Do people lie on their EC's?

[badasshairday]

Do you think people lie about their EC's for AMCAS?

If so, what percent of applicants lie? It must suck to be caught lying during an interview. 😱

My friend told me about a couple of people she knows that lied about a couple AMCAS. I was surprised and told her, they will probably get caught when the interviewer asks them about that particular EC.

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[63768]

a lot of people lie. i don't think there's been research or anything done on it so there's not a percentage. i know people embellish, hell i did a little. the key is if you're going to lie, be able to talk about it and act like you really did it. if you suck at bsing, i wouldn't try.

but yea, you do it at your own risk. if you get questioned about it, i'm sure the interviewer can see right through your bull****.

 

[ryandote]

Do you think people lie about their EC's for AMCAS?

If so, what percent of applicants lie? It must suck to be caught lying during an interview. 😱

My friend told me about a couple of people she knows that lied about a couple AMCAS. I was surprised and told her, they will probably get caught when the interviewer asks them about that particular EC.

People definitely lie on their AMCAS EC's. Especially if you just count exaggerating hours and stuff.

Personally, I don't think they'll get caught unless they are too stupid to know a little about their lie. I don't think that schools call the people you list very often. Who knows?

 

[Jacks Mannequin]

My guess is that they make more of what you can say about your ECs and what you learned from them during the interview rather than what's on the application.

 

[jochi1543]

A friend who's in med school now did a little informal poll of 8 buddies, and 7 told him they had "exaggerated" their ECs.

And as I have mentioned in the past, in Canada they actually do random checks on interviewed applicants' contact people. They obviously don't have the resources to call every single reference listed on the app or even to run this check on every single interviewed applicant, but they do 1) random checks 2) check on some especially suspicious ECs, such as ones that the applicant had a hard time discussing in detail. I don't know anyone who's been caught, but then again, not many people would admit being caught, so it probably doesn't mean anything.

 

[AppleseedCast]

it's probably a common practice, but a despicable one. If you are entering a field which requires the utmost of ethical standards, what crappier way is there of starting it?

 

[Karen12345]

Do you think people lie about their EC's for AMCAS?

If so, what percent of applicants lie? It must suck to be caught lying during an interview. 😱

My friend told me about a couple of people she knows that lied about a couple AMCAS. I was surprised and told her, they will probably get caught when the interviewer asks them about that particular EC.

I wish people were honest.

 

[viciouz]

I thought about lying... but then I figured, I don't want to be like those other pre-meds nor do I want to get caught in the act during an interview or something. So instead of like 12 EC's... I have only 9 EC's and they are strong too.

 

[pagemmapants]

What sucks is that if 9 out of 10 people are exaggerating their hours and you AREN'T they're automatically going to assume you ARE and think that what you put down was way more than you actually did.

It's like how docs assume that patients smoke 3x more than they say they do, which sucks if they're honest and tell the truth about smoking 5 cigs/day.

*grump*

 

[146233]

Do you think people lie about their EC's for AMCAS?

This is like asking, "Do you think people lie on their resumé?" Absolutely. And I think they'll get away with it far more often than not.

If so, what percent of applicants lie? It must suck to be caught lying during an interview. 😱

I'd be so bold as to guess upwards of 80% lie or otherwise "polish" their EC's.

My friend told me about a couple of people she knows that lied about a couple AMCAS. I was surprised and told her, they will probably get caught when the interviewer asks them about that particular EC.

They won't get caught as long as the applicant did a little reading on the EC. The only time they'll get nabbed is on the off chance they listed an EC the interviewer either personally participates in or is somehow intimately familiar with.

Bottom line - don't lie. [sarcasm] Unless your EC's are really weak. [/sarcasm]

 

[deleted36260]

Look, I'm not perfect and don't to come across as a holier than thou type, but lying on your app is as stupid as you can be.

You run the risk of getting black listed from all US med schools for it and flushing down so much hard work (you can't lie about your GPA or MCAT).

Sure people lie on the app, but they are braver/stupider than I am!

 

[postbacker]

Can you live with yourself after lying on the app? Answer that question and follow your conscience...whether you believe almost everyone else is doing it or not should have no bearing on your decision...

 

[gujuDoc]

Do you think people lie about their EC's for AMCAS?

If so, what percent of applicants lie? It must suck to be caught lying during an interview. 😱

My friend told me about a couple of people she knows that lied about a couple AMCAS. I was surprised and told her, they will probably get caught when the interviewer asks them about that particular EC.

There are people out there with no morals who do lie but i wouldn't encourage it.

And anyhow define lying. Do you mean lie by saying you did something you didn't??? or do you mean embellish the activity you did. I know a lot of people embellish and that's not really so bad, but outright saying you earned an award you didn't or you lied about a talent you didn't really have or something like that is not cool.

No that if you get caught you could lose your acceptance or worse so I'd try not to do it.

 

[trichomoniasis]

easy solution:

just be impressive, then you don't have to lie or exagerrate.

 

[TheGreatHunt]

If you're thinking about it: DON'T

It's a little bit of on your honor, with a lot of repercussions thrown in. It's not that hard to do a little bit of volunteering on your own time rather than play nintendo. I'd say every single one of those people who lied on their applications had plenty enough time to do everything they say they did. I'm sure most people who interview others have pretty darn good bull**** detectors.

 

[coralfangs]

aren't they worried about the adcom contactin their contactpeople?

 

[sehnsucht]

Do you think people lie about their EC's for AMCAS?

If so, what percent of applicants lie? It must suck to be caught lying during an interview. 😱

My friend told me about a couple of people she knows that lied about a couple AMCAS. I was surprised and told her, they will probably get caught when the interviewer asks them about that particular EC.

that is discouraging for people who have planned a lot to make sure that ALL the details in their ECs are accurate. no justice at all, man. c'est la vie🙁 at least i can take solace in the fact that when I get asked about my ECs, I can talk a ton about what I've done since i didn't embellish anything.

 

[jlamacc1]

It's amazing that adcoms put as much stock as they do on ECs if lying/exaggerating is this common or easy.

 

[postbacker]

It's amazing that adcoms put as much stock as they do on ECs if lying/exaggerating is this common or easy.

I agree, but some of these ECs are supported by letters of recommendation that confirm or corroborate claims (volunteer activities, research hours, etc.). IMO, I frankly think that the ECs that lend themselves to the most exaggeration (namely # of hours of volunteer, clinical, and shadowing activities) are perhaps viewed with a slightly jaundiced eye and are actually a little less important, at least in terms of absolute hours, than folks here on SDN seem to believe...

And it is my understanding that colleges that write a committee letter usually make the students fill out an extensive activities sheet, so it is possible that claims of volunteer hours can be vetted at the college (and this is probably one more reason why med schools prefer committee letters that serve as a check against lying and exaggeration by applicants).

Another thought - lying to your college pre med committee constitutes an honor violation, and wouldn't that be really stupid to exaggerate hours in an activity and get nailed because someone checked up on you?

Bottom line: I am not too worried about other people lying on their apps...

 

[NJDIF]

my school does something similar. If you complete a shadowing program, you must put a certificate of completion in your pre-health file. If you do research, one of your letters of recommendations MUST be from your research adviser. I guess this lets your school know what you did do and what you didnt.

 

[glamqueen]

I plan on being completely honest next June when I apply. I'd rather get into medical or get rejected from medical according to who I am rather than a version of who I wish I was...

 

[sendwich]

Do you think people lie about their EC's for AMCAS?

If so, what percent of applicants lie? It must suck to be caught lying during an interview. 😱

My friend told me about a couple of people she knows that lied about a couple AMCAS. I was surprised and told her, they will probably get caught when the interviewer asks them about that particular EC.

not to put down your question, but who cares if people lie (or don't lie) on ECs? Just do your best to be honest as possible on your app.

 

[Severus]

I honestly don't understand how people can live with themselves when they lie on their applications -- by either completely making stuff up or exaggerating hours -- and then get accepted to a bunch of schools.

I mean, I know I'm more neurotic than the average pre-med but I absolutely agonized over calculating my volunteer hours activities which were feast-or-famine in nature (30+ hours for weeks... and then nothing for weeks). I talked to professors and friends and pre-med advisors to see what I should do, and while they all advocated the guestimate method, I still felt bad and explained all guestimate activities during interviews. I was so worried about over-estimating hours for activities I actually did do, I cannot fathom completely making something up. 👎

Bottom line... don't be a ***** and lie.

 

[NervousNed]

this is exactly why the MCAT + GPA are the most important factors, and MCAT moreso, its the only trustworthy number to rank people on, numbers dont lie, people lie 😀

 

[AppleseedCast]

It's a really bad idea to lie about ECs. In fact, be sure you are ready to talk about every ec you write down extensively because they will probably ask you about it

 

[blueskyline]

I'm sure many of you guys have seen this before:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=J7pok0TKDU8

 

[gujuDoc]

I honestly don't understand how people can live with themselves when they lie on their applications -- by either completely making stuff up or exaggerating hours -- and then get accepted to a bunch of schools.

I mean, I know I'm more neurotic than the average pre-med but I absolutely agonized over calculating my volunteer hours activities which were feast-or-famine in nature (30+ hours for weeks... and then nothing for weeks). I talked to professors and friends and pre-med advisors to see what I should do, and while they all advocated the guestimate method, I still felt bad and explained all guestimate activities during interviews. I was so worried about over-estimating hours for activities I actually did do, I cannot fathom completely making something up. 👎

Bottom line... don't be a ***** and lie.

I understand where you are coming from. I calculated all my shadowing hours and stuff when I was applying to a masters and went to the Volunteer places and looked up exactly when I started and the last date I volunteered.

 

[gujuDoc]

this is exactly why the MCAT + GPA are the most important factors, and MCAT moreso, its the only trustworthy number to rank people on, numbers dont lie, people lie 😀

 

[tigerprawn]

I wonder what happens when an applicant gets caught lying. Seems to me like either:

1. the particular med. school that found out rejects the applicant and the other schools are not affected unless they find out on their own

2. the particular med. school sends out letters to the AAMC / all other med. schools to let them know

3. the particular med. school sends out letters to the AAMC, AACOM, and Carribean schools and the applicant has no future chance of being a physician.


I'm going to guess 2 since I think I've read about people who had to get a foreign M.D. after falsifying. I'm at a loss for how allopathics and osteopathic communicate though.

 

[gujuDoc]

I don't know if MD schools contact the DO organization, but I know that you will get blacklisted from MD schools if you are caught. You could already be in med school but if you are found out you can be kicked out.

I wonder what happens when an applicant gets caught lying. Seems to me like either:

1. the particular med. school that found out rejects the applicant and the other schools are not affected unless they find out on their own

2. the particular med. school sends out letters to the AAMC / all other med. schools to let them know

3. the particular med. school sends out letters to the AAMC, AACOM, and Carribean schools and the applicant has no future chance of being a physician.


I'm going to guess 2 since I think I've read about people who had to get a foreign M.D. after falsifying. I'm at a loss for how allopathics and osteopathic communicate though.

 

[jochi1543]

I'm going to guess 2 since I think I've read about people who had to get a foreign M.D. after falsifying.

Hmmmm, they'd still have to come back and do residency here, and get licensed if they wanna practice in the US...I don't know whether this puts an end to just being a med student in the US or to being an MD in the US altogether.

 

[Beau Geste]

I didn't lie about my ECs but I did talk them up. Some of them were also long enough ago that I wasn't sure about exact hours, so I made educated guesses.

 

[Davjc2009]

What sucks is that if 9 out of 10 people are exaggerating their hours and you AREN'T they're automatically going to assume you ARE and think that what you put down was way more than you actually did.

It's like how docs assume that patients smoke 3x more than they say they do, which sucks if they're honest and tell the truth about smoking 5 cigs/day.

*grump*

Makes me think of the Rule of Three from American Pie.

If a guy says he slept with Y many girls, you divide it by three.

If a girl says she slept with X many guys, you multiply it by three.

...I watch too many movies...

 

[deleted77919]

I don't believe most people are intentionally dishonest on their applications. Sometimes it is tough to be 100% accurate, especially with the hours catagory. What I did was try to put a range estimate into my description so as to be as accurate as possible.

The biggest area where people get caught is the language catagory. The question is something like "Which languages are you fluent in?" A lot of people say, "Oh, I took 3 years of spanish in high school . . . I'll check that box." Then they get an interviewer from Chilie and it's curtains for them. And it wasn't even intentional dishonesty, just a failure to understand what the term "fluent" means.

 

[aubreytex]

I didn't lie, but I didn't include things that I thought would hurt my chances.

 

[armybound]

hell yes

 

[jochi1543]

The biggest area where people get caught is the language catagory. The question is something like "Which languages are you fluent in?"

No, it actually just says: " Others (Select all that apply) " after you note your primary language. So it doesn't suggest you should be 100% fluent to check any other languages.

 

[viciouz]

I can see how language can screw you if you happen to get purposely paired with an interviewee who knows that language fluently.

 

[TheRealMD]

Realize that this is why adcoms don't care about the number of hours. While 5 hours volunteering compared to 500 hours looks bad on an application, there's no way to tell if someone really did volunteer for that long without actually being there. Besides, they'd much rather care about the experience you got from an event that how long you did it for.

If your acceptance really comes down to the number of hours you volunteered (after you've done maybe 40 or so), then I really question whether you were a qualified applicant at all.

 

[voirlesetoiles]

I'll second some things that have already been said.... I don't consider it cheating to leave out things that would hurt someone's chances or to make educated guesses on hours from activities done long ago.

It's about how an activity is presented... two applicants could make one experience seem wonderful or ordinary just based on how they present the activity and talk about what they learned from it...Some applicants can "sell" their activities and engage in more in-depth discussion. I think that's okay.

Yes, I'm positive people lie about their EC's. Guessing the number of hours without much thought or rounding/bumping up the number of hours is blatant cheating. It's unfair to other applicants who choose to stay truthful even if they don't have as many hours... and unfair to everyone that has actually put in those hours. And an applicant saying they did something when it wasn't in their job description or if someone else did that work is also clearly wrong. At the end of the day, the only person you can control is yourself. And staying truthful throughout the process only makes victory that much sweeter. 🙂 And I doubt that the people who lied in their applications will feel as good as I will when getting accepted!

 

[mshheaddoc]

I honestly don't understand how people can live with themselves when they lie on their applications -- by either completely making stuff up or exaggerating hours -- and then get accepted to a bunch of schools.

I mean, I know I'm more neurotic than the average pre-med but I absolutely agonized over calculating my volunteer hours activities which were feast-or-famine in nature (30+ hours for weeks... and then nothing for weeks). I talked to professors and friends and pre-med advisors to see what I should do, and while they all advocated the guestimate method, I still felt bad and explained all guestimate activities during interviews. I was so worried about over-estimating hours for activities I actually did do, I cannot fathom completely making something up. 👎

Bottom line... don't be a ***** and lie.

I did the same thing, to the point where now I keep a spreadsheet. Wish I would have thought of that a long time ago.

 

[medstuddude]

Realize that this is why adcoms don't care about the number of hours. While 5 hours volunteering compared to 500 hours looks bad on an application, there's no way to tell if someone really did volunteer for that long without actually being there. Besides, they'd much rather care about the experience you got from an event that how long you did it for.

If your acceptance really comes down to the number of hours you volunteered (after you've done maybe 40 or so), then I really question whether you were a qualified applicant at all.

Trust me they do. Many adcoms that I've talked to said that avg applicants have ~ 200 clinical hours

 

[jochi1543]

I can see how language can screw you if you happen to get purposely paired with an interviewee who knows that language fluently.

I bet it only happens if you spend lots of time BSing about how you are so committed to practicing with such and such population of immigrant patients. I mean, I'm obviously "fluent" in my native language, but I wouldn't interview well in it, because I don't speak it daily, especially at an interview level. I've had situations at job interviews before where I said I spoke Japanese, and the person suddenly switched to Japanese, but even though I'm nowhere near "fluency" (very few people ever become fluent in Japanese as a foreign language), my ability to maintain a simple conversation was always enough. One job had nothing at all to do with using Japanese, and another was a project I came up with and wanted a Japanese researcher's assistance on, so I guess he did want to check that I wasn't full of crap. But even though I'm not 100% fluent (and never claimed to be, btw), neither was like, "oh my goodness, she can't talk about pro-abortion politics in Zambia in Japanese at the speed of 100 words per minute!" and both interviews ended well.


After all, you're not applying for a position of a translator, but a position of a doctor - who, btw, will have access to translators if necessary. I worked at a clinic for 3 years and not ONCE had to speak anything other than English to a client - 99% of them spoke enough English to understand all the info, and the remaining 1% came with a social worker who interpreted everything for them even though I could have easily spoken to them in their native language to begin with.

 

[prionsRbad]

Trust me they do. Many adcoms that I've talked to said that avg applicants have ~ 200 clinical hours

Adcoms have access to volunteer hours that all hospitals and clinics are required to keep (the hospital keeps a record for funding reasons). You can call up any hospital's volunteer department and ask about a persons hours and so can Adcoms. They might not be able to find out about other EC's, but lying about your clinical hours is plain stupid and there is a good chance that you will get caught.