Do I Love Anatomy? Question for Surgeons

[manofmen]

Hey SDN,

I have a question that I'm wrestling with more and more now that I've started third year, namely if I want to go into surgery. When speaking to some of the people that went on this path and did (or did not) decide on being a surgeon, one of the things that seem to come up is a love of anatomy. I was wondering if I may ask some self-proclaimed anatomy lovers to opine on what exactly it is about anatomy that they like, how strong the relationship between a love of anatomy and being a surgeon is for them, and if it's possible to 'love' a certain anatomy (i.e. head and neck) and 'hate' the pelvis.

Yesterday I was scrubbed into a total laryngectomy and the fellow kept pointing out structures to me, repeatedly saying, 'isn't this beautiful?' in a quasi-spiritual way. In a way, I saw what he was saying. Is that what the experience of anatomy is like for you soon-to-be surgeons and surgeons out there? And ultimately, do you guys think that a healthy degree of awe and wonder about the human anatomy is an integral part of a lasting and fulfilling career as a surgeon?

I'd love to hear what you guys think!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[jorjorswens]

Mordaddy? Is it really you?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[ConfusedChemist]

I love anatomy, and yes I want to do surgery. It's not a hard and fast rule, but yeah it's a trend I've noticed. Those who hated/did poorly in anat tended not to be gunning for anything surgical either

 

[guytakingboards]

I really like head and neck anatomy too but I'm not a surgeon. I'm a radiologist going into neurorads.

 

[dpmd]

I didn't particularly excel at gross anatomy (actually struggled for parts of it). Because I didn't excel at it, I didn't really love it. But I did enjoy seeing anatomy during operations and that helped me to understand it better.

 

[Donald Juan]

I did not "love" anatomy as an M1. It was a lot of grueling rote memorization. I did enjoy standing on my feet and working with my hands while learning as opposed to sitting in front of a computer looking at powerpoint slides for 12 hours straight. At this point as a resident, and now that most of the anatomy feels more intuitive, the pathology that you can think through in anatomic fashion are enjoyable to me.

 

[whatisthisstuff]

Just an anecdotal experience but I spoke to an Ortho resident about this. Mainly my question was about learning anatomy. Since you don't see it a ton after first year how do these guys go about learning the anatomy so well. Just memorizing origins/insertions, nerve supplies, etc seems like pulling teeth and he agreed. He basically said that its a little different in surgery because you learn anatomy in a clinical context. What am I doing and what structures affect what I am doing? You tend to chunk things by section and procedures it seems like.

 

[Tsunnami]

Beware of the illusion of "love" and "hate" - not just in Medicine, but in other areas of life also, I have discovered that love and hate are sometimes limiting concepts, because they change and turn and they give contrast to each other, plus never underestimate the power of conditioning that your mind has.

For me, starting weightlifting was the first time in my life when I discovered the synergy between love and hate : you go in the gym and if you do it like me, picking the hard stuff, you'll obviously "hate" it in the beginning - but that hate is going to turn into love once you master it, because then you'll excel at it and you'll see the beauty of it.
You cannot possibly see the beauty of anything as long as you're failing at it, it's probably a survival mechanism set in our brains to signal that you've got to focus on mastering it or to not do it at all. Imagine how it would be if you'd enjoy failing at things - it would make no sense, your brain couldn't tell the difference between success and failure and that would cost you. I'm saying this only to emphasize that there is a logic why you got to master something before you can love it and this is also why hate can turn into love, no matter how cliche it sounds.

That being said, every coin has two sides : just because you excel at something, it doesn't mean that you'll necessarily love it. This is the case for many high-performance doctors who work in the field, but deep down they don't love what they do. The reasons for this are usually that he/she does it only for the career, for reputation, for financial aspects, etc. - Just because these incentives work for some people, they don't work for everyone, so you can end up great and bitter in your career, like many doctors are.

However it will turn out, don't beat yourself up for it - After all, it's like a planned marriage : sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesn't. It's a risk, but what isn't in this life ? 😎

 

[masaraksh]

I like cutting people's bones with saws and putting nails into long bones.

 

[MSTP18]

I didn't particularly excel at gross anatomy (actually struggled for parts of it). Because I didn't excel at it, I didn't really love it. But I did enjoy seeing anatomy during operations and that helped me to understand it better.

I actively disliked anatomy. When I did an autopsy as part of a path elective I found myself really enjoying it though. The cadavers in anatomy, to me, look unrealistic given the fixation and amount of time that passes. The "fresh" unfixed cadaver was way more interesting.

 

[dpmd]

I actively disliked anatomy. When I did an autopsy as part of a path elective I found myself really enjoying it though. The cadavers in anatomy, to me, look unrealistic given the fixation and amount of time that passes. The "fresh" unfixed cadaver was way more interesting.

I'm sure my patients would not be comforted to know I once mistook a spleen for a kidney when it was sat on a table by itself during a test.

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

Hey SDN,

I have a question that I'm wrestling with more and more now that I've started third year, namely if I want to go into surgery. When speaking to some of the people that went on this path and did (or did not) decide on being a surgeon, one of the things that seem to come up is a love of anatomy. I was wondering if I may ask some self-proclaimed anatomy lovers to opine on what exactly it is about anatomy that they like, how strong the relationship between a love of anatomy and being a surgeon is for them, and if it's possible to 'love' a certain anatomy (i.e. head and neck) and 'hate' the pelvis.

Yesterday I was scrubbed into a total laryngectomy and the fellow kept pointing out structures to me, repeatedly saying, 'isn't this beautiful?' in a quasi-spiritual way. In a way, I saw what he was saying. Is that what the experience of anatomy is like for you soon-to-be surgeons and surgeons out there? And ultimately, do you guys think that a healthy degree of awe and wonder about the human anatomy is an integral part of a lasting and fulfilling career as a surgeon?

I'd love to hear what you guys think!

When you correlate anatomy with clinical work and function, and then alter or restore it with your own hands--that is when you love your work as a surgeon. There is nothing to me like recreating the perfect post reduction fluoro shot and understanding the best way to get there. It is a means to an end, but there is essential love for it too. For Ortho, a strong interest in MSK anatomy is essential. But it is also possible to hate other parts of it---I can't stand head and neck, and basically any viscera. 🙂

 

[Donald Juan]

I'm sure my patients would not be comforted to know I once mistook a spleen for a kidney when it was sat on a table by itself during a test.

As long as you're not in the middle of a nephrectomy and decide you want to remove your patients aberrant anterior accessory kidney, it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[sinombre]

I'm sure my patients would not be comforted to know I once mistook a spleen for a kidney when it was sat on a table by itself during a test.

One of my favorite moments in med school: my classmate pulled a lung out of a cadaver during our anatomy lab, and then (very seriously) proclaimed: "so, this is a heart."

Luckily he avoided surgery and is now a family med intern.

 

[Henry101]

I'm just an MS-II but I LOVED anatomy. Even today, I flip through my Thieme atlas of anatomy and just marvel at the pictures. I also enjoy going through Grey's Anatomy book (the old one) and I am absolutely amazed at how much our understanding of human anatomy has developed from when he first published the book.

 

[surgonc2017]

Anatomy in medical school was alright I guess. In surgery my love for anatomy is different - it's about knowing where things are, what's safe to cut and what isn't. There's something about the thing you're looking for being exactly where it's supposed to be and knowing the road map to get there.

 

[John L]

Beware of the illusion of "love" and "hate" - not just in Medicine, but in other areas of life also, I have discovered that love and hate are sometimes limiting concepts, because they change and turn and they give contrast to each other, plus never underestimate the power of conditioning that your mind has.

For me, starting weightlifting was the first time in my life when I discovered the synergy between love and hate : you go in the gym and if you do it like me, picking the hard stuff, you'll obviously "hate" it in the beginning - but that hate is going to turn into love once you master it, because then you'll excel at it and you'll see the beauty of it.
You cannot possibly see the beauty of anything as long as you're failing at it, it's probably a survival mechanism set in our brains to signal that you've got to focus on mastering it or to not do it at all. Imagine how it would be if you'd enjoy failing at things - it would make no sense, your brain couldn't tell the difference between success and failure and that would cost you. I'm saying this only to emphasize that there is a logic why you got to master something before you can love it and this is also why hate can turn into love, no matter how cliche it sounds.

That being said, every coin has two sides : just because you excel at something, it doesn't mean that you'll necessarily love it. This is the case for many high-performance doctors who work in the field, but deep down they don't love what they do. The reasons for this are usually that he/she does it only for the career, for reputation, for financial aspects, etc. - Just because these incentives work for some people, they don't work for everyone, so you can end up great and bitter in your career, like many doctors are.

However it will turn out, don't beat yourself out for it - After all, it's like a planned marriage : sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesn't. It's a risk, but what isn't in this life ? 😎

Wonderful answer

 

[gcuddles]

I love anatomy and want to go into surgery too. Part of it is the thrill of working and learning with your hands, by either feeling or seeing things out in real life. 2D representations of 3D structures just don't compare.

I also love anatomy because of both it's reliability and it's novelty. Every human body is different: The same artery could be in a totally different place between 2 people, but (for the most part), the same artery is there, you just have to find it. At the same time, though, when I was an anatomy TA and the students would tell me "my body doesn't have an X!" and I'd take their scissors and pickups and say, "yes it does. let's find it." And that was really powerful to me.

 

[mehc012]

I love anatomy and want to go into surgery too. Part of it is the thrill of working and learning with your hands, by either feeling or seeing things out in real life. 2D representations of 3D structures just don't compare.

I also love anatomy because of both it's reliability and it's novelty. Every human body is different: The same artery could be in a totally different place between 2 people, but (for the most part), the same artery is there, you just have to find it. At the same time, though, when I was an anatomy TA and the students would tell me "my body doesn't have an X!" and I'd take their scissors and pickups and say, "yes it does. let's find it." And that was really powerful to me.

I never thought it didn't have them, but we couldn't find any of the arteries coming off the front of the aorta and it was maddening, because those are huge landmarks. Turns out they'd gotten some super bizarre retroperitoneal tumor that had lifted and rotated their whole aorta so the damn things weren't on the front anymore.

 

[Planes2Doc]

Anatomy was awful. It had absolutely no bearing on my third year rotations. I enjoyed OBGYN and strongly considered it.

 

[rafa 22]

I have heard the same exactthing and I think it makes sense, however, i think of that saying as some more of an orientation (physio---any clinical residnecy and anatomy-- more surgery). Yet, i don't think a dislike for gross anatomy disqualifies for surgery (also in my experience it's just taught badly)