class concern

[psydstudent2020]

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We took a test on our laptops in one of our classes (psyd program). i saw some people on Facebook, word, etc. but wasn't sure if they were cheating or just being reckless. apparently someone told him a list of people who cheated. i know and can honestly say i did not cheat. i already told him messenger popped up on my mac when people texted me but i ignored it and he didn't seem to care. he just announced that if people don't come forward, then it's up to the program for however they want to punish but if they tell him, then it's up to him and he believes in forgiveness. now, i know i sound completely paranoid and that's okay, but i do not get along with my cohort and some of the master's students. maybe it's a personality flaw, but that's the fact of the matter and i just have this feeling they threw my name in there. especially since this whole ordeal i told someone two people who i know cheated in a different class. i regret saying names because I'm sure he went and told them and then they wanted revenge. we have a lot of, let's say, eccentric/dramatic people in this program for some reason and now idk if i should come forward to something i did not do, or risk being kicked out of the program. either way, could they really punish based on hearsay?

 

[erg923]

We took a test on our laptops in one of our classes (psyd program). i saw some people on Facebook, word, etc. but wasn't sure if they were cheating or just being reckless. apparently someone told him a list of people who cheated. i know and can honestly say i did not cheat. i already told him messenger popped up on my mac when people texted me but i ignored it and he didn't seem to care. he just announced that if people don't come forward, then it's up to the program for however they want to punish but if they tell him, then it's up to him and he believes in forgiveness. now, i know i sound completely paranoid and that's okay, but i do not get along with my cohort and some of the master's students. maybe it's a personality flaw, but that's the fact of the matter and i just have this feeling they threw my name in there. especially since this whole ordeal i told someone two people who i know cheated in a different class. i regret saying names because I'm sure he went and told them and then they wanted revenge. we have a lot of, let's say, eccentric/dramatic people in this program for some reason and now idk if i should come forward to something i did not do, or risk being kicked out of the program. either way, could they really punish based on hearsay?

Student/program handbook's will outline the university policy for student disciplinary actions (criteria, process, and procedure), as well the student's rights and the process for filling grievances. Read it.

Btw, is you professor a *****? Or has he just never heard of wifi and the internet?

 

[WisNeuro]

I mean they theoretically could punish based on hearsay, but you can always fight it. What's more concerning is the idiocy of a professor giving a test and allowing wifi-connected laptops to be used in the first place.

 

[psydstudent2020]

I mean they theoretically could punish based on hearsay, but you can always fight it. What's more concerning is the idiocy of a professor giving a test and allowing wifi-connected laptops to be used in the first place.

How would I even begin to fight it? There's no proof either way :/

 

[WisNeuro]

How would I even begin to fight it? There's no proof either way :/

Exactly, in the grievance process, they will have to justify their actions some way. If they cannot provide proof, it opens them up to a lawsuit. Administrators do not like lawsuits.

 

[psydstudent2020]

Student/program handbook's will outline the university policy for student disciplinary actions (criteria, process, and procedure), as well the student's rights and the process for filling grievances. Read it.

Btw, is you professor a *****? Or has he just never heard of wifi and the internet?

He just trusted us. He said he thinks he knows who did it based on their facial expression when he told the class. I'm pretty sure I looked upset because I was pissed I got a good grade that would not count!

 

[psydstudent2020]

Exactly, in the grievance process, they will have to justify their actions some way. If they cannot provide proof, it opens them up to a lawsuit. Administrators do not like lawsuits.

I couldn't afford a lawsuit and either way if someone tried to throw me under the bus and I fought it, I'm not sure if I could ever have a good relationship with the faculty again.

 

[erg923]

He said he thinks he knows who did it based on their facial expression when he told the class.

So, yes. You're professor is a *****.

 

[Pragma]

There is due process and your professor's accusations won't hold up without any evidence. Usually the policy for this sort of thing is buried on the university website somewhere, but take the time to see what your rights are.

Agreed re: Professor is a *****.

 

[WisNeuro]

I couldn't afford a lawsuit and either way if someone tried to throw me under the bus and I fought it, I'm not sure if I could ever have a good relationship with the faculty again.

Some schools have free legal counsel, although that would be less likely at a PsyD. Could always represent yourself.

 

[psydstudent2020]

There is due process and your professor's accusations won't hold up without any evidence. Usually the policy for this sort of thing is buried on the university website somewhere, but take the time to see what your rights are.

Agreed re: Professor is a *****.

I think they would hold it up without evidence because the program already said they will deal with the students if he doesn't.

 

[erg923]

I think they would hold it up without evidence because the program already said they will deal with the students if he doesn't.

Program attrition looks bad, especially to APA site visitors. While your professor is clearly a dufus, programs/universities do not take expelling students lightly, I assure you.

Just like criminal and civil law, the burden of proof lies with the state, not the accused, right? If there is no evidence you cheated (hearsay is not evidence), I'm not clear what you're so worried about?

A lot of this is sounds very high school to me. I would suggest getting back to work and not feed any drama.

 

[psych.meout]

So, yes. You're professor is a *****.

There is due process and your professor's accusations won't hold up without any evidence. Usually the policy for this sort of thing is buried on the university website somewhere, but take the time to see what your rights are.

Agreed re: Professor is a *****.

C'mon, you guys, it could just be that the professor is an incredible psychologist who can use facial expressions to deduce lying and cheating. Probably a former FBI profiler.

 

[psydstudent2020]

Program attrition looks bad, especially to APA site visitors. While your professor is clearly a dufus, programs/universities do not take expelling students lightly, I assure you.

Just like criminal and civil law, the burden of proof lies with the state, not the accused, right? If there is no evidence you cheated (hearsay is not evidence), I'm not clear what you're so worried about?

A lot of this is sounds very high school to me. I would suggest getting back to work and not feed any drama.

You're right. I had a falling out with some people who have already done some cut-throat things, hence why I was concerned. That on top of the whole "reasonable doubt" made me believe I would be screwed.

 

[psydstudent2020]

UPDATE: he told us to stay after our final and not to take our phones out, study for another class, anything. then after an hour he told us to stop where we were and that we could finish after his speech. He said that multiple students reported multiple different names of students who supposedly cheated. He said "I'm going to try my hardest to not get anyone kicked the F*** out of the program." He was extremely mad and it was so uncomfortable. People who weren't finished had to finish taking the exam after that in those conditions. Plus he gave us an exam from years prior that wasn't on anything we studied for. while we were taking it, he walked around the room continuously. He told us we had 15 minutes to email him therefore making it a "legal document" saying who cheated or anything we know. He said he's giving the list of names to the dean so they can start an "investigation." people talked to the dean and she laughed it off. so I feel he was just threatening us, or he's really delusional. the whole thing is stressful! I feel like I would tell people not to come to this program now. I felt like I couldn't laugh or cry because he would think I cheated or something. I just never heard of this happening anywhere else so I hope we're not alone in this kind of experience.

 

[Meteora]

I wouldn't be too worried, as all present evidence points to the likelihood that you are in an episode of The Twilight Zone.

 

[foreverbull]

UPDATE: he told us to stay after our final and not to take our phones out, study for another class, anything. then after an hour he told us to stop where we were and that we could finish after his speech. He said that multiple students reported multiple different names of students who supposedly cheated. He said "I'm going to try my hardest to not get anyone kicked the F*** out of the program." He was extremely mad and it was so uncomfortable. People who weren't finished had to finish taking the exam after that in those conditions. Plus he gave us an exam from years prior that wasn't on anything we studied for. while we were taking it, he walked around the room continuously. He told us we had 15 minutes to email him therefore making it a "legal document" saying who cheated or anything we know. He said he's giving the list of names to the dean so they can start an "investigation." people talked to the dean and she laughed it off. so I feel he was just threatening us, or he's really delusional. the whole thing is stressful! I feel like I would tell people not to come to this program now. I felt like I couldn't laugh or cry because he would think I cheated or something. I just never heard of this happening anywhere else so I hope we're not alone in this kind of experience.

This sounds like School Ties, millennial version. Honestly, based on what you've said about your cohort and program, I'd stop trusting your peers and don't tell them anything from here on out. The drama might stop with empty threats from your professor. If not, the burden of proof is on your program to prove cheating, so hopefully you'll be okay. I'm sorry to hear that your program sounds so terrible....

 

[erg923]

UPDATE: he told us to stay after our final and not to take our phones out, study for another class, anything. then after an hour he told us to stop where we were and that we could finish after his speech. He said that multiple students reported multiple different names of students who supposedly cheated. He said "I'm going to try my hardest to not get anyone kicked the F*** out of the program." He was extremely mad and it was so uncomfortable. People who weren't finished had to finish taking the exam after that in those conditions. Plus he gave us an exam from years prior that wasn't on anything we studied for. while we were taking it, he walked around the room continuously. He told us we had 15 minutes to email him therefore making it a "legal document" saying who cheated or anything we know. He said he's giving the list of names to the dean so they can start an "investigation." people talked to the dean and she laughed it off. so I feel he was just threatening us, or he's really delusional. the whole thing is stressful! I feel like I would tell people not to come to this program now. I felt like I couldn't laugh or cry because he would think I cheated or something. I just never heard of this happening anywhere else so I hope we're not alone in this kind of experience.

No. You're not alone. My wife teaches 5th grade. Similar things happen there too. 🙄

If all this is true, your professor clearly has boundary issues. I don't know why you would be "mad" when students cheat. You follow policy and you move on. You don't go all teenage drama queen on them.

 

[deleted343839]

He said "I'm going to try my hardest to not get anyone kicked the F*** out of the program." He was extremely mad and it was so uncomfortable. People who weren't finished had to finish taking the exam after that in those conditions. Plus he gave us an exam from years prior that wasn't on anything we studied for. while we were taking it, he walked around the room continuously. He told us we had 15 minutes to email him therefore making it a "legal document" saying who cheated or anything we know. He said he's giving the list of names to the dean so they can start an "investigation."

This is kind of what I pictured in my head while reading this.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Agreed, this sounds like two separate issues: 1) your professor seems to be behaving pretty unprofessionally, and 2) the pervasive lack of trust regarding your classmates.

RE: point 1, at least the class is almost over. If you are somehow brought up to the dean, other posters have given great recs. I can't imagine the university pressing forward with any sort of formal discipline without either direct proof or your own confession. If they do, you should have options for recourse via university policy.

RE: point 2, not sure if there's much you can do other than make friends outside your cohort. It's not always fun, but it this whole situation offer an opportunity for some introspection to determine if there's anything you've done to foster those sorts of relationships with your classmates, and/or if you may be misinterpreting the situation. It's not always the case, but having difficulty getting along with a large proportion of your classmates (if this is the case), who are your future professional peers, may be an early indication of difficulties down the road once you finish your training and get out into the "real world."

 

[psydstudent2020]

Agreed, this sounds like two separate issues: 1) your professor seems to be behaving pretty unprofessionally, and 2) the pervasive lack of trust regarding your classmates.

RE: point 1, at least the class is almost over. If you are somehow brought up to the dean, other posters have given great recs. I can't imagine the university pressing forward with any sort of formal discipline without either direct proof or your own confession. If they do, you should have options for recourse via university policy.

RE: point 2, not sure if there's much you can do other than make friends outside your cohort. It's not always fun, but it this whole situation offer an opportunity for some introspection to determine if there's anything you've done to foster those sorts of relationships with your classmates, and/or if you may be misinterpreting the situation. It's not always the case, but having difficulty getting along with a large proportion of your classmates (if this is the case), who are your future professional peers, may be an early indication of difficulties down the road once you finish your training and get out into the "real world."

Thank you. I was close to a handful of them and witnessed firsthand how they talk about each other behind each other's backs and their own MI they are struggling with. I have found friends outside the cohort and have a very active dating life. So all is well, I just never thought this kind of drama would be relevant at this level. I actually considered it could be me contributing to it, and I'm sure I have in some ways, but they have started turning against each other lately.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Thank you. I was close to a handful of them and witnessed firsthand how they talk about each other behind each other's backs and their own MI they are struggling with. I have found friends outside the cohort and have a very active dating life. So all is well, I just never thought this kind of drama would be relevant at this level. I actually considered it could be me contributing to it, and I'm sure I have in some ways, but they have started turning against each other lately.

Sounds like a fairly toxic environment overall, unfortunately. But as you mentioned, you have friends outside the department, which can be a huge help in making it through grad school.

 

[michiganxoxo]

I'm in the same program, and in this class as well. I am not satisfied with how things have been handled thus far. I do not know of any "drama" that is going on, but we have a Facebook group for our cohort and someone got offended and asked us to stop posting "anxiety provoking memes" (memes about failing exams). A whole back-and-forth ensued with a few people and then someone suggested a survey to create "guidelines" for posting. Guidelines for posting in a Facebook group! I also do not feel like I am in a doctoral-level environment. However, the program is pretty solid itself and has given me multiple opportunities.

 

[psydstudent2020]

I'm in the same program, and in this class as well. I am not satisfied with how things have been handled thus far. I do not know of any "drama" that is going on, but we have a Facebook group for our cohort and someone got offended and asked us to stop posting "anxiety provoking memes" (memes about failing exams). A whole back-and-forth ensued with a few people and then someone suggested a survey to create "guidelines" for posting. Guidelines for posting in a Facebook group! I also do not feel like I am in a doctoral-level environment. However, the program is pretty solid itself and has given me multiple opportunities.

I PMed you.

 

[WisNeuro]

Gorram millennials. Reading things on SDN fairly consistently makes me ever so thankful for my graduate program.

 

[psych.meout]

Gorram millennials. Reading things on SDN fairly consistently makes me ever so thankful for my graduate program.

Thank you for giving me hope that my upcoming cohort and program won't be full of overly sensitive drama kings/queens.

 

[WisNeuro]

Thank you for giving me hope that my upcoming cohort and program won't be full of overly sensitive drama kings/queens.

I loved my cohort (mostly). It's been years and I still visit/get visited by old friends from grad school.

 

[PsychPhDone]

I loved my cohort (mostly). It's been years and I still visit/get visited by old friends from grad school.

Yup. Half my cohort was in my wedding party. My cohort was awesome.

 

[G Costanza]

I'm pretty confident I could call anyone from my cohort at any time for the rest of my life and they would help me out.

PhD power up!!!

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

I'm pretty confident I could call anyone from my cohort at any time for the rest of my life and they would help me out.

PhD power up!!!

The trick is to guest lecture/present at their Uni so you can visit AND get it paid for by their dept.

 

[psych.meout]

The trick is to guest lecture/present at their Uni so you can visit AND get it paid for by their dept.

I learn so much from you awesome mofos.

 

[EmotRegulation]

The trick is to guest lecture/present at their Uni so you can visit AND get it paid for by their dept.

Ha, I literally just did this last month with one of my BFFs from grad school (not technically my cohort, but still). And I've had several come visit ME this way, give a talk, get travel paid for and then we hang out for a few days. It's so great. Now trying to figure out how to make this work for my more clinically oriented friends....

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Ha, I literally just did this last month with one of my BFFs from grad school (not technically my cohort, but still). And I've had several come visit ME this way, give a talk, get travel paid for and then we hang out for a few days. It's so great. Now trying to figure out how to make this work for my more clinically oriented friends....

1. Outcome-based research (based on their clinical population). This would take a bit of planning, but these trips take awhile to get approved anyway.

2. Program improvement (about a group they run) might work if pitched right.

3. Give a talk on a specific intervention (e.g. Behavioral Intervention in X-setting, Prolonged Exposure Therapy).

4. Something to do with collaborating across depts and/or disciplines. If they can talk from the clinical side, it may be helpful to the mostly research folks to hear what works/doesn't work with possible collaborations.

I've been kicking around ideas and these were a few of the ideas I had. I have a few presentations ready to go, so I'm hoping I can just use one of them. 😀

 

[Psychdocta44]

@psydstudent2020

It's kinda hard to believe he would have such an outburst in front of a classroom of students? Is he tenured? Maybe up for tenure and is having a breakdown? Just trying to rationalize what you're explaining.

Also, what do you mean the "Dean laughed"? Laughed about what? And what is a "legal email"?

 

[Justanothergrad]

1. Outcome-based research (based on their clinical population). This would take a bit of planning, but these trips take awhile to get approved anyway.

2. Program improvement (about a group they run) might work if pitched right.

3. Give a talk on a specific intervention (e.g. Behavioral Intervention in X-setting, Prolonged Exposure Therapy).

4. Something to do with collaborating across depts and/or disciplines. If they can talk from the clinical side, it may be helpful to the mostly research folks to hear what works/doesn't work with possible collaborations.

I've been kicking around ideas and these were a few of the ideas I had. I have a few presentations ready to go, so I'm hoping I can just use one of them. 😀

Yup, those are the steps I'm taking to justify visits to friends while still doing the professional stuff next year and afterwards.

#1 is my current favorite. I'm setting up right now with a clinic to do this and its going swimmingly. Should make the TT 'get established' workload a good deal easier to go in with a full training clinic collecting for me as well. Talk about a double dip.
#3 is something I'm talking to TD's about in the area. Sounds like I will be able to double up with the outcome-based research idea when that rolls.

 

[Psychdocta44]

Student/program handbook's will outline the university policy for student disciplinary actions (criteria, process, and procedure), as well the student's rights and the process for filling grievances. Read it.

Btw, is you professor a *****? Or has he just never heard of wifi and the internet?

THIS. OP, did you read the handbook to see your rights as a student? I hope you have a copy handy. And make sure it's up to date (aka not from 2 years ago).

But for real, is your professor a *****?