Deaf can't be doctors?

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Neurocentric said:
Seriously. He's got me blocked, so he can't see anything I say, but I don't understand why people haven't gotten it into their heads that nothing you say will be agreed with by him. He'll just continue to say that medical schools cannot discriminate and of course the deaf can be doctors.. after all, there are some. 🙄
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Mr. T said it best: I pity the fool!
 
poppie910 said:
No not at all


Its more your attitude, reluctance to accept others opinions, and your sheer ridiculousness. (That of which being the dictionary's definition, not the thesaurus's. Which is in no way the same thing.)
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I do not, nor should anyone else, accept opinions that oppress Deaf people.
 
dmf2682 said:
"I understand you perfectly, Carl. You're an idiot."

Sigmund Freud, in correspondence to Jung. April, 1910
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Yes, Freud called Jung an idiot. Their understandings of consciousness were in conflict; hence, the reason for calling him an idiot. That does though, make jung or even me idiots. Its a bit shameful too, that you would use such a quote as if it somehow does.
 
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jasin said:
And that's because of the continued stereotypes and misconceptions hearing people have about the Deaf. It should not be that way though, especially with medical schools. When it comes to medical schools its doctors we are speaking of. Medical schools are ran by doctors and doctors of all people should be the first to know that these stereotypes and misconceptions are all false. They of all people should know that deafness does not prevent a person's limbs from moving or their vocal cords from making sounds. They should also know that deafness does not affect, negatively, a person's a ability to think and reason either.
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I've never seen a medical school claiming those limitations, much less ability to think and reason, but you must admit that there are procedures that require an ability to listen. Those are the things that are cited as a limitation. If you have any proof whatsoever that medical schools claim that limitations of deaf people are: ability to move limbs, vocal cords, ability to think and reason, please provide it. Otherwise, you should reconsider what you're claiming.
 
jasin said:
Yes, Freud called Jung an idiot. Their ways of understanding consciousness often were in conflict.
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See Jasin, that's your problem. You see something that *seems* to make sense, but you don't ask yourself, "hey, where did this guy get this?" You don't know if I just made that quote up for entertainment. Actually, I did! And it was hilarious!

Always try and verify sources. Especially when it deals with more critical information, like whether or not deaf people can become doctors. If say, a source like the amphl has information and doesn't provide a reference you need to ask yourself where they got that information, and what stake could they possibly have in spinning this info in the way that would profit them. An association of deaf healthcare professionals providing unreferenced information on how people can become physicians sounds pretty sketchy to me. Just about as bad as the tobacco lobby saying how there is no evidence that cigarettes cause cancer.

I think you're a decent gentleman (or lady), but a bit naive in what you believe. Take what I've taught you. Go forth and do good.

dmf- out.
 
TriagePreMed said:
here are procedures that require an ability to listen.
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But listening with the ears would not apply to the Deaf unless the deaf person is specifically using a hearing aid or CI to do their listening. Deaf people use their eyes, lip reading, writing exchange, general observation, behavioral observation, interpreters, etc. to listen. We listen using all of these or some of these, depending on the situation, methods and means to listen.
 
TriagePreMed said:
I've never seen a medical school claiming those limitations, much less ability to think and reason, but you must admit that there are procedures that require an ability to listen.
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People on here are asserting it does because there are certain requirements that mandate the need to speak, listen, not be impaired, etc.

see post #37


Also, Certain medical schools do lump together in their requirements things like the ability to hear, speak, etc. when in fact one has nothing to do with the other and has no bearing on one's ability to be a physician and practice medicine.

see post #164 here in this thread http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=882427&page=4
 
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If you want your opinions to be accepted by me or other Deaf than do not mock this thread. And certainly do not keep going on about how Deaf people are not capable of being doctors when in fact its been proven they are. When you do these things you only show a disdain for deaf people wanting to become physicians and a general ignorance about deafness and medical technology.
 
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dmf2682 said:
See Jasin, that's your problem. You see something that *seems* to make sense, but you don't ask yourself, "hey, where did this guy get this?" You don't know if I just made that quote up for entertainment. Actually, I did! And it was hilarious!
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Winning. You sir, are doing it right.
 
FrkyBgStok said:
Winning. You sir, are doing it right.
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Yeah that was hilarious! And Jasin even took the bait. Lmao!!

On a more serious note Jasin, and I would like to preface it by saying im not trying to show "disdain" towards you or the deaf.. I understand how the deaf can read lips and mannerisms and whatnot, but how is it that they're able to communicate BACK to the patient, medical staff, etc?? This in my opinion would create quite a hurdle, especially in an emergency situation...
 
tantacles said:
The ignore feature is great on SDN, but it's kind of worthless when everyone keeps quoting the troll.
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Trolling is posting responses or remarks that try to get a rise out of someone. None of my posts constitue that though since all my posts were factually based, on topic, and not insulting or mocking.

Examples of trolling can be seen in what you all are doing. eg. posts #27, 34, 44, 31, etc. And you were all asked to not do that. That request, however, went ignored and that is impolite and disrespectful towards the creator of this thread and SDN in general.
 
poppie910 said:
Yeah that was hilarious! And Jasin even took the bait. Lmao!!

On a more serious note Jasin, and I would like to preface it by saying im not trying to show "disdain" towards you or the deaf.. I understand how the deaf can read lips and mannerisms and whatnot, but how is it that they're able to communicate BACK to the patient, medical staff, etc?? This in my opinion would create quite a hurdle, especially in an emergency situation...
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I 've never had a problem communicating with hearing people reading, writing, signing, using nature gestures, and yes, even talking. 🙂
 
jasin said:
Trolling is posting responses or remarks that try to get a rise out of someone. None of my posts constitue that though since all my posts were factually based, on topic, and not insulting or mocking.

Examples of trolling can be seen in what you all are doing. eg. posts #27, 34, 44, 31, etc. And you were all asked to not do that. That request, however, went ignored and that is impolite and disrespectful towards the creator of this thread and SDN in general.
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Is that a joke? You truly are a freakin' trip dude. I don't know if you're really as naive as you act, but regardless, you need a dose of reality.. how old are you anyway??
 
poppie910 said:
Yeah that was hilarious! And Jasin even took the bait. Lmao!!

On a more serious note Jasin, and I would like to preface it by saying im not trying to show "disdain" towards you or the deaf.. I understand how the deaf can read lips and mannerisms and whatnot, but how is it that they're able to communicate BACK to the patient, medical staff, etc?? This in my opinion would create quite a hurdle, especially in an emergency situation...
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Please do not imply deaf people are communicationless i.e. stupid and mute. It's extremely insulting!!!!! 😡
 
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I personally think he should be banned. I guess its our faults that we rebut his comments, but he does nothing to add to this web forum imo.
 
FrkyBgStok said:
account on hold again????
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Maybe they realized they made a mistake when his account was taken off hold after barely 24 hours.

poppie910 said:
I personally think he should be banned. I guess its our faults that we rebut his comments, but he does nothing to add to this web forum imo.
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Agreed, seriously. Taking everything out of context - like he's done countless times - does nothing, and he only posts about issues that the Deaf have.

Why do I feel like we're in some sort of government operation?
 
Post#59
Jasin said:
Also, Certain medical schools do lump together in their requirements things like the ability to hear, speak, etc.
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Name them.


Post #1
Jasin said:
And yes, many medical schools still have policies and requirements that discriminate against the Deaf.
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Post #39
Jasin said:
Medical schools can't enforce and/or mandate policies against the Deaf that discriminate against them.
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Either they do or they don't. I asked you to give examples and you have failed. You have failed to give a single shred of evidence or name a single name. You can't change things if you can't specifically address the things which you feel are wrong. You can't make people see your point of view if all you do is throw accusations of descrimination and audism at them every time they share their opinion.

You're advocating in a way that, in my personal opinion, hurts those who have a hearing disability more than it could ever help them. You've managed to alienate a whole crowd of individuals who, despite the recriminations you have consistently thrown at them, were still (at a base level) trying to understand what makes you tick.

Sure, there are some folks here who are "poking the badger". You've played right into their hands. They want to see you banned and gone. At some point you're going to realize that you've failed to successfully "enlighten" anyone. That's your fault. You haven't made your case. The burden of proof is on the accuser, not the accusee.

You're entitled to your opinion. These other folks are entitled to theirs. Some of them will never change their opinions, and some are on the fence. (like me) I can see both points of view. There are varying degrees of deafness (as I'm sure you know). The more severe the case, the more significant the hurdles to meet a standard which is equal to all. It's only natural to harbor doubts. The point is that doubt is a human condition that is only cured by proving it wrong.

Your advocacy has proved nothing but the fact that you can make enemies. Anyone can do this. It's not hard at all. If you would rather be a good advocate, then try to make some friends. Ask some questions. Try being a bit more humble and a little less confrontational. See what makes people tick and you will start to see more subtle ways of getting their gears to go in the direction that you want them to.

This is just some advice from an old man who was once a young man that was good at making enemies too.
 
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Ok, jasin, I don't think a single person in this thread has said "deaf people can't be doctors". You keep saying people are, but I don't see a SINGLE PERSON saying it.

You also say that medical schools have rules/regulations that bar deaf students from entering their medical program. Can you cite a specific example of any of these?

It just seems like you keep attacking everyone for not saying how oppressed deaf people are and that you are 100% right. We're just asking for facts to back up what you're saying. You're playing victim here.

As for me, I'm perfectly fine with having a doctor treat me that is deaf as long as there isn't a communication barrier, such as having a medical translator or the doctor having a hearing aid. As long as we can communicate without issue I see no problem.
 
I am retired Federal employee. During my career I worked with a number of deaf people. One of them gradated from Galudet. I have been reading this thread and part of me thinks you are being taken for a ride. He writes way to well for someone who communicates via ASL. ASL has a different sentence structure. I read enough notes and memos to know how they write.
My question would be not can deaf be doctors but how does he plan on passing the MCAT if he has trouble understanding long paragraphs.
 
OldBat said:
I am retired Federal employee. During my career I worked with a number of deaf people. One of them gradated from Galudet. I have been reading this thread and part of me thinks you are being taken for a ride. He writes way to well for someone who communicates via ASL. ASL has a different sentence structure. I read enough notes and memos to know how they write.
My question would be not can deaf be doctors but how does he plan on passing the MCAT if he has trouble understanding long paragraphs.
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Agreed. Someone else mentioned that in another thread he had. I was going to say that he does seem to write very well, but on the other hand, he can't seem to grasp the context of what people are saying, so I thought it evened out. And many started off giving him the benefit of the doubt, but with his refusal to acknowledge anything that he cannot directly attack, most have moved into the "I got swindled by a snake oil salesman" camp. We don't want to admit we get trolled, but many of us did.
 
FrkyBgStok said:
Agreed. Someone else mentioned that in another thread he had. I was going to say that he does seem to write very well, but on the other hand, he can't seem to grasp the context of what people are saying, so I thought it evened out. And many started off giving him the benefit of the doubt, but with his refusal to acknowledge anything that he cannot directly attack, most have moved into the "I got swindled by a snake oil salesman" camp. We don't want to admit we get trolled, but many of us did.
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More like the crazy old person who yells at a telephone pole. That's what I feel like.
 
can people with no arms be surgeons? why does everyone here discriminate so much!
 
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cantthink said:
can people with no arms be surgeons? why does everyone here discriminate so much!
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They have some amazing prosthetic limbs and with Robotic surgery I would say yes they could be. Who knows maybe ten years from now they could be a regular surgeon.

No one has said he cannot be a doctor but he does have to take the MCAT and be accepted
 
To the OP:

I've been lurking this thread, and the only person I see saying deaf can't be doctors is you.

To me it sounds like everyone else is saying that as a deaf person, you could be a doctor, but there are a lot of challenges that you'll have to overcome in order to do so. What's so unreasonable or discriminatory about that?

There is one question I have. Do you think whatever technology you have available will be able to help you distinguish cardiac, lung, or bowel sounds? There are different kinds of sounds and they all can point to different pathologies (i.e. wheezing could mean bronchitis or asthma, crackles in the lungs could mean fluid is present, hyperactive bowel sounds could mean there is an obstruction). If you can get the technology to do this, then you could probably practice medicine. But this is an example of a way you have to get around your deafness in order to be successful. That's what everyone is saying. You have to be creative in order to overcome obstacles that could prevent you from functioning effectively as a physician. It doesn't mean you can't be a physician.

Still though, judging from your posts, even if you're not a troll, you don't show much emotional maturity. And that is something you absolutely cannot practice medicine without.
 
This thread really does remind me of the struggles of Helen Keller and how brave she was hiding in the attic from the Nazis.
 
pkwraith said:
This thread really does remind me of the struggles of Helen Keller and how brave she was hiding in the attic from the Nazis.
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She used the underground railroad to travel from attic to attic, evading the communist troops until she finally invented the atom bomb and defeated Pearl Harbor.
 
tantacles said:
She used the underground railroad to travel from attic to attic, evading the communist troops until she finally invented the atom bomb and defeated Pearl Harbor.
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Uh, pretty sure the latter part was Amelia Earhart.
 
pkwraith said:
Uh, pretty sure the latter part was Amelia Earhart.
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No, I just asked my professor, and he said that aside from during the tearing down of the Berlin wall, she was never allowed to wield any kind of machinery except a plane. Being locked into her potty chair in her aircraft, she never learned syntax. Which explains a lot, really.
 
tantacles said:
No, I just asked my professor, and he said that aside from during the tearing down of the Berlin wall, she was never allowed to wield any kind of machinery except a plane. Being locked into her potty chair in her aircraft, she never learned syntax. Which explains a lot, really.
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Ah, your professor must be talking about her career BEFORE she won the Nobel Prize in Aviation. After that, she was allowed to do whatever she wanted.
 
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theseeker4 said:
Ah, your professor must be talking about her career BEFORE she won the Nobel Prize in Aviation. After that, she was allowed to do whatever she wanted.
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This is off topic! Please address post #1 or something related to it out of respect to the Op.
 
Top Gun said:
To the OP:

I've been lurking this thread, and the only person I see saying deaf can't be doctors is you.
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I never once stated a deaf person could not be a doctor. If I did state a deaf person could not be a doctor then surely you could quote me stating that. Since you can't though its obvious you are just making stuff up. Matter of fact, I actually stated the opposite. If you had read post #1 you would know that.
 
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Top Gun said:
To the OP:
the only person I see saying deaf can't be doctors is you.
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I said the opposite. Here is proof:

jasin said:
even after the Deaf have proven themselves in this field a countless number of times people still discriminate. This is very disheartening too because the deaf should not of had to of gone to such an extent to just be accepted equally alongside hearing physicians. The fact though that Deaf people have proven themselves does blow away and disprove any myths, misconceptions, and half-truths still held about the Deaf becoming physicians and in general.

Which is evident by the fact that there are now Deaf who are pre-med, medical students, residents, and even attending physicians. In every level of becoming a physician and in the end ... being a physician, there are Deaf people.
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Top Gun said:
To the OP:

Do you think whatever technology you have available will be able to help you distinguish cardiac, lung, or bowel sounds? There are different kinds of sounds and they all can point to different pathologies (i.e. wheezing could mean bronchitis or asthma, crackles in the lungs could mean fluid is present, hyperactive bowel sounds could mean there is an obstruction). If you can get the technology to do this, then you could probably practice medicine. But this is an example of a way you have to get around your deafness in order to be successful. That's what everyone is saying. You have to be creative in order to overcome obstacles that could prevent you from functioning effectively as a physician. It doesn't mean you can't be a physician.
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Are you saying Deaf doctors are stupid and do not understand where the lungs, heart, and other organs are?
 
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