Cost/benefit of mentioning personal issue

[homeaway]

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Hi all. I've lurked the forum for awhile now and I had a question that's been urking me for the last month.

I was involved in an abusive relationship (mentally and physically) that caused a lot of stress, anxiety and fear. It incited a period where I felt vulnerable and alone, but also caused me to dig deep and realize attributes of my character that I wasn't as aware of as before. The experience caused me to mature a lot and I have no doubt that it made me much stronger.

My grades were unaffected but I attribute that largely to me trying to be strong and not be broken down....I was able to keep my sense of worth and self basically. That's not to say that I didn't have days where I was scared for my life.

Long story short, after a series of events that led to the end of the relationship (a lot of which was initiated by me), I didn't skip a beat in putting my personal growth from that experience to work and went on to accomplish a lot of things I didn't ever think I would - including doing some awareness-raising things that related to what I went through.

So you can see that this was a big part of my life and I know it played a role from an emotional standpoint for why I want to pursue med. I left it out of my primary but for a lot of secondaries with those optional essays I don't know if I should include it because:
1. Stigma/sensitive issue
2. People might not necessarily agree with how I handled the relationship
I don't want to include details of the relationship to be honest, but it'll probably seem curious if I don't at least describe how I ended it

I know I have a strong app in every other aspect but I don't know if the benefits it might show about my character overweigh the costs of writing about this experience. Any insight from adcoms/people who read applications is appreciated. Would you feel uncomfortable/want to judge the person if you saw an essay like this?

Thanks 🙂

 

[suuuperhuman17]

Kudos to you for eventually getting yourself out of an abusive relationship and coming out as a stronger person on the other side. I was in a situation similar to the one you described, and I chose not to mention it in my applications. Stigma or not, it is a difficult scenario for people to understand unless they have been through it, and stories of abusive relationships usually prompt a weird mixture of sympathy and disbelief along the lines of, "why didn't you just end it?"

The lessons from my relationship are my own. I know how my experiences have shaped me into the person I am today, and I hope to represent myself in the best possible way to adcoms and interviewers. To me, that meant leaving the details in the past and focusing on the future. 🙂

 

[MedPR]

If you mention it, expect to be asked about it. Don't cry in interviews. Don't whine in interviews. If you can't talk about it without crying, I wouldn't mention it.

 

[pietachok]

I would not discuss it. If you want to abstract it & say you had some life circumstances that helped you learn a lot about yourself, etc., that's probably fine. I, personally, think that it would be difficult to discuss it in a way that didn't strike me as being inappropriate--your med school application isn't a place for bedroom issues, & this is uncomfortably close to going there...I think many readers will feel it's TMI. (and I'm at a pretty liberal school, & only in my 30's, so if I feel this way you should probably be concerned).

Additionally, it is really hard to realize how young you seem to older adults. They have more hindsight than you & they know that deeply rooted problems don't disappear overnight & this isn't nearly as far behind you as you feel like it is right now. You may have a reader who thinks it will help you connect with certain patients, but I think it's far more likely to raise concerns about your emotional stability & maturity., because it's only been a few years (and because the decision to include this might also scream "poor decision-making skills" to some). People usually bring up serious problems because they have to in order to explain bad grades or their motivation for going into medicine. This always has the potential disadvantage of planting a seed in the reader's mind as to whether or not this problem will hurt your ability to succeed as a medical student or doctor. You're opening yourself up to a whole bunch of speculation about whether you have the emotional fortitude or support system to get through this successfully. Also, don't forget that women in abusive relationships are too common in our training and practice, so you are writing to an audience that is quite knowledgeable about the potential severity (could they think you're being melodramatic?) and the potential psychopathology often accompanied by it....I'm not going to say it's a fair judgment, but I don't think you want to open yourself up to worries about the latter.

 

[Rumalum]

https://chronicle.com/article/article-content/133169/

 

[FSU2013]

Wouldn't touch that with a 10 foot pole......right or wrong, the risk greatly outweighs the reward. Someone who will give you the benefit of the doubt might think that you are stronger and more mature from it, but you could probably accomplish this goal by writing something else. Others might see it as extremely poor judgement by dating someone who was verbally and physically abusive as well as weakness and lack of foresight by not immediately leaving at the first sign of abusiveness. You definitely have WAY MORE to lose than you ever could gain from this. Don't ever mention it when applying. You can open the door by using any number of other personal stories. Good luck.

 

[CurlsandPearls]

Wouldn't touch that with a 10 foot pole......right or wrong, the risk greatly outweighs the reward. Someone who will give you the benefit of the doubt might think that you are stronger and more mature from it, but you could probably accomplish this goal by writing something else. Others might see it as extremely poor judgement by dating someone who was verbally and physically abusive as well as weakness and lack of foresight by not immediately leaving at the first sign of abusiveness. You definitely have WAY MORE to lose than you ever could gain from this. Don't ever mention it when applying. You can open the door by using any number of other personal stories. Good luck.

Absolutely this.

And go Noles! 👍

 

[homeaway]

Thanks everyone 🙂 You echoed my worries exactly, but I just needed to hear it from someone else. I'll just save it as a personal learning experience and let it be.

 

[Mosa]

Thanks everyone 🙂 You echoed my worries exactly, but I just needed to hear it from someone else. I'll just save it as a personal learning experience and let it be.

I was in an abusive relationship and grew tremendously from it during freshman year. I mentioned this as well as the lessons I've learned from this ugly relationship in one secondary since it was most applicable for the specific essay question asked, and I received an interview invite to that school for next month. If you show tht you've grown and become a better, more mature human being who would be able to use these experiences to help your career in medicine, then I'd say to mention it definitely. Just make sure to focus on the growth and positive rewards of how it changed you if you do mention it

 

[theseeker4]

I was in an abusive relationship and grew tremendously from it during freshman year. I mentioned this as well as the lessons I've learned from this ugly relationship in one secondary since it was most applicable for the specific essay question asked, and I received an interview invite to that school for next month. If you show tht you've grown and become a better, more mature human being who would be able to use these experiences to help your career in medicine, then I'd say to mention it definitely. Just make sure to focus on the growth and positive rewards of how it changed you if you do mention it

The problem is it is hit or miss in the impression such a story will have on adcoms. For the review of your secondary it didn't hurt, (assuming they even read secondaries prior to interview invites) but it might not have helped and it could hurt your admissions chances depending on the views of the Adcom members. While it might help, the risk is not worth it IMO.

 

[FSU2013]

I was in an abusive relationship and grew tremendously from it during freshman year. I mentioned this as well as the lessons I've learned from this ugly relationship in one secondary since it was most applicable for the specific essay question asked, and I received an interview invite to that school for next month. If you show tht you've grown and become a better, more mature human being who would be able to use these experiences to help your career in medicine, then I'd say to mention it definitely. Just make sure to focus on the growth and positive rewards of how it changed you if you do mention it

Why even take the chance? When applying to med school, the deck is stacked against you. It's not the time to take risks....

 

[pietachok]

I was in an abusive relationship and grew tremendously from it during freshman year. I mentioned this as well as the lessons I've learned from this ugly relationship in one secondary since it was most applicable for the specific essay question asked, and I received an interview invite to that school for next month. If you show tht you've grown and become a better, more mature human being who would be able to use these experiences to help your career in medicine, then I'd say to mention it definitely. Just make sure to focus on the growth and positive rewards of how it changed you if you do mention it

I would urge you not to think of the invite as validating the disclosure you made in the secondary. Many invites are sent out without the whole secondary or even any of the secondary being read. And if it was read, it may have been one person versus a whole committee. Additionally, you may have gotten the interview in spite of it, because other aspects of your application compensated for it.

I don't know if you read my response above, but as an older student, I just can't emphasize enough that your sense of hindsight on this issue is likely to sound naive to older adults who have been around long enough to see many people swear off abusive relationships only to get into another and another. At 23, you think being 2 years past it is definitive, but that doesn't sound that long even to me in my 30's (it's kinda like a drug addict who says he's quit after 24 hours of being sober...it's possibly true, but you're not going to trust him til it's been a bit longer). You are using your only opportunity to sell yourself as a venue to tell them you're a high risk investment. Getting into med school isn't just about proving you have the brains, it's about convincing them you can make it brought all the years of training. People with healthy relationships end up with more than enough conflicts to distract them!

I also think the link Rumalum posted is worth a look. Your generation is really different even than the younger profs/MDs. You've already submitted it, but from here on out I would only address it if your interviewer does.

 

[Mosa]

I would urge you not to think of the invite as validating the disclosure you made in the secondary. Many invites are sent out without the whole secondary or even any of the secondary being read. And if it was read, it may have been one person versus a whole committee. Additionally, you may have gotten the interview in spite of it, because other aspects of your application compensated for it.

I don't know if you read my response above, but as an older student, I just can't emphasize enough that your sense of hindsight on this issue is likely to sound naive to older adults who have been around long enough to see many people swear off abusive relationships only to get into another and another. At 23, you think being 2 years past it is definitive, but that doesn't sound that long even to me in my 30's (it's kinda like a drug addict who says he's quit after 24 hours of being sober...it's possibly true, but you're not going to trust him til it's been a bit longer). You are using your only opportunity to sell yourself as a venue to tell them you're a high risk investment. Getting into med school isn't just about proving you have the brains, it's about convincing them you can make it brought all the years of training. People with healthy relationships end up with more than enough conflicts to distract them!

I also think the link Rumalum posted is worth a look. Your generation is really different even than the younger profs/MDs. You've already submitted it, but from here on out I would only address it if your interviewer does.

Thank you but I believe I have enough skills on judgement with what I say for my OWN application. I did not post the question here, OP did. I did not ask for your advice as I don't want it. You really believe Adcoms want to see applicants who had picture perfect lives with no kinds of struggles? If an applicant has had no struggles and therefore nothing from which to emerge triumphant, how would they deal with struggles in medical school, residency, and practice? They wouldn't know what it's like to struggle and would therefore have a harder time emerging as a more mature person because of whatever obstacle presented itself. I wrote a deply detailed autobiography for my Pre health committee, and this situation was one of the extensive ones my interviewer--who is older--discussed and praised me for recovering a better person and contributing to help other peers and teens get out of abusive relationships. Yes i know, n=1. For your information, relationships don't start out abusive, but they evolve to that point, which is when I left as any mature person would do. It's a shame I feel as if I have to defend myself here when so many others--adults that were my professors of both genders, bosses at work, and my peers--have shown their support. I've been working full time ever since that relationship and taking full loads of classes and no negative effects have been seen from that relationship. Why? Because rather than dwelling or letting myself drown in it, I made sure to route my energy in a more positive direction. I shape what experiences affect me and which don't, and this one hasn't and will not affect me negatively. If someone states they were overweight or in an abusive household as a child or had drugs around when they were young but has since lost weight or gotten out of these bad situations, you're saying Adcoms won't like to see this? You're saying they won't appreciate their recovery and how they moved on to make the best of a situation? You're saying they don't like to see someone being in a bad situation and ultimately defeating it? Wow. I have more faith in humanity than that. So I will mention this whenever I see fit and if a medical school does not like that, then I wouldn't want to go there anyway because I'd enjoy a place where utilizing amazing human potential to recover from even the worst situations is championed.

 

[FSU2013]

Thank you but I believe I have enough skills on judgement with what I say for my OWN application. I did not post the question here, OP did. I did not ask for your advice as I don't want it. You really believe Adcoms want to see applicants who had picture perfect lives with no kinds of struggles? If an applicant has had no struggles and therefore nothing from which to emerge triumphant, how would they deal with struggles in medical school, residency, and practice? They wouldn't know what it's like to struggle and would therefore have a harder time emerging as a more mature person because of whatever obstacle presented itself. I wrote a deply detailed autobiography for my Pre health committee, and this situation was one of the extensive ones my interviewer--who is older--discussed and praised me for recovering a better person and contributing to help other peers and teens get out of abusive relationships. Yes i know, n=1. For your information, relationships don't start out abusive, but they evolve to that point, which is when I left as any mature person would do. It's a shame I feel as if I have to defend myself here when so many others--adults that were my professors of both genders, bosses at work, and my peers--have shown their support. I've been working full time ever since that relationship and taking full loads of classes and no negative effects have been seen from that relationship. Why? Because rather than dwelling or letting myself drown in it, I made sure to route my energy in a more positive direction. I shape what experiences affect me and which don't, and this one hasn't and will not affect me negatively. If someone states they were overweight or in an abusive household as a child or had drugs around when they were young but has since lost weight or gotten out of these bad situations, you're saying Adcoms won't like to see this? You're saying they won't appreciate their recovery and how they moved on to make the best of a situation? You're saying they don't like to see someone being in a bad situation and ultimately defeating it? Wow. I have more faith in humanity than that. So I will mention this whenever I see fit and if a medical school does not like that, then I wouldn't want to go there anyway because I'd enjoy a place where utilizing amazing human potential to recover from even the worst situations is championed.

Here's the catch. You have everything to lose and they have nothing to gain. The attitude of "well, if they don't like me for who I am, then I don't want to go there anyway" is a bit naive. You may end up getting in - potentially everywhere you apply - but you may not get in anywhere. At that point, you certainly would have been better off not disclosing that. Sure, it shows great courage to go through those things and end up a stronger person. No one is questioning that. But with those experiences comes baggage and the potential to return to those habits. Women who are in abusive relationships often return to abusive relationships, children who get abused often grow up to be abusers. Obviously, these are not hard and fast rules, in fact, probably most don't, but the statistics are such that these things are more common in those particular subsets of society. Adcoms have absolutely no vested interest in taking a risk; they want to take someone that is a sure thing. I am of the opinion that you should never voluntarily give them a reason to question whether or not you should be successful.

Also, chill out - no one told you what to do. They said that your experience should not cause the OP to do the same thing. Neglecting to point out that your decision was not necessarily a wise one would fail to answer the OPs question. Further, unless you are sitting on a pile of acceptances with notes from adcoms saying "we picked you because this experience" - i really don't think you're in the appropriate place to give advice. I repeat, you never give anyone a reason not to hire you - even if you think you can turn it into a positive, you always put your best foot forward. Sorry if this seems harsh, but it's true. A med school/residency/hospital has no interest in hiring you - they have an interest in filling a spot - you are a warm body and there are plenty of people they could use to fill that slot. Don't give them any reason to pick the next application up.

 

[Mosa]

Here's the catch. You have everything to lose and they have nothing to gain. The attitude of "well, if they don't like me for who I am, then I don't want to go there anyway" is a bit naive. You may end up getting in - potentially everywhere you apply - but you may not get in anywhere. At that point, you certainly would have been better off not disclosing that. Sure, it shows great courage to go through those things and end up a stronger person. No one is questioning that. But with those experiences comes baggage and the potential to return to those habits. Women who are in abusive relationships often return to abusive relationships, children who get abused often grow up to be abusers. Obviously, these are not hard and fast rules, in fact, probably most don't, but the statistics are such that these things are more common in those particular subsets of society. Adcoms have absolutely no vested interest in taking a risk; they want to take someone that is a sure thing. I am of the opinion that you should never voluntarily give them a reason to question whether or not you should be successful.

Also, chill out - no one told you what to do. They said that your experience should not cause the OP to do the same thing. Neglecting to point out that your decision was not necessarily a wise one would fail to answer the OPs question. Further, unless you are sitting on a pile of acceptances with notes from adcoms saying "we picked you because this experience" - i really don't think you're in the appropriate place to give advice. I repeat, you never give anyone a reason not to hire you - even if you think you can turn it into a positive, you always put your best foot forward. Sorry if this seems harsh, but it's true. A med school/residency/hospital has no interest in hiring you - they have an interest in filling a spot - you are a warm body and there are plenty of people they could use to fill that slot. Don't give them any reason to pick the next application up.

Fair enough. For some reason, the tone of your response hits me more favorably than that of the poster to whom I replied. Less patronizing I think. Youre absolutely right that I have 0 acceptances and do not know point blank how committees view this experience and that being in med school already you have more wisdom than me when it comes to gaining admission. The reason this thread and the consensus on it bothers me is that, when generalized, it is IMO saying that one should hide any hardship they faced as it makes them a more vulnerable person to medical pressures etc than an applicant who has not faced these hardships. So...an applicant who takes a negative situation and turns it into a positive seems to be deemed lesser by the standards of the posters. At least that's the vibe I get and it may very well be because this is how Adcoms view them as well. For indtance, I mean why do minorities have higher admission than non-minorities? Yes, to fill quotas and to make a med school more diverse, but these are communities who statistically often deal with issues such as discrimination--legal or social/personal--and may suffer self esteem issues from them. That is taken from reputable sources. If that's the case, then wouldn't med schools be better off taking applicants who are all non minorities and therefore are less likely to have self esteem issues etc since they're running that risk by taking a minority even if they would enhance diversity? If the answer to that is yes, then I'm not sure why minorities have higher admission rates if they aren't worth the risk. I am of the belief that when someone has the ability to take a bad situation and make it right and mature from it, then they are better prepared for other obstacles which may confront them. That's my opinion and being a premed with no acceptances, there is no backing to it. OP, I would ask your premed advisor at your undergrad how they feel about it. Best of luck, OP, and congrats on leaving a horrible relationship. I was in shoes similar to yours once and I am proud of us both.