So to clarify, if an intern is using the restroom, running 5 minutes late or feeling sick or something that causes him/her to miss role call at the beginning of a shift, he/she should just not show up at all? If you get 0 credit for missing 5 minutes of an entire shift, then it would make sense to just not show up. I've never had a job where that's the case.
I'd love to have one of my students or residents tell me that in the OR. If you scrub out for a bathroom break, it'd better be either the most dire GI/GU circumstance, or after I as surgeon have offered you a chance for a bathroom break during a stupidly long case.
Don't see how you even come to that logical conclusion. If there were a clause in a resident's contract saying "Pay will be docked for bathroom breaks," but the intern takes a full day's pay, then that would be comparable. OP knew going in that credit was contingent upon being present for the attendance check, tried to get around it, and got caught. Stupidly harsh punishment, but oh well.
I'm not trying to be argumentative, I'm just trying to put this into perspective. It seems a bit far-fetched to me that having a friend sign you in while you use the restroom is indicative of becoming a dishonest doctor. As a young professional, I can't imagine using the restroom while at work ever being an issue. If I'm a few minutes late to work because I used the restroom a few doors down from my suite, no one cares.
Yeah except no one believes the OP's story.
Yeah. In my school, it's an automatic IA for using someone else's clicker to give them attendance points.
Full honor code violation at my med school
I understand why they do it. In classes with 400+ 20 yr olds, the truth is many would try and cheat on attendance points if they thought they could get away with it.
What does that mean exactly? Suspension plus IA?
it means you have to sit in front of the "do you get to stay" committee...it gets pretty subjective at that point but it's not a good risk
I went to a military college where we spent much of our freshman year following dumb rules and getting yelled at a lot. One time a guy in my unit broke a dumb rule, and admitted he simply didn't feel like following it. The cadre then made his follow every statement he made in their presence with "The rules don't apply to me!" It was hilarious for the rest of us.
Really?
Question, do they put this on the syllabus or otherwise tell you?
We got the standard spiel about academic integrity in the syllabus. The first day of class, the Professor usually says that clicking in for others is cheating, will be treated as such, and is unfair to those who come to class every day. I used to roll my eyes when they told us that they had to do it or everyone would be cheating on attendance on a massive scale. After reading some of the posts from above, I see where they're coming from. I'm not judging anyone, I just am a little surprised that cheating (even on a very small scale) is so normalized. Maybe it's a generational thing? Has it slowly crept into the academia over time? I'm not sure. I am inclined to think it's not really a big deal. But then I see the individuals I knew in undergrad who got others to do their HW embellishing their apps to med schools. Again, I'm not saying that this will apply to everyone who skips attendance, just that these individuals are more likely to be dishonest in more serious scenarios down the road.
Interesting, We never got any threats about the clickers.
I won't go through it point-by-point, but the loopholes you mentioned are closed at my school. They are really, really hard on cheating. One time a kid stole someone else's HW, erased their name, wrote in his own, and turned it in. When he was caught, the biology department put up posters of him (with his face blurred out, of course) on the doors of our giant lecture halls. It said something along the lines of "I was caught stealing someone else's HW and was expelled as a result. Don't be like me!" They've done this before. I don't know if I agree with the tactics, but cheating does seem to be relatively rare at my alma mater.
That's pretty intense. I can't really complain about a lack of cheating though..it seems to be effective at your school.
Oh, I'd keep my mouth shut and, if no other option presented itself, I'd still attend that school - I'm not going to let their poor decisions delay my career - but that doesn't make it a good policy.
Thank you. I'm a terrible auditory learner and can't pay attention in class for the life of me. I wish more profs realized that attendance does not always equal more effective learning.
Fair enough - I suppose I have never had a course with required attendance that wasn't a large lecture (like 40+ people), so I was mainly referring to that.
That would suck, but it doesn't justify requiring even more people to spend time on something that wasn't helpful.
You'd be surprised how little that reflects maturity. Not that I agree with the policy...
Technically it was cheating, for which he took an F rather than face more serious consequences.
Yes. It was only worth a stinking point and he gamed it anyway.
