Dismissed from Graduate School, Chances for MD/DO?

[bpm23]

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Hi everyone, this is my first post on SDN.

TL;DR -- I did well in undergrad, but failed out of graduate school due to family/financial circumstances & lack of maturity. My failures do not represent a trend, but a hiccup. What can I do, if anything, to smooth out this blemish from my record as I prepare to apply to MD/DO programs in a couple years?

I finished my undergraduate degree in Mathematics/Physics with a 3.75 GPA. Early into my college days I expressed my interest in medicine to my parents, but they discouraged me from the pursuit. I can't remember exactly what they said but I'm sure it was along the lines of "playing it safe" as they did with everything and saying "how can someone with such potential in math give that up to pursue medicine." During college I got a job as a software engineer and developed an interest in how computers work/electrical engineering, and decided to take some extra electronics classes after graduation and apply to a M.S. program in EE. Early into my first semester I realized I really did not enjoy EE at all and was running out of money as I was not working at the time. I switched programs and started a M.S. in math as it offered me a graduate assistantship which paid for my living expenses.

I had recently also met my wife, who is from another country and at the time here on a student visa. She was a student at a smaller school where working conditions were bad, if not illegal ($25/week for 40 hours of work!). We were engaged to be married and yet applying for her permanent residency (Green card) would be nearly impossible since my income fell far below the national poverty guidelines; even then I would not have the money to pay in cash the fees USCIS charges (north of $2k). My wife would not be able to legally work until several months after the application process had started. The result of me trying to keep up the long-distance relationship with my fiance, my graduate classes, my graduate assistantship, trying to find a job that would pay for my wife's and my future, and the resulting stress/depression from this was that I failed out of my classes that semester and was dismissed from the graduate school.

You may ask why I didn't just withdraw from graduate school. The reasons are that my assistantship did pay me something (but not enough) and that had I resigned my position, all my responsibilities (I was a grader for a large class of 60+ students with daily quizzes/assignments to be graded) would have fallen onto some other grad students who already had full plates with teaching / research responsibilities. I felt I had a responsibility to at least complete the grading for the class, at the expense of my own grades.

It's been four years since I was dismissed from graduate school. Since then my wife and I are happily married, we have our own home, and I am software engineer making a very good salary. But I still want to pursue medicine. My wife is very supportive. I am training to be certified EMT-B and volunteering at a nearby hospital. I'm preparing to take pre-reqs and apply to a post-bacc before I (hopefully) go on to apply to MD/DO programs. I'm ready to take my time with pre-reqs/post-bacc in order to be competitive.

With my dismissal from grad school, do I have any realistic chances for MD programs, or should I just apply to DO schools? Do I even have any chances with DO programs, or at all?

Thank you in advance for not replying with harshness/trolling behaviour. My dismissal from graduate school is my greatest personal failure I'm still ashamed of every day.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Very unique situation. I have never heard of anyone else being in a similar one.

Your previous grades reflect intellectual ability, but I think the big concern here will be your ability to manage in medical school and not end up being a dropout once again. I know this will sound harsh, but many people will scoff at the idea that your reason to fail out of graduate school was because you had a long-distance relationship and then you decided not to withdraw before being dismissed.

The EMT/Volunteering is good because at least you can establish some interest in medicine, and the fact that you are leaving a lucrative career could be seen as genuine interest.

My suggestion is you keep moving forward and you create a pattern of change and showing genuine interest for the field. I think some people will want to give you that second chance, but you'll really need to apply broadly because there's no way of predicting what programs will and which ones won't.

 

[THEBACKANDFORTH]

You're obviously smart. Knock the MCAT out and apply broadly. I guess if I were you I would shoot for 505+ for DO and 512+ for MD (above averages to compensate for poor masters performance). Honestly, four years is a long time, and I think ***some*** adcoms will recognized that.

No reason not taking a crack at it.

 

[Osminog]

The physician I shadowed flunked out of a STEM graduate program before entering medical school (DO). To redeem himself, he did really well on the MCAT.

 

[QofQuimica]

It helps that four years have passed since that point, and another 2-3 years will have passed by the time you even apply (let along matriculate) into medical school. While there are no guarantees for anything, all you can do is move forward and try to show that you are a mature, committed person now. That's what adcoms will be looking to see.

First, do not slack off at your job. Besides needing the income, you will want a glowing character reference for med school from your supervisor saying that you are the greatest employee since sliced bread.

Second, do pursue the clinical experiences you mentioned, as you will need them to show interest in medicine (as well as to help yourself have some sense of whether this might be a career you'd enjoy). You can also look into doing some non-medical community service if you are not doing so already. Teaching and mentoring junior people are great preparation for medical school.

Third, take the post bac and MCAT seriously. You need to do well in both.

Best of luck to you. 🙂

 

[Goro]

Hi everyone, this is my first post on SDN.

TL;DR -- I did well in undergrad, but failed out of graduate school due to family/financial circumstances & lack of maturity. My failures do not represent a trend, but a hiccup. What can I do, if anything, to smooth out this blemish from my record as I prepare to apply to MD/DO programs in a couple years?

I finished my undergraduate degree in Mathematics/Physics with a 3.75 GPA. Early into my college days I expressed my interest in medicine to my parents, but they discouraged me from the pursuit. I can't remember exactly what they said but I'm sure it was along the lines of "playing it safe" as they did with everything and saying "how can someone with such potential in math give that up to pursue medicine." During college I got a job as a software engineer and developed an interest in how computers work/electrical engineering, and decided to take some extra electronics classes after graduation and apply to a M.S. program in EE. Early into my first semester I realized I really did not enjoy EE at all and was running out of money as I was not working at the time. I switched programs and started a M.S. in math as it offered me a graduate assistantship which paid for my living expenses.

I had recently also met my wife, who is from another country and at the time here on a student visa. She was a student at a smaller school where working conditions were bad, if not illegal ($25/week for 40 hours of work!). We were engaged to be married and yet applying for her permanent residency (Green card) would be nearly impossible since my income fell far below the national poverty guidelines; even then I would not have the money to pay in cash the fees USCIS charges (north of $2k). My wife would not be able to legally work until several months after the application process had started. The result of me trying to keep up the long-distance relationship with my fiance, my graduate classes, my graduate assistantship, trying to find a job that would pay for my wife's and my future, and the resulting stress/depression from this was that I failed out of my classes that semester and was dismissed from the graduate school.

You may ask why I didn't just withdraw from graduate school. The reasons are that my assistantship did pay me something (but not enough) and that had I resigned my position, all my responsibilities (I was a grader for a large class of 60+ students with daily quizzes/assignments to be graded) would have fallen onto some other grad students who already had full plates with teaching / research responsibilities. I felt I had a responsibility to at least complete the grading for the class, at the expense of my own grades.

It's been four years since I was dismissed from graduate school. Since then my wife and I are happily married, we have our own home, and I am software engineer making a very good salary. But I still want to pursue medicine. My wife is very supportive. I am training to be certified EMT-B and volunteering at a nearby hospital. I'm preparing to take pre-reqs and apply to a post-bacc before I (hopefully) go on to apply to MD/DO programs. I'm ready to take my time with pre-reqs/post-bacc in order to be competitive.

With my dismissal from grad school, do I have any realistic chances for MD programs, or should I just apply to DO schools? Do I even have any chances with DO programs, or at all?

Thank you in advance for not replying with harshness/trolling behaviour. My dismissal from graduate school is my greatest personal failure I'm still ashamed of every day.

As of right now, your chances are zero.

You need to convince Adcoms that you can handle med school, that you are dedicated to this path, and that you now make good choices.
Read this:
Goro’s advice for pre-meds who need reinvention

Then there's all the ECs you need to do as well.

Also keep in mind that your mental health issues need to be resolved. You have a history of both not being able to handle stress and not being good at time mgt. Medical school is a furnace, and I've seen it break even healthy students. The #1 reason my school loses students to withdrawal, dismissal or LOA is to unresolved mental health issues. Thus, you need to demonstrate that you have developed better coping skills. Academic success in a post-bac or SMP will allay our concerns.