Do not go to "X" school

[KyleSBU]

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I don't know if any of you guys view the Pre-Osteo forum but if you do you know they are loaded with "Do not go to X School" Threads....especially about LECOM

I think this is really discouraging and also potentially very biased because usually the people voicing their opinions about this issue are people that do NOT like the school in question...So im asking you guys, as med students, as the ppl at these school...to go in the Pre-osteo forum and lists some good things about the school you attend....tell us why its a good school...maybe share some really good experiences

I think it would help a lot and also distinguish between real threads and fake ones about somone schools...id also like to mention that you never see a thread like this in the pre-allo forum and it makes the DO's look really bad...Thanks in advance guys and good luck....hope to be there with you guys in Fall of 2008

 

[allendo]

I don't know if any of you guys view the Pre-Osteo forum but if you do you know they are loaded with "Do not go to X School" Threads....especially about LECOM

I think this is really discouraging and also potentially very biased because usually the people voicing their opinions about this issue are people that do NOT like the school in question...So im asking you guys, as med students, as the ppl at these school...to go in the Pre-osteo forum and lists some good things about the school you attend....tell us why its a good school...maybe share some really good experiences

I think it would help a lot and also distinguish between real threads and fake ones about somone schools...id also like to mention that you never see a thread like this in the pre-allo forum and it makes the DO's look really bad...Thanks in advance guys and good luck....hope to be there with you guys in Fall of 2008

I agree these threads only support the negative stereotypes about D.O. education

 

[medhacker]

Many times these threads are fueled/started by people who wish to attend that school and are on that school waitlists in hope that people get discouraged by their intimidating perorates. Caveat emptor! - good suggestion though! 👍

 

[jonwill]

I don't know if any of you guys view the Pre-Osteo forum but if you do you know they are loaded with "Do not go to X School" Threads....especially about LECOM

I think this is really discouraging and also potentially very biased because usually the people voicing their opinions about this issue are people that do NOT like the school in question...So im asking you guys, as med students, as the ppl at these school...to go in the Pre-osteo forum and lists some good things about the school you attend....tell us why its a good school...maybe share some really good experiences

I think it would help a lot and also distinguish between real threads and fake ones about somone schools...id also like to mention that you never see a thread like this in the pre-allo forum and it makes the DO's look really bad...Thanks in advance guys and good luck....hope to be there with you guys in Fall of 2008

It's always easier to blame ones failures on someone else.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

As a prospective student, I like to hear both good and bad things about schools I'm considering, and I really do like to hear from disgruntled students. I like the threads. Give SDN readers enough credit to use the information (or ignore it) appropriately. Some schools apparently already censor what their students can say -- I don't think SDN or the AOA should do it, too.

 

[OnMyWayThere]

As a prospective student, I like to hear both good and bad things about schools I'm considering, and I really do like to hear from disgruntled students. I like the threads. Give SDN readers enough credit to use the information (or ignore it) appropriately. Some schools apparently already censor what their students can say -- I don't think SDN or the AOA should do it, too.

I agree with exlawgrrl. I read a ton of bad stuff about my school that occured in the past and I went on to look into further on my own to see what truth it had to it. Although a lot of the problems have been resolved, much of what was said is indeed true and still exists, but I came here expecting it and I appreciate every bit of "bad" things that was said so that I can see what I'm getting myself into. And when some of my classmates complain, I tell them it's their fault for not doing their research before they came here and to accept them now that they're here (and a lot of what they complain about was stated right here on SDN years ago). I think they are doing a great service to premeds by sharing their bad experiences -as well as good- and I don't think this should be discouraged the slightest bit. It helped me choose a school based on what problems I'd rather deal with than others and has made my experience a much better one with no surprises. This type of information should not be held back with reasoning that "it looks bad on our profession"... everybody knows that all schools have their own share of problems (DO, MD, DDS, etc.)

 

[DragonWell]

As a prospective student, I like to hear both good and bad things about schools I'm considering, and I really do like to hear from disgruntled students. I like the threads. Give SDN readers enough credit to use the information (or ignore it) appropriately. Some schools apparently already censor what their students can say -- I don't think SDN or the AOA should do it, too.

The "Do Not go to LECOM" thread spans some 14 pages and over 330 posts. It digressed somewhere around page 5. I don't believe it's censorship to finally close it.

While I agree that it is helpful to hear good and bad opinions about schools, I also think it is important to remember that to some extent SDN is part of the image of Osteopathic Medicine online. A student attempting to glean useful information from these threads is a bit like watching "The People's Court" for legal advice or "Jerry Springer" for relationship help. There are some facts and valid opinions there, but most folks are just tuning in to see or create conflict and maybe get to see a "catfight" if they're lucky. I'm not saying Jerry Springer should be censored, but I am asking if we want SDN and in particular the Pre-DO forum to be viewed as a "Fox" quality news source - OK for a laugh and to hear someone plug their agenda, but not a place to for real news or insightful opinions grounded in fact. I think it hurts SDN and more importantly, our profession, to spend 14 pages bashing a school.

 

[KyleSBU]

The "Do Not go to LECOM" thread spans some 14 pages and over 330 posts. It digressed somewhere around page 5. I don't believe it's censorship to finally close it.

While I agree that it is helpful to hear good and bad opinions about schools, I also think it is important to remember that to some extent SDN is part of the image of Osteopathic Medicine online. A student attempting to glean useful information from these threads is a bit like watching "The People's Court" for legal advice or "Jerry Springer" for relationship help. There are some facts and valid opinions there, but most folks are just tuning in to see or create conflict and maybe get to see a "catfight" if they're lucky. I'm not saying Jerry Springer should be censored, but I am asking if we want SDN and in particular the Pre-DO forum to be viewed as a "Fox" quality news source - OK for a laugh and to hear someone plug their agenda, but not a place to for real news or insightful opinions grounded in fact. I think it hurts SDN and more importantly, our profession, to spend 14 pages bashing a school.

I couldnt agree more....and to clear up...I started this thread because it just seemed that the students posting on threads tht start with "dont go to..." just seem to list negative qualities about school...I was just trying to motivate the people with positive things to say to post their feelings..so when pre-meds like me are researching on these schools we're not just hearing the bad things...wheather their true or not

 

[scpod]

I think they are doing a great service to premeds by sharing their bad experiences -as well as good- and I don't think this should be discouraged the slightest bit.

Yet, there is a difference between sharing good and bad experiences, and some of the things mentioned in previous threads. Some of the material was simply disinformation, and whether intentional or not, that's not good. Some of the information was bold-faced lying. That's not good either. If everyone followed the rules of common courtesy and gave honest opinions...THEN it would be OK. When someone tells a fib, and it gains momentum as others jump on the bandwagon, it becomes much more of a problem. At that point, when SDN doesn't shut it down, then SDN becomes a party to the spread of rumor, not opinion. While I'm all up for freedom of speech, there have to be limits.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

The "Do Not go to LECOM" thread spans some 14 pages and over 330 posts. It digressed somewhere around page 5. I don't believe it's censorship to finally close it.

While I agree that it is helpful to hear good and bad opinions about schools, I also think it is important to remember that to some extent SDN is part of the image of Osteopathic Medicine online. A student attempting to glean useful information from these threads is a bit like watching "The People's Court" for legal advice or "Jerry Springer" for relationship help. There are some facts and valid opinions there, but most folks are just tuning in to see or create conflict and maybe get to see a "catfight" if they're lucky. I'm not saying Jerry Springer should be censored, but I am asking if we want SDN and in particular the Pre-DO forum to be viewed as a "Fox" quality news source - OK for a laugh and to hear someone plug their agenda, but not a place to for real news or insightful opinions grounded in fact. I think it hurts SDN and more importantly, our profession, to spend 14 pages bashing a school.

I don't think SDN has any obligation to be a good PR source for osteopathic medicine. SDN is so great because it's a relatively uncensored place where people can come and share their personal experiences with applying to and attending schools. If people feel like they should only be positive, or that it's somehow their duty to make osteopathic medicine look flawless, SDN would be totally worthless place, and no one would come here anymore.

Also, I fail to see how criticizing a certain school makes osteopathic medicine as a whole look bad. Also, even if it does, I'd prefer a fairly low level of censorship to a place where you can only post happy-good thoughts about everything.

 

[DragonWell]

I don't think SDN has any obligation to be a good PR source for osteopathic medicine. SDN is so great because it's a relatively uncensored place where people can come and share their personal experiences with applying to and attending schools. If people feel like they should only be positive, or that it's somehow their duty to make osteopathic medicine look flawless, SDN would be totally worthless place, and no one would come here anymore.

Also, I fail to see how criticizing a certain school makes osteopathic medicine as a whole look bad. Also, even if it does, I'd prefer a fairly low level of censorship to a place where you can only post happy-good thoughts about everything.

I hope that no one reading my post comes away believing that I am in any way in favor of whitewashing Osteopathic Medicine or any school there of. As I said before, I agree emphatically that it is helpful and necessary to hear the good and the bad.

However, like any community, in order to function SDN must have ground rules for appropriate conduct, especially since the anonymity of the internet enables essentially no accountability for one's behavior.

Whatever you feel about MDs or DOs, bashing each other is not going to solve any issues. I am embarrassed to see the vitriol that spouts from some DO students when someone questions their degree.

That's a quote from the sticky on MD vs. DO threads. I would hope that this ground rule also applies to DO's bashing other DO's, their school, etc. That said, there are plenty of threads which discuss differences in MD vs. DO. The difference is in motivation: criticism seeks to inform and enlighten, bashing seeks to hurt and make a spectacle. I realize that's kind of a "pornography - I know it when I see it" type of standard, and that we probably differ in where that line should be drawn.

Perhaps the pre-DO forum needs to find some more intelligent discussions for entertainment, like Whether or not you'd eat a poop hot dog to get into med school Or are DO schools so easy to get into that no one would do it? (kidding)

At least a thread like this entertains without slamming the reputation of a school. Poop already has a pretty $hitty reputation... Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[scpod]

I don't think SDN has any obligation to be a good PR source for osteopathic medicine.

No, it doesn't have the obligation to be a good PR source. Yet, it shouldn't be a bad PR source either. When it allows the spread of inacurate information it is doing the profession a disservice.

Also, I fail to see how criticizing a certain school makes osteopathic medicine as a whole look bad. Also, even if it does, I'd prefer a fairly low level of censorship to a place where you can only post happy-good thoughts about everything.

You're really trying to simplify this to justify your stance. We are not talking about someone criticizing one school, leading to the endangerment of DOs worldwide. We're talking about threads that are filled with personal attacks, lies, and the spread of rumors that are allowed to go on for 14 pages. There's a lot of censorship on SDN; it's just selective censorship. To put it in another perspective, threads are closed every single day just because they are duplicates. They are closed because, even though they aren't causing problems, they annoy people. Bodymechanic was right in many ways because the pre-osteopathic section has turned into the "Jerry Springer" of SDN. Nobody is advocating "censorship," but when a thread turns from a spirited debate into something that is "ugly", it needs to be shut down.

 

[Daddydoc]

I hope that no one reading my post comes away believing that I am in any way in favor of whitewashing Osteopathic Medicine or any school there of. As I said before, I agree emphatically that it is helpful and necessary to hear the good and the bad.

However, like any community, in order to function SDN must have ground rules for appropriate conduct, especially since the anonymity of the internet enables essentially no accountability for one's behavior.



That's a quote from the sticky on MD vs. DO threads. I would hope that this ground rule also applies to DO's bashing other DO's, their school, etc. That said, there are plenty of threads which discuss differences in MD vs. DO. The difference is in motivation: criticism seeks to inform and enlighten, bashing seeks to hurt and make a spectacle. I realize that's kind of a "pornography - I know it when I see it" type of standard, and that we probably differ in where that line should be drawn.

Perhaps the pre-DO forum needs to find some more intelligent discussions for entertainment, like Whether or not you'd eat a poop hot dog to get into med school Or are DO schools so easy to get into that no one would do it? (kidding)

At least a thread like this entertains without slamming the reputation of a school. Poop already has a pretty $hitty reputation... Sorry, couldn't resist.

Nice! I never fail to be surprised what some people think up. Gotta love SDN!

 

[KyleSBU]

DO NOT REPEAT DO NOT go to CLOWN U.....I heard they treat their students like elephant ****....too much politics in the circus friendly school...and dont even get me started on the dress code....and the worst part is...the sword swalloers look down on you because they feel they are more qualified to entertain ppl.....RIDICULOUS 😉

 

[OnMyWayThere]

Nobody is advocating "censorship," but when a thread turns from a spirited debate into something that is "ugly", it needs to be shut down.

exlawgrrl wasn't arguing that a thread that turns from a debate into something ugly shouldn't be shut down. I think we all agree that threads sharing the thoughts of current students are of great value to premeds deciding on schools given that everything stated is the truth. And I hope that everybody is smart enough to do their own homework by speaking to current students by visiting the campus or PMing them on SDN.

 

[yanky5]

It's important for SDN to be a free and open community since my school (NYCOM) and many other schools will not allow you to post bad remarks in their forums. You also can not say anything annonymously. This is why SDN is so cool.

 

[KyleSBU]

A lot of ppl say that certain schools...I.E. NYCOM, LECOM etc....don't allow you to post negative things in their forums...how does that work?....is there a moderator in there ready to boot out anyone that starts talking badly?....i'm just curious??

 

[doc2010]

exlawgrrl wasn't arguing that a thread that turns from a debate into something ugly shouldn't be shut down.

No, she doesn't seem to want them shut down at all according to her previous postings. She said:

I really do like to hear from disgruntled students. I like the threads. Give SDN readers enough credit to use the information (or ignore it) appropriately.

Are you in the habit of defending her when she says one thing, but really means another? She says that it is up to the SDN readers to decide on their own. Thus, one might assume that she doesn't want these threads shut down at all. Or, maybe you could interpret that too, so we might determine what she actually meant instead of what she said?

 

[OnMyWayThere]

No, she doesn't seem to want them shut down at all according to her previous postings. She said:



Are you in the habit of defending her when she says one thing, but really means another? She says that it is up to the SDN readers to decide on their own. Thus, one might assume that she doesn't want these threads shut down at all. Or, maybe you could interpret that too, so we might determine what she actually meant instead of what she said?

🙄

 

[Nate]

No, she doesn't seem to want them shut down at all according to her previous postings. She said:



Are you in the habit of defending her when she says one thing, but really means another? She says that it is up to the SDN readers to decide on their own. Thus, one might assume that she doesn't want these threads shut down at all. Or, maybe you could interpret that too, so we might determine what she actually meant instead of what she said?

I agree with exlawgrrl as well.

As OnMyWayThere already stated, we shut down threads when they have been beaten to death and have turned into something ugly rather than the original discussion. Some threads are closed immediately if they are spam or if the OP is posting it just to incite conflict and harass other members (trolling).

 

[yanky5]

A lot of ppl say that certain schools...I.E. NYCOM, LECOM etc....don't allow you to post negative things in their forums...how does that work?....is there a moderator in there ready to boot out anyone that starts talking badly?....i'm just curious??

Yes, they have moderators (faculty) that will remove negative remarks and they will repremand you for it since you are not anonymous.

 

[Redneck]

Freedom Let the text flow freely.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

No, she doesn't seem to want them shut down at all according to her previous postings. She said:



Are you in the habit of defending her when she says one thing, but really means another? She says that it is up to the SDN readers to decide on their own. Thus, one might assume that she doesn't want these threads shut down at all. Or, maybe you could interpret that too, so we might determine what she actually meant instead of what she said?

Wow, you're not a very sophisticated reader if you're interpreting my post that way. Sure, if a thread is filled with trolls, insults and all sorts of other bad stuff, it's okay to shut it down. However, a student posting bad stuff about their school is exactly what SDN is for. I read part of the LECOM thread and backed out, but it seemed like more of the ugliness resulted from people jumping in trying to attack the original posters for sharing their views.

 

[DragonWell]

It's interesting that the OP's initial purpose in this post wasn't to debate when a thread should be shut down, it was to suggest that we state some positives about schools, a proposition no one has taken him/her up on.

Therefore this thread should be shut down immediately! And all negative opinions stricken from the record! From now on all SDN posts must be "state approved"...by me! 😉

Before ya'll skewer me, I'm not saying we shouldn't be debating what's appropriate in this thread; it's just interesting that when someone actually asks for the positive side of the story, they get no responses.

 

[scpod]

Before ya'll skewer me, I'm not saying we shouldn't be debating what's appropriate in this thread; it's just interesting that when someone actually asks for the positive side of the story, they get no responses.

You are right. This thread has strayed far from its original purpose and, just like other threads that do that, ought to be shut down immediately.

 

[(nicedream)]

Wow, guys, this is an internet DISCUSSION FORUM. It's not do-online.org, or osteopathic.org, or lecom.edu. It is for people to discuss, air opinions, ask questions, and yes, criticize if they wish. I fail to see what makes some of you so specially qualified to determine which opinions are valid, and which are "disinformed" or "lying". This thread seems to focus on the "Don't go to LECOM" thread, which I have read through most of, and I can tell you that I didn't see any lying, fibbing, or disinformation except from the pre-meds arguing with the current/past students!

If you don't like what is being said in a thread, don't read it. But this forum should not become a tool for recruiting students to a given school, or for promoting a given school. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and in the case of current/past students, those opinions (like it or not) are far more valuable than those of excited, hopeful pre-meds.

You mention that you don't see the "Don't go to school X" in the pre-allo forums. I also don't see it for the vast majority of DO schools. Why do you think that is? I'm not suggesting anything, but it's an important question you should consider instead of asking for censorship.

 

[scpod]

This thread seems to focus on the "Don't go to LECOM" thread, which I have read through most of, and I can tell you that I didn't see any lying, fibbing, or disinformation except from the pre-meds arguing with the current/past students!

I've read the entire thread, several times. There's plenty of opinion, but plenty of lying too. Let's just look at the first post only:

This is the best advice you will ever receive. Don't go to this school. You will regret the decision for a long time and you will have a miserable four years of medical school.

That, of course, was just opinion...

You will here the same story from any LECOM student because we all feel the same way about our school.

That, however, was a lie. It was only one of the first of many. I really don't want to go through the thread and quote every one of them, but I can if necessary.

 

[Dr Trek 1]

I don't understand all this talk that schools can punish you for posting your honest opinion about their school on SDN. In fact, it's unconstitutional.

In America, we often take these rights for granted. However, once I am a med student, I cannot wait to practice my constitutional rights on SDN. And I really cannot wait to see the school try to do something about it

 

[Luba Licious]

I don't understand all this talk that schools can punish you for posting your honest opinion about their school on SDN. In fact, it's unconstitutional.

In America, we often take these rights for granted. However, once I am a med student, I cannot wait to practice my constitutional rights on SDN. And I really cannot wait to see the school try to do something about it

The school can do as it wishes. Your rights are protected from government interaction. The school has as much right as you do. It is a private entity. It may be censorship, but it is perfectly legal. Free speech does have consequences.

 

[Dr Trek 1]

The school can do as it wishes. Your rights are protected from government interaction. The school has as much right as you do. It is a private entity. It may be censorship, but it is perfectly legal. Free speech does have consequences.

There are limitations here. Unless you sign a statement for the school saying, "I will not publically say bad things about the school" there is not much they can do. Believe me, if someone got in trouble from the school for saying their honest opinion about the school on SDN, and the school decided to punish the student somehow, and the student took it to court- the school would have a hard time winning. Freedom of speech is the backbone of America.

We too often forget out first amendment rights. If you are over 21 and a US citizen, you have constitutional rights unless you are in prison. Slander is different than stating your honest opinion.

 

[lama]

Hey, I have an idea... why dont all of you premeds and incoming students of 2010 and 2011 go back to your premed forum and leave us big kids alone! If things suck at LECOM, then let the students at LECOM say their school sucks. If premeds say LECOM sucks, then ignore the thread like a mature grown-up would. I doubt any allopathic students spend any time looking on the preosteo forum because Im sure they don't care. And the preallo student are just as naive and know-it-all, so who cares what impression they come away with after visiting your forum.

Let me fill you guys in on a couple of secrets. AFTER you start school:

1. You will meet many of you classmates who are just as intelligent and just as talented as anyone sitting in any allopathic school in the country.

2. You will meet MD students, residents and attendings during your training that simply dont give a $#@! about where you went to school; as long as you are competent. This was made possible by the hardworking DO students that went before you.

3. Your school is not as virtuous as you once believed. It's a money-making machine with primarly financial interests. (They'll find someone else to fill your spot and they know it)

4. OMM will not save the world! It's a tool in your toolbelt and it often goes unused.

Thanks kids. If you'd like anymore secrets, I'd be happy to post them.

BTW, LECOM does not suck. It offers a great education. But I also know, from first-hand conversation with friends at both schools, that the students there sometimes poke fun and are frustrated with the schools strict dress and attendance policies. Should I post this on the premed forum? Or is it possible that my opinion wont make difference in forum full of know-it-alls!?!

 

[Dr Trek 1]

Hey, I have an idea... why dont all of you premeds and incoming students of 2010 and 2011 go back to your premed forum and leave us big kids alone! If things suck at LECOM, then let the students at LECOM say their school sucks. If premeds say LECOM sucks, then ignore the thread like a mature grown-up would. I doubt any allopathic students spend any time looking on the preosteo forum because Im sure they don't care. And the preallo student are just as naive and know-it-all, so who cares what impression they come away with after visiting your forum.

Let me fill you guys in on a couple of secrets. AFTER you start school:

1. You will meet many of you classmates who are just as intelligent and just as talented as anyone sitting in any allopathic school in the country.

2. You will meet MD students, residents and attendings during your training that simply dont give a $#@! about where you went to school; as long as you are competent. This was made possible by the hardworking DO students that went before you.

3. Your school is not as virtuous as you once believed. It's a money-making machine with primarly financial interests. (They'll find someone else to fill your spot and they know it)

4. OMM will not save the world! It's a tool in your toolbelt and it often goes unused.

Thanks kids. If you'd like anymore secrets, I'd be happy to post them.

BTW, LECOM does not suck. It offers a great education. But I also know, from first-hand conversation with friends at both schools, that the students there sometimes poke fun and are frustrated with the schools strict dress and attendance policies. Should I post this on the premed forum? Or is it possible that my opinion wont make difference in forum full of know-it-alls!?!

Good post 👍 Espeically the part about the hard working, talented DO students who went before us.

 

[(nicedream)]

There are limitations here. Unless you sign a statement for the school saying, "I will not publically say bad things about the school" there is not much they can do. Believe me, if someone got in trouble from the school for saying their honest opinion about the school on SDN, and the school decided to punish the student somehow, and the student took it to court- the school would have a hard time winning. Freedom of speech is the backbone of America.

We too often forget out first amendment rights. If you are over 21 and a US citizen, you have constitutional rights unless you are in prison. Slander is different than stating your honest opinion.

Yeah, have fun taking that to court. Where is that going to get you? Ah, the naivete...

 

[Luba Licious]

There are limitations here. Unless you sign a statement for the school saying, "I will not publically say bad things about the school" there is not much they can do. Believe me, if someone got in trouble from the school for saying their honest opinion about the school on SDN, and the school decided to punish the student somehow, and the student took it to court- the school would have a hard time winning. Freedom of speech is the backbone of America.

We too often forget out first amendment rights. If you are over 21 and a US citizen, you have constitutional rights unless you are in prison. Slander is different than stating your honest opinion.

All the Constitution is saying is that the government can't suppress your right to speak your mind. Your school, as much as you may think it is Big Brother, is not the government. If your school does not want you saying bad things about it, and will consider you in bad standing if you do, then you are up a creek. There are standards of conduct, and they are perfectly within their rights to enforce them.

 

[Flea girl]

Just remember, if people want to find out who you are it is possible. Especially if you have posted enough that you have left clues to your identity. Here is a story for you all; at a certain school, a dress-code and attendence policy was put forth. Some of that school's students were posting on sdn and complaining about the new policy, one of those student's suggested that they try to come to together and have some sort of protest. This person was pulled into the VP office(within a few days of posting) and threatened with expulsion b/c of what they posted on sdn. Do not be mislead that people can't find who you are. I found it kinda crazy that someone from the school's admin was reading sdn.

 

[Dr Trek 1]

Just remember, if people want to find out who you are it is possible. Especially if you have posted enough that you have left clues to your identity. Here is a story for you all; at a certain school, a dress-code and attendence policy was put forth. Some of that school's students were posting on sdn and complaining about the new policy, one of those student's suggested that they try to come to together and have some sort of protest. This person was pulled into the VP office(within a few days of posting) and threatened with expulsion b/c of what they posted on sdn. Do not be mislead that people can't find who you are. I found it kinda crazy that someone from the school's admin was reading sdn.

I believe we all know which school you are talking about. And it doesn't look like that student was aware of their constiutional rights and also that student did not take action against the school for being unconstitutional.

That's the problem. Too many people are unwilling to go against administrations when their fundamental constitutional rights are being violated. It does not matter if the school is a "private" institution. They do not make you sign any paper that says, "I hereby forfeit my freedom of speech." Even if they did, that document would have a hard time holding up in court.

I was lucky enough to attend a college that understood consitutional rights- even though it was private school. Students protested and stated their true opinions of the school and administration all the time. And of course, the school couldn't do anything. They supported our first amendment rights, which they would have had to have done anyways. If they had tried to punish the students, believe me these students (myself included) would have had even more fun pressing charges against the school.

 

[FutureDocDO]

BTW, LECOM does not suck. It offers a great education. But I also know, from first-hand conversation with friends at both schools, that the students there sometimes poke fun and are frustrated with the schools strict dress and attendance policies. Should I post this on the premed forum? Or is it possible that my opinion wont make difference in forum full of know-it-alls!?!

It seems like the only thing LECOM students and future students complain about is it's strict rules (i.e., dress code, attendance policy, and seating charts). Remember, we're there for the education. It's not a vacation. You're not going to like everything especially under stress with all those hours spent <ahem> studying.

 

[Dr Trek 1]

It seems like the only thing LECOM students and future students complain about is it's strict rules (i.e., dress code, attendance policy, and seating charts). Remember, we're there for the education. It's not a vacation. You're not going to like everything especially under stress with all those hours spent <ahem> studying.

I agree. And if these people don't want to have to dress up and attend class, they should have either done ISP (so they'd only have to be on campus ~1 day per week) or chosen another school.

 

[Flea girl]

I believe we all know which school you are talking about. And it doesn't look like that student was aware of their constiutional rights and also that student did not take action against the school for being unconstitutional.

That's the problem. Too many people are unwilling to go against administrations when their fundamental constitutional rights are being violated. It does not matter if the school is a "private" institution. They do not make you sign any paper that says, "I hereby forfeit my freedom of speech." Even if they did, that document would have a hard time holding up in court.

I was lucky enough to attend a college that understood consitutional rights- even though it was private school. Students protested and stated their true opinions of the school and administration all the time. And of course, the school couldn't do anything. They supported our first amendment rights, which they would have had to have done anyways. If they had tried to punish the students, believe me these students (myself included) would have had even more fun pressing charges against the school.

From what I heard, the person in question was told they were being disruptive and not professional. I do not believe that person signed any documents either. But that meeting and the threat was alone to scare that person. Look, I completely agree with you but the problem comes with this; does not matter with school, work, or whatever, is someone is out to get you they will. I personaly feel that person just did not want to be under the microscope for the next 4yrs and constantly watching their step. Basically being paranoid for the next four years about every little thing you do or say could get you kicked out. All I am saying is that be careful about what you post, especially if you are bashing your school. There are ways to express your frustration with without inciting complete chaos. But look at it this way, and the end of the game you get want you want..to be a doctor. Though what I did find curious was that I never seen seen a thread in the allo forum about them their schools as much as do student's bash theirs(if there is someone let me know). Just find that a little weird.

 

[Dr Trek 1]

From what I heard, the person in question was told they were being disruptive and not professional. I do not believe that person signed any documents either. But that meeting and the threat was alone to scare that person. Look, I completely agree with you but the problem comes with this; does not matter with school, work, or whatever, is someone is out to get you they will. I personaly feel that person just did not want to be under the microscope for the next 4yrs and constantly watching their step. Basically being paranoid for the next four years about every little thing you do or say could get you kicked out. All I am saying is that be careful about what you post, especially if you are bashing your school. There are ways to express your frustration with without inciting complete chaos. But look at it this way, and the end of the game you get want you want..to be a doctor. Though what I did find curious was that I never seen seen a thread in the allo forum about them their schools as much as do student's bash theirs(if there is someone let me know). Just find that a little weird.

I like how you pointed out that they were being disruptive and not professional. If you are a physician and tell a patient "I hate you" or something like that, you can lose your license because you violated the ethical and professional standards that the profession abides by (and which you swore to uphold), which is different than constitutional rights. Same thing for medical students, they are expected to uphold to certain professional guidelines. "Bashing" your school on SDN is not all that professional, and there are much more constructive ways to bring your case to the administration with the hopes of insighting change.

 

[Luba Licious]

I believe we all know which school you are talking about. And it doesn't look like that student was aware of their constiutional rights and also that student did not take action against the school for being unconstitutional.

That's the problem. Too many people are unwilling to go against administrations when their fundamental constitutional rights are being violated. It does not matter if the school is a "private" institution. They do not make you sign any paper that says, "I hereby forfeit my freedom of speech." Even if they did, that document would have a hard time holding up in court.

I was lucky enough to attend a college that understood consitutional rights- even though it was private school. Students protested and stated their true opinions of the school and administration all the time. And of course, the school couldn't do anything. They supported our first amendment rights, which they would have had to have done anyways. If they had tried to punish the students, believe me these students (myself included) would have had even more fun pressing charges against the school.

Dude, get a clue. The school is well within its rights. The first amendment guarantees that you will not go to jail if you say something that the government finds unsavory. It does not guarantee that if someone else doesn't like what you are saying they can't seek retribution. If they aren't breaking any laws (threatening you with bodily harm, for example) they have as much freedom of speech to kick you out of their program. Freedom of speech does not equal speech without consequences. Is political science still a requirement at American colleges?

 

[Flea girl]

"Bashing" your school on SDN is not all that professional, and there are much more constructive ways to bring your case to the administration with the hopes of insighting change.

Could not have said it any better!

 

[Luba Licious]

Just remember, if people want to find out who you are it is possible. Especially if you have posted enough that you have left clues to your identity. Here is a story for you all; at a certain school, a dress-code and attendence policy was put forth. Some of that school's students were posting on sdn and complaining about the new policy, one of those student's suggested that they try to come to together and have some sort of protest. This person was pulled into the VP office(within a few days of posting) and threatened with expulsion b/c of what they posted on sdn. Do not be mislead that people can't find who you are. I found it kinda crazy that someone from the school's admin was reading sdn.

While creepy and unsettling, this is not illegal. I know you aren't saying it is, but for Dr Trek's benefit, pointing it out. Hopefully SDN does not disclose IP addresses, but be careful with your identifying information if you feel you need to wear tin-foil hat. (I know, you're not paranoid if they're actually out to get you! 🙂 )

 

[Dr Trek 1]

While creepy and unsettling, this is not illegal. I know you aren't saying it is, but for Dr Trek's benefit, pointing it out. Hopefully SDN does not disclose IP addresses, but be careful with your identifying information if you feel you need to wear tin-foil hat. (I know, you're not paranoid if they're actually out to get you! 🙂 )

No it is not illegal. But it would be very difficult for the school to prove that the SDN name actually does belong to you just by going by things you said in your posts. They would have to go to a judge to subpoena SDN and your internet service provider in order to make a case that would stand up in a US court of law. Then they would have to be able to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the IP address was actually a computer that was used by you at that time. Pretty tricky to do, even for a good attorney.

 

[Luba Licious]

No it is not illegal. But it would be very difficult for the school to prove that the SDN name actually does belong to you just by going by things you said in your posts. They would have to go to a judge to subpoena SDN and your internet service provider in order to make a case that would stand up in a US court of law. Then they would have to be able to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the IP address was actually a computer that was used by you at that time. Pretty tricky to do, even for a good attorney.

I doubt they care that much. But the school, as a private entity, can do whatever the hell it wants within legal limits. And you have not mentioned anything that is illegal.

 

[Dr Trek 1]

I doubt they care that much.

Exactly.

 

[(nicedream)]

Dr Trek, your views on recourse against schools for punishment of students' conduct is the juvenile equivalent of a child's protest "It's a free country, I can do what I want!"

You DO sign something that says you will behave professionally etc. By your own argument that posting disparaging comments on SDN is unprofessional, you can be kicked out of school for violating said agreement. There are many more things said in the agreement you sign, but I'm not going to look it up right now. Freedom of speech has absolutely nothing to do with it. In any event, why would you want to continue going to a school that wanted to expel you in the first place? Do you think you would succeed there, let alone be happy?

As far as rules being the only thing LECOM students complain about, if you bothered to read the relevant thread (as well as numerous others over the years) you would see that is far from the truth.

Constitutional rights.... Welcome to the real world.

 

[FutureDocDO]

As far as rules being the only thing LECOM students complain about, if you bothered to read the relevant thread (as well as numerous others over the years) you would see that is far from the truth.

What other threads are you referring to?

 

[ericdopt]

Dude, get a clue. The school is well within its rights. The first amendment guarantees that you will not go to jail if you say something that the government finds unsavory. It does not guarantee that if someone else doesn't like what you are saying they can't seek retribution. If they aren't breaking any laws (threatening you with bodily harm, for example) they have as much freedom of speech to kick you out of their program. Freedom of speech does not equal speech without consequences. Is political science still a requirement at American colleges?

Amen Luba Licious. I love the tools who proclaim "freedom of speech", or "censorship" when they want to say something that goes against the "man" , but they are the first ones to impose it (censorship) on those whose opinions they disagree with. Dude, GOVERNMENT cannot censor, but any private entity can, whether you like it or not.

BTW, welcome to the real world. Not exactly what the professors said it was, is it...not that most would know.

(steps off soap box)

 

[(nicedream)]

What other threads are you referring to?

There have been several threads over the past 2 years (maybe before, I wouldn't know I joined in 04) about it. I don't exactly have all of them bookmarked...