DO NOT tell me to take the DO route if...

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lazymed said:
I don't know where you come up with this crap. Many/(most?) average/below average allopathic applicants ALSO apply to DO schools. I don't think many/any students or doctors will tell you apply ONLY to DO schools (unless your stats are much below average, in which case they are trying to save you the time and money from applying MD)... they usually tell you to consider applying to DO ALSO (aka as in a back up). I personally applied to both, so maybe that gives me the right to give that as advice. My first choice was MD school (regardless of cost, location etc), but I would have taken DO school over nothing in a heart beat (let alone 1,000,000 years). If your stats are below average or hardly average, yes, you will be advised to apply to BOTH or wait and apply after improving your application.
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when you say regardless location, would that include SGU in greneda?
 
sorry lol, because I was reading it and I decided I like what these people have to say and I value their opinion.
 
To the OP: I was accepted to osteopathic, and decided to go. However, I got accepted to an MD school closer to home, AND instate tuition. I still advocate the DO degree to pre-meds. Don't let your bitterness get the best of you. If people give you advice, its up to you to take it or leave it.
 
sorry but the OP is long gone. I just wanted to utilize the other minds on here.
 
BORNagainSTDENT said:
sorry but the OP is long gone. I just wanted to utilize the other minds on here.
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haha okay. it's been a while since i've been here...didnt realize this thread was ancient 🙂
 
Okay guys, let's just be honest with ourselves and address the elephant that is clearly present in threads such as these.

Obviously everyone knows that medicine is a highly respectable career that involves helping people. Now, let me stress the words everyone knows and respectable.

Whenever the question is brought up about why a person has chosen this profession, I can't help but cringe at the ol' "helping people" response.

We want to become doctors - and in the process, bust our butts to no end and forsake many good things in life - because it is in my opinion the most prestigous career out there, plain and simple. What does this imply? It means that we get an elevated sense of status in our lives. In America, status seems to be everything. The end all and be all. This shouldn't be the case, but it is. And what inevitably comes with status in this country? Money!

I genuinely enjoy threads such as these, because I find the justification for one's reasoning for entering medicine very fascinating. Unlike careers such as I-Banking, medicine (quite conveniently) just happens to go hand in hand with the ideals of compassion and "helping thy neighbor." But are we really helping a person when we are getting paid...either with status or money (or both)...to do it?

Many of us already acknowledge these concepts and will therefore ask, "So what?" There is nothing wrong with any of this. But when certain people become frustrated and angry that they are being confronted by the DO route, I can't help but believe that the reasoning behind such frustration is detailed in the statements that I have just made. It really isn't a question of not understanding a particular "philosophy."

Why can't one just say something along the lines of, "I don't want to do DO because not that many people know what that is, and I don't want to have to explain myself for the rest of my career, because it will remind me that I wasn't 'good enough'"?

It is not my intention to be harsh or cause hurt feelings. I just wanted to speak the truth on something that I have become very familiar with throughout this entire process.
 
You get the degree your school confers.

MD schools confer MD degrees.

DO schools confer DO degrees.

The only way someone could qualify for the other degree is to convince an academic institution to confer it upon them.
 
wheyprotein said:
Hey, everyone.

I just wanted to start this post to rant a little. Like the vast majority of the posts that deal with osteopathic medicine and the DO option, I begin by making the politically correct statement of acknowledging that there is nothing wrong with the DO option and that DOs make great doctos.

Having said that, I want to harshly criticize every pre-allopathic student, every allopathic student, and every allopathic physician who goes around and assures struggling pre-allos to consider the DO route. While there is inherently wrong in this piece of advice, the individuals who I want to criticize are those who give this piece of advice but themselves would NEVER IN 10^6 YEARS consider the osteopathic option! You all know who you are! Why offer this advice to students when you know that you, yourself, would have never went the DO route! Shut up and let people achieve what they want to achieve! Man!
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I would have to agree. There are alot of people who always suggest DO, eventhough some would never have taken that route nor is the original poster of those posts considering that route since he/she is posting in the pre-allopathic section anyways.

At the same time, it is not ill advice, and posters have the right to their opinion on what they think is the best option considering the stats given by the OP's.
 
Stop bitching to everyone about how hard it is to get into an allopathic med school and they will stop telling you to go DO. Problem solved.
 
zdogg said:
I would have to agree. There are alot of people who always suggest DO, eventhough some would never have taken that route nor is the original poster of those posts considering that route since he/she is posting in the pre-allopathic section anyways.
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I'm going to a DO school and I post in these parts.
 
Depakote said:
I'm not sure what you're talking about, but that doesn't change the fact that you've got a DO degree.
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The difference is that if you have a MD degree, you can't do anything. You need Board certification. Its the MD certification that allows you to practice as an MD, not the degree. A DO with MD certification, IS an MD by legal standards.
 
You are not an MD. You did not graduate from an MD school. Just because your training is MD training doesn't make you an MD. When you get board certified you're not taking the DO or MD boards... you're taking the boards.
 
I really don't know much about this, because it wasn't something I wanted to look into, but I was told this at a welcoming session by one of the interviews at Pitt when he was addressing the group. Maybe he was just trying to keep us hopeful if we didn't get in or something.... Idk. So I really can't really debate it, its just what I was told.
 
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mmmcdowe said:
The difference is that if you have a MD degree, you can't do anything. You need Board certification. Its the MD certification that allows you to practice as an MD, not the degree. A DO with MD certification, IS an MD by legal standards.
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Dude, you haven't A CLUE. Stop posting blatant misinformation - you only embarrass yourself.
 
mdmdt said:
Despite your disclaimer, the assumption here is one shared by a lot of allo and pre-allo physicians, and that is osteopathy as "allopathy lite". Yes, there is some basis for that (slightly relaxed admissions standards, etc) but certainly not to the extent that it should be treated as the reject's path to medicine. I know several incredibly bright, capable people who could have gotten into mid and top-tier med schools but are taking the DO route because they find themselves more aligned with its philosophy. I can only imagine how insulting the old "Well, if all else fails, just be a DO" schtick must be for them, let alone some being upset because people suggest it as an alternative to taking the MD route.
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I agree with this. I don't really know that much about osteopathic medicine, but would like to comment on one thing. The DO philosophy has not been around as long, hence the public is not as familiar with this school of doctors. In fact, the other day I asked another MD about DOs and he is not so familiar with them either. Since they haven't been around for as long as MD, it is reasonable to infer that fewer college students know about this option unless they dig deeper. I feel this could be one of the reasons for a "more relaxed" admission standard. Besides, many people are probably afraid to venture into DO because they want to be part of the "mainstream" flow. DO is unfamiliar territory to them. It's also true that some just don't agree with the philosphy. Either way, a consideration is that you have fewer students knowing about it, thus fewer applications and less competition to get in (compared to MD schools). I think it's unfair to judge the DO schools' prestige, difficulty, and ability to produce great doctors by picking on its lower admission requirements. In fact, DO classes may match closely to that of MDs. I know that many DOs don't practice any differently than MDs after they get out.

Anyway, that's just my perception of it. MD or DO, it doesn't really matter to me; as long as my doctor is good and cares! (p.s. My family doctor is a DO and he is a really awesome person...🙂 )
 
meilideai said:
I agree with this. I don't really know that much about osteopathic medicine, but would like to comment on one thing. The DO philosophy has not been around as long, hence the public is not as familiar with this school of doctors. In fact, the other day I asked another MD about DOs and he is not so familiar with them either. Since they haven't been around for as long as MD, it is reasonable to infer that fewer college students know about this option unless they dig deeper. I feel this could be one of the reasons for a "more relaxed" admission standard. Besides, many people are probably afraid to venture into DO because they want to be part of the "mainstream" flow. DO is unfamiliar territory to them. It's also true that some just don't agree with the philosphy. Either way, a consideration is that you have fewer students knowing about it, thus fewer applications and less competition to get in (compared to MD schools). I think it's unfair to judge the DO schools' prestige, difficulty, and ability to produce great doctors by picking on its lower admission requirements. In fact, DO classes may match closely to that of MDs. I know that many DOs don't practice any differently than MDs after they get out.

Anyway, that's just my perception of it. MD or DO, it doesn't really matter to me; as long as my doctor is good and cares! (p.s. My family doctor is a DO and he is a really awesome person...🙂 )
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Agreed, most of the docs in my home town are DO's.
 
wheyprotein said:
Hey, everyone.

I just wanted to start this post to rant a little. Like the vast majority of the posts that deal with osteopathic medicine and the DO option, I begin by making the politically correct statement of acknowledging that there is nothing wrong with the DO option and that DOs make great doctos.

Having said that, I want to harshly criticize every pre-allopathic student, every allopathic student, and every allopathic physician who goes around and assures struggling pre-allos to consider the DO route. While there is inherently wrong in this piece of advice, the individuals who I want to criticize are those who give this piece of advice but themselves would NEVER IN 10^6 YEARS consider the osteopathic option! You all know who you are! Why offer this advice to students when you know that you, yourself, would have never went the DO route! Shut up and let people achieve what they want to achieve! Man!
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As one of those allopathic physicians who didn't have the option to attend osteopathic medical school when I applied to medical school, I will keep recommending that any person (and every person) who truly wishes to be a physician should explore every route into medicine that is currently available to them. To do otherwise shows judgement that is not sound. There are plenty of folks out there who will never become physicians so don't be one of them because you are misinformed.
 
So sort of along the lines of what mmmcdowe was saying...

If you take the USMLE-track and you're a DO student then you're termed 'a DO student who took the USMLE', not an MD? But --> effectively you're licensed the same way as an MD if you take the exam right? 😕😕😕😕 Or am I just confused? I thought the US Medical Licensing Exam/individual states licensed you and not your medical school...😕😕 (shows what I know).

Can allopathic students take the COMLEX and would they opt to do so?

Thanks.
 
pianola said:
So sort of along the lines of what mmmcdowe was saying...

If you take the USMLE-track and you're a DO student then you're termed 'a DO student who took the USMLE', not an MD? But --> effectively you're licensed the same way as an MD if you take the exam right? 😕😕😕😕 Or am I just confused? I thought the US Medical Licensing Exam/individual states licensed you and not your medical school...😕😕 (shows what I know).

Can allopathic students take the COMLEX and would they opt to do so?

Thanks.
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My understanding, DO's can take the USMLE to help them apply for MD residencies, but they still must take the COMLEX for DO licensure. Even if they are completing a MD residency, they must complete all steps of the COMLEX rather than the USMLE as this is the path for full DO licensure. They are not required to pass steps II and III of the USMLE.

After you've completed your degree, the post-graduate training you receive (MD or DO residency) does not change the degree conferred.
 
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^ yes you are correct.
 
DO/MD are academic degrees. So is the MBBS, MBBCh, etc that is conferred upon British graduates (or other Commonwealth countries except Canada). No matter what you do, the degree conferred to you does not change. In the US, those holding the degrees MBBS, MBBCh can informally use the MD post-nominal letters, but for formal occasions, have to use their earned degree (hence why on journal articles you see MBBS instead of MD).

USMLE/COMLEX are for licensure ONLY (and has no role on your designation or post-nominal letters used). US MD students must take USMLE. DO students must take step 1 and step 2 of COMLEX. USMLE is optional for DO students. If a DO student takes and pass COMLEX 3, then that student can be licensed in all 50 states. If the DO student does not take COMLEX 3 but finishes the USMLE series, that student can be licensed in most but not all states. MD students do not have the option of taking COMLEX.

Board certification exams is the test you take after residency and/or fellowship. It does not matter what degree or USMLE/COMLEX you have - only that you successfully completed an accredited residency/fellowship program. A DO who completes an ACGME residency in Internal Medicine is eligible to take the American Board of Internal Medicine exam. A DO who completes an AOA residency in Internal Medicine is eligible to take the American Osteopathic Board of Internal Medicine exam. For the vast majority of cases, it does not matter if you are boarded by ABIM or AOBIM - you're still board-certified and usually that's enough for insurance, HMO, hospital priviledges, etc.

You can practice without board certification. All you need is an unrestricted license to practice medicine. But it's hard to find a medmal carrier, hospital priviledges, or get listed amongst various health insurance carriers - but there are doctors out there who are not board certified.
 
JaggerPlate said:
This thread is just stupid all around. People who truly bash on DO are 18 year old freshman in college who seriously get off thinking about GPA and MCAT scores. They are f*cking losers and could not be more out of touch with reality. The truth is that there are, in some cases, more obstacles for DOs. Namely those shooting for competitive MD residencies or becoming extremely specialized. However, the truth is that it is difficult for MD students as well. Anyone who thinks that they can attend an MD school, score low on USMLE, have crappy LORs, and still land an integrated plastics residency JUST because they went to a US MD school is just as delusional as the DO student who rocks everything, but thinks they will be forced into an IM residency because they went the DO route. People also need to realize that there are VARIOUS reasons for going DO above MD. People choose schools based on cost, location, the atmosphere of the student body, etc etc. NOT simply because they had SLIGHTLY lower stats or screwed up in undergrad. These assumptions are just wrong, and represent the ignorance of the people who make them. Most people who bash DO schools truly know nothing about it.

NOW ... on the other side of the card ... there are people who are superrrr pro DO and ignore some pretty basic facts. First, the difference in philosophy thing is bull****, and it isolates a lot of people who would be more supportive of DO schools. DOs do not treat patients better than MDs. There may be some deep routed, OLDER differences, but today both practice western medicine and with the exception of OMM -which an unfortunately small number of DOs use - MDs and DOs are identical in practice. It's also foolish to assume that a DO will be able to land any MD residency because, let's face it, they are MD residencies. People also need to be careful with certain DO schools when it comes to clinical rotations.

Bottom line: DO schools provide an excellent medical education. If your end goal is to become a DOCTOR, an MD or DO will provide you a path to complete your goal. I just wanted to state that I am applying to both, and really have no preference. People need to quit making assumptions for whatever reason and just go to medical school. If the DO route is the option that works out for you, get your god damn DO, don't bitch about it, don't care what some acne faced 18 year old pre med says, and practice medicine. If you choose to take the MD route, don't feel like you need to put DOs down for entertainment on a Friday night, just practice medicine.
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very well said 👍
 
Thanks, group_theory. 🙂
 
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