Concerned about my number of interviews

[Tylermall1]

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Hi everyone. I am a reapplicant who did not match last year in Internal Medicine due to applying too narrowly to mainly California programs(where I'm from) with a subpar application. To increase my chances this year, I have applied to a large number of much less competitive programs this (60+) in Internal Medicine and also some Family Medicine. So far, I have gotten 4 interviews total. I am wondering if that is an ok number or if people are receiving way more already. I know the dean's letter gets released tomorrow and have heard that many interviews are given after this. However, I'm a little more cautious and paranoid than most because this may be my last chance to match. Do people know if most interviews are given after the deans letter release? I'm already choosing even more programs to apply to if many people here have received a large number of interviews.

Edit: Also, I only got 4 interviews total last year so I dont have a good reference. Obviously, Ive gotten as many this year in the first two weeks, but in my situation, I would like the peace of mind of having many more

 

[Iamnotme]

Hi everyone. I am a reapplicant who did not match last year in Internal Medicine due to applying too narrowly to mainly California programs(where I'm from) with a subpar application. To increase my chances this year, I have applied to a large number of much less competitive programs this (60+) in Internal Medicine and also some Family Medicine. So far, I have gotten 4 interviews total. I am wondering if that is an ok number or if people are receiving way more already. I know the dean's letter gets released tomorrow and have heard that many interviews are given after this. However, I'm a little more cautious and paranoid than most because this may be my last chance to match. Do people know if most interviews are given after the deans letter release? I'm already choosing even more programs to apply to if many people here have received a large number of interviews.

Edit: Also, I only got 4 interviews total last year so I dont have a good reference. Obviously, Ive gotten as many this year in the first two weeks, but in my situation, I would like the peace of mind of having many more

Are you an american or foreign grad? If american grad it's unlikely you would not match IM/FM. If foreign, I have no idea. If american and still not a lot of interviews, it's simple-apply to more programs. You have 60, add another 60. It's rather cheap to apply and it'll save you a lot of money in the end if you match and never have to think about this process again.

 

[Tylermall1]

Im an american graduate. And I am going to apply to many more programs. I guess I just wanted to see what other people's experiences are/allay my worries.

 

[missmedschool]

Are you an american or foreign grad? If american grad it's unlikely you would not match IM/FM. If foreign, I have no idea. If american and still not a lot of interviews, it's simple-apply to more programs. You have 60, add another 60. It's rather cheap to apply and it'll save you a lot of money in the end if you match and never have to think about this process again.

"It's rather cheap to apply" to 60 more programs ... #liestoldonStudentDoctor

 

[rkaz]

"It's rather cheap to apply" to 60 more programs ... #liestoldonStudentDoctor

Definitely cheaper to apply widely to 60 or even 100 programs (if you are a subpar candidate) than run the risk of not matching, then lose one year of income and then applying to 200+ lower-tier places the next year (as now you are even a lesser competitive candidate than the year before, as every year away from graduation only leads to significantly diminishing returns).

Not to mention the psychological stress of not matching either. If your application is less competitive than others then it's surely better to apply widely.

I was concerned about my application being weaker, as I have a low but passing level 1 COMLEX score (on first attempt). I also had to take an extra year, due to failing a couple courses in the early part of my first year (though I have done quite well in all classes and clerkships since that time). This is my first year applying, but due to this I wasn't willing to take any chances, despite applying to psychiatry (which is already a non-competitive specialty). I applied to around 110 places (which is total overkill), but I am thankful to already have 7 interviews lined up in the last 2 weeks. Hopefully I'll get a lot more as interviews should start to pick up from here onwards now that the dean's letter is out. I'm hoping for about 15 places to interview total, which is more than needed for most people in my specialty - but it would give me some more confidence, due to my weaker application.

Yes, the $2,500 I spent on applying IS expensive, but when you think about it, I'm already going to have to spend many thousands of dollars (likely $5,000-7,000 on interviewing). This is all very expensive, but many of us are already paying mid-40k to mid-50k in school tuition. Many of us are already $200-300k in debt. In perspective, using a few thousand extra dollars to apply is much better than taking the chance of losing an extra year of attending's salary (and suffering psychologically) by not matching this year. I already suffered by not being able to graduate with my matriculating class as I'm graduating one year after them. I absolutely do not want to suffer again by not matching. I am determined to match this year, and am VERY happy that I applied widely.

 

[missmedschool]

Definitely cheaper to apply widely to 60 or even 100 programs (if you are a subpar candidate) than run the risk of not matching, then lose one year of income and then applying to 200+ lower-tier places the next year (as now you are even a lesser competitive candidate than the year before, as every year away from graduation only leads to significantly diminishing returns).

Not to mention the psychological stress of not matching either. If your application is less competitive than others then it's surely better to apply widely.

I was concerned about my application being weaker, as I have a low but passing level 1 COMLEX score (on first attempt). I also had to take an extra year, due to failing a couple courses in the early part of my first year (though I have done quite well in all classes and clerkships since that time). This is my first year applying, but due to this I wasn't willing to take any chances, despite applying to psychiatry (which is already a non-competitive specialty). I applied to around 110 places (which is total overkill), but I am thankful to already have 7 interviews lined up in the last 2 weeks. Hopefully I'll get a lot more as interviews should start to pick up from here onwards now that the dean's letter is out. I'm hoping for about 15 places to interview total, which is more than needed for most people in my specialty - but it would give me some more confidence, due to my weaker application.

Yes, the $2,500 I spent on applying IS expensive, but when you think about it, I'm already going to have to spend many thousands of dollars (likely $5,000-7,000 on interviewing). This is all very expensive, but many of us are already paying mid-40k to mid-50k in school tuition. Many of us are already $200-300k in debt. In perspective, using a few thousand extra dollars to apply is much better than taking the chance of losing an extra year of attending's salary (and suffering psychologically) by not matching this year. I already suffered by not being able to graduate with my matriculating class as I'm graduating one year after them. I absolutely do not want to suffer again by not matching. I am determined to match this year, and am VERY happy that I applied widely.

You're talking about a risk benefit analysis. I'm talking about the actual cost of applying to 60 programs. That's not cheap. Comparing that to the risk of not matching is a totally different scenario. Applying to 60 programs is cheap… If you're a rich person. Just stating facts

 

[Iamnotme]

Definitely cheaper to apply widely to 60 or even 100 programs (if you are a subpar candidate) than run the risk of not matching, then lose one year of income and then applying to 200+ lower-tier places the next year (as now you are even a lesser competitive candidate than the year before, as every year away from graduation only leads to significantly diminishing returns).

Not to mention the psychological stress of not matching either. If your application is less competitive than others then it's surely better to apply widely.

I was concerned about my application being weaker, as I have a low but passing level 1 COMLEX score (on first attempt). I also had to take an extra year, due to failing a couple courses in the early part of my first year (though I have done quite well in all classes and clerkships since that time). This is my first year applying, but due to this I wasn't willing to take any chances, despite applying to psychiatry (which is already a non-competitive specialty). I applied to around 110 places (which is total overkill), but I am thankful to already have 7 interviews lined up in the last 2 weeks. Hopefully I'll get a lot more as interviews should start to pick up from here onwards now that the dean's letter is out. I'm hoping for about 15 places to interview total, which is more than needed for most people in my specialty - but it would give me some more confidence, due to my weaker application.

Yes, the $2,500 I spent on applying IS expensive, but when you think about it, I'm already going to have to spend many thousands of dollars (likely $5,000-7,000 on interviewing). This is all very expensive, but many of us are already paying mid-40k to mid-50k in school tuition. Many of us are already $200-300k in debt. In perspective, using a few thousand extra dollars to apply is much better than taking the chance of losing an extra year of attending's salary (and suffering psychologically) by not matching this year. I already suffered by not being able to graduate with my matriculating class as I'm graduating one year after them. I absolutely do not want to suffer again by not matching. I am determined to match this year, and am VERY happy that I applied widely.

Precisely! Problem is that frequently med students don't see the big picture. sure, spending 2-3k for ERAS sucks, we all agree. However, OP has already not matched during the previous match. That right there is an opportunity cost of 55kish or so for first year salary.

If OP does not match a second time, not only is he/she risking another 50 something k, but also risking them not matching in the future, not only making their hard work, MD worthless but also wasting hundreds of thousands that they have in loans.

So for the person who was caustic regarding me saying it's cheap-yes 2-3k is CHEAP! compared to losing hundreds of thousands, and millions in possible income over a lifetime of working as a physician.

If I were the OP, I would apply to 150 programs or so (and i'm not exaggerating here). If you think about it, even if he/she only got 10% of IVs, that would be 15 IVs, which almost gives a statistical likelihood of matching.

I know someone who was a foreign grad and applied to over 250 programs. Cost him a ton, but unlike many of his foreign grad classmates, matched. So it's 2-3k today, or hundreds in lost debt, and millions over a lifetime.

And btw-I think you have exactly the appropriate mind set when it comes to applying. I think doing what you are doing is spot on-you applied broadly, already have a good # of IVs, and if you do get to 15 you'll be practically guaranteed to match unless something awful happens, which is unlikely.

Good luck!

 

[Iamnotme]

You're talking about a risk benefit analysis. I'm talking about the actual cost of applying to 60 programs. That's not cheap. Comparing that to the risk of not matching is a totally different scenario. Applying to 60 programs is cheap… If you're a rich person. Just stating facts

Dropping a few thousand IS CHEAP when you compare the repercussions that are possible. Everything in medicine is a cost benefit analysis.

Everything has pros and cons. If I were OP, I would apply like crazy.

 

[Tylermall1]

So in reality i actually initially applied to 200 programs on September 1 but only put it as 60+ because i didnt want to sound like an unnecessarily worrisome troll and get flamed right out of here. Sorry if that was dishonest but i didnt want my question to be ignored, mainly how many interviews people have been getting before the deans letter.

I agree with what you guys have been saying that the money I spend now is worth it longterm. I just applied to 15 moe programs last night and Im considering 20 more. Like iamnotme, I figure that just by sheer probability of applying to these less competitive fields, Im bound to get 15-20 interviews and should be able to match off of that. Or so I thought. Thats why I was asking about the deans letter and interviews after it. My application isnt stellar(low steps with one fail on step2, and one failed preclinical course that i passed on re-exam) but i figure that shouldnt preclude me from internal and family medicine somewhere. Anyway, thanks for the info and hopefully this helps other people too

 

[Tylermall1]

Also rkaz, you getting 7 interviews makes me feel a bit better since 4 is in the same ballpark at least. I also got 2 interviews in the first couple of days(both california family medicine programs) which I took as a very good sign but obviously the more I get and the earlier I get them, the less stress and uncertainty it is for me.

 

[Moosemilk86]

Some people don't have any interviews. Get a reality check.

 

[pinecat]

I have 3 so far and am really beginning to be concerned about the lack of response the past 2 weeks. I thought I had a really strong application for a prelim spot but now, not so sure. All A's through 1st 2 years, all high honors in clerkships, community service, leadership position, mid 240's step 1, mid 250's step 2.
I made senior AOA. What the heck could be holding the prelim interviews back?
Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[chargersfan]

I have 3 so far and am really beginning to be concerned about the lack of response the past 2 weeks. I thought I had a really strong application for a prelim spot but now, not so sure. All A's through 1st 2 years, all high honors in clerkships, community service, leadership position, mid 240's step 1, mid 250's step 2.
I made senior AOA. What the heck could be holding the prelim interviews back?
Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks!

Don't prelim interviews come out later then the categorical ones? I'm sure programs would want to fill categorical interview spots first. Have you checked to see if other people are getting prelim invites?

 

[Jubears09]

I have 3 so far and am really beginning to be concerned about the lack of response the past 2 weeks. I thought I had a really strong application for a prelim spot but now, not so sure. All A's through 1st 2 years, all high honors in clerkships, community service, leadership position, mid 240's step 1, mid 250's step 2.
I made senior AOA. What the heck could be holding the prelim interviews back?
Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks!

Where did you apply for prelim? And what advanced specialty are you aiming for? prelim can be tricky at academic programs because 1) there often is very few that their own students often take up 2) they often coordinate with the advanced program at their institution and will offer interview only once the advanced program you're applying to passes your name along

With your stats you should be competitive for the independent prelim programs, but my experience as been the ones associated with advanced programs will generally only interview you if you're also offered by your primary specialty.

 

[pinecat]

My specialty apps are for Derm. Is it too late to apply to more programs?

 

[Leveledup]

I also have a few advanced I.Vs but no Ty/Prelim med yet. I'm getting a little worried and might apply for some Prelim surgery just in case. What do you guys think?

1. Is it to late to apply for prelim surgery?
2. Would I need a Surgical LOR even though im going into PM&R to apply for surgery prelim?
3. Worst case should I just soap into surgical Prelim b/c the huge number of unmatched spots?

Thanks in advance for any feed back guys.

 

[rkaz]

Any more interviews, Tyler? Hope things are looking up for you.

 

[Iamnotme]

Any more interviews, Tyler? Hope things are looking up for you.

I'm frustrated with the lack of response from some programs. I have not heard from several programs one way or the other. I have even called about a number but I get no answer. No invite, no rejection, no nothing. What to do?

 

[Tylermall1]

Yes, 3 more interviews came last Friday from Sept 15 application. From second batch of 15 applications, only 2 interview, 3rd batch of 12 applications no interviews.

 

[rkaz]

Yes, 3 more interviews came last Friday from Sept 15 application. From second batch of 15 applications, only 2 interview, 3rd batch of 12 applications no interviews.

So that's 9 interviews total then (if my math adds up)? 4 originally and other 5 interviews since your original post? That should hopefully put you in a better place. I can understand that you'd feel comfortable with a few more though...

 

[pinecat]

I'm frustrated with the lack of response from some programs. I have not heard from several programs one way or the other. I have even called about a number but I get no answer. No invite, no rejection, no nothing. What to do?

I'm in the same frustrating situation as you. I never thought I would have to worry about prelim interviews...just derm interviews. I thought I was a strong candidate...now, not so much😕

Any suggestions or thoughts would be really appreciated👍

 

[Dreamer2014]

I am also in a similar boat as you. Only have 8 interviews total for IM and was wondering if it might be too late to start applying to more on ERAS (applied to <30 programs so far). Any thoughts would be much appreciated. Thanks!

 

[longjourney]

I'm also wondering the same thing... would it be too late to apply to some more programs now?

 

[NotAProgDirector]

I'm in the same frustrating situation as you. I never thought I would have to worry about prelim interviews...just derm interviews. I thought I was a strong candidate...now, not so much😕

Any suggestions or thoughts would be really appreciated👍

I would contact all prelim programs where you received Derm interviews.

 

[pinecat]

I would contact all prelim programs where you received Derm interviews.

Thank you for the advice. I haven't received any derm interviews as of yet (I believe they come out in November) but I did receive two prelims at pretty competitive schools this week for a total of five so far. Should I send out letters of interest to schools I haven't heard from yet?

Again, thank you for your opinions!

 

[Tylermall1]

So I was a little confusing in my last post about the number of interviews. I have had more come in within the last couple weeks so that I am up to 19. This absoulutely puts my mind at ease.

Im not trying to boast or brag or anything since I know people looking at 19 interviews will wonder why I am even posting or was worried in the first place. I am just giving updates to people for the sake of completeness and information. If you go one year without matching, trust me you will be very worried and extremely overcautious the next time you go through the process. Again, I applied to 200+ programs on Sept. 15 and then added about 30 more since. It took some weeks, but eventually my number has gotten up there with almost all interviews coming from the first group of apps I sent in and the majority being from FM programs. It seems like IM programs wait a little bit longer before sending invites but that's just what I've personally seen.

If that helps anyone in the same boat as me, then good. And hopefully it doesnt make people with less interviews feel bad. I only have this many because of how many I applied to.

 

[dolhan16]

Im getting concerned too. So far I have only gotten 2 interviews and about 60 rejections. I applied VERY broadly (and expensively) to ~250 programs in IM and FM. Red flags are that I am an IMG with 1 repeat on step 2 ck. Still, my scores are 220/220/P on my steps.

Feeling a little pressed for time and worried at this point in the game. Anything that I could do to get more offers? I recently came back from a program in minnesota and was told that my application "had no red flags," which im sure was a bit of smoke up my a**.

Dont know what else to do other than apply broadly and to less competitive programs, but this is ridiculous.

 

[Tylermall1]

Im getting concerned too. So far I have only gotten 2 interviews and about 60 rejections. I applied VERY broadly (and expensively) to ~250 programs in IM and FM. Red flags are that I am an IMG with 1 repeat on step 2 ck. Still, my scores are 220/220/P on my steps.

Feeling a little pressed for time and worried at this point in the game. Anything that I could do to get more offers? I recently came back from a program in minnesota and was told that my application "had no red flags," which im sure was a bit of smoke up my a**.

Dont know what else to do other than apply broadly and to less competitive programs, but this is ridiculous.

I would say apply to as low-tier programs as possible but with applying to 250 programs, lots of low-tier programs probably got lumped in there too. also, im not sure if its too late or not. one program told me they expect to have a surge of new apps in november or so when current interviewees tell their friends about the program. and like i said, from my personal experience it seems like im programs are taking longer to review apps, especially on the west coast. also, one of my friends asked his school and they said programs are still adjusting to having the mspe being sent out earlier(although he is also focusing on west coast schools) this year so it may not be too late to apply to more.

 

[dolhan16]

Yeah, Im at a loss as to what to do. Im considering contacting PC's and stating my interest, but I dont want to hurt my chances if they were considering me (ie, being the annoying student).

Ill maybe throw out some more but I did apply pretty broadly. If anyone has any more advice as to the next step id really appreciate it.

 

[Jubears09]

Yeah, Im at a loss as to what to do. Im considering contacting PC's and stating my interest, but I dont want to hurt my chances if they were considering me (ie, being the annoying student).

Ill maybe throw out some more but I did apply pretty broadly. If anyone has any more advice as to the next step id really appreciate it.

I really don't understand the notion that you're being annoying by contacting someone.

Maybe a PD here can tell me the logic behind this. In every other field it's entirely appropriate to be proactive and contact the places you seriously want to work at. Assuming you're being sincere and are not contacting everyone/would not turn down an interview after establishing contact, could this really work against you?

 

[dolhan16]

I agree, it shouldnt work against you if you are being proactive and are showing you really care about your future. Thing is- from others' responses in this forum there are mixed thoughts as to whether or not this kind of contact is beneficial. In fact, some say that contacting the PD is a big no-no, especially for fields such as surgery. What I took away from it is that "it depends," that each PD is different and it may or may not be a good choice.

Id really like a PD here to comment on this and give a little guidance from their POV.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

I agree, it shouldnt work against you if you are being proactive and are showing you really care about your future. Thing is- from others' responses in this forum there are mixed thoughts as to whether or not this kind of contact is beneficial. In fact, some say that contacting the PD is a big no-no, especially for fields such as surgery. What I took away from it is that "it depends," that each PD is different and it may or may not be a good choice.

Id really like a PD here to comment on this and give a little guidance from their POV.

I think your post really sums it up quite well. I get tons of emails asking me to look at applications. Does it make a difference? Probably not in most cases. Might it make a difference at some other program? Maybe. Might it upset someone enough to say no? Maybe.

 

[Andyg83]

I think your post really sums it up quite well. I get tons of emails asking me to look at applications. Does it make a difference? Probably not in most cases. Might it make a difference at some other program? Maybe. Might it upset someone enough to say no? Maybe.

LOL I love how much of a "non-answer" this is.

 

[IMPD]

I agree, it shouldnt work against you if you are being proactive and are showing you really care about your future. Thing is- from others' responses in this forum there are mixed thoughts as to whether or not this kind of contact is beneficial. In fact, some say that contacting the PD is a big no-no, especially for fields such as surgery. What I took away from it is that "it depends," that each PD is different and it may or may not be a good choice.

Id really like a PD here to comment on this and give a little guidance from their POV.

My PoV.

When you write people to plead your case, the more specific and researched your request is, the better your chances of the email doing something good.

Random, form-letter quality emails gets deleted by me (maybe not everyone).

Emails addressed to me, with possibly 1-2 lines of reference to information found on our website, gets read by me.

Emails addressed to me, with a paragraph that shows that the applicant actually bothered to read my easily available profile AND the website, get forwarded to my PC to be discussed in the morning.

Emails addressed to me, yada yada yada, with a faculty's name and their research interest ---well, I've never seen that email, so I'm not sure what I would do.

All of this is predicated on the idea that I am still looking....which some programs are, and some are not. It's a labor intensive effort, but then so is residency.

 

[futureNCmed]

My PoV.

When you write people to plead your case, the more specific and researched your request is, the better your chances of the email doing something good.

Random, form-letter quality emails gets deleted by me (maybe not everyone).

Emails addressed to me, with possibly 1-2 lines of reference to information found on our website, gets read by me.

Emails addressed to me, with a paragraph that shows that the applicant actually bothered to read my easily available profile AND the website, get forwarded to my PC to be discussed in the morning.

Emails addressed to me, yada yada yada, with a faculty's name and their research interest ---well, I've never seen that email, so I'm not sure what I would do.

All of this is predicated on the idea that I am still looking....which some programs are, and some are not. It's a labor intensive effort, but then so is residency.

I made the mistake of writing a program I am very interested in a very generic "interest/please keep me in consideration" email about a month ago. I haven't heard anything since. I have plenty of specific reasons why I am interested in this program and really wish I had included this in my email. As it was sent, it sounds like it could have been sent to 20 different PDs. Is it acceptable to re-write the PD with a more specific email? Again, it's been about a month since the first. I don't want to come across as pushy but as it stands, if I could get this one last interview invite, I would be 100% satisfied and would stop neurotically checking my email every 5 minutes and just relax

 

[IMPD]

I made the mistake of writing a program I am very interested in a very generic "interest/please keep me in consideration" email about a month ago. I haven't heard anything since. I have plenty of specific reasons why I am interested in this program and really wish I had included this in my email. As it was sent, it sounds like it could have been sent to 20 different PDs. Is it acceptable to re-write the PD with a more specific email? Again, it's been about a month since the first. I don't want to come across as pushy but as it stands, if I could get this one last interview invite, I would be 100% satisfied and would stop neurotically checking my email every 5 minutes and just relax

yes.

 

[mercaptovizadeh]

Some of the invite decisions are also by committee, so even if the PD is interested per email from you or a personal connection, s/he may not be able to push through an invite decision past 4-5 other committee members.