Chances at top tiered programs

[hotchik]

---

Members do not see this ad.

Wondering what my chances are at TOP tiered gen surg programs (MGH, BWH, Hopkins, UCSF, etc), or even top tired integrated CT programs (i.e. columbia, stanford, etc).

Stats:
MedSchool: Top 10-15
Step 1: 260
Step 2: will take later
Research: 1 publication (co-author) cards, 2 first author poster presentation cards (one at a nationally recognized meeting), 1st author abstract (cards), 1st author publication pending cards, working on another project if data comes back conclusive will possibly have another 1st author pub (cards)
LOR: moderate to very strong

Downside to application:
- will not get AOA probably
- pass/fail school
- research in internal medicine and pediatric fields rather than surgery 🙁

Please give me whatever insight you guys have at the TOP programs...should I take a year off for additional research in surgery related fields? How can I improve my application within the next 6 months?

Career goals:academics cardiac transplant or cardiac congenital surgeon (thus shooting for MGH/BWH/UCSF) --> if not, then I wanna do something along the lines as Dr. Oz lol jk

Thanks in advance for any advice!

 

[SouthernSurgeon]

I hate responding to these threads, but I'm awake so here goes:

As a female applicant from a top medical school with a through the roof board score and a pretty impressive research resume for a student, you will be an extremely competitive applicant for general surgery.

Your research is impressive because as a student you have produced results (multiple pubs, presentations). The field of the research is less important than that you have success I. This area.

Things you can do to improve your app - work on LORs - you say your LORs are "moderate" - that should be addressed by carefully selecting your sub-is to get good letters from well known attendings.

As for integrated CT - you need to make a decision whether that is the route you want to go. The requirements/expectations, particularly regarding research within the field. I'm far from an expert when it comes to CT; if you are trying to match in that you need to find a good mentor at your school ASAP.

 

[Winged Scapula]

So I take it you've changed your mind about orthopedic surgery?

 

[hotchik]

Haha thanks for the response. It went days without hearing back from anyone, but yea, I'll take ur advice and work on LORs with Sub-Is...

and actually yes, I would prefer to do CT (in a perfect world, I would love to go to a I6 CT program, rather than do a 5-7 yr gen surg --> 2-3 yrs CT surg fellowship, but am fine with the longer route as long as it takes me to the same final destination), I will start a mentor search right now

I hate responding to these threads, but I'm awake so here goes:

As a female applicant from a top medical school with a through the roof board score and a pretty impressive research resume for a student, you will be an extremely competitive applicant for general surgery.

Your research is impressive because as a student you have produced results (multiple pubs, presentations). The field of the research is less important than that you have success I. This area.

Things you can do to improve your app - work on LORs - you say your LORs are "moderate" - that should be addressed by carefully selecting your sub-is to get good letters from well known attendings.

As for integrated CT - you need to make a decision whether that is the route you want to go. The requirements/expectations, particularly regarding research within the field. I'm far from an expert when it comes to CT; if you are trying to match in that you need to find a good mentor at your school ASAP.

 

[hotchik]

Yea, I've decided to follow my interest (cardiac), rather than following a bandwagon, despite the poor outlook of CT surg ATM.

Besides I kinda like the idea of being in an underdog field and trying to revive interest in it with new research and cool ideas, which is why i'm aiming for academics.

But yea, gotta follow what you love!

So I take it you've changed your mind about orthopedic surgery?

 

[djommy2005]

Because I do not know enough about these integrated programs, but do I6 allows you to a subsequent fellowship in pediatric cardiac surgery or transplant?

 

[Buzz Me]

Yea, I've decided to follow my interest (cardiac), rather than following a bandwagon, despite the poor outlook of CT surg ATM.

Out of curiosity, why do you say this? What have you heard?

I'm asking because what I thought was the "future" or "outlook" of CT Surg has changed quite a bit depending on where I was in my training (i.e. pre-med vs. med student vs. junior resident vs. senior resident vs. fellow).

 

[Buzz Me]

Because I do not know enough about these integrated programs, but do I6 allows you to a subsequent fellowship in pediatric cardiac surgery or transplant?

Yes.

 

[hotchik]

Out of curiosity, why do you say this? What have you heard?

I'm asking because what I thought was the "future" or "outlook" of CT Surg has changed quite a bit depending on where I was in my training (i.e. pre-med vs. med student vs. junior resident vs. senior resident vs. fellow).

You're absolutely correct, outlook of CT surgery varies depending on where you are at in your training. So what I meant that currently, from what I have heard from residents and attendings at my institution, graduating CT fellows are having trouble finding jobs (decent paying with reasonable work hours). One of the gen surg chief residents that I know initially planned to go into CT surg, but switched to plastics because within 3 or so years, he predicted difficulty in finding good jobs.He said when rotating through CT surg department, all the fellows were unhappy due to long work hours and not being able to find a job. And as there have been posts here on SDN, there are some graduating fellows doing extra fellowships just to have a job.

Despite this, there was an article published recently in the CTS journal predicting a shortage of cardiac surgeons by 2020. Even though this will be the time I graduate if I am able to go the I6 route, the reason I say "poor outlook" is because this is "predicted". All you have to base your job outlook is the current trends. If you can predict the future, you might as well play the stock market instead of being a doctor.

But yeah, that's what I've heard about CT surg, but don't mind because its where my interests lie. Hopefully these are just myths, but somewhere in my mind, I doubt it. I am however content with 150K as long as I am doing what I love.

Because you're a 1st year CT fellow, you've obviously did your research, and probably know something that we don't. Could you enlighten me with any good news regarding the future outlook of CT surg?

 

[orangesky38]

I know the job market issue was big ~5 years ago but I heard it's changed a lot in recent years, in that if you go to a good program, there's not a big issue. And as you said I have also heard the "shortage of CT surgeons by 2020" thing.

 

[Buzz Me]

So what I meant that currently, from what I have heard from residents and attendings at my institution, graduating CT fellows are having trouble finding jobs (decent paying with reasonable work hours). One of the gen surg chief residents that I know initially planned to go into CT surg, but switched to plastics because within 3 or so years, he predicted difficulty in finding good jobs.He said when rotating through CT surg department, all the fellows were unhappy due to long work hours and not being able to find a job. And as there have been posts here on SDN, there are some graduating fellows doing extra fellowships just to have a job.

May be program-specific. I asked about this two years ago on the interview trail, asked again when I started fellowship a year ago and when I went to the CT Surg "bootcamp" (for first-year fellows) where you meet up with the majority of other first-year fellows around the country, as well as faculty from all over.

What I can tell you is, for the vast majority of graduates these days, jobs aren't anywhere near as hard to come by as they were 5-10 years ago. Of course, it also depends on location, academics vs. private practice, and whether you're interested in cardiac vs. thoracic vs. both vs. congenital. Some people do an additional year of superfellowship if they want to do academics and need a "niche," e.g. aortas, or VADs/Txp, or minimally invasive esophagectomies, or robotics. Some 2-year programs don't (and, quite honestly, can't) fully prepare you to be an independently operating cardiac attending in those 24 months.

From the people I've talked to, and the graduating fellows here, and the graduating fellows in all 7 years where I went to residency? No probs.

 

[Wustenfuchs]

Wondering what my chances are at TOP tiered gen surg programs (MGH, BWH, Hopkins, UCSF, etc), or even top tired integrated CT programs (i.e. columbia, stanford, etc).

Stats:
MedSchool: Top 10-15
Step 1: 260
Step 2: will take later
Research: 1 publication (co-author) cards, 2 first author poster presentation cards (one at a nationally recognized meeting), 1st author abstract (cards), 1st author publication pending cards, working on another project if data comes back conclusive will possibly have another 1st author pub (cards)
LOR: moderate to very strong

Downside to application:
- will not get AOA probably
- pass/fail school
- research in internal medicine and pediatric fields rather than surgery 🙁

Please give me whatever insight you guys have at the TOP programs...should I take a year off for additional research in surgery related fields? How can I improve my application within the next 6 months?

Career goals:academics cardiac transplant or cardiac congenital surgeon (thus shooting for MGH/BWH/UCSF) --> if not, then I wanna do something along the lines as Dr. Oz lol jk

Thanks in advance for any advice!

I think you got just what it takes to be next medical crook on tv. Just focus on that and don't even think of acquiring skills you'll never utilize...