Child psychiatry in Miami

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miamichildpsych

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Hi everyone! Just wanted to put up a post for everyone out there that might be applying for child psychiatry fellowship….I’m one of the child fellows at the University of Miami, finishing this year. I remember applying 2 years ago, having a lot of questions and not really feeling sure of what I wanted to do. UM is an excellent training sight, with a diverse patient population, psychopathology and many attendings with different areas of expertise. We have 5 positions every year and the faculty are really committed to didactics and making sure that time is protected. I’m so happy here and I’d be happy to answer any questions you may have about our program here at UM, or just any questions in general about applying to Child and adolescent fellowship—Feel free to PM me!

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Thanks for taking the time to do this.

Is research required when applying to C&A fellowships?

What was the call schedule like at UM and at other programs you interviewed at?

Is it really a buyer's market, i.e. you can basically pick where you want to go?
 
No worries, happy to do it 🙂

Research is not required when applying, but I think it does enhance your application and programs definitely like it; some more than others. It doesn't have to be a huge under-taking--- even if you can help out with a project that someone else is doing- that can go on your CV.
The call varies by program. Most places I looked at had call from home- basically, you are called to approve transfers to inpatient. At Miami, you share the call between the 5 first year fellows- so you are on every fifth week. For us, we come into the hospital if there are any admissions to the inpatient unit on Saturday or Sunday. Some days there are none, sometimes there are 1-3. The adult psychiatric emergency room covers any emergencies on the inpatient unit, so you don't have to come in or get called in the middle of the night (phew!). During the week, you're available by phone to approve transfers to inpatient from other community hospitals (literally requires one minute on the phone).

Second year fellows have no call- yay!!

I'd say, yes, it is a buyer's market in my opinion. I chose a program that has an awesome location and awesome training. I wanted to live on the beach and enjoy life, but I also wanted to feel confident when I went into the "real world." I think Miami is ideal for those things 🙂Hope that helps!
 
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-You mind commenting the personality of the attendings and the overall culture of the program?
- What percentage of the patients are primarily spanish speaking?
- How many of your fellows speak English as their primary language?

Thanks.
 
Sure.
The culture of the program is definitely very collegiate and friendly. We cover calls for each other and people are happy to help cover each other in clinical duties when "life" comes up. We do frequent events together- work-related and non-work-related 🙂 The attendings are very supportive and host many of the outside-of-work get-togethers. For example, the chief of our division threw a welcome party at his house a few weeks ago. We've also done many happy hours, dinners and beach days. We also go to academic events together- like the APA and AACAP. The attendings care that we get along and like each other and they are supportive of that 🙂
Re patients' language- I'd say most patients are able to speak English. There are some that cannot- maybe 10%??? (very rough estimate). However, we do have a phone language line in every office that has immediate availability of interpreters for multiple languages (including Spanish and Creole, of course).
Almost all of our fellows speak English as their first language. Actually, in my class, no one speaks any Spanish.
Hope that helps!
 
What types of jobs have fellows taken in recent years? Can you comment on salary expectations?

From what you have seen, what percentage of PP child and adolescent psychiatrists generally see children and adolescents, versus adults?

How do you deal with patients whose behavioral problems are largely due to environment, i.e. foster care, bad parenting, etc? I feel like no amount of anti-psychotics will fix this, and is a bit of a sticking point for me in this field of psychiatry.

Do you feel that C&A psych is more therapy than medication management?
 
What types of jobs have fellows taken in recent years? Can you comment on salary expectations?

From what you have seen, what percentage of PP child and adolescent psychiatrists generally see children and adolescents, versus adults?

How do you deal with patients whose behavioral problems are largely due to environment, i.e. foster care, bad parenting, etc? I feel like no amount of anti-psychotics will fix this, and is a bit of a sticking point for me in this field of psychiatry.

Do you feel that C&A psych is more therapy than medication management?
I obviously have nothing to say about Florida, but I can say this about my program:

3 out of 4 fellows in my southwest fellowship who graduated last year are doing telepsychiatry due to the geographical flexibility it gave them for their own personal reasons. I think they are doing only child psychiatry. They aren't making any more than most adult psychiatrists or other child psychiatrists from what they told me. They are on call a lot. Fellows the year before that mostly went into private practice and are now working very hard, and are earning a bit more than the median adult psychiatry employed jobs, but not massively more. They are really busy so I haven't seen them around much anymore at the University.

You are right medications do not solve all behavioral problems. ADHD is the bread and butter of child psych, our "otitis media", and is often co-morbid with Oppositional Defiant Disorder. How do we treat ODD? First we treat the ADHD and aggression with medication, then work on the parenting and behavior in therapy. It is hard to parent, and even harder if you are an ill equipped or uneducated parent or a parent that has his/her own psychiatric illness.
Treatment for ODD is generally behavioral psychotherapy that includes the parent (Parent Child Interaction Therapy), Parent Management Training, family therapy, maybe some cognitive therapy.

We do PCIT, PMT, and other therapy in my program during training, but increasingly we seem to be doing less and less therapy and more medication management and referring patients for psychotherapy with a social worker or psychologist. The effectiveness of the social workers and psychologists we refer patients to is poor in comparison to the outcomes I've seen in our University fellow clinic. Outpatient psychiatrists in this area don't seem to do PCIT or PMT much. Psychotherapy with both parent and child is difficult work, and is not more lucrative than medication management. Many patients don't have the insurance coverage or cash available for therapy. Most often the single mother, low income parent that needs PCIT wants a pill that solves the problem immediately instead of doing therapy work.

In short, C&A is more medication management and less therapy these days, just like adult psychiatry.
I assume it is probably the same in Florida?
 
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3 out of 4 fellows in my southwest fellowship who graduated last year are doing telepsychiatry due to the geographical flexibility it gave them for their own personal reasons.

Could you possibly expand a little more on the telepsychiatry part? Does your program have an active telepsych program or is this a private practice deal? How are they being reimbursed?
 
Hi everyone! Just wanted to put up a post for everyone out there that might be applying for child psychiatry fellowship….I’m one of the child fellows at the University of Miami, finishing this year. I remember applying 2 years ago, having a lot of questions and not really feeling sure of what I wanted to do. UM is an excellent training sight, with a diverse patient population, psychopathology and many attendings with different areas of expertise. We have 5 positions every year and the faculty are really committed to didactics and making sure that time is protected. I’m so happy here and I’d be happy to answer any questions you may have about our program here at UM, or just any questions in general about applying to Child and adolescent fellowship—Feel free to PM me!

I didn't know UM had child psych. I rotated through the child psych at Miami Children's
 
Fellows take various jobs depending on their interests. Completing C&A fellowship really opens up the possibilities, and also results in higher salaries, even in adult jobs. I have friends who chose to stay in academics- one involved mostly in eating disorders and the other working with PDD/autistic outpatients, to give specific examples. Some of my friends do only outpatient, with a mix of adult and child. I have a few that have opened private practices and are doing well. Some are doing therapy, some doing analytic training... the list goes on and on.
Salary is very dependent on location and inpatient vs outpatient. I can only comment on starting salaries, as my friends are recent grads.... In Miami, I have heard a starting range from $140-225,000. Now, if you are willing to move to somewhere in the midwest that is under-served and desperate for C&A psychiatrists, you can expect in the $200-300,000 range. Child psychiatrists generally make $10-20,000 more per year. Please know that this has been what I have heard from friends! I am still in training myself, so this is definitely not an official salary and I’m sure there are ppl making more or less! 🙂
Most PP docs see 50/50- adult and child. Most like to b/c of the variety. Some see adults to keep their practice afloat during the summer, when many children are on vacation and may not take meds (specifically ADHD meds which are our bread and butter for child).
Honestly, I have been trained to NOT give medications to treat an environmental problem. We have the choice to do individual or family therapy ourselves and we are trained in this. Mostly though, I refer to in-home options for family therapy. We also work closely with schools and teachers to ensure kids are in the right classes and that they receive the services they need in school to be successful. Most child psychiatrists that I meet and know use medication sparingly and only when absolutely necessary. No one likes giving psychotropic meds to kids 🙁
I choose to do more therapy b/c I like it 🙂 Some of my colleagues do not, and they are happy seeing ADHD, PDD kids w/ Axis I comorbidities who need meds- there are plenty of these. They refer to psychology or to other fellows for therapy. We balance each other out. If you enjoy therapy, completing C&A training makes you a better therapist overall- you have a hands-on understanding of development and how pathology develops. Honestly, you can do pretty much whatever you enjoy- C&A fellowship and board certification opens so many doors, increases overall salary and makes you a "hot commodity" in the job market. It really gives you a lot more freedom and opportunity.

And yes!!! UM has a large child psych program!! 🙂
 
I don't actually have an interest in CAP (or I do but won't be pursuing it as a fellowship), but I'm finding this thread very enlightening. Thanks for the input...
 
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