Confused in Canada

[Mps1]

Advertisement - Members don't see this ad

Hey everyone,

I am in a bit of a conundrum and was hoping that someone in a similar situation could give me some advice.

I want to be a physician, and have felt this way my whole life, but I am struggling to decide what to do. First I am 36 years old(would not start until 38). I graduated from pharmacy school in 2006, then went on to do a doctor of pharmacy and am currently a clinical pharmacy specialist in critical care. I really do have a pretty cool job. I am able to see patients, discuss diagnosis and help come up with treatment plans with the staff doc. I also teach med students,get paid well, work M-F, but yet something inside me just won't let it die. I have thought about why, and I think it boils down to responsibility for the patient care and passion for diagnosis and treatment. Right now all of my thoughts on care are "suggestions", and my suggestions are all based on having a proper diagnosis which I have limited knowledge of.

Based on this I should just go right? My problem is I have 2 young children and a wife that is extremely un-supportive of this dream. She has essentially said that if I decide to go, she is leaving with the kids. I have tried to discuss this with her for over 4 years, but she just won't budge.

Now that you know my life story, I am wondering if any of you have words of wisdom? Has anyone been through something like this? I am worried that if I don't make this jump I will end up resenting her and the end product will be the same either way.

 

[TheShowGoesOn]

Hey,

although I am not in a similar situation, I have read through your passage and believe that you're living quite the life right now. You have chosen pharmacy and made a great career out of it, you have a wife and kids whom you are responsible for. You have to think about the consequences of this action, and if they'll be worth it. My suggestion to you would be to continue your current career but look for opportunities that allow you to take on added responsibilities; pharmacy has many pathways one can choose and it seems you're on one of the better ones as is. There are many respected pharmacists in the hospital I work at currently who work very closely with doctors, I have witnessed many accompany physicians at the patients bedside during procedure etc... it's quite neat actually. With that being said, if you choose to pursue medical school it is possible and my suggestions would be for you to a) spend as much time with your kids as possible when you have free time from school, you won't want to miss out on their important development in the early years and b) continue trying to persuade your significant other to put things aside and be apart of your long-sought after dream, it will be quite the accomplishment if you all do it together.

Best wishes.

 

[ROSC]

Man,

If you REALLY want to be a physician what would you need to do to apply to medical school ? what are the steps you have left? Why is she extremely un-supportive ? These are the problems that I would evaluate first and foremost. As far as your age and children I would not be discouraged...... do it now while they're still young and reap the benefits later. Marriage advice or relationship advice is a whole different forum so I will do my best and steer clear of that one.

 

[oldanddone]

perhaps a few sessions of couples counselling, and a serious written-out game/business plan that takes into account finances etc. in order for you/you both to evaluate for viability. probably best to do this in a timely way, since you've been talking of several years of not having fully committed to going forward or dropping the thought. perhaps time to fish or cut bait with regards to full and supported discussion and decision making.

as an aside: i had a pharm in my med class, and defo work with various pharm at hospital - you guys have some serious clout there, and much respect for the knowledge you bring. and the role of 'md' is not all that autonomous anymore...not with talk about hiring nps to quality-control the doc's handling of chf etc. in one of the local hospitals i rounded in as a resident. perhaps you are in a highlevel centre and specialty? i know that larger but peripheral community hospitals/hospitalists pay a lot of attention to what a pharm says. anyways. gl.

ps: also speaking as another cdn

 

[Mps1]

Wow everyone, thanks so much for your replies.

First to answer some questions. I have all pre-reqs and would be competitive across Canada. My only hurdle would be the MCAT and applying.

She is unsupportive because she doesn't want to be the sole earner for the family until I hit residency (she is also a pharmacist). On top of that she doesn't want to move and has a view of docs that is based on gray's anatomy and ER. You know 100 hr weeks, always at the hospital, affairs etc.

I must say I do work in a very collaborative environment with physicians and nurses that really value my input. It really is great to hear from oldanddone and theshowgoeson that we pharmacists are valued.I guess it comes down to a few things though. I am a very hands on person, and pharm is essentially the opposite of that. I watched a tracheotomy today and was thinking .... I want to do that. I know the grass is always greener, and you all have given me a lot to think about.. Thanks 🙂

 

[Mps1]

Yah, my UG GPA=3.8 , my grad stuff is all Honors,pass, fail. I know U of C tends to like non-trads, and I'm IP for both U of C and UBC...

 

[Goro]

There are 74 MD schools that accept international students. These tend to be highly exceptional applicants. FYI.

Hey everyone,

I am in a bit of a conundrum and was hoping that someone in a similar situation could give me some advice.

I want to be a physician, and have felt this way my whole life, but I am struggling to decide what to do. First I am 36 years old(would not start until 38). I graduated from pharmacy school in 2006, then went on to do a doctor of pharmacy and am currently a clinical pharmacy specialist in critical care. I really do have a pretty cool job. I am able to see patients, discuss diagnosis and help come up with treatment plans with the staff doc. I also teach med students,get paid well, work M-F, but yet something inside me just won't let it die. I have thought about why, and I think it boils down to responsibility for the patient care and passion for diagnosis and treatment. Right now all of my thoughts on care are "suggestions", and my suggestions are all based on having a proper diagnosis which I have limited knowledge of.

Based on this I should just go right? My problem is I have 2 young children and a wife that is extremely un-supportive of this dream. She has essentially said that if I decide to go, she is leaving with the kids. I have tried to discuss this with her for over 4 years, but she just won't budge.

Now that you know my life story, I am wondering if any of you have words of wisdom? Has anyone been through something like this? I am worried that if I don't make this jump I will end up resenting her and the end product will be the same either way.

 

[jayceee]

There are 74 MD schools that accept international students. These tend to be highly exceptional applicants. FYI.

I don't think OP is talking about moving down here for med school...

 

[jayceee]

OP, a few things.

1.You can definitely do it.

I'm in a similar situation (RN-->>MD), but I moved down here to facilitate the career transition (parents moved down here from Canada years ago and offered me free room and board).

The most important thing this journey requires is the unwavering support of your family. My husband (bf at the time) supported my dream enough to stay back in Canada while I took pre-reqs and determined if I could make myself into a competitive applicant.

Without your wife's support, you will have a much harder time--even if you get into medical school.

2. I creeped your posting history and noticed that you were studying for the MCAT 5 years ago. This shows me that you've always had this dream, or at the very least, have had this desire for a long time. You can't forget about it. It's obvious because here you are, five years later, still talking about wanting to become a physician. I'm a big believer that if (at the mature age of 36) you're still fixated on a dream despite having explored other viable options, you should go balls to the wall for it.

3. You need to talk to your wife again. See a therapist if you have to. Make her see how badly you want this.

4. Your wife is a pharmacist. She can support you while you're in medical school. She might have to make a few lifestyle concessions, but going back to school now won't decimate you financially.

5. Not sure if you're aware the the big Canadian banks give you a $200,000 line of credit at prime (currently at 2.7%) when you get into medical or dental school. I just spoke to someone at Bank of Montreal yesterday. You can use $50k a year over your 4 years of medical school. This will help you guys out a lot. This is on top of Canada Student Loan program money. So for years of sacrifice, then you start getting paid during residency. Here's the salary scale for BC and Alberta residents: http://www.carms.ca/en/match-process/your-application/salaries-benefits/ <-- Not great, but not horrible if your partner is a pharmacist.

U of A tuition if only $12k/year http://www.registrarsoffice.ualbert...Tuition/Dentistry-Medicine-and-PGME-Fees.aspx
UBC is 18K/year.

6. UBC lets your drop your lowest 30 credit year, so your previously posted GPA of 3.8 might be even higher than that. One of the Alberta schools has a similar way of giving you a bit of a boost as well. Also, one of the Alberta schools (maybe both) has a lower GPA requirement for in-province applicants.

7. Are you sure you can have residency in both provinces? UBC considers you a BC resident if you have a BC Care Card/MSP Card. You have to show it to them.

8. If you're a clinical pharmacist on a critical care unit, use this to your advantage. Are you involved in any of the research being conducted on your unit? I know that SPH in Vancouver's ICU is world renown for doing a lot of interesting research on sepsis. See if you can get involved with something like this on your unit. This will add to the NAQ (non academic quotient) portion of your admissions evaluation. UBC weights AQ (academic quotient) and NAQ equally--50%/50%. You'll also be able to connect with the physicians on your unit who teach for whichever school you plan on applying to. Get some letters from them. Get some mentorship.

9. You need to get your wife on board.

Happy to answer any other questions you have about the process. I've been at this for 6 years (exploring both US and Canadian options), so I know stuff. 😛

 

[jayceee]

Have you looked into Canadian schools? A better forum is premed101.com. "Competitive" in Canada is much higher than in the US (3.8 GPA vs 3.5, and some schools had MCAT section cutoffs at 12 this year.). Canada is also much less open toward non-trads. I interviewed at a few Canadian schools this year, and there were very few people over 25. (and remember, Canadian interview days have ~125 people in attendance).

That said, beyond the Canadian school systems, I personally would not go into this without the full support of my spouse. Otherwise, you can basically expect a divorce, and how would you handle explaining that to your kids? If med school is your priority above your family, then do your research, but I would really consider the non-trad aspect in Canada because it's a not the same as the US at all.

Things are changing regarding non-trads in Canada. Slowly, but surely. UBC's average age is getting older. The dean was featured in a Vancouver Sun article a few years ago discussing this. I can't find it, but this CMAJ article talks about how the tide is slowly changing. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2988529/

This article is talks about the opposite end of the spectrum, but the dean also said: “We try hard to include applicants from non-traditional backgrounds,” Dr. Fleming says. “We don’t want to take a cookie-cutter approach. A large part of our program’s strength stems from the diversity of our students, whether it’s their ethnic backgrounds, talents, academic interests, or age.”
http://med.ubc.ca/an-injection-of-youth/

 

[Goro]

Canadian schools are really, really competitive!

I don't think OP is talking about moving down here for med school...