Originally posted by alexPDX
No offense, but reading your statements I realize that your logic is haphazard at best. Do I have a solution for improoving human condition? Sure I do, but so does everyone else. The problem is that each of us has a different take on what it takes to make our world better. Most likely not one person or group has the whole answer. So don?t tell me that Christianity as we know it IS the answer, when history demonstrates that attempts to ?bring people to God? ended with abuse, suffering, and murder. The number of people who suffered because of religious persecution is vastly higher than the victims of any other social turmoil. And I think that most Christians today realize and recognize that everyone has the right to his or her own set of beliefs, or lack of thereof. Everyone agrees that today?s society has serious problems. But to say that a certain religion and its morals (by the way, Christianity does not have the exclusivity to the term; there are other philosophies of life that are ?moral.?) has the answer to humanities woes, shows a surprising lack of historical insight.
Also, to imply that if you?re not religious you are immoral and unethical is preposterous. But, of course, you will retort with ?I?m not saying that.? Well, what ARE you exactly saying.
oh dont worry, you cant offend me
😀
well you said:
"when history demonstrates that attempts to ?bring people to God? ended with abuse"
this is actually getting old. lets see how many times in just this thread i have said "what i am trying to say" shall we?
1) now what did i say ... all this time - you cant make someone believe in God if they refuse. why is that? seems easy to convince many ppl of many things... but not God... interesting to say the least.
2) guys i have said this time and time again, you cant make someone convert to something, and i am not trying to do that nor could i do that even if i wanted to. if someone is trying to make you convert to whatever, then they are doing everything all wrong. not all christians are like that. i am not like that.
3) Christianity is about Jesus. Jesus died on the cross for all of us. It is your choice to choose to accept that or not.
4) you are right, if a doc is trying to convert a dieing patient by scaring them, that is wrong. i would never do that. but if i found a patient open to talk about God, then yes, i would definitely talk about it.
5) you cannot convert someone, it is their choice to do something...
6) have you actually been out there on religious missions?? the ones ive seen... missions give help to everyone... during and after their work they are voluntarily asked about God and such... its amazing... these people WANT to know about God... kinda makes you think that maybe the missionaires would be better used here in usa where it is wrong(??????) to be religious....
eh... so its in reverse chronological order, and i got tire of looking after 6...
the way that i see it, here is the arguement:
YOU SAY: christianity is bad because they force their religion on others
I SAY: christianity teaches us to follow the moral codes of the bible, and that to accept the fact that Jesus died for our sins on the cross is completely your choice-that nothing i say or anyone else says can make you believe.
then you repeat...
if you want to broadent the scope of this arguement go ahead but you are 'beating a dead horse' here so to speak...
religious persecution vs social turmoil?? hmm there is a good ice breaker hehe... check it out :
simple everyday social turmoil:
1) (abortions-25 yr history) -
http://www.nrlc.org/news/2001/NRL01/roe.html
estimated at more than 40,000,000 abortions since it became legal. and on average about 1.5million babies a year....
2) USA trivia - the most ppl ever died in American war (200 yr history)? When america was at war with itself! (sounds a bit like social turmoil to me) the estimated total death count is about 650,000 -
http://www.usahistory.com/trivia/historical/hc14d.htm