Didn't get into residency this year - unsure on how to move forward?

[EndoResidencyHelp]

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Hi everyone. I am a current D4 and applied to endo residency programs. I applied to about 10 schools, only received 1 interview, and it doesn't look like I am receiving an acceptance. I haven't had an official rejection yet from the school I interviewed at, but being that it is November, I am assuming I was silently rejected. I did keep in touch with the program director after applying and they told me that they were "definitely interested" in me and that they had some spots open still, but this was about 6 weeks ago and it's been silence ever since.

I just feel really lost because I spent the last 4 years getting my resume/CV built up for residency that I don't really know what to do next other than looking for a job.

I definitely want to reapply for residency, but don't know WHEN I should reapply. My assumption is that my biggest weakness is that I was a D4 as opposed to someone who has been out in practice. I'm not sure how many years of practice I should have under my belt before trying again - 1? 3? 5? More than that? My school had 4 people apply for endo and 2 got in, so then again, I don't really know how true it is that programs value applicants with work experience?

As well, I'm not entirely sure what to do with the rest of my CV. I guess none of the class rank, leadership activities, research, publications, TA experience, etc matter anymore. Should I focus the next couple of years on CE? Is there anything else I should be doing? Do I need to apply to more schools than 10? I did go to AAE this with a faculty member from my school and he introduced me to several program directors. I didn't get an interview though to any of those schools. Do I go again next year?

Any advice at all is really appreciated. It's super awkward because all of my friends have been accepted into some kind of residency program and I'm just sitting here absolutely crushed.

 

[Extirpator]

Don’t sweat it. You’re far from the only one who’s been in this position. The applicant pool is very competitive and all other things being similar, programs are going to tend to prefer GPR/AEGD and/or private practice experience.

You already have an application ready to go and can send in some GPR applications after spending a couple hours on a new personal statement and clicking a few buttons (don’t bother with new letters). Most endo programs prefer people with experience beyond dental school. A good GPR or AEGD will not only look very impressive on an application, but will make you a more well-rounded clinician in the long run. Private practice is another option and would allow you to save some money, but it’s going to be tougher to get time off for interviews and won’t touch the experience you get at a good GPR in that same amount of time. Plus you don’t sound like you want to go into practice just yet. Be honest and let programs know you didn’t get in and intend to apply again this coming cycle.

Apply to endo next year and start getting that application ready now. You’ll need to submit right around graduation time. Let faculty know you’ll be applying again and ask if they’d be willing to submit letters again next cycle. Consider the ADAT if you didn’t take it and feel it could improve things. Taking the ADAT now (if you didn’t already) will likely be easier than making time to study during a GPR. Obviously don’t let your grades suffer too much in the name of studying, since those will remain important. Consider contacting the programs you applied to and asking how you could improve your application. Puts you on their radar and you’ll probably get better advice since they have your actual application in front of them. No harm in applying to more programs if you’re at all financially able. Better to spend $10-15k on apps/interviews than having to apply a third time and wait another year. While one year in a GPR is probably better than going straight into endo residency, the benefit of additional years in practice is more questionable in my opinion.

 

[rubberdamit]

I understand how you feel. I decided that I wanted to pursue endo when I was a second year dental student. Due to things going on in my personal life (getting married and my wife also being in professional school), it never worked out for me to apply for endo residency until I had been out of school for 1 year. Timeline: I graduated dental school in 2018, went to work in private practice, applied last cycle/summer 2019, and will be starting endo residency in summer 2020. When I was in your shoes, It was really tough to watch my friends start residencies, buy practices, etc. all while I felt like I was just spinning my wheels putting off what I knew I wanted to do. Looking back, I wouldn't trade these years working as a general dentist for anything. It is really nice to start making money and there is a ton to learn about dealing with staff, patients, labs, specialists, insurance companies, etc. that no classroom or residency can teach you. Is any of this absolutely necessary to be an endodontist..? No.. but my advice here would be: enjoy the ride and learn as much as you can from every situation you're in. Focus on doing quality dentistry and taking care of your patients and I can guarantee you that it will all work out how it is supposed to in the end.

I think continuing to show interest in the profession is never a bad idea. If you are able to go to AAE, I feel like this is a great opportunity to connect with program directors and current residents. Also, I would reach out to all of the schools you applied to this time and seek advice for what you can change for next cycle to increase your chances of getting an interview. I know there aren't many published externships for endodontics programs, but I doubt many or any would turn you away if you want to go spend a day shadowing to learn more about the program prior to the application opening. This is a good way to get your foot in the door and make a good first impression when the stakes aren't so high. If you are positive that you want to pursue endo, I would continue to apply each cycle until you are accepted.

Lastly, don't give up on this cycle just yet. I know two people who were accepted to endo late in the spring, only a few months before starting their program. If I were you I would start figuring out your non-endo plan for next year right now. If you can find a spot in a GPR/AEGD, this is a great transition year. If not, figure out where you'd like to live and start the job search. Whatever you do, don't let other people's journey make you feel bad about your own. You are a few months away from being a real deal dentist.. you have an incredible career ahead of you and a skill that will allow you to change lives. Keep a positive attitude and don't give up- good luck!

 

[gryffindor]

It would not be a bad idea to go into a GPR that does endo cases. But if that's not feasible, then you get a job and reapply in the next cycle. You apply to more programs depending on how badly you want this speciality. I don't know about Endo specifically, but I know in ortho that there is no CE course you could take as a GP that would impress a program director, the courses for GPs all suck. So do your research before spending a ton on Endo CE aimed at GPs. Good luck and don't lose hope, try again. You may want to consider having all endodontists write your letters. You never know if the letter write went to school with someone reviewing the applications and that causes your file to get a second look.

 

[EndoResidencyHelp]

Don’t sweat it. You’re far from the only one who’s been in this position. The applicant pool is very competitive and all other things being similar, programs are going to tend to prefer GPR/AEGD and/or private practice experience.

You already have an application ready to go and can send in some GPR applications after spending a couple hours on a new personal statement and clicking a few buttons (don’t bother with new letters). Most endo programs prefer people with experience beyond dental school. A good GPR or AEGD will not only look very impressive on an application, but will make you a more well-rounded clinician in the long run. Private practice is another option and would allow you to save some money, but it’s going to be tougher to get time off for interviews and won’t touch the experience you get at a good GPR in that same amount of time. Plus you don’t sound like you want to go into practice just yet. Be honest and let programs know you didn’t get in and intend to apply again this coming cycle.

Apply to endo next year and start getting that application ready now. You’ll need to submit right around graduation time. Let faculty know you’ll be applying again and ask if they’d be willing to submit letters again next cycle. Consider the ADAT if you didn’t take it and feel it could improve things. Taking the ADAT now (if you didn’t already) will likely be easier than making time to study during a GPR. Obviously don’t let your grades suffer too much in the name of studying, since those will remain important. Consider contacting the programs you applied to and asking how you could improve your application. Puts you on their radar and you’ll probably get better advice since they have your actual application in front of them. No harm in applying to more programs if you’re at all financially able. Better to spend $10-15k on apps/interviews than having to apply a third time and wait another year. While one year in a GPR is probably better than going straight into endo residency, the benefit of additional years in practice is more questionable in my opinion.

My school really discourages AEGD/GPR programs for our graduates, unless its a requirement for a state like NY or the military. They say that we are "overqualified" and that we are ready to go into practice after graduation. However, I did speak with a faculty member from one of the schools that I applied to (prior to applying) and his advice was to do an AEGD... but he was also the former program director for their AEGD, so I guess I didn't really take that advice to heart. I wouldn't be against doing one, but I have a lot of debt and am wondering if it might be better to just start working and at least make payments? My school is also very generous with time off, I have about 5 weeks of time off saved up that I can use to interview if needed.
I did not take the ADAT. That's a really good idea to take it. We are done with classes at my school, so I don't have to worry about grades anymore. I'll definitely start looking into taking it!

I understand how you feel. I decided that I wanted to pursue endo when I was a second year dental student. Due to things going on in my personal life (getting married and my wife also being in professional school), it never worked out for me to apply for endo residency until I had been out of school for 1 year. Timeline: I graduated dental school in 2018, went to work in private practice, applied last cycle/summer 2019, and will be starting endo residency in summer 2020. When I was in your shoes, It was really tough to watch my friends start residencies, buy practices, etc. all while I felt like I was just spinning my wheels putting off what I knew I wanted to do. Looking back, I wouldn't trade these years working as a general dentist for anything. It is really nice to start making money and there is a ton to learn about dealing with staff, patients, labs, specialists, insurance companies, etc. that no classroom or residency can teach you. Is any of this absolutely necessary to be an endodontist..? No.. but my advice here would be: enjoy the ride and learn as much as you can from every situation you're in. Focus on doing quality dentistry and taking care of your patients and I can guarantee you that it will all work out how it is supposed to in the end.

I think continuing to show interest in the profession is never a bad idea. If you are able to go to AAE, I feel like this is a great opportunity to connect with program directors and current residents. Also, I would reach out to all of the schools you applied to this time and seek advice for what you can change for next cycle to increase your chances of getting an interview. I know there aren't many published externships for endodontics programs, but I doubt many or any would turn you away if you want to go spend a day shadowing to learn more about the program prior to the application opening. This is a good way to get your foot in the door and make a good first impression when the stakes aren't so high. If you are positive that you want to pursue endo, I would continue to apply each cycle until you are accepted.

Lastly, don't give up on this cycle just yet. I know two people who were accepted to endo late in the spring, only a few months before starting their program. If I were you I would start figuring out your non-endo plan for next year right now. If you can find a spot in a GPR/AEGD, this is a great transition year. If not, figure out where you'd like to live and start the job search. Whatever you do, don't let other people's journey make you feel bad about your own. You are a few months away from being a real deal dentist.. you have an incredible career ahead of you and a skill that will allow you to change lives. Keep a positive attitude and don't give up- good luck!

You are such a kind person! Thank you so much for sharing your experience and congratulations on starting residency next year! You have a very good point that there is no substitution for actually working in private practice to learn all of those things. I took a couple of years off between undergrad and dental school and there is no harm in doing the same between dental school and residency either.
Prior to applying this year, I did reach out to a bunch of different schools to see if I could shadow for a day. Only one responded though and let me visit, but that was also the school that interviewed me. I think your idea of networking at AAE and making connections there might increase my chances at getting a reply this time around.
And thank you! I think I am just in a bit of a self-pity wallow. Everyone yesterday was sharing their MATCH results and writing about how all of their hard work the last 4 years has paid off and I was just sitting there like, what about my hard work? But you're right, I have to just move forward and work on my non-endo plan!

It would not be a bad idea to go into a GPR that does endo cases. But if that's not feasible, then you get a job and reapply in the next cycle. You apply to more programs depending on how badly you want this speciality. I don't know about Endo specifically, but I know in ortho that there is no CE course you could take as a GP that would impress a program director, the courses for GPs all suck. So do your research before spending a ton on Endo CE aimed at GPs. Good luck and don't lose hope, try again. You may want to consider having all endodontists write your letters. You never know if the letter write went to school with someone reviewing the applications and that causes your file to get a second look.

That's a good point about the CE courses. I'll definitely have to do research and see what ones (if any) are even worth it. I'll also try to increase the number of LORs from endodontists next time. This year I only had 2 of them come from endodontists, the other ones came from my clinical supervisor, my research mentor, and our Dean.

 

[Extirpator]

My school really discourages AEGD/GPR programs for our graduates, unless its a requirement for a state like NY or the military. They say that we are "overqualified" and that we are ready to go into practice after graduation. However, I did speak with a faculty member from one of the schools that I applied to (prior to applying) and his advice was to do an AEGD... but he was also the former program director for their AEGD, so I guess I didn't really take that advice to heart. I wouldn't be against doing one, but I have a lot of debt and am wondering if it might be better to just start working and at least make payments? My school is also very generous with time off, I have about 5 weeks of time off saved up that I can use to interview if needed.
I did not take the ADAT. That's a really good idea to take it. We are done with classes at my school, so I don't have to worry about grades anymore. I'll definitely start looking into taking it!

If you’re at a super clinical school, you likely won’t gain much more in residency vs. private practice/CE as far as private practice oriented procedures go. However, a hospital-based GPR where you take call and get decent exposure to trauma, facial infections, and medically complex patients will offer experience that could take an entire career in private practice to match.

 

[Torshammer]

Great advice from others. I also recommend taking the ADAT - a high score will help a lot.

 

[AONLINE]

My school really discourages AEGD/GPR programs for our graduates, unless its a requirement for a state like NY or the military. They say that we are "overqualified" and that we are ready to go into practice after graduation.

Let me guess... Midwestern?
If so, you must have a HUGE amount of debt. It might not be a bad idea to work for a few years first before going to Endo residency and accumulate even more debt.

 

[EndoResidencyHelp]

Let me guess... Midwestern?
If so, you must have a HUGE amount of debt. It might not be a bad idea to work for a few years first before going to Endo residency and accumulate even more debt.

Haha surprisingly not. I don't want to give out the exact name of my school but we are on the east coast. I do, however, have a large amount of debt (not as bad as Midwestern thankfully) and 100% see the benefit of working for a few years to tackle at least some of it.

 

[deleted1003756]

What about another postgraduate program?, and then after, you go for endodontics again. You will be surprised how many have done this. Is an alternative way of proving that you want to study and be a better professional.

 

[allDAT]

Congrats on landing an interview. If you’re serious about endo, the best step is to go to an aged or GPR, preferably one close to an endo program and then reapply next year. Take the ADAT too. Use the next year to network, network, network. Disregard what your school says about being overqualified for a GPR, this is about getting into endo, not getting into private practice. Attend the AAE next year too.

Good luck.

 

[allDAT]

An aside to my post - if the one program you interviewed at was your school, many will do a courtesy interview. Just be aware of that if this is the case.

 

[erinnnnn]

The University of Kentucky offered a part-time endo internship program this past year. It’s referred to as the “Endo Scholars Program” and is essentially 1 year of seeing endo-only patients M-W, allowing you to work in private practice the other days. I am not at all affiliated with this program but it might be worthwhile to see if something like this might be an option for you!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN

 

[Torshammer]

The University of Kentucky offered a part-time endo internship program this past year. It’s referred to as the “Endo Scholars Program” and is essentially 1 year of seeing endo-only patients M-W, allowing you to work in private practice the other days. I am not at all affiliated with this program but it might be worthwhile to see if something like this might be an option for you!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN

That sounds like an awesome opportunity. Are there any others schoola offering endo-only internships?

 

[EndoResidencyHelp]

An aside to my post - if the one program you interviewed at was your school, many will do a courtesy interview. Just be aware of that if this is the case.

Thank you for the advice. My school doesn't have residency programs. However, the school that did interview, all of their residents were people that had practiced for a few years before going into residency. Our group that actually interviewed was a mix of D4s, people in an AEGD/GPR, and those that had been out in private practice. It was brought up during my interview that in the past, they had accepted D4s and that they "didn't perform as well" as those who came from private practice. It was kind of awkward to be honest. I'm not really sure why they even interviewed me.

 

[PreDentTechySon]

My school really discourages AEGD/GPR programs for our graduates, unless its a requirement for a state like NY or the military. They say that we are "overqualified" and that we are ready to go into practice after graduation. However, I did speak with a faculty member from one of the schools that I applied to (prior to applying) and his advice was to do an AEGD... but he was also the former program director for their AEGD, so I guess I didn't really take that advice to heart. I wouldn't be against doing one, but I have a lot of debt and am wondering if it might be better to just start working and at least make payments? My school is also very generous with time off, I have about 5 weeks of time off saved up that I can use to interview if needed.
I did not take the ADAT. That's a really good idea to take it. We are done with classes at my school, so I don't have to worry about grades anymore. I'll definitely start looking into taking it!

You are such a kind person! Thank you so much for sharing your experience and congratulations on starting residency next year! You have a very good point that there is no substitution for actually working in private practice to learn all of those things. I took a couple of years off between undergrad and dental school and there is no harm in doing the same between dental school and residency either.
Prior to applying this year, I did reach out to a bunch of different schools to see if I could shadow for a day. Only one responded though and let me visit, but that was also the school that interviewed me. I think your idea of networking at AAE and making connections there might increase my chances at getting a reply this time around.
And thank you! I think I am just in a bit of a self-pity wallow. Everyone yesterday was sharing their MATCH results and writing about how all of their hard work the last 4 years has paid off and I was just sitting there like, what about my hard work? But you're right, I have to just move forward and work on my non-endo plan!

That's a good point about the CE courses. I'll definitely have to do research and see what ones (if any) are even worth it. I'll also try to increase the number of LORs from endodontists next time. This year I only had 2 of them come from endodontists, the other ones came from my clinical supervisor, my research mentor, and our Dean.

Honestly, it sounds like you had a great application but it was just a competitive cycle. Not to discourage you at all, but having that many classmates apply for Endo at the same time probably hurt your chances the most. A lot of programs will try to make sure they don’t interview too many people from the same school, so working for a year or doing an AEGD/GPR might improve your chances.

I’m sure you already know this too, but it seems like Endo is one of those specialties that almost prefers applicants with a little experience under their belt outside of dental school. If I were in your shoes, I would strongly consider doing a GPR or AEGD if possible, doing any CE you can, and reapply if Endo is for sure want you want.

Whichever way you go, you’re going to be successful. Best of luck!

 

[EndoResidencyHelp]

Thank you everyone for the advice. However, I am confused about how I switch over to applying for an AEGD/GPR. I went through the PASS website for program selection and it looks like the overwhelming majority of programs already had an application deadline pass. There are a couple of schools listed that don't, but their application deadline is coming up. Do I need new letters of recommendation? I know I need a new personal statement. Am I supposed to register for Match? Is it too late to apply anywhere? The AEGD/GPR thread shows all of these schools that already held interviews. Nobody from my school applied for an AEGD/GPR so I'm so confused on all of this.

 

[PreDentTechySon]

Thank you everyone for the advice. However, I am confused about how I switch over to applying for an AEGD/GPR. I went through the PASS website for program selection and it looks like the overwhelming majority of programs already had an application deadline pass. There are a couple of schools listed that don't, but their application deadline is coming up. Do I need new letters of recommendation? I know I need a new personal statement. Am I supposed to register for Match? Is it too late to apply anywhere? The AEGD/GPR thread shows all of these schools that already held interviews. Nobody from my school applied for an AEGD/GPR so I'm so confused on all of this.

Most of the programs for AEGD/GPR have already had their deadlines pass, but not all. You would probably be fine with your current letters of rec, it might be too time consuming for you to contact your letter writers and have them update them for AEGD/GPR specifically. I think unless it’s a really competitive program, most AEGD/GPRs at this point will probably understand the position you’re in and won’t mind if your letters are Endo specific (that’s my own personal opinion. If it were me, since it’s so close to the deadlines, I’d just leave it and send it as is and explain during an interview).

You may need to register for Match, just look at the programs that are available that you want to apply to and see whether they require Match or not. I would wait until after you apply since match doesn’t open until mid December.