Dermpath compensation?

[odyssey2]

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Anyone know the average compensation for dermpath? Is it in line with other pathology salaries or is it generally as or more lucrative than general derm? Is it difficult to match dermpath through a dermatology residency?

 

[Dr. Doctor MD]

Anyone know the average compensation for dermpath? Is it in line with other pathology salaries or is it generally as or more lucrative than general derm? Is it difficult to match dermpath through a dermatology residency?

Salary is usually equal to or a bit higher than general dermatology (but can sometimes be a lot higher, depending on the job). Matching dermatopathology from dermatology residency is very easy and is almost guaranteed for anyone who wants it, while matching dermpath after pathology residency is very competitive.

 

[PhillyMed777]

Salary is usually equal to or a bit higher than general dermatology (but can sometimes be a lot higher, depending on the job). Matching dermatopathology from dermatology residency is very easy and is almost guaranteed for anyone who wants it, while matching dermpath after pathology residency is very competitive.

Agree with this. Some do very well. Others find themselves in unsavory positions (e.g working for private equity/VC type places).

One thing I would add for matching dermpath is that matching at "top" places can be quite hard. There can be lots of politics, with spots filling out years in advance. Also for the departments where dermpath is housed out of pathology department, some like to take path trained folks (this includes internals or places that often trade spots for fellowships). Still so, matching as derm trained is orders of magnitude easier. This is certainly debatable, but given the current environment I do think it could be beneficial to do dermpath at a top tier place if possible. Also at least anecdotally, it seems that derm-trained dermatopathologists seem to get better offers/opportunities, but that is absolutely not a rule. After training, many take hybrid derm-dermpath positions. If you are geographically limited, you may be required to take the hybrid job if you cannot move to another place which has a full time opportunity.

 

[odyssey2]

Agree with this. Some do very well. Others find themselves in unsavory positions (e.g working for private equity/VC type places).

One thing I would add for matching dermpath is that matching at "top" places can be quite hard. There can be lots of politics, with spots filling out years in advance. Also for the departments where dermpath is housed out of pathology department, some like to take path trained folks (this includes internals or places that often trade spots for fellowships). Still so, matching as derm trained is orders of magnitude easier. This is certainly debatable, but given the current environment I do think it could be beneficial to do dermpath at a top tier place if possible. Also at least anecdotally, it seems that derm-trained dermatopathologists seem to get better offers/opportunities, but that is absolutely not a rule. After training, many take hybrid derm-dermpath positions. If you are geographically limited, you may be required to take the hybrid job if you cannot move to another place which has a full time opportunity.

What is the state of the "current environment" for dermpath and why is it necessary to go to a top-tier place? Is it hard to find an exclusive dermpath job?

 

[PhillyMed777]

What is the state of the "current environment" for dermpath and why is it necessary to go to a top-tier place? Is it hard to find an exclusive dermpath job?

i never said its required or needed. If you are passionate and capable, it does not matter.
current environment is a more difficult job market, and over the years declining reimbursement.
it can be hard, although not impossible to find exclusive dermpath.

 

[Nilf]

What is the state of the "current environment" for dermpath and why is it necessary to go to a top-tier place? Is it hard to find an exclusive dermpath job?

I don't think a top-tier place is necessary at all. I don't care where you did you did the fellowship. I care if you can find melanoma on a slide.

I'm a path-trained dermpath. I sign out almost exclusively dermpath. It's almost impossible for us to get a derm-trained dermpath to even come down for an interview, and we are paying above average as far as I know. Path-trained folks are easier, but still it's very difficult to find a competent one.

Over past 8 years we've hired and fired dermpaths who were plain incompetent and dangerous to patients (missed melanomas etc), had mental issues, or substance abuse problems.

If you know your stuff and are somewhat normal, you'll be a hot commodity especially if you are derm trained. Regarding compensation I think you'll make much more if you mix clinic with dermpath signout. YMMV

 

[PhillyMed777]

I don't think a top-tier place is necessary at all. I don't care where you did you did the fellowship. I care if you can find melanoma on a slide.

I'm a path-trained dermpath. I sign out almost exclusively dermpath. It's almost impossible for us to get a derm-trained dermpath to even come down for an interview, and we are paying above average as far as I know. Path-trained folks are easier, but still it's very difficult to find a competent one.

Over past 8 years we've hired and fired dermpaths who were plain incompetent and dangerous to patients (missed melanomas etc), had mental issues, or substance abuse problems.

If you know your stuff and are somewhat normal, you'll be a hot commodity especially if you are derm trained. Regarding compensation I think you'll make much more if you mix clinic with dermpath signout. YMMV

Thanks for your input

How many cases do you read per day?

 

[mario2010]

I have done hiring for both derm and path trained dermpaths. Compensation varies and is a function of volume particularly in collection based setting. Generally speaking, a high volume dermpath (130 plus jars) in a collection based model will make more as compared to a gen derm seeing 35-40 pts including few excisions, if both are working same number of days.

I agree with the above comments. It has become increasingly difficult to find quality dermpaths, willing to live outside of large urban centers. I guess part of is a generational change, most derm as well as path-dermpaths that I interviewed recently, want to stay in big cities with emphasis on work life balance. Going to a big name academic place will help for academic jobs. If I am hiring for an exclusive dermpath position, I will personally prefer someone with solid diagnostic skills, ideally with atleast few years experience and a sensible easy going personality. It wouldn’t really matter whether that person went to Harvard for fellowship or at a small program.

 

[PhillyMed777]

I have done hiring for both derm and path trained dermpaths. Compensation varies and is a function of volume particularly in collection based setting. Generally speaking, a high volume dermpath (130 plus jars) in a collection based model will make more as compared to a gen derm seeing 35-40 pts including few excisions, if both are working same number of days.

I agree with the above comments. It has become increasingly difficult to find quality dermpaths, willing to live outside of large urban centers. I guess part of is a generational change, most derm as well as path-dermpaths that I interviewed recently, want to stay in big cities with emphasis on work life balance. Going to a big name academic place will help for academic jobs. If I am hiring for an exclusive dermpath position, I will personally prefer someone with solid diagnostic skills, ideally with atleast few years experience and a sensible easy going personality. It wouldn’t really matter whether that person went to Harvard for fellowship or at a small program.

great inputs!

this if anything, bodes well for dermpath. I do wonder if the long held notion of a horrid job market in dermpath is no longer true.

And i agree, my comment above about going to a "top place" for fellowship was referring to placement for academic jobs. If you look at top academic institutions, many of their dermpaths seem to have trained at similar peer institutions

 

[infiniteregress2020]

@mario2010 @Nilf

Salary is usually equal to or a bit higher than general dermatology (but can sometimes be a lot higher, depending on the job). Matching dermatopathology from dermatology residency is very easy and is almost guaranteed for anyone who wants it, while matching dermpath after pathology residency is very competitive.

@PhillyMed777
I've also gotten recently interested in dermpath and have been looking into the field.

If you're a path-trained dermpath doctor rather than derm-trained, will your salary still be on equal or higher footing than a general dermatologist? and is the job market generally worse for path-trained dermpath doctors than derm-trained ones?

If I want to pursue dermpath through the pathology residency route (I'm more interested in the path-side of things cuz I worked for 2 years as a RA in a pathology lab, I don't start med school until this July 2024, and idk if I stand a chance at matching into derm and idk if I'm interested in general derm itself), will going to a top-tier residency program be crucial for me to stand a competitive shot at a dermpath fellowship later on to be on competitive standing with other derm-trained applicants?

And if I just wanna go into private practice/industry/non-academic jobs, the prestige of the dermpath fellowship program doesn't matter as much, right?

 

[Mace1370]

@mario2010 @Nilf

@PhillyMed777
I've also gotten recently interested in dermpath and have been looking into the field.

If you're a path-trained dermpath doctor rather than derm-trained, will your salary still be on equal or higher footing than a general dermatologist? and is the job market generally worse for path-trained dermpath doctors than derm-trained ones?

If I want to pursue dermpath through the pathology residency route (I'm more interested in the path-side of things cuz I worked for 2 years as a RA in a pathology lab, I don't start med school until this July 2024, and idk if I stand a chance at matching into derm and idk if I'm interested in general derm itself), will going to a top-tier residency program be crucial for me to stand a competitive shot at a dermpath fellowship later on to be on competitive standing with other derm-trained applicants?

And if I just wanna go into private practice/industry/non-academic jobs, the prestige of the dermpath fellowship program doesn't matter as much, right?

I'm a path trained dermpath. Salaries are generally even at a given location for paths and derms. However, I agree with the comments above that derm trained dermpaths tend to have an easier time finding jobs. This may be because of the hybrid general derm/dermpath jobs that path trained folks can't access. Many practices like to have a mix of both and it seems (from my experience) that there are fewer derm/dermpaths out there so it makes them slightly more desirable in that regard.

Going to a prestigious fellowship will help, but is by no means required to find a good job. The vast majority of dermpath fellowships are very good, with only a few notable exceptions. You'll know if you are at one of those programs when you interview.