So im currently in a PhD program. im in my 3rd year getting ready to take my preliminaries and qualifiers. Im at a stand still because i dont know what route i want to take when i graduate. i know that i dont what to do a post doc. I like research but i dont see myself doing it everything for the rest of my life. I want to have options in my career which is why i was thinking about pursuing a PharmD once i finish. I know that pharmacy is saturated but i do not want to do into retail. I just want that background drug knowledge that i didnt get with the PhD and also have the option that if i want to practice, teach or conduct research i have that option. Any advice?
decisions
- Thread starter sdn24
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Two questions:
1. What is your PhD major? (If something really broad like Med Chem or Pharmacology, what is your area of specialization within that major.)
2. What did you want to do as a PhD originally? Teach, research, work a corporate oversight job, etc?
The PharmD is a very defined in terms of work and also jobs, but a PhD has to find their own way. If you don't have the ego to do so, you will be a lifelong Postdoc.
1. What is your PhD major? (If something really broad like Med Chem or Pharmacology, what is your area of specialization within that major.)
2. What did you want to do as a PhD originally? Teach, research, work a corporate oversight job, etc?
The PharmD is a very defined in terms of work and also jobs, but a PhD has to find their own way. If you don't have the ego to do so, you will be a lifelong Postdoc.
You started a PhD but don't want to do research? And now you want to get a PharmD but don't want to do retail? Listen to what you are saying...
You need to set a goal, if you aim for nothing you will end up nowhere.
You need to set a goal, if you aim for nothing you will end up nowhere.
If you don't know exactly what you want to do, how do we know?
PhD who doesn't want reaearch.
PharmD who doesn't want to work retail and just want some drug knowledge.
Somehow, You remind me of my patient saying "I need refill.. white and round pill.. but i don't know what it is. Since you are a pharmacist, you can help, right?"
No offence. But If you want to get PharmD just for drug info, just get LexiComp. 200K loan & 4 years not needed..
PhD is a long dragged out process with no guaranteed outcome. It will take years to become a successful PI. You probably know it by now. I had that choice years ago. Although I never enrolled into a PhD program.
You should be good with numbers... PhD route - 3-4 years more of schooling (depending on your program you might be getting paid for being in school right now). After that you are in for post doc pay at NIH levels (45-50k). Research, with current funding, is probably more competitive than pharmacy right now.
PharmD - best case you are in school in 2018 at this point. Graduating in 2022 with the loans noted above (~150-200k).
Since it doesn't look like you have passion for either field, it kind of hard to say what you should do. It will be hard to succeed in science if you are not dedicated to it. Not so much for retail pharmacy.
You should be good with numbers... PhD route - 3-4 years more of schooling (depending on your program you might be getting paid for being in school right now). After that you are in for post doc pay at NIH levels (45-50k). Research, with current funding, is probably more competitive than pharmacy right now.
PharmD - best case you are in school in 2018 at this point. Graduating in 2022 with the loans noted above (~150-200k).
Since it doesn't look like you have passion for either field, it kind of hard to say what you should do. It will be hard to succeed in science if you are not dedicated to it. Not so much for retail pharmacy.
My phd major is in pharmacology specializing in CIDs. Initially I want to work in industry. I don't mind teaching nor doing research but I want to have that option where if I want to do one over the other I can.
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For PharmDs, there is a historical difference separating those who are really good at doing one technical thing over and over like nuclear pharmacy or technical informatics which is mine (the technician), or very good at putting things together from some knowledge background basis in ways that are situation dependent like clinical pharmacy, or nursing home oversight, or clinical informatics (the performer). While it is possible as a PharmD to switch between the two, it's more or less hardcoded into PhD work where transitioning requires a postdoc year most of the time.
Thanks, the reason I asked was to figure out whether you were in a "technician" (crystallography) or a "performer" (channel) PhD track. What you stated in your brief career plan is a very standard plan in the business. Research is important as a credential in the early, but how it is parleyed into mid and late is where the tracks diverge.
Something to know, not many (and I mean less than 10%) in your major are directly involved in the laboratory after around 50. This includes NIH. Yes, there are exceptions, but they are usually confined to people who disqualify themselves for other roles (autistic spectrum, extreme introvert, particularly terrible speaker). The rest of the neurotypicals may or may not continue to oversee the laboratory as a research director (yes, PI's don't necessary do the dirty work, often leaving it to their spectrum co-I or eternal postdoc to do the day-to-day supervision), but there are just as many in the scientific management, regulatory, and/or education areas. And if you look at the Nobel Prize winners in Pharmacology who are exceptional, I usually talk about why they were exceptional what happens to most of them who were very lab focused. Earl Sutherland had a hell of a drinking problem which prevented him from active teaching (he unfortunately drank himself to death), Goodman Gilman (his premier graduate student) has a particularly well-known laboratory management style (which you can ask about from his alumni and has gotten UT Southwestern in not so easy trouble), Ferid Murad had a practice that was an outlet for the times that Stanford was screwing him over. This is not to say that there are not positive reasons for direct involvement, but there is usually a personal agenda or something of an exception involved. Lester Mitscher who ran a classical Med Chem laboratory is obsessive over antibiotic research due to a sister dying from what is easily treatable today, so he remains not only as PI but an active wet lab worker. There's a loose rule that most pharmaceutical scientists end their direct research careers around 45 and use the remaining time to either see their vision through management or end up in oversight.
This is probably the case in your lab, unless it is unusually small or your PI advisor has the same sorts of disqualifying mannerisms for other work. You at least need some research occupation to deal with the first five to ten years of your career, then depending on personal talents (and vices), it's fairly easy in the industry to find your way into less research heavy careers.
Something about you that I suspect where the other posters who are PharmD's or in training to be PharmD's won't understand at a level that we do. The dissertation phase is a lonely one, and it's easy to feel despondent over the work particularly because the burden is not shared with anyone else in a way that straight PharmD training does not have (almost all PharmD training is prescriptive and normative in nature, not giving the candidate time to explore unless they go out of their way to experience it). This feeling of alienation from what you think you love to do is not uncommon to experience during dissertation especially during the twilight phase to get done. I couldn't look at a computer six months prior and after mime, which was commented on by my colleagues of basically overeating at a cake buffet. It's not that I don't like cake, but there's limits for everyone. I have a deep feeling that you are experiencing those feelings of "I loved this once upon a time, why not now that I have all the time to do this?" and are thinking that this is not for you. I think you are in a forced overindulgence which is causing you to think about anything else rather than finishing. This is a dangerous time. Figure out whether or not this is dissertation blues or not, but if is not...then you need to think about your other talents. It's best if you talk to people who knew you BEFORE you started your dissertation as judges. Your advisor may or not be able to help (they may be one of the aforementioned defective personalities), but your friends and lover(s) should be to ground your own psyche from your work personality (I hope).
However, if you are experiencing this at your preliminaries (pre-dissertation), I can see why this might work out. If you find that this sort of work is not for you, there are plenty of regulatory, clinical trial, and even I-bank work (but you should look and act more like a drug rep if that is going to be your talent). Academic pharmacologists are one aspect of the business, but not as representative as the diversity of industry pharmacologists. There's plenty of alternate roles, but unlike the PharmD's where there is more a defined career trajectory, PhD's have to continually reevaluate themselves and redo their careers as their ambition for research, energy level, and let's face it, sexiness of the topic (ask around how crystallography turned out for all those 1990 grads and what AI clinical support is for mine). Otherwise, you will recover your initial love in time, but that takes some distance, and you might not have that luxury in this market.
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I actually think that I am going to switch over to the pharmD. My department has been giving me a hard time and I think it's best if I just remove myself from that situation before I get in way too deep. They are holding me back from doing a lot of things. I haven't even took my preliminary test yet and each time I ask my advisor he says don't worry about it. I honestly think they are trying to hold me longer than I should be so I think it's best if I just get a fresh start
