Clinical Respecialization Programs

[researchjunky]

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I know the question of respecialization has come up in the past, but has anyone on the thread been through this process? Or, goes to a school that offers it and knows how the training compares to a clinical program?

I am about to complete my experimental masters and I am very much into the research side. My best research matches are in experimental programs (which is why it makes sense that those were the only interviews I received this season). At the end of the day, I still have in the back of my mind.. clinical, but that could subside.

The particular program that is the best match for me would give me my PhD in 4 years (based on my previous work in my masters) and would be.. well perfect for research opportunities. So if nearing the end of my PhD I realized I still wanted to respecialize it would only take an additional 3 years (and many people take 7 years to get through clinical programs anyways).. I don't want to ask too many people about this because then it would be assumed that I am taking a back door approach, but in most ways experimental psychology would be a better fit for various reasons:

1. Research training is the only focus, as many clinical programs told me that I couldnt take advanced stats courses until my third year or later.
2. The cohort/people are typically less conforming/cliqueish/stuck up.

Am I setting myself up by not being committed so strictly experimental if I enter an experimental program? Part of me is only doing it because I don't want to spend 3 years just trying to find the perfect match and get into a clinical program when experimental programs are excited to take me.

 

[KillerDiller]

If you are leaning toward respecialization, keep in mind that that 3 year quote likely does not include internship. In just trying to puzzle through that, if you were to finish the entire respecialization process in only 3 years, that would mean you would be applying in the APPIC match in the fall of your second year. You would only have one year of practicum experience (plus a couple months). I honestly don't think you'd be a competitive applicant for internship with that little clinical experience. You can try talking to the DCT of the respecialization program to get details on their match rates, but I would guess a more realistic estimate would be 4 years to complete respecialization.

 

[4410]

I know someone who had the MS in clinical psychology but then was accepted to the TCU experimental psychology program with specialization in physiology psychology. He graduated with the PhD in experimental psychology and lo and behold had difficulty finding an academic research position. He worked at the county hospital as a LPA under the supervision of a licensed psychologist with neuropsychology specialization. He was allowed to apply for licensure in Texas and they evaluated his credentials considering his MS in clinical psychology and his PhD in experimental psychology with a number of years working as a LPA with a clinical neuropsychologist. Somehow they allowed him to respecialize but he had to complete a one year internship in clinical psychology. This was back in the 90's when there was no shortage of internships and he actually was accepted at an APA accredited internship somewhere in Indiana. He successfully completed his internship and he has now been licensed in clinical psychology.

I believe he had many hurdles but it seemed to help that he had the PhD in experimental psychology at TCU and some of the faculty were actually licensed clinical psychologist but have worked in academic/research settings most of their career. It was rumored that he scored one of the highest EPPP scores above the 95th percentile due to his research experimental PhD.

So it can be done but I believe under current guidelines you probably have to complete an approved respecialization program. I believe there was a WOW factor for him as he was very gifted and TCU has one of the higher rated experimental PhD programs, but if you score above the 95% on the EPPP it tends to impress licensing boards.

 

[lava12345]

I know the question of respecialization has come up in the past, but has anyone on the thread been through this process? Or, goes to a school that offers it and knows how the training compares to a clinical program?

I am about to complete my experimental masters and I am very much into the research side. My best research matches are in experimental programs (which is why it makes sense that those were the only interviews I received this season). At the end of the day, I still have in the back of my mind.. clinical, but that could subside.

The particular program that is the best match for me would give me my PhD in 4 years (based on my previous work in my masters) and would be.. well perfect for research opportunities. So if nearing the end of my PhD I realized I still wanted to respecialize it would only take an additional 3 years (and many people take 7 years to get through clinical programs anyways).. I don't want to ask too many people about this because then it would be assumed that I am taking a back door approach, but in most ways experimental psychology would be a better fit for various reasons:

1. Research training is the only focus, as many clinical programs told me that I couldnt take advanced stats courses until my third year or later.
2. The cohort/people are typically less conforming/cliqueish/stuck up.

Am I setting myself up by not being committed so strictly experimental if I enter an experimental program? Part of me is only doing it because I don't want to spend 3 years just trying to find the perfect match and get into a clinical program when experimental programs are excited to take me.

First off, I think that #2 on your list has to go... that seems completely irrelevant and unfounded. I don't even know where you got that from.

If you want more of a research focus, I would look at programs that are a 6 or 7 in the Guide, usually calling themselves "clinical science" programs. You have to have some clinical focus/training if you want to be licensed, that's kind of the point.

Overall, this post made no sense.

 

[KillerDiller]

First off, I think that #2 on your list has to go... that seems completely irrelevant and unfounded. I don't even know where you got that from.

If you want more of a research focus, I would look at programs that are a 6 or 7 in the Guide, usually calling themselves "clinical science" programs. You have to have some clinical focus/training if you want to be licensed, that's kind of the point.

Overall, this post made no sense.

It does make sense if one's research interests aren't studied by profs in clinical programs. If you don't have a research match with anyone in a clinical science program, there's not really any point in applying. I agree with your point on #2, though. There's no reason to think clinical students are more cliquish and stuck-up than other psych students.

 

[Psychadelic2012]

I'm in a similar situation--perfect research match (and a working history) with a POI in a research-only PhD program. I will have a licensable clinical masters before beginning the program if accepted, though. So, I can always do therapy, even though I'm not really into the clinical work as my 'life's work.' My ideal work would be research/teaching first and foremost, with a very part-time private practice doing therapy. Personally, I know I'd be happy with a non-clinical PhD but with a masters-level license.

I think it depends on what you want to do. There are certainly options for applied work with and without any kind of license. And the licenses, if attained, are tiered. You can practice in addictions without a graduate degree, for example. You could get a masters-level license to do therapy, and that would take much less time than a respecialization. If you specifically want to be a clinical psychologist, I'm assuming your goal involves clinical administration (i.e., working in a hospital) and/or diagnostic testing.

 

[Psychadelic2012]

Also, I just want to say that I understand that it's hard to talk to people about this. I find the research folk have labeled me as 'clinical' and are critical of my research interests, thinking I will miss the lack of clinical training. Meanwhile, practice-oriented clinicians are often dismissive of research and tend to scoff at it. And then we have the clinical PhD programs who are so competitive and so focused that it's difficult to find a good match--and if you have a specific interest, it's difficult all around.

 

[researchjunky]

I do appreciate the thoughts and recognize that I have very negative stereotypes attached to clinical psychology. There is a basis for them that is not limited to any one school or any one conference, but multiple observations, enough to develop a schema that would be hard to transform. I know that I am also not a minority in having such a stereotype, either.

This go round I applied to work with several experimental faculty who told me that they would accept a clinical student. (Only a few of my applications actually went out to clinical faculty). I wouldn't worry about my qualifications to get into an internship... because if I failed to get in the first go round I would already have a PhD, qualifying me for more jobs while I wait for the next internship application season. I would most likely be interested in a research focused internship that might even value a "different" training background.

Basically, I am interested in methodology and quantitative research and want to understand the difficulty or option for later incorporating a clinical piece to provide me with a more holistic understanding of the application of interventions.

The more people I ask or just have a basic conversation with, the more I realize that people don't know. Having a PhD that can't be held up by an internship sounds very enticing to me right now.