Chances for a DO

[MountainDeW]

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[AdmiralChz]

Your SO is better off asking directly, to be honest. But to answer your question!

Repeating first year can be overcome, but continuing poor performance (fail on surgery rotation) is a tough sell. For MD programs USMLEs will absolutely need to be taken, and a strong performance is a must (I am not familiar with COMLEX scoring). One thing I've learned being on our admission committee is that DO school matters as well.

She should start to get some Anesthesiology exposure and ensure strong letters in the field. She should focus on community-based programs that are DO-friendly - reaching out to recent graduates may be helpful as well. Honestly it's going to be tough, and this is a case where it might be a good idea to set up an away rotation or two at targeted, realistic programs.

 

[gasdocSF1991]

Repeating a year + failing a surgery rotation + DO student=no chance, unless she kills her boards (hard to see that happening with history of failing) and wants to go to a bottom-tier program. And even then, still a low chance.

 

[didiee]

Just did a quick google search. Complex avg score is 500. With all the red flags it will be a very very tough road ahead.
But never say never. Need probably something special that will get her interview somewhere, because she already lost in the numbers game. Maybe research at a big institution. Need to pay her dues somewhere.

 

[anesthesiadoc]

Any one of those variables (including the low comlex) would give a PD pause. The combo of the three renders the situation grim.


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[nimbus]

That application looks well within the bottom 0.1 percentile. I'd be concerned about matching period.

 

[Man o War]

That application looks well within the bottom 0.1 percentile. I'd be concerned about matching period.

Agreed. She should take any residency she can get. I'd be shocked if she got an anesthesia spot.

 

[Consigliere]

Hi all,

I am trying to help out my SO in getting into an anesthesiology program. I would appreciate any advice or programs that she'd be competitive for. She is a DO and hasn't taken any of the USMLE. Comlex is 443. Hasnt taken Comlex 2. Red flags: had to repeat first year bc she failed 3 classes, failed her first 3rd yr rotation (surgery). Anyone have any advice on if anesthesiology is still possible for her and if so what programs she should be aiming for? Thanks

Not to be harsh but hell no. Anesthesiology is dead anyway and only getting worse. She'll have a rough time getting into a family practice residency with that history.

 

[pocafx]

I didn't want to create another simple thread, so ill ask in here.

I am DO student. 225 on usmle 1, 630 on Comlex 1. Do I need to take USMLE step2 for application competitiveness or can I just apply with step 1?

 

[Pharmado]

Unfortunately she's not going to make it past the initial application screen. It wouldn't be impossible for her to get into anesthesia by a backdoor method, perhaps getting an advanced spot after a killer intern year, but there's no way that she will match now. I would be surprised if she were even offered any interviews. There is the possibility that she could do a rotation at a non-competitive program (LSU Shreveport or the likes) and impress them, but even that seems unlikely. She has a long road ahead of her to match at all. She should focus on a solid FM or IM program that is not as competitive (look at small rural programs and do a rotation there while in med school) and work first to get a residency position. There are a ton of IMG's just waiting to come in and take spots from people like her who have applications that have red flags.

 

[Pharmado]

I didn't want to create another simple thread, so ill as in here.

I am DO student. 225 on usmle 1, 630 on Comlex 1. Do I need to take USMLE step2 for application competitiveness or can I just apply with step 1?

pocafx: take step 2. Your USMLE step 1 is average. It likely will get you past the computer screen, but it isn't going to lock you in. Take step 2, do well and you should be on track to match.

 

[MountainDeW]

Appreciate all the advice! I will let her know

 

[AdmiralChz]

On second thought with new information (very below average COMLEX), this individual is in danger of not graduating DO school. An MD residency at all will be very, very difficult to obtain if not totally out of the question. I'd have to say anesthesiology is out of the question (even for a DO program) without some sort of miraculous turnaround. Graduating medical school has to be priority number one, because starting 3rd year with a fail in a rotation is a bad omen.

 

[AdmiralChz]

I didn't want to create another simple thread, so ill ask in here.

I am DO student. 225 on usmle 1, 630 on Comlex 1. Do I need to take USMLE step2 for application competitiveness or can I just apply with step 1?

225 USMLE step 1 is average to slightly below which is fine but won't turn heads, 630 on COMLEX is solid but most MD programs won't know (or care) about that number. I'd take Step 2 and aim for a stronger score this summer before interview seasons. You'll need it anyway before rank lists and its easier to take while the rotations/shelf exams are fresh in your memory.

 

[sethco]

How does one fail a third year rotation in DO school? Honest question, as I am curious. Do they take shelf exams now because I didn't when I was going through PCOM?

 

[Scotty_G]

DO schools take shelf exams after each core rotation yes.

 

[Chip N Sawbones]

How does one fail a third year rotation in DO school? Honest question, as I am curious. Do they take shelf exams now because I didn't when I was going through PCOM?

Failing a rotation is quite possible. I'm not a DO, but I failed surgery despite passing each part of the rotation, including the shelf exam. The grading policy for the course was set up so students needed a 61 to pass the shelf (national mean was ~75) but an average grade of 80 to pass the rotation. My shelf score was low but passing, I got a bad but passing evaluation from one of the surgeons I worked with, and everything averaged out to a 79. I thought that it was ridiculous that I could pass everything but still fail. The surgeon I worked with the most with agreed with me completely, since he knew I was busting my ass when I was working for him. He wanted to go back and change his grade enough to boost my overall average enough to pass. On other rotations this is fairly common, usually to bump up the grades of deserving students to high pass or honors. It turned out that surgeons at my school are no longer allowed to change grades, since too many of them were dropping grades in retribution for bad feedback they'd received from students. So, I had to repeat the entire two month rotation, and I ended up working with students who were slacking off way more than I ever did but still had no trouble passing. Because of my experience the grading policy for the surgery rotation got changed two months after this happened to me when a new department head stepped in, but it didn't help me much.

From my experience, the way to fail a rotation is:
1. Do all your 3rd year rotations at a different site from your main campus, with a different rotation director.
2. Don't work as hard as you possibly can when you get assigned to a surgeon who turns out to be known for giving bad grades to all his students.
3. Work really hard the next month and do a pretty good job both in the OR and managing patients.
4. Pass the shelf and the oral exam, but not by much.
It'll only cost you an extra year until you match. Hopefully you can learn from my mistakes.