laughter or something to wait for, for some people.
and thanks @AlteredScale for that link. Now it makes some people on this website more authentic/whotheysaytheyare.

I read all of your criticisms and ridicules. And i see the point in many of them. and cabin it seems like @cabinbuilder is a good (if not great) physician (food, shower, cab.. etc). Some of you guys are pretty funny, to say the least.
However, my views/thoughts/opinions do not change. Maybe it is my stubbornness? But you guys are pretty stubborn also...
I get that you have to generalize. That how most of us learn new things. We learn the general things and then learn the specifics in most cases. Sometime it's the reverse. Don't you agree?
But how do some of you not see the problem with saying "Treat with clindamycin at any sign of facial swelling.". How more blatant can someone say something?
(and I have no idea whey cabin changed abx back to clindamycin but...)

REALLY, I get the point of generalizing.
If someone has a right lower quadrant pain, it's generally something wrong with the appendix. Agree? Generally (I'm sure you can thing of many more things wrong in the RLQ). And we will order a CT of the abdomen.
But what if that person had an appendectomy in the past? It may be "rare" or it may be unlikely that a person who had an appendectomy will have RLQ pain but do you just go ahead and put them through radiation just because in most cases/in most people it's something wrong with the appendix? (not saying cabin doesn't look at patients' histories.)
Do I make myself clear?
I'm not saying you should question a physician ordering a CT to rule out an appendicitis but question him/her if she hasn't even looked at the person's history.
Am I so wrong to say you should consider things by case by case basis?
Cabin was generalizing patients with a symptom but giving out a specific method to treat a symptom.

As rude/bad/sarcasm as Dr. House may seem, he asks his members for opinions and thoughts on most, if not all cases (yes, he shoots most of them down but...). Even if he or someone thinks it's a common symptoms for a disease/ailment, he doesn't just jump to conclusion (I know this is a made up TV series...).

Some of you guys seem to live in some kind of a hierarchy society or something. Sure, what cabin said has much more value and insight in to medicine than what I had said. And maybe I am being nitpicky about what she said. Maybe I was just picking out that 1 "wrong" things (at least in my point of view, and some of you did agree in some sense) out of 1 million "right" things she said and went "extreme", which I do not think so because I was just pointing out that you can't just assume someone is not allergic or has bad reaction to (which is basically being allergic) a SPECIFIC antibiotic she mentioned to use in ANY circumstance involving facial swelling in a patient with dental pain.

"Antibiotics do not fight infections caused by viruses like colds, flu, most sore throats, bronchitis, and many sinus and ear infections. Instead, symptom relief might be the best treatment option for viral infections.
Get smart about when antibiotics are needed—to fight bacterial infections. When you use antibiotics appropriately, you do the best for your health, your family's health, and the health of those around you."
- http://www.cdc.gov/features/getsmart/
Yes, I know clindamycin is an appropriate abx in the cabin's situation and tooth pain isn't a viral problem but I saw a problem in the way she said to use a SPECIFIC abx quickly and many patients can become septic. More relevant things on the link. Not to mention overprescribing abx has lead to superbacteria/drug-resistance bacterias (along those lines...) becoming more common. That's part of evolution.

And the whole, taking things to extreme with giving out pain medication like candy. Do you guys not get sarcasm... I mean look at my avatar...
Not to point out that overprescribing pain medication is a HUGE problem in medicine.

"In a period of nine months, a tiny Kentucky county of fewer than 12,000 people sees a 53-year-old mother, her 35-year-old son, and seven others die by overdosing on pain medications obtained from pain clinics in Florida.1 In Utah, a 13-year-old fatally overdoses on oxycodone pills taken from a friend’s grandmother.2 A 20-year-old Boston man dies from an overdose of methadone, only a year after his friend also died from a prescription drug overdose.3
These are not isolated events. Drug overdose death rates in the United States have more than tripled since 1990 and have never been higher. In 2008, more than 36,000 people died from drug overdoses, and most of these deaths were caused by prescription drugs."
- http://www.cdc.gov/homeandrecreationalsafety/rxbrief/

I saw a problem in what cabin said and point out a problem that I thought would add to the conversation.
But you guys are the one who took things out of proportion and to extreme to say I am telling cabin how to practice. I'm wasn't and I'm not.
However, I would rather be stingy with pain medication (or any medications) and try to help patients otherwise.
Where did A.T. Still's philosophy go? Aren't most of us on this forum going to be OSTEOPATHIC physicians? Don't we learn that there is more to it than medications and surgeries?

Did I ever say you shouldn't learn how to splint? or you shouldn't use xray to r/o constipation? I didn't because I didn't see a problem in that. But I saw a problem in generalizing everyone to be the same and a problem about "not being stingy" with pain medications. I am sure I could have worded my original post to make it sound more appropriate.

I'm not trying to fight with you guys. And I'm sorry if you guys thought I was trying to be "that" pre-med. Trust me, I wasn't and I could do better if I wanted to.
I'm not here to tell physicians how to practice.
But I believe we all have the right to voice our opinions and thoughts. In an online setting, things don't reflect one's thought as accurately. I think we all know that.

Let me just finish my point with this EXTREME example that may or may not be relevant (this is going extreme).

Hundreds if not thousands of little kids are sexually molested by adults (even Catholic priests) every year. But (at least from what I know/read/heard) many of them never mention it or say something to anyone else because they believe what is done to them is okay since the molesters were older/"higher" than them.
They don't speak out and many of them are afraid to. They remain silent until it's too late to punish the molester.

Now, many of you guys will say "wtf? is he joking? what is wrong with iwilloneday?"
But please read between the lines.
My point is, just because someone is "higher" than you, has more experience, older, or has more authority doesn't mean you can't question them or point out wrong things.
I don't want my future colleagues, coworkers, staff, attendings, or students to think they can't voice their thought. Just like how you guys try to go against the requirements that hospitals put on you or your parents put on you.


Let the ridicules begin.
I will accepted constructive criticism but please READ it before you respond. and can we be more "civil" about this? Come on, seriously? You guys are just going to jump on the bandwagon?
What has this thread turn into...
This is almost like cyber bulling... 🙁

View attachment 186171


Thanks for reading. Love you guys. :kiss:
 
I feel the need to add to the discussion

I come from a town considered very rural (population ~500) and we don't even have physicians. We rely on PA's and FNPs. I have volunteered in the clinic at home and now I work in a level 1 trauma center in a larger city. To assume that just because people are from a rural area means that they are an idiot about their health is an ignorant statement to make.

Stupidity know no bounds, and the ER I work at now is frequently full of people who want antibiotics for their cold or think poison ivy is going to kill them. I have found that in rural communities, people are less likely to visit a physician unless they are VERY SICK, unlike here in the city where people come to the ER with the slightest sniffle or (God forbid) a tick bite.

Don't just assume that because people grew up in the sticks that they don't have a clue or you will have a client base that thinks you're a pretentious snob
 
hi guys,
I recently got accepted to a school in a rural area with huge emphasis on serving underserved populations. I have few experiences working with underserved- tutoring underprivileged high school kids and working with health department to address nutrition needs of low income populations. However, I do not have any clinical experience that revolves around helping underserved. I loved the school but before I commit myself to anything I would like to know what challenges should I expect to face as a physician if I decide to work in a rural/underserved area.

does anyone have clinical experience working with underserved populations? if anyone does, can you please comment on if you liked/disliked it and how was it overall?

thanks =)

Most DO schools are generally geared towards serving underserved populations, that is why most hospitals that take DO students tend to be community hospitals in rural or inner city areas.

Of course working in a small town clinic will be nothing like working in Mass General, which is probably the best hospital in the entire country.
 
Man I was so excited... I had a busy and fun weekend and come back to SDN thinking @iWillOneDay was finally gone from SDN. But it appears he/she is "back and stronger than ever."

Awesome,

see yall in a couple more weeks. PM me, text me (for those of you that have my number) or facebook me, if you need anything. I need a break from this kind of crap. There has to be more to life than arguing with 14 year olds (either physically or mentally) on SDN all day.
 
hehehe, that's pretty funny. I'm gonna use that in my future posts and stuff.
Only if they didn't have the "god" thing at the end...
Chill with the God thing. I get the feeling if you ever become a doctor you would correct a patient for thanking God you finally showed up to treat him. Let it go...

tumblr_n1zi5rWB2V1r7b6cio1_500.gif
 
Chill with the God thing. I get the feeling if you ever become a doctor you would correct a patient for thanking God you finally showed up to treat him. Let it go...

tumblr_n1zi5rWB2V1r7b6cio1_500.gif

it's a joke because most people already know that I'm an atheist on SDN if they have read my previous posts...
and I will have a problem with patients who thank god that they are cured instead of thanking physicians who actually did work...
 
Man I was so excited... I had a busy and fun weekend and come back to SDN thinking @iWillOneDay was finally gone from SDN. But it appears he/she is "back and stronger than ever."

Awesome,

see yall in a couple more weeks. PM me, text me (for those of you that have my number) or facebook me, if you need anything. I need a break from this kind of crap. There has to be more to life than arguing with 14 year olds (either physically or mentally) on SDN all day.

If thinking about issues and voicing my thoughts makes me a 14 year old, sure I'll be 14 forever. :banana:
 
it's a joke because most people already know that I'm an atheist on SDN if they have read my previous posts...
and I will have a problem with patients who thank god that they are cured instead of thanking physicians who actually did work...
Yes, we know you're atheist. You're the author on the 'manifesto' on being an atheist during medical school, everybody here remembers. It's cool to be atheist, but remember you will be looked up by the future population you may treat, if they feel you are condescending towards their beliefs your clientele will dwindle.

About patients thanking God, if you ever become a physician get ready for decades of numerous patients thanking him or blaming him for things 🙂 correcting them will get old VERY quickly...
 
it's a joke because most people already know that I'm an atheist on SDN if they have read my previous posts...
and I will have a problem with patients who thank god that they are cured instead of thanking physicians who actually did work...

What are you going to say to a patient who says "I'm glad I'm saved" and dies the next day?
 
Yes, we know you're atheist. You're the author on the 'manifesto' on being an atheist during medical school, everybody here remembers. It's cool to be atheist, but remember you will be looked up by the future population you may treat, if they feel you are condescending towards their beliefs your clientele will dwindle.

About patients thanking God, if you ever become a physician get ready for decades of numerous patients thanking him or blaming him for things 🙂 correcting them will get old VERY quickly...

This brings up something I have been giving thought to lately. Of course as physicians there must be respect for diversity. But I remember, for example, once my father (a professor) told his graduate student that this was America and in America we do not hit our wives, period. The culture of my father's graduate student felt otherwise. Anyway, what advice about diverse and culturally different issues do the experienced on this board have for those of us heading into the profession?

One more example, I shadowed a pediatrician in a pretty rural area of Georgia and one of the patients had a necklace of cut potatoes around her neck. I asked about it after the patient and her mother had gone and the physician said that the mother's folklore was that if a baby is acting sick, you put this around their neck and if the potatoes become darkened and the baby is still sick, it is time to take the baby to the doctor.

Well, clearly this is a version of give it a couple days and then go to the doctor. I am rambling a bit here - but would love really like to hear advice from others in the medical field regarding issues of diversity that we pre-med's should think about.

Thanks.
 
This brings up something I have been giving thought to lately. Of course as physicians there must be respect for diversity. But I remember, for example, once my father (a professor) told his graduate student that this was America and in America we do not hit our wives, period. The culture of my father's graduate student felt otherwise. Anyway, what advice about diverse and culturally different issues do the experienced on this board have for those of us heading into the profession?

One more example, I shadowed a pediatrician in a pretty rural area of Georgia and one of the patients had a necklace of cut potatoes around her neck. I asked about it after the patient and her mother had gone and the physician said that the mother's folklore was that if a baby is acting sick, you put this around their neck and if the potatoes become darkened and the baby is still sick, it is time to take the baby to the doctor.

Well, clearly this is a version of give it a couple days and then go to the doctor. I am rambling a bit here - but would love really like to hear advice from others in the medical field regarding issues of diversity that we pre-med's should think about.

Thanks.
That's always a difficult balance to have. For things that are possibly of a criminal nature (for example, abuse) I think it is a doctor's duty to try to council their patient and notify the police (if any physicians want to correct my view, go ahead, I'm open to it). For harmless things (the potato on the neck) I would personally let it go. If it isn't causing harm to the patient, there is no issue.

On a similar note, if a God-believing patient says they want to treat their disease through prayer only, I would gently correct them by using their belief in their favor (saying something to the effect "in the Bible Jesus cured people by having them do things on their own, such as walking to the priests or bathing in the pool, so taking medication is part of what He expects you to do so you can improve"). In the end, it's the patients' choice to follow or not your instructions.
 
What are you going to say to a patient who says "I'm glad I'm saved" and dies the next day?

... that's not funny...
Anyways, I'm not as bat****crazy as you guys think I am.
While I don't like "religion," I have nothing against "religious people."
 
... that's not funny...
Anyways, I'm not as bat****crazy as you guys think I am.
While I don't like "religion," I have nothing against "religious people."
"I will have a problem with patients who thank god that they are cured instead of thanking physicians who actually did work"
 
@iWillOneDay
Not only have you completely derailed another thread, but now your causing users to leave SDN. Really hoping to be inb4ban.

But won't you miss me if I get banned?
And don't you think I'll just keep coming back?

I know that our views differ a lot but don't hate me just for that.
I may sound rude/condescending/bat****crazy or w/e on here but that's not really who I am.
Dr. House had some good parts to himself too.
I'm here to have fun and give advises based on my experience.

and isn't it fun having me around???
 
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"I will have a problem with patients who thank god that they are cured instead of thanking physicians who actually did work"

It's the religion that put those ideas into people. "Religious people," the people themselves aren't bad.
 
Guys... I'm back stronger than ever!
I was just gonna quit sdn but I think I'm addicted to it now. I'll stay on for a little more until I have things to do. And i think my posts give some laughter or something to wait for, for some people.
and thanks @AlteredScale for that link. Now it makes some people on this website more authentic/whotheysaytheyare.

I read all of your criticisms and ridicules. And i see the point in many of them. and cabin it seems like @cabinbuilder is a good (if not great) physician (food, shower, cab.. etc). Some of you guys are pretty funny, to say the least.
However, my views/thoughts/opinions do not change. Maybe it is my stubbornness? But you guys are pretty stubborn also...
I get that you have to generalize. That how most of us learn new things. We learn the general things and then learn the specifics in most cases. Sometime it's the reverse. Don't you agree?
But how do some of you not see the problem with saying "Treat with clindamycin at any sign of facial swelling.". How more blatant can someone say something?
(and I have no idea whey cabin changed abx back to clindamycin but...)

REALLY, I get the point of generalizing.
If someone has a right lower quadrant pain, it's generally something wrong with the appendix. Agree? Generally (I'm sure you can thing of many more things wrong in the RLQ). And we will order a CT of the abdomen.
But what if that person had an appendectomy in the past? It may be "rare" or it may be unlikely that a person who had an appendectomy will have RLQ pain but do you just go ahead and put them through radiation just because in most cases/in most people it's something wrong with the appendix? (not saying cabin doesn't look at patients' histories.)
Do I make myself clear?
I'm not saying you should question a physician ordering a CT to rule out an appendicitis but question him/her if she hasn't even looked at the person's history.
Am I so wrong to say you should consider things by case by case basis?
Cabin was generalizing patients with a symptom but giving out a specific method to treat a symptom.

As rude/bad/sarcasm as Dr. House may seem, he asks his members for opinions and thoughts on most, if not all cases (yes, he shoots most of them down but...). Even if he or someone thinks it's a common symptoms for a disease/ailment, he doesn't just jump to conclusion (I know this is a made up TV series...).

Some of you guys seem to live in some kind of a hierarchy society or something. Sure, what cabin said has much more value and insight in to medicine than what I had said. And maybe I am being nitpicky about what she said. Maybe I was just picking out that 1 "wrong" things (at least in my point of view, and some of you did agree in some sense) out of 1 million "right" things she said and went "extreme", which I do not think so because I was just pointing out that you can't just assume someone is not allergic or has bad reaction to (which is basically being allergic) a SPECIFIC antibiotic she mentioned to use in ANY circumstance involving facial swelling in a patient with dental pain.

"Antibiotics do not fight infections caused by viruses like colds, flu, most sore throats, bronchitis, and many sinus and ear infections. Instead, symptom relief might be the best treatment option for viral infections.
Get smart about when antibiotics are needed—to fight bacterial infections. When you use antibiotics appropriately, you do the best for your health, your family's health, and the health of those around you."
- http://www.cdc.gov/features/getsmart/
Yes, I know clindamycin is an appropriate abx in the cabin's situation and tooth pain isn't a viral problem but I saw a problem in the way she said to use a SPECIFIC abx quickly and many patients can become septic. More relevant things on the link. Not to mention overprescribing abx has lead to superbacteria/drug-resistance bacterias (along those lines...) becoming more common. That's part of evolution.

And the whole, taking things to extreme with giving out pain medication like candy. Do you guys not get sarcasm... I mean look at my avatar...
Not to point out that overprescribing pain medication is a HUGE problem in medicine.

"In a period of nine months, a tiny Kentucky county of fewer than 12,000 people sees a 53-year-old mother, her 35-year-old son, and seven others die by overdosing on pain medications obtained from pain clinics in Florida.1 In Utah, a 13-year-old fatally overdoses on oxycodone pills taken from a friend’s grandmother.2 A 20-year-old Boston man dies from an overdose of methadone, only a year after his friend also died from a prescription drug overdose.3
These are not isolated events. Drug overdose death rates in the United States have more than tripled since 1990 and have never been higher. In 2008, more than 36,000 people died from drug overdoses, and most of these deaths were caused by prescription drugs."
- http://www.cdc.gov/homeandrecreationalsafety/rxbrief/

I saw a problem in what cabin said and point out a problem that I thought would add to the conversation.
But you guys are the one who took things out of proportion and to extreme to say I am telling cabin how to practice. I'm wasn't and I'm not.
However, I would rather be stingy with pain medication (or any medications) and try to help patients otherwise.
Where did A.T. Still's philosophy go? Aren't most of us on this forum going to be OSTEOPATHIC physicians? Don't we learn that there is more to it than medications and surgeries?

Did I ever say you shouldn't learn how to splint? or you shouldn't use xray to r/o constipation? I didn't because I didn't see a problem in that. But I saw a problem in generalizing everyone to be the same and a problem about "not being stingy" with pain medications. I am sure I could have worded my original post to make it sound more appropriate.

I'm not trying to fight with you guys. And I'm sorry if you guys thought I was trying to be "that" pre-med. Trust me, I wasn't and I could do better if I wanted to.
I'm not here to tell physicians how to practice.
But I believe we all have the right to voice our opinions and thoughts. In an online setting, things don't reflect one's thought as accurately. I think we all know that.

Let me just finish my point with this EXTREME example that may or may not be relevant (this is going extreme).

Hundreds if not thousands of little kids are sexually molested by adults (even Catholic priests) every year. But (at least from what I know/read/heard) many of them never mention it or say something to anyone else because they believe what is done to them is okay since the molesters were older/"higher" than them.
They don't speak out and many of them are afraid to. They remain silent until it's too late to punish the molester.

Now, many of you guys will say "wtf? is he joking? what is wrong with iwilloneday?"
But please read between the lines.
My point is, just because someone is "higher" than you, has more experience, older, or has more authority doesn't mean you can't question them or point out wrong things.
I don't want my future colleagues, coworkers, staff, attendings, or students to think they can't voice their thought. Just like how you guys try to go against the requirements that hospitals put on you or your parents put on you.


Let the ridicules begin.
I will accepted constructive criticism but please READ it before you respond. and can we be more "civil" about this? Come on, seriously? You guys are just going to jump on the bandwagon?
What has this thread turn into...
This is almost like cyber bulling... 🙁

View attachment 186171


Thanks for reading. Love you guys. :kiss:

I want you to come back after med school and read this post of yours. Then I want you to come back after residency and read it again.

it's a joke because most people already know that I'm an atheist on SDN if they have read my previous posts...
and I will have a problem with patients who thank god that they are cured instead of thanking physicians who actually did work...

Wow. I won't even touch the level of disrespect for other people's beliefs on this one...

I suppose it was you that healed them, not the drug that a scientist invented, not the pharmacist who calculated the right dose, not the nurse who gave it and made sure the patient took it, just you and other physicians.

As much as I like the primary role physicians have in care, believing that your patients are living and dying solely by your hands is not really healthy. Recognize that you are dealing with life and death circumstances, so take your role seriously, but just because an emergent patient survived doesn't mean it was you that saved them (just as if a patient died, its not necessarily you that killed/failed them).

Also, life and medicine is not like House.
 
I want you to come back after med school and read this post of yours. Then I want you to come back after residency and read it again.



Wow. I won't even touch the level of disrespect for other people's beliefs on this one...

I suppose it was you that healed them, not the drug that a scientist invented, not the pharmacist who calculated the right dose, not the nurse who gave it and made sure the patient took it, just you and other physicians.

As much as I like the primary role physicians have in care, believing that your patients are living and dying solely by your hands is not really healthy. Recognize that you are dealing with life and death circumstances, so take your role seriously, but just because an emergent patient survived doesn't mean it was you that saved them (just as if a patient died, its not necessarily you that killed/failed them).

Also, life and medicine is not like House.

You don't like me do you...
I know what you are saying but we can get nitty picky all day if you want.
Should I thank the parents of those pharmacist? Their grandparents? Their elementary teachers?
Adam and eve?
The fact that you dont even try to grasp other people's views are mind-boggling.
 
You don't like me do you...
I know what you are saying but we can get nitty picky all day if you want.
Should I thank the parents of those pharmacist? Their grandparents? Their elementary teachers?
Adam and eve?
The fact that you dont even try to grasp other people's views are mind-boggling.

Actually, I don't dislike you, I just think that your views come off a bit uninformed and a touch close minded. I'm sure life experiences will change them, which is why I want you to return to this thread when you're a doc. We all say things in our early 20s that make us scratch our heads later in life.

I can't help but say that these bolded statements coming from you are a bit comical, given that your main premise in your responses in this thread are based on your being nitpicky and continued due to your inability to grasp what others mean.

Also, I meant for my response to be a bit hyperbolic so that you'd realize that what you said didn't quite make sense. Given your response it seems I failed.
 
Actually, I don't dislike you, I just think that your views come off a bit uninformed and a touch close minded. I'm sure life experiences will change them, which is why I want you to return to this thread when you're a doc. We all say things in our early 20s that make us scratch our heads later in life.

I can't help but say that these bolded statements coming from you are a bit comical, given that your main premise in your responses in this thread are based on your being nitpicky and continued due to your inability to grasp what others mean.

Also, I meant for my response to be a bit hyperbolic so that you'd realize that what you said didn't quite make sense. Given your response it seems I failed.

I know, after I wrote it, I was like "well... i nitpicky a lot of times too and there are times I don't consider others views".... hehe... but I wasn't going to edit out the mistake.
 
I know, after I wrote it, I was like "well... i nitpicky a lot of times too and there are times I don't consider others views".... hehe... but I wasn't going to edit out the mistake.
You should really exit the thread. Derailing threads is against the TOS. What could have been a good thread has ground to a halt because you won't stop spouting your beliefs, ironically in the face of people who had real world experience to contribute to answering the OP's question. Get back on topic before this thread gets locked.
 
You should really exit the thread. Derailing threads is against the TOS. What could have been a good thread has ground to a halt because you won't stop spouting your beliefs, ironically in the face of people who had real world experience to contribute to answering the OP's question. Get back on topic before this thread gets locked.
Ironic when you consider the venom he has towards religious people who do the same. Imagine that.
 
@iWillOneDay

This is off topic, but that doesn't appear to make a difference. Do you have any acceptances this cycle?
 
this is off topic, but I don't want to make a new thread. This thread is going way off topic anyway,

So, I am just going through sample MMIs for my upcoming interview and I am not really sure how I would deal with this one.

You are a 3rd year medical student on your outpatient internal medicine rotation. The attending physician tells you to see a patient, take a history, and perform a physical examination. You enter the room and introduce yourself. The patient states that he does not want to be seen by you and demands to be seen by a “real doctor.” How do you respond to the patient’s request? What do you say to the patient?

suggestions/comments/opinions?

thanks🙂🙂
 
OK, so do any docs feel like there are some inherent downsides to rural med that you didn't expect prior to doing it?

this is off topic, but I don't want to make a new thread. This thread is going way off topic anyway,

So, I am just going through sample MMIs for my upcoming interview and I am not really sure how I would deal with this one.

You are a 3rd year medical student on your outpatient internal medicine rotation. The attending physician tells you to see a patient, take a history, and perform a physical examination. You enter the room and introduce yourself. The patient states that he does not want to be seen by you and demands to be seen by a “real doctor.” How do you respond to the patient’s request? What do you say to the patient?

suggestions/comments/opinions?

thanks🙂🙂

Make a new thread or bump an old one (search something like "patient doesn't want medical student real doctor" and you'll probably find something). Derailing threads is against TOS.

Also, I'd explain that I'm a medical student and the attending asked for me to do X, Y, and Z prior to seeing you him/herself, is that alright? If they still say no, I'd thank them, leave the room and tell the attending.
 
this is off topic, but I don't want to make a new thread. This thread is going way off topic anyway,

So, I am just going through sample MMIs for my upcoming interview and I am not really sure how I would deal with this one.

You are a 3rd year medical student on your outpatient internal medicine rotation. The attending physician tells you to see a patient, take a history, and perform a physical examination. You enter the room and introduce yourself. The patient states that he does not want to be seen by you and demands to be seen by a “real doctor.” How do you respond to the patient’s request? What do you say to the patient?

suggestions/comments/opinions?

thanks🙂🙂
If I got asked that I think I'd **** bricks and just leave the interview. Truthfully I'd just respect the patient's wishes, because the patient always comes first.
 
Beliefs don't deserve respect, no matter what they are. They should always be open to criticism and debate. We must, however, respect the rights of people to hold beliefs, even if we don't agree with them. And where disagreement arrises, there is debate. However, debate has a time and a place and debating with a sick patient under you care, regarding their religious beliefs, is neither of those. @iWillOneDay , while I understand you position on religion, seeing as I hold similar views, your interactions with people on this forum reveal a lack of maturity on your part. Look at the way you speak to others and see if you'd want the same treatment. I know it's easy to get defensive, seeing as atheists like ourselves are often vilified, and I know you are just trying to put your mind out there but we must all be diplomatic, professional and kind to people, if not their ideas. So chill out.
That's all I have to say about that.


@cabinbuilder , that is certainly fascinating work you do. Thanks for sharing! Since we are on the topic...do faith and religion ever come into play with your work in rural populations? Is it generally a big part of the groups you tend to work with or do you generally not spend quite enough time in any one area to pick this up? Where I work there are frequent and often enthusiastic "praise jesus-es" and the like thrown around.

Additionally, could you please go into a bit more detail about how locums works? I suppose I don't have enough information to ask a more specific question than that. Thanks, doc!
 
@cabinbuilder , that is certainly fascinating work you do. Thanks for sharing! Since we are on the topic...do faith and religion ever come into play with your work in rural populations? Is it generally a big part of the groups you tend to work with or do you generally not spend quite enough time in any one area to pick this up? Where I work there are frequent and often enthusiastic "praise jesus-es" and the like thrown around.

Additionally, could you please go into a bit more detail about how locums works? I suppose I don't have enough information to ask a more specific question than that. Thanks, doc!
I'm not sure what you want me to say about religion. I was not brought up in any faith so I don't have a concept of what religion is supposed to do for me. I do understand that most people believe in a religion and I am ok if it works for them in the healing process. Healing is all about the power between mind and body so If one believes that their religion will heal them, then it will. Do I agree with that approach? No. But I am not one to dispute or argue about what an individual believes.

As far as how locums works? I have a few agencies who are privy to different parts of the country who have a doctor shortage. My agents get with me about the job that they are representing and tell me the details. I say yes or no as to whether to present me to the site. If the site accepts me as a temporary provider then I am bound by contract to go. Before I am presented I give my terms of availability, time off needed, etc. The hourly wage is determined before I am presented. Usually the site is minimum of 2 months with option to extend. The site pays all travel, housing, rental car. The locums company provides malpractice. If I show up and the job is not what was presented then I do have the option to leave. I am not bound by any entity. Not sure what questions you have exactly??
 
As far as how locums works? I have a few agencies who are privy to different parts of the country who have a doctor shortage. My agents get with me about the job that they are representing and tell me the details. I say yes or no as to whether to present me to the site. If the site accepts me as a temporary provider then I am bound by contract to go. Before I am presented I give my terms of availability, time off needed, etc. The hourly wage is determined before I am presented. Usually the site is minimum of 2 months with option to extend. The site pays all travel, housing, rental car. The locums company provides malpractice. If I show up and the job is not what was presented then I do have the option to leave. I am not bound by any entity. Not sure what questions you have exactly??
That's just it. I didn't have any specific questions. Thanks for clarifying, doc.
 
That's just it. I didn't have any specific questions. Thanks for clarifying, doc.
I will say that I go to a locums site to WORK. I request a minimum of 50 hours a week. If I'm going to be away from home then I want all the hours I can get. I am not there to sightsee. I am there to fill the gap and make money. Most times I work 70 hours a week. Just FYI. But I am not the norm.
 
I will say that I go to a locums site to WORK. I request a minimum of 50 hours a week. If I'm going to be away from home then I want all the hours I can get. I am not there to sightsee. I am there to fill the gap and make money. Most times I work 70 hours a week. Just FYI. But I am not the norm.
How would you describe the "norm"?
 
Cabin, I was sitting in on my Micro colleague's lecture the other day and wondered about this: what do you do for lab work when you need to take a culture? When I had a strep throat scare, all I had to do was go to my local HMO's lab and have the rapid strep test done right there. What do you do?


Well, most doctors want a "life" and work a 40 hours week and be able to "sightsee" at the location they are placed. That is not my goal, mine is solely to make money. I could care less about where the location is.
 
Cabin, I was sitting in on my Micro colleague's lecture the other day and wondered about this: what do you do for lab work when you need to take a culture? When I had a strep throat scare, all I had to do was go to my local HMO's lab and have the rapid strep test done right there. What do you do?
Most places I work at do have the CLIA waived rapid strep test. Of course that test only covers Group A strep. As many may not know there are other strep types that will come back positive on culture 3-4 days later. Groups B,C,D,F,G. I have seen all strains. Comes down to experience and looking at a person's throat and knowing the difference between bacterial, allergic, or viral pharyngitis. Anyone who has a fever, looks sick, throat has beefy red appearance, swelling of uvula, and/or exudates gets treated even if the rapid A is negative since 95% of the time the culture will be positive for a different strain. Same goes for UTI. I have rapid UA but cultures come back in 3-4 days.
 
Beliefs don't deserve respect, no matter what they are. They should always be open to criticism and debate. ...

The statement was more about respecting a person's right to their beliefs without persecution based on them, not about respecting the beliefs themselves. As you said, an idea/belief doesn't/can't deserve respect.

And there's certainly nothing wrong debating ideas 🙂
 
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