Dismiss or Withdrawal from Med School

[dansmith]

This is a throw-away account...not my real name.

My current situation: I repeated MS2, and failed two classes my repeat year. Therefore, I'm being dismissed. However, I have the option to change the dismissal to a withdrawal. Two questions:

1. Which would be better for my future professional school applications (for instance pharmacy, dental, PT, OT, etc.) or would look the least worst ("the lesser of the evils") for employment in the future, a "dismissal" or a "withdrawal"? Pros and Cons of each option?

2. What options do I have in the U.S. if I wish to avoid the sharks in the Caribbean or other foreign places? I don't wish to go down the IMG path.

I'm looking for honest answers, and NOT trolling. Thank you in advance.

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[NeurologyHopeful2018]

This is a throw-away account...not my real name.

My current situation: I repeated MS2, and failed two classes my repeat year. Therefore, I'm being dismissed. However, I have the option to change the dismissal to a withdrawal. Two questions:

1. Which would be better for my future professional school applications (for instance pharmacy, dental, PT, OT, etc.) or would look the least worst ("the lesser of the evils") for employment in the future, a "dismissal" or a "withdrawal"? Pros and Cons of each option?

2. What options do I have in the U.S. if I wish to avoid the sharks in the Caribbean or other foreign places? I don't wish to go down the IMG path.

I'm looking for honest answers, and NOT trolling. Thank you in advance.

1) Definitely choose withdraw. You can always frame it as you no longer wanted to become a physician, so you left voluntarily to do XYZ. Almost all professional/graduate programs will screen for "dismissal" (aka expulsion) - so you do NOT want that on your record.

2) If you still want to be a physician - I recommend DO. But I do not know how their admissions would work given your record. You are wise to avoid off shore schools. There is no hand holding there - you would be murdered academically given your failing performance in US schools.

 

[DocWinter]

If you are forced to choose between the two, having a withdrawl>>>dismissal for your records. There are no pros to a dismissal.

If you failed M2 X2 in the states, you will be prime to fail again in the Caribbean, only with more debt and a longer, sadder story to tell. Do not entertain it for a second.

Someone more knowledgeable than I could better direct you on next career, but pharm rep, podiatry, PA are all options you could explore.

 

[DocWinter]

2) If you still want to be a physician - I recommend DO. But I do not know how their admissions would work given your record. You are wise to avoid off shore schools.

OP would be DOA on a application to DO school. A single year failure and dismissal/withdrawl would not sneak past admissions, much less a double.

 

[ndafife]

1. Probably withdrawal, but you're still going to have to answer to why you withdrew which means lie or explain you couldn't cut it academically

2. Any other career. Failing classes that you're retaking (I'm assuming because you failed the 1st time around?) Pretty much cements that you can't cut it in medical school

 

[PlasticBag]

First of all, I am sorry that this happened to you and I admire your positive attitude of moving forward.

I agree with everyone else that withdrawal is much better than a dismissal.

I know someone who failed out of Carribean and is now an excellent (and happy!) podiatry student. Do you like surgery? Perhaps you could mention how you love surgery but 1) it would have been hard to make it happen in the MD world 2) you like the idea of being a surgeon with a primary care component, which is unique to podiatry.
Wherever you apply, they will see your transcripts, so addressing the failures to some degree of truthfulness is advisable in my opinion.

If your ego is not hungry for the doctor position, PA is a great option as well.

 

[NeurologyHopeful2018]

OP, is there anyway you can appeal the dismissal and beg the school to take you back?

Did you have any extenuating circumstances like mental health issue, abusive relationship, death in family, or other hardship?

I have seen students appealing their dismissals and have won.

As long as you can graduate from a US school, there will be a rural primary care residency waiting for you.

 

[Goro]

This is a throw-away account...not my real name.

My current situation: I repeated MS2, and failed two classes my repeat year. Therefore, I'm being dismissed. However, I have the option to change the dismissal to a withdrawal. Two questions:

1. Which would be better for my future professional school applications (for instance pharmacy, dental, PT, OT, etc.) or would look the least worst ("the lesser of the evils") for employment in the future, a "dismissal" or a "withdrawal"? Pros and Cons of each option?

2. What options do I have in the U.S. if I wish to avoid the sharks in the Caribbean or other foreign places? I don't wish to go down the IMG path.

I'm looking for honest answers, and NOT trolling. Thank you in advance.

1) Withdrawal always looks better than dismissal. The latter says that your deficits led to your school getting rid of you. The former gives you some spin in the story.

2) For medical school? I can't sugar coat this: your career as a doctor is over. You'd be DOA at my school.

Won't your school let you take a LOA, so you can go and fix what's broken?

 

[NeurologyHopeful2018]

1) Withdrawal always looks better than dismissal. The latter says that your deficits led to your school getting rid of you. The former gives you some spin in the story.

2) For medical school? I can't sugar coat this: your career as a doctor is over. You'd be DOA at my school.

Won't your school let you take a LOA, so you can go and fix what's broken?

Now waiting for Goro to tell his story about an incompetent anesthesiologist who is now harming patients....

 

[Goro]

Now waiting for Goro to tell his story about an incompetent anesthesiologist who is now harming patients....

He never got dismissed! He did have to repeat a year, though. OP's position looks far more dire.

 

[W19]

Try the new(er) DO schools and if that does not work, then try RN/NP and PA if practicing medicine is your 'calling'...

 

[Weirdy]

I know someone who failed out of Carribean and is now an excellent (and happy!) podiatry student. Do you like surgery? Perhaps you could mention how you love surgery but 1) it would have been hard to make it happen in the MD world 2) you like the idea of being a surgeon with a primary care component, which is unique to podiatry.
Wherever you apply, they will see your transcripts, so addressing the failures to some degree of truthfulness is advisable in my opinion.

If your ego is not hungry for the doctor position, PA is a great option as well.

Don't lie.

Just tell them the truth during interviews and show them how you've improved.

Telling a half truth is like dressing up a turd when you really don't have to.

 

[mistafab]

I would withdraw for sure. No need to lie to future folks, just say medicine wasn’t for you - it clearly wasn’t.

Best of luck on your journey.

 

[Ho0v-man]

PA, podiatry (probably would be most satisfying if you’re into surgery), RN—>NP. PA schools will likely be a challenge bc they don’t want doc wannabes who couldn’t cut it. Not sure if podiatry would have the same bias. DO won’t want you. Dental won’t want you. Not sure about pharm tbh but my hunch is they won’t want you either.

Hate that this happened to you OP. It could easily happen to anyone.

 

[GoSpursGo]

As others have said, withdrawal is much preferable to dismissal.

I have a friend from Med school who was dismissed and successfully completed PA school. I would look into that route. I don't think DO schools will look at you, and as you alluded to international schools would be a tremendous risk that I would not endorse.

 

[762513]

You’re a perfect candidate for direct entry master degree nursing programs.

 

[b52bomber]

1. Withdrawal is better just like quitting is better than getting fired. You get the 'high ground' of saying you left rather than was forced out.
2. Very slim you'd get into another MD school. Very slim you'd get into a DO school - they check for these things. You will probably find a foreign school to take you, but that's on your own risk. PA might be risky because they'd want to know the same thing MD/DO does. MSN-> NP might be best.

 

[dansmith]

If you are forced to choose between the two, having a withdrawl>>>dismissal for your records. There are no pros to a dismissal.

If you failed M2 X2 in the states, you will be prime to fail again in the Caribbean, only with more debt and a longer, sadder story to tell. Do not entertain it for a second.

Someone more knowledgeable than I could better direct you on next career, but pharm rep, podiatry, PA are all options you could explore.

Here's a little more detail on my story: I did all of first semester the first time I attempted MS2, and failed about 3 classes. Then I was counseled to take a leave of absence, and return as a repeat student to repeat MS2 the year after. During my "repeat" year (I put repeat in quotes), I did well in most of the courses first semester, but I failed two courses in the 2nd semester (which are courses that I took for the first time.)

 

[dansmith]

Thank you everyone for your thoughtful replies. Sorry for the late responses. I had trouble logging in to SDN, and just figured out my way into the forum LOL.

I'm going to withdraw

 

[dansmith]

I understand that this must be an extremely hard time for you. Said situation turns people's life upside down. Kudos to you for keeping a clear mind and asking for advice regarding the next step.

My personal opinion as just another student is withdrawal always looks better than dismissal. With a repeated year, failed classes, and withdrawal/dismissal- getting back into medicine will be nearly impossible. Alternatives like Dental school or PA will be unlikely as well.

Your strongest shot will be accelerated 1 year BSN followed by NP or changing tracks altogether and getting a masters in accounting/engineering/finance.

Thank you for your thoughtful reply. One question I have for everyone - I was wondering if anyone knows what pre-requisites I would need to enter a nursing degree program. When I googled nursing schools, the pre-requisites seem to be Anatomy/Physiology, Microbiology, Biostatistics, Psych, Nutrition, Sociology and Human Growth/Development. Would completion of MS1 satisfy the requirement for anatomy/physiology, microbio, and/or nutrition? (Since I passed all of MS1). My med school is on an organ-based system, so my med school transcript doesn't include any of those words. Also, what other experiences, activities, courses would you recommend between med school and nursing application? And would waiting a year or two to apply help?

 

[NeurologyHopeful2018]

Thank you for your thoughtful reply. One question I have for everyone - I was wondering if anyone knows what pre-requisites I would need to enter a nursing degree program. When I googled nursing schools, the pre-requisites seem to be Anatomy/Physiology, Microbiology, Biostatistics, Psych, Nutrition, Sociology and Human Growth/Development. Would completion of MS1 satisfy the requirement for anatomy/physiology, microbio, and/or nutrition? (Since I passed all of MS1). My med school is on an organ-based system, so my med school transcript doesn't include any of those words. Also, what other experiences, activities, courses would you recommend between med school and nursing application? And would waiting a year or two to apply help?

Nursing is not good fit for you - you will regret it. Try PA.

 

[dansmith]

Nursing is not good fit for you - you will regret it. Try PA.

Also, the other question I was about to ask - what pre-reqs would I need to fulfill for PA school given my medical school credits? My understanding is that the pre-requisite coursework would be similar.

It seems like there are an equal number of posters saying that PA school and nursing school are good options. What are the pros and cons of each option?

 

[croak2]

OP, maybe you're looking at this hastily. Maybe you're just not into doing anything in healthcare. Why, (I'm assuming you're under thirty) waste time and money, selling your soul for a 'career' at all? Maybe you need some time to rethink things. Withdrawal is an honorable way to step back for a while, and explore what you want. If you have the means, it'd serve any future endeavor with a history of withdrawing. Have some reasons, like personal, emotional, family, or some issues, that precluded you from optimal performance. You'd be sort of cleaning the slate. Don't give up on yourself. Who knows, you may find out you want to go to law school, or go into business (Carl Icahn comes to mind). Best of luck to you.

 

[NVO]

Engineering is a pretty cool gig. There are plenty of bootcamps to learn coding, and I've had lots of friends see success going that route after doing career changes (1 was a dental student, 1 was graphic design, 1 was finance..)

Honestly, I dont think healthcare is for you. You failed 5 total MS2 classes over the span of 2 years, including a LOA. This means that you didnt really improve on your study habits, or any academic performance at all.

If youre willing to wait up to 2 years and do nursing school... perhaps you can use all that time more wisely and focus your drive onto another path