icekitsune

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I was just talked to by my pic regarding several issues and it just irritates me to no end, though I'm not sure if it is constructive or not. I'm here to talk and see what others think. I'm a floater that currently has a semi permanent store like 20 hrs per week.Ive been working for about 5 months at that store and the other rph,pic, I work with has been there for 6 years so the customers are pretty familiar with her. He brought up two issues with me, 1) He has concern over my pharmacy knowledge because I took time (he said 20 min) which I'm pretty sure was not true but I didn't time myself exactly, to look up if a person is eligible for pneumo shot since we have the 23 as well as the 13.He knows all this because my techs has been talking to him (idk if they have true concerns or just talking behind my back just for fun) FYI, this is my first pneumo shot and yeah, i guess i don't have this stuff memorized.

2) He said in his experienced (30 years in retail, 6 years with the store) that if he gets pts asking for him on the phone or wondering why he isn't working when they bumped into him, it must be indication that I'm doing something wrong. Like why doesn't his customer want to come in or get flu shot with me rather than with him. Honestly, I don't get what the issue is. I thought it was pretty normal if customers esp if FT vs PT and how they know each other, that customers ask for him. I'm not rude or disrespectful. I seen some familiar faces that comes in a say Hi to me. Idk who the ones that kept asking for him. Ive hear some customers asking where a certain tech was, whats the difference? How is that so unusual? I will never get a straight answer but it makes me wonder, is it because I'm younger looking/grad, I'm new, I'm not friends with them and know them by name, control med issues? Basically ppl don't want to /prefer not to come in when I'm working so he says.
 

Reirrac

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I suppose the customers do not feel as comfortable as they are with the PIC? Perhaps the PIC has the grace and skill that puts the customers at ease?

If I were to go out on a limb and make unfounded conjectures and nitpicking, maybe you are giving out an impression of a icy foxy pharmacist?

While you can't do much about the techs gossiping, the pts seeking out the PIC specifically certainly is cause for concern. I wouldn't get too stressed and lose sleep over it, but the PIC is correct in indirectly pointing out that there is room for improvement.
 

nnguyenc

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I may have to side with the PIC on this one because retail is about survivial of the fittest
(you need to be fast, smart, and a people person to become good and not weigh down the workflow)


i'll give you a good tip for connecting with people, you need to jump in and say hi when you see a familiar customer and
start BSing about their personal lives (e.g., how did the swim competition go for Ashley?)

if you are one of those timid rph that stays at the verification station all day then GTFO is what the staff will think
 
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icekitsune

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I suppose the customers do not feel as comfortable as they are with the PIC? Perhaps the PIC has the grace and skill that puts the customers at ease?

If I were to go out on a limb and make unfounded conjectures and nitpicking, maybe you are giving out an impression of a icy foxy pharmacist?

While you can't do much about the techs gossiping, the pts seeking out the PIC specifically certainly is cause for concern. I wouldn't get too stressed and lose sleep over it, but the PIC is correct in indirectly pointing out that there is room for improvement.
Thanks, I understand that there is a need for improvement. Its just that most of the time, I don't cash the customer out and I greet them and talk to the ones I do cash out.
 
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icekitsune

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I may have to side with the PIC on this one because retail is about survivial of the fittest
(you need to be fast, smart, and a people person to become good and not weigh down the workflow)


i'll give you a good tip for connecting with people, you need to jump in and say hi when you see a familiar customer and
start BSing about their personal lives (e.g., how did the swim competition go for Ashley?)

if you are one of those timid rph that stays at the verification station all day then GTFO is what the staff will think
Thanks for the reply. I do try to talk and say hi to familiar customers but its taking some time to get to know all of them since I work two days a week but I do have some ppl that come and chat. I'm gradually improving my workflow.
 

npage148

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When i hear this, the pic probably does questionable stuff to "help" out his patients that you won't/don't do.

"Eh, ill just come back and see tony tomorrow, he always does xxx for me"
 
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Gombrich12

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When i hear this, the pic probably does questionable stuff to "help" out his patients that you won't/don't do.

"Eh, ill just come back and see tony tomorrow, he always does xxx for me"
This is a big part of it. The other pharmacist knows what corporate/legal rules they can bend and get away with while pleasing the customer. You'll learn these in time too.
 

GatorPharm

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People like one of the pharmacists at my store better than the other both because he is more friendly/personable and because he is more likely to fill an iffy C2 :whistle:.
 

BidingMyTime

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This is a big part of it. The other pharmacist knows what corporate/legal rules they can bend and get away with while pleasing the customer. You'll learn these in time too.
bending corporate/legal rules is a bad idea, just because your boss gets away with it, doesn't mean that you would (or that you ethically should.) Never bend a legal rule, and it should be a pretty unique circumstance to bend a corporate rule. I would start documenting what kind of illegal/against corporate stuff your PIC is doing.
 

zelman

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bending corporate/legal rules is a bad idea, just because your boss gets away with it, doesn't mean that you would (or that you ethically should.) Never bend a legal rule, and it should be a pretty unique circumstance to bend a corporate rule. I would start documenting what kind of illegal/against corporate stuff your PIC is doing.
You don't know much about the reality of retail pharmacy, do you? What is the correct thing to do if someone hands you a Percocet prescription dated for tomorrow? You would suggest that the patient be arrested for attempting to use an invalid prescription to obtain a controlled substance and the MD be arrested for fraudulently dating a legal document? Just because their partner will hold on the the Rx and fill it the next morning doesn't make them Scarface. They're just applying practicality to the situation.
 

Gombrich12

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bending corporate/legal rules is a bad idea, just because your boss gets away with it, doesn't mean that you would (or that you ethically should.) Never bend a legal rule, and it should be a pretty unique circumstance to bend a corporate rule. I would start documenting what kind of illegal/against corporate stuff your PIC is doing.
You'll learn soon enough, otherwise you'll be getting customer complaints or into arguments every other day. An example of bending a rule would be a regular gets their Ambien called in every month and this time on a Friday after the office is closed the nurse forgets to leave the DEA number. The patient is about to leave to go out of town and is about to run out of their medication, what do you do?
 

HouTX

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two sides to every story and we are only hearing the OP's side. I think the OP is way over their head in terms of managing workflow. let me ask you a simple question. are the techs constantly waiting on you or are you constantly waiting on the techs to push things to your queue?
 

fewaopi

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sometimes it's familiarity or who you replaced. if it was a good pharmacist you replaced, you've got big shoes and expectations to fill. i know married women who go to the pharmacy just to go googly eyed over the guy working and bring their business just for him. i imagine the same goes for married men going for a hot female pharmacist, just for stares.

but i think most of the time, it's just familiarity. patients want to see someone they've known for a long time and in a time when so many things change in the area they live, it's nice to have something be as a constant and who knows your habits, expectations. OP didn't you just start? it can take many months or years (depending how frequent the customer is) for you to develop patient relationships. it also helps to learn their names but it takes time. i wouldn't sweat over it, just know where you need to improve and you'll be fine.
 

BidingMyTime

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You don't know much about the reality of retail pharmacy, do you? What is the correct thing to do if someone hands you a Percocet prescription dated for tomorrow? You would suggest that the patient be arrested for attempting to use an invalid prescription to obtain a controlled substance and the MD be arrested for fraudulently dating a legal document? Just because their partner will hold on the the Rx and fill it the next morning doesn't make them Scarface. They're just applying practicality to the situation.
I said absolutely nothing of the sort. No where did I say to call the police in. And nowhere was this discussion about holding a prescription that was dated incorrectly for the next day (I am aware that every other doctor does this) I AM saying that since it sounds like his manager is keeping notes on him for not doing the same things that the manager does to make customers happy (and since it sounds like that things could pertain to early refills or other such things), then YES, he needs to be keeping notes himself, so that if this is carried further and he is wrote up, he can have a record to show to his manager's manager, to show that his manager is only writing him up because he follows the law.
 
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BidingMyTime

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You'll learn soon enough, otherwise you'll be getting customer complaints or into arguments every other day. An example of bending a rule would be a regular gets their Ambien called in every month and this time on a Friday after the office is closed the nurse forgets to leave the DEA number. The patient is about to leave to go out of town and is about to run out of their medication, what do you do?
In my state this is a legal prescription, there is no requirement for the prescriber to leave their DEA number on a phone-in call. Is there such a requirement in your state?
 

PharmDstudent

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two sides to every story and we are only hearing the OP's side. I think the OP is way over their head in terms of managing workflow. let me ask you a simple question. are the techs constantly waiting on you or are you constantly waiting on the techs to push things to your queue?
I don't think this question has any weight to it. The pharmacist is always the point at which everything bottlenecks. Always. There is only how many of you versus how many of them?

I always type prescriptions and answer phone calls in addition to data review and product review.

These are my priorities in order of importance:
1. prescriptions are entered into the system (I will help them type)
2. phones are answered (I will held them answer the phones)
3. data is reviewed (I will review)
4. product is verified (I will review)
5. voicemail (I will receive)
6. product is filled (I will help them fill)
7. prescription bags are filed (I will help them file prescription bags)

Why do I prioritize this way? Well, if someone calls to find out if their prescription is there we'll know whether it in fact is because it's in our system. Plus, other stores can access our information through the database in case we're too busy and the customer doesn't want to wait or it was called into the wrong location. Customers have this pesky way of coming in unannounced, and if you don't answer the phones, you won't know what they're planning on doing. If they ask if their prescription is ready, and you're almost done with it, just tell them that it's ready, and then get it ready right then and there. Perhaps the customer is jumping the line but who cares. It's better to spend the five seconds that it takes to verify their product than to spend it reapproximating their wait time or explaining why it's not ready already. An added bonus is that if tell them their script is ready, which is what they want to hear mind you, then you will get them off the phone abruptly.

I have this bad habit of putting off taking the voicemail. I'm working on it though. LOL
 

zelman

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I said absolutely nothing of the sort. No where did I say to call the police in. And nowhere was this discussion about holding a prescription that was dated incorrectly for the next day (I am aware that every other doctor does this) I AM saying that since it sounds like his manager is keeping notes on him for not doing the same things that the manager does to make customers happy (and since it sounds like that things could pertain to early refills or other such things), then YES, he needs to be keeping notes himself, so that if this is carried further and he is wrote up, he can have a record to show to his manager's manager, to show that his manager is only writing him up because he follows the law.
You said "Never bend a legal rule..." and I gave an example of one.
 

HouTX

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I don't think this question has any weight to it. The pharmacist is always the point at which everything bottlenecks. Always. There is only how many of you versus how many of them?

I always type prescriptions and answer phone calls in addition to data review and product review.

These are my priorities in order of importance:
1. prescriptions are entered into the system (I will help them type)
2. phones are answered (I will held them answer the phones)
3. data is reviewed (I will review)
4. product is verified (I will review)
5. voicemail (I will receive)
6. product is filled (I will help them fill)
7. prescription bags are filed (I will help them file prescription bags)

Why do I prioritize this way? Well, if someone calls to find out if their prescription is there we'll know whether it in fact is because it's in our system. Plus, other stores can access our information through the database in case we're too busy and the customer doesn't want to wait or it was called into the wrong location. Customers have this pesky way of coming in unannounced, and if you don't answer the phones, you won't know what they're planning on doing. If they ask if their prescription is ready, and you're almost done with it, just tell them that it's ready, and then get it ready right then and there. Perhaps the customer is jumping the line but who cares. It's better to spend the five seconds that it takes to verify their product than to spend it reapproximating their wait time or explaining why it's not ready already. An added bonus is that if tell them their script is ready, which is what they want to hear mind you, then you will get them off the phone abruptly.

I have this bad habit of putting off taking the voicemail. I'm working on it though. LOL
it's a trick question and you answered it correctly. for somebody that is overwhelm by the workflow, they would not be able to help other workstations. and they will not have the foresight to give me the answer you just provided. thanks for spoiling it
 
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icekitsune

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Sep 9, 2008
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two sides to every story and we are only hearing the OP's side. I think the OP is way over their head in terms of managing workflow. let me ask you a simple question. are the techs constantly waiting on you or are you constantly waiting on the techs to push things to your queue?
Thanks for the reply. Sorry couldn't get back earlier. Usually I'm waiting for the techs to finish up inputting. When they are working on inputting or filling, I will get the phone or run the register if there are customers. There are times when the techs have to wait for me since in our workflow, the rx gets to the rph twice but for the most part, I wait for the tech. If there is only one tech and she is stuck at register, I would input, fill, and bag ect.
 
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icekitsune

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Sep 9, 2008
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sometimes it's familiarity or who you replaced. if it was a good pharmacist you replaced, you've got big shoes and expectations to fill. i know married women who go to the pharmacy just to go googly eyed over the guy working and bring their business just for him. i imagine the same goes for married men going for a hot female pharmacist, just for stares.

but i think most of the time, it's just familiarity. patients want to see someone they've known for a long time and in a time when so many things change in the area they live, it's nice to have something be as a constant and who knows your habits, expectations. OP didn't you just start? it can take many months or years (depending how frequent the customer is) for you to develop patient relationships. it also helps to learn their names but it takes time. i wouldn't sweat over it, just know where you need to improve and you'll be fine.
I did start about 5 months ago working 2 days a week so Idk if that is considered long enough time esp I don't see the same customers. I do know there are improvements but perhaps the way he said it made it sound like I'm purposely forcing them to go to him.
 

Chodronfan

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Don't sweat it. I switched pharmacy chains about 1 1/2 years ago. At first the customer satisfaction went down a little with me, now it's really great. Better than before I was there. They just need to get used to you. You won't change at all, but they will like you more next year I promise, if you stick it out.
It took me about ten minutes to figure out whether I could give Tdap with flu yesterday. I couldn't find the reference! I've been in retail 7 years, immunizing for 6.
You can't change your PIC's high opinion of themselves, best you can do is flip it, maybe ask them for advice on what they think you can do to be a better pharmacist - i.e. more like them. Nod politely, act interested, get a specific metric from them like a customer satisfaction score when you are the RPh on duty, and track that metric. Their feelings or intuition are kind of a lame metric, there is no way for you to measure that or track it, and their feelings might change from day to day. As a professional, you need metrics, not opinions and idle gossip.
 
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icekitsune

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Don't sweat it. I switched pharmacy chains about 1 1/2 years ago. At first the customer satisfaction went down a little with me, now it's really great. Better than before I was there. They just need to get used to you. You won't change at all, but they will like you more next year I promise, if you stick it out.
It took me about ten minutes to figure out whether I could give Tdap with flu yesterday. I couldn't find the reference! I've been in retail 7 years, immunizing for 6.
You can't change your PIC's high opinion of themselves, best you can do is flip it, maybe ask them for advice on what they think you can do to be a better pharmacist - i.e. more like them. Nod politely, act interested, get a specific metric from them like a customer satisfaction score when you are the RPh on duty, and track that metric. Their feelings or intuition are kind of a lame metric, there is no way for you to measure that or track it, and their feelings might change from day to day. As a professional, you need metrics, not opinions and idle gossip.
Thank you for the reply. Its kindof nice to know that even someone with that much experience will need to look things up. I just felt a bit down after he said I should know all these things in my head about shots/immunization but I rather be safe than sorry and make sure it is appropriate for the patient, especially if its the first pneumo vaccine I administer.
 

BidingMyTime

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You said "Never bend a legal rule..." and I gave an example of one.
If that is the law in your state, then yes the law should be followed. I fear the DEA & the pharmacy board, more than I fear the wrath of any patient. Honestly though, phone messages are always a he said/she said situation, so if you thought you heard the prescriber give their DEA, nobody is every going to be able to prove that you didn't.
 

zelman

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If that is the law in your state, then yes the law should be followed. I fear the DEA & the pharmacy board, more than I fear the wrath of any patient. Honestly though, phone messages are always a he said/she said situation, so if you thought you heard the prescriber give their DEA, nobody is every going to be able to prove that you didn't.
It's the law in my country. Probably yours, too. People just forget because it is broken so often.
 
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sounds like new grad hazing to me. you work part time there and for what? 3 months? and you're expected to win over a customer base from a dude that's been serving them full time for 6 years?
 

BidingMyTime

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It's the law in my country. Probably yours, too. People just forget because it is broken so often.
Really your country? Why would you think the law in my country would be anything like the law in your country?
 

BidingMyTime

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Most of us are in the USA
Well, I was assuming you were from the US, until you brought up "your country", then I thought you must be from a different country, otherwise why bring it up?

I have *never* heard of a requirement that the minimum wage clerk calling in a controlled prescription for a doctor must verbally recite his DEA number. Not in IL, not in any of the other states I've worked at. Out of curiosity, I did go through the IL pharmacy practice act to see if this really was something that I'd "forgotten", and no, I didn't forget it, because there is no such requirement. I am sorry that your state/country/planet has such a ridiculous requirement, but I stand by my statement that pharmacists should follow the law (and if the law is ridiculous enough, then work to change the law.) My license is NOT worth breaking the law for, you have made it clear in this and other threads that you disagree. That is your choice, it is not a choice I will make.
 

owlegrad

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Well, I was assuming you were from the US, until you brought up "your country", then I thought you must be from a different country, otherwise why bring it up?
He is cleverly pointing out that it is federal law for the DEA number to be included on any prescription for a controlled substance. No exceptions for phoned in prescriptions.
 

zelman

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Well, I was assuming you were from the US, until you brought up "your country", then I thought you must be from a different country, otherwise why bring it up?

I have *never* heard of a requirement that the minimum wage clerk calling in a controlled prescription for a doctor must verbally recite his DEA number. Not in IL, not in any of the other states I've worked at. Out of curiosity, I did go through the IL pharmacy practice act to see if this really was something that I'd "forgotten", and no, I didn't forget it, because there is no such requirement. I am sorry that your state/country/planet has such a ridiculous requirement, but I stand by my statement that pharmacists should follow the law (and if the law is ridiculous enough, then work to change the law.) My license is NOT worth breaking the law for, you have made it clear in this and other threads that you disagree. That is your choice, it is not a choice I will make.
I never addressed that example. I brought up the common practice of issuing/filling post-dated prescriptions. And you replied to that post. Back and forth and we ended up here.
 

Ackj

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I have *never* heard of a requirement that the minimum wage clerk calling in a controlled prescription for a doctor must verbally recite his DEA number.
At least in NY, it must be the prescriber who does the call in. Not knowing your own DEA = huge red flag.
 

BidingMyTime

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He is cleverly pointing out that it is federal law for the DEA number to be included on any prescription for a controlled substance. No exceptions for phoned in prescriptions.
Yes, the DEA must be written on the RX, but it's not required that the clerk calling it in recite it on the phone. If the pharmacist knows the doctor & knows their DEA, then they can put it on the RX (just the same as if the clerk called in and said to refill so & so's HCTZ with the same directions as last month). Obviously, the directions must be on the RX, but the pharmacist can fill in the directions.

I never addressed that example. I brought up the common practice of issuing/filling post-dated prescriptions. And you replied to that post. Back and forth and we ended up here.
It's the law in my country. Probably yours, too. People just forget because it is broken so often.
True, you did not originally bring up that point, but you certainly did address it.
 

zelman

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True, you did not originally bring up that point, but you certainly did address it.
Nope. Check the thread.

Care to comment on your "I will not be a part of ANY illegal activity" stance and the prevalence of post-dated prescriptions?
 

BidingMyTime

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Nope. Check the thread.
Care to comment on your "I will not be a part of ANY illegal activity" stance and the prevalence of post-dated prescriptions?
Sure, I don't fill post-dated prescriptions. The prescription is the property of the patients, so I return it to them. What they do with it at that point is their business. Following the law is not that hard to do.
 

zelman

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Sure, I don't fill post-dated prescriptions. The prescription is the property of the patients, so I return it to them. What they do with it at that point is their business. Following the law is not that hard to do.
So you're okay being an accessory to crimes? Also, you should check the laws of each state before you assume that the patient owns the prescription. I believe that NY state retains ownership of the blanks they issue.
 

BidingMyTime

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So you're okay being an accessory to crimes? Also, you should check the laws of each state before you assume that the patient owns the prescription. I believe that NY state retains ownership of the blanks they issue.
Well, I've never been to NY, so I have no idea about their blanks. I'm pretty sure a miswritten RX is not a crime in any state--scripts are miswritten all the time because of prescriber error (errors in directions, dating, even patient name!)--I have seen postdated RX's for antibiotics & all kinds of things because the prescriber didn't know what day it was or whatever. When the drug is not a CII, I will call & get the date clarified. Because the date on a CII can not be clarified over the phone, I give it back to the patient (as legally required since the script is their property in my state & encourage them to take it back to the physician to have correctly rewritten.)

Why do you find it so hard to believe that people can follow the law? You seem intent on trying to figure out how other pharmacists are breaking the law, as a means of justifying your own law-bending/breaking.

Oh, and I do check the laws of the states I practice in. Obviously, everyone should do the same. As I have already said if a previous post, you should follow the law in your state, and if its a ridiculous law, then work to change it.
 

zelman

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Well, I've never been to NY, so I have no idea about their blanks. I'm pretty sure a miswritten RX is not a crime in any state--scripts are miswritten all the time because of prescriber error (errors in directions, dating, even patient name!)--I have seen postdated RX's for antibiotics & all kinds of things because the prescriber didn't know what day it was or whatever. When the drug is not a CII, I will call & get the date clarified. Because the date on a CII can not be clarified over the phone, I give it back to the patient (as legally required since the script is their property in my state & encourage them to take it back to the physician to have correctly rewritten.)

Why do you find it so hard to believe that people can follow the law? You seem intent on trying to figure out how other pharmacists are breaking the law, as a means of justifying your own law-bending/breaking.

Oh, and I do check the laws of the states I practice in. Obviously, everyone should do the same. As I have already said if a previous post, you should follow the law in your state, and if its a ridiculous law, then work to change it.
Taking a prescription to another state doesn't mean that ownership changes. I assume you've filled prescriptions from out of state. Those may not be the property of the bearer.

You don't think a miswritten prescription is a crime? What about a forged one? How is a forged RX different from one that is intentionally miswritten? If Dr. X isn't following the laws of prescribing and practice, the fact that they have a license means very little.

I'm intent on showing people who act like they are "holier than thou" and say they would never bend a law or corporate rule that they have, in fact, done so.
 

BidingMyTime

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Taking a prescription to another state doesn't mean that ownership changes. I assume you've filled prescriptions from out of state. Those may not be the property of the bearer.
I have never seen a miswritten CII RX from another state, if I ever do, you can be sure I will research the law on the proper way to handle it.

You don't think a miswritten prescription is a crime? What about a forged one? How is a forged RX different from one that is intentionally miswritten? If Dr. X isn't following the laws of prescribing and practice, the fact that they have a license means very little.
A miswritten RX means the doctor made an error. Making an error is not a crime. Why would you assume that an RX that has an error on it was intentionally miswritten, and not the result of normal human error? Do you think the police should be called every time a pharmacist makes an error in filling a prescription? Likewise, why in the world would I call the police because a doctor made an error in writing an RX?

A forged prescription IS legally different, and I do keep forged prescriptions (as required by law.) Are you really a pharmacist and you don't know the legal difference between a forged prescription written by a non-licensed person and a legal prescription written by a legal prescriber that contains errors?

I'm intent on showing people who act like they are "holier than thou" and say they would never bend a law or corporate rule that they have, in fact, done so.
Oh, I'm human and make errors, just as everyone else. I quite possibly have broken a law or corporate rule because I was not aware of it, or because I just messed up. Accidently doing something wrong, is far different from PURPOSELY planning to break laws & corporate regulations. The vast majority of pharmacists don't purposely break rules or sit around thinking of ways to break rules.

But no hard feelings, if I'm I ever am having an anaphylaxis attack, I will be sure to come to your store for my flu shot. :)