do pharmacists earn more then optometrists?

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Aznfarmerboi said:
I am going to take a shot here as it disgusts me at how many ignorant people there are in this forum.

Lets start with the earning income. You guys say that you can max out; so can we. Someone owning an independent pharmacy or niching in say parental can rake in millions. You guys probably cant even estimate the amount of independent pharmacies out there and how much they are making. Do you have any idea how easy it is for us to make a buck compare to you guys? We but 1000 capsules of amoxicillin fo 5 dollars and sell it for 500. About salary, we are guarantee an increase. When i started pharmacy school, the average salary was about 60k. Now it is 100k. The wages are still going up with an expected 5 to 6 percent salary increase for most pharmacists this year. In addition to a pharmacists's salary, they also recieve bonuses, 401k matching (thats another 10k right there for me), FSA, employee stock purchases, etc.

Saying that we are only pill counters is the most ignorant statement I have ever heard. Besides nuclear pharamcy and retail (the two that someone apparaently thinks we do), there are a lot more career paths out there. http://hsc.unm.edu/pharmacy/docs/Pfizerpharmacyguide.pdf this guide alone shows that although there are about 40-50 career paths out there that are COMMON. Take a look at it and you will be surprised at what we do daily. Most doctors that I work with respect us and come to us for advice. I had two recommendations that was asked of me and did a couple of interventions today. By saving the hospital millions of dollars from lawsuits (one of my intervention was a heparin overdose), I am already making myself worth my salary plus a lot more.

To the poster who said that you guys should get paid more because you guys diagnosis and do exams, give me a break. If that was the point, pharmacists do that often. We do it in health management, PBMs (we talk it over with doctors on what is cover or not and what is the most appropriate route based on clinical medicine), diabetic clinics (we prescribe and manage insulin therapy, run tests, give advice), smoking cessation, hypertension and CAD, weight loss,etc. What do you think we do when patients come in asking for advice on a cold to a first aid problem? Take a look at the NHS and VA system. On the other hand, our job isn't to diagnosis but to treat. With that (to treat, we need to understand pathology, anatomy, and medicine), I can honestly say we know more about medicine than you guys. You guys probably cant even differentiate between a flu and a cold must less the disease states that we were trained on. Concerning liability, look up any state board of pharmacy disiplinary action and you will see that we get disciplined more than any other profession (only second to nurses). Heck, (http://www.op.nysed.gov/jul07.htm) a pharmacist got disciplined because he failed to counsel on a new medication.

I respect ODs, but respect is only given when it is recieved. . .
Click to expand...

Calm down..........take a deep breath......everything is going to be all right...;)
Members don't see this ad.
 
"We buy 1000 capsules of amoxicillin fo 5 dollars and sell it for 500."

You guys are like the NIKE bastards.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Aznfarmerboi said:
To the poster who said that you guys should get paid more because you guys diagnosis and do exams, give me a break. If that was the point, pharmacists do that often. We do it in health management, PBMs (we talk it over with doctors on what is cover or not and what is the most appropriate route based on clinical medicine), diabetic clinics (we prescribe and manage insulin therapy, run tests, give advice), smoking cessation, hypertension and CAD, weight loss,etc. What do you think we do when patients come in asking for advice on a cold to a first aid problem? Take a look at the NHS and VA system. On the other hand, our job isn't to diagnosis but to treat. With that (to treat, we need to understand pathology, anatomy, and medicine), I can honestly say we know more about medicine than you guys. You guys probably cant even differentiate between a flu and a cold must less the disease states that we were trained on. Concerning liability, look up any state board of pharmacy disiplinary action and you will see that we get disciplined more than any other profession (only second to nurses). Heck, (http://www.op.nysed.gov/jul07.htm) a pharmacist got disciplined because he failed to counsel on a new medication.

I respect ODs, but respect is only given when it is recieved. . .
Click to expand...

I'm no psychology expert, but I don't think ignorant rants spewing flawed logic is going to make many folks friendly to your position...especially since you couldn't be more off base.

You have the same credentials to diagnose and treat as my dog does, so spare me the diatribe about how much you know about medicine. You know a lot about a VERY specific area of already prescribed medicine. There is a vast difference between having a room full of diabetics and explaining how insulin works and the side effects and having a person in your chair and through an evaluation adding their symptoms with the small dot hemorrhage and ordering tests to come up with diabetes that they didn't know they had. There is also a VAST difference between counseling a pt on a certain medication and going through all of the steps of figuring out what they had, why they had it, which medication (out of the possible thousands) is going to fix it and having the legal ability to prescribe it.

FWIW, you may know more about "medicines" than we do but I promise we know a HELL of a lot more about medicine than you. Just so you know, most of the time a doctor just quietly chuckles when their rx is questioned by a pharmacist.

You do have a point about independent pharmacies, but you guys are the only profession more infected with commercial influence than we are...and in most states we aren't employees. Yeah, no benefits but also our salary is whatever we choose it to be. Commercial ODs constitute approx 35% of the total optometric population...what is the percentage of commercially employed pharmacists?
 
"Success is becoming like dentistry, failure is becoming like pharmacy"

-ODs everywhere
 
Eyedoc1999 said:
I'm no psychology expert, but I don't think ignorant rants spewing flawed logic is going to make many folks friendly to your position...especially since you couldn't be more off base.

You have the same credentials to diagnose and treat as my dog does, so spare me the diatribe about how much you know about medicine. You know a lot about a VERY specific area of already prescribed medicine. There is a vast difference between having a room full of diabetics and explaining how insulin works and the side effects and having a person in your chair and through an evaluation adding their symptoms with the small dot hemorrhage and ordering tests to come up with diabetes that they didn't know they had. There is also a VAST difference between counseling a pt on a certain medication and going through all of the steps of figuring out what they had, why they had it, which medication (out of the possible thousands) is going to fix it and having the legal ability to prescribe it.

FWIW, you may know more about "medicines" than we do but I promise we know a HELL of a lot more about medicine than you. Just so you know, most of the time a doctor just quietly chuckles when their rx is questioned by a pharmacist.

You do have a point about independent pharmacies, but you guys are the only profession more infected with commercial influence than we are...and in most states we aren't employees. Yeah, no benefits but also our salary is whatever we choose it to be. Commercial ODs constitute approx 35% of the total optometric population...what is the percentage of commercially employed pharmacists?
Click to expand...

While we might know more about medicines, in order for us to understand how the medicine works properly, when it is appropriate for usage, how to optimize it, we have to have an intensive (although not as intensive as a MD) knowledge of medicine. For example, a poison control pharmacist/ER pharamcist usually is advance cardiac life support certified and understands, toxicology certified, etc and will know more about the human body disease state than an OD. Your study of systemic medicine is nothing compared to what we have to go through. You might study hypertension and diabetes plus eye diseases, but we study anywhere from intensive microbiology courses (infectious disease control), anti viral therapy (a pharmacist who specializes in AIDS/HIV will probably know more only next to a HIV specialist), cardiovascular hemodynamics, respiratory functions (we manage asthma/COPD also), to say neuro states. For example, lets use oncology as an example. Most hospitals would have tumor board. The tumor board will consist of an attending, a radiologist, a surgeon, a pharmacist, and maybe the PCP. You would bet that the pharmacist knows more about chemotherapy (the main course of treatment for most stages of cancer), than any of the other 4. The pharmacist would make that recommendation based on his knowledge of how other appoaches such as surgery might or might not be better as opposed to chemotherapy. Remember that there are clear guidelines but medicine is still an art in the end. I can go on and on, but lets admit it. . . there is no way you know more about medicine then we do. You guys specialize in the eyes, just like how dentists specialize in the mouth. Yet a dentist would not be able to come up with a summary (or probably even know where to look for it) based on lab values and what each tests means.

You guys dont even do rotations in a general hospital where you round with a general healthcare team (the team at my unit right now is an attending, a resident, and a pharmacy student). Other teams consists of nurses and PAs.

For your statement that a doctor chuckles when a pharmacist questions them, where are you getting this from? Pharmacist never questions doctors (although there are a lot of mistakes out there). I can confidentially say that for most parts, the doctors usually go with our recommendations. If they dont, we kindly refer them to an Infectious disease consult (renal dosing on most antibiotics), cardiology consult, psych consult, etc. At the end, i would say 50-60 pecent of our recommendations are followed since the department would agree with us. We dont question them because we want to practice medicine. We question them because we are held liable the same way they are if anything goes wrong. In court, the lawyer will be sure to ask, you went through 6 years of pharmacy school making you an expert on drugs. Why did you fill a normal dose of vanco when you clearly saw that his kidneys are not up to par? Isnt it your responsibility to check his kidneys, the most sensitive organ in the body since the information is available to you before giving out the vano? Another example would be why did u give 60mg of methadone when the recommended guideline is 20.

About commercial opt. . , that 35 pecent is what, compared to 5 percent commercial doctors? Our percentage is 65 pecent. To not respect pharmacy as a profession based on that is saying that it is okay for nurses, PAs, and doctors to not respect you guys. Even more, what is to say that for ODs, that number wont change in the future? Numbers are dictated by money and pretty much, that leads to insurance companies. For you to say that your profession wont be commercialize is a dream. To look down on pharmacy because they have a large number of commercial pharmacists, even though these phamacists provide valuable services to the community is unprofessional. Maybe one day if you or a close family member/friend needs an asthma inhaler beacuse their pump is empty, you can value this.



To sum it up eyedoc, for somebody who has no idea what a pharmacist do, you sure are confident of your statements. Pharmacy has gone a long way since 1999. . if that is when you graduated.

Still confused, I agree with you. If ODs becomes like dentists, your profession can be said to be successful. However, pharmacy is a different profession than OD. Without commercial pharmacy, there would be no way that the majority of pharmacists are as well paid as they are now. Only in commercial pharamcy can they work three to four times a week and make 120k + for a starting graduate. That and they dont have to worry about vacation (3 weeks paid vacation for me) coverage, sick + holiday days, retirement, etc.
 
Aznfarmerboi said:
While we might know more about medicines, in order for us to understand how the medicine works properly, when it is appropriate for usage, how to optimize it, we have to have an intensive (although not as intensive as a MD) knowledge of medicine. .
Click to expand...

God Almighty these threads are so incredibly laaaaame!

The fact is that NOT A SINGLE SOLITARY ONE OF YOU OUT THERE, INCLUDING MYSELF HAS ANY IDEA HOW INTENSIVE OR DIFFICULT THE TRAINING IS, HOW BROAD THE KNOWLEDGE BASE IS, HOW COMPETITIVE THE ADMISSIONS PROCESS IS, OR HOW MUCH MONEY IS MADE BY ANY OTHER PROFESSION OUT THERE OTHER THAN YOUR OWN UNLESS YOU HAVE GONE THROUGH BOTH PROGRAMS AND PRACTICED/WORKED IN EACH OF THOSE PROFESSIONS. THAT EXCLUDES 99.99% OF EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM AND IT DOES NOT MAKE A SINGLE SOLITARY LICK OF DIFFERENCE HOW MANY FRIENDS YOU HAVE OR RELATIVES YOU HAVE WHO ARE ODS/MDS/DDSS/PODIATRISTS/PHARMACISTS BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH SO FOR THE LOVE OF JESUS H CHRIST CAN YOU ALL JUST SHUT UP WITH YOUR LIMP PLAYGROUND CHEST THUMPING ABOUT HOW SMART YOU ALL ARE, OR HOW MUCH MONEY YOU ALL MAKE BECAUSE THE FACT IS THAT NO ONE GIVES A FIDDLER'S FART!!!!!
 
KHE said:
God Almighty these threads are so incredibly laaaaame!

The fact is that NOT A SINGLE SOLITARY ONE OF YOU OUT THERE, INCLUDING MYSELF HAS ANY IDEA HOW INTENSIVE OR DIFFICULT THE TRAINING IS, HOW BROAD THE KNOWLEDGE BASE IS, HOW COMPETITIVE THE ADMISSIONS PROCESS IS, OR HOW MUCH MONEY IS MADE BY ANY OTHER PROFESSION OUT THERE OTHER THAN YOUR OWN UNLESS YOU HAVE GONE THROUGH BOTH PROGRAMS AND PRACTICED/WORKED IN EACH OF THOSE PROFESSIONS. THAT EXCLUDES 99.99% OF EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM AND IT DOES NOT MAKE A SINGLE SOLITARY LICK OF DIFFERENCE HOW MANY FRIENDS YOU HAVE OR RELATIVES YOU HAVE WHO ARE ODS/MDS/DDSS/PODIATRISTS/PHARMACISTS BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH SO FOR THE LOVE OF JESUS H CHRIST CAN YOU ALL JUST SHUT UP WITH YOUR LIMP PLAYGROUND CHEST THUMPING ABOUT HOW SMART YOU ALL ARE, OR HOW MUCH MONEY YOU ALL MAKE BECAUSE THE FACT IS THAT NO ONE GIVES A FIDDLER'S FART!!!!!
Click to expand...

Thank you, even though you screamed at us.
 
KHE said:
God Almighty these threads are so incredibly laaaaame!

The fact is that NOT A SINGLE SOLITARY ONE OF YOU OUT THERE, INCLUDING MYSELF HAS ANY IDEA HOW INTENSIVE OR DIFFICULT THE TRAINING IS, HOW BROAD THE KNOWLEDGE BASE IS, HOW COMPETITIVE THE ADMISSIONS PROCESS IS, OR HOW MUCH MONEY IS MADE BY ANY OTHER PROFESSION OUT THERE OTHER THAN YOUR OWN UNLESS YOU HAVE GONE THROUGH BOTH PROGRAMS AND PRACTICED/WORKED IN EACH OF THOSE PROFESSIONS. THAT EXCLUDES 99.99% OF EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM AND IT DOES NOT MAKE A SINGLE SOLITARY LICK OF DIFFERENCE HOW MANY FRIENDS YOU HAVE OR RELATIVES YOU HAVE WHO ARE ODS/MDS/DDSS/PODIATRISTS/PHARMACISTS BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH SO FOR THE LOVE OF JESUS H CHRIST CAN YOU ALL JUST SHUT UP WITH YOUR LIMP PLAYGROUND CHEST THUMPING ABOUT HOW SMART YOU ALL ARE, OR HOW MUCH MONEY YOU ALL MAKE BECAUSE THE FACT IS THAT NO ONE GIVES A FIDDLER'S FART!!!!!
Click to expand...

Hmph, you think you're so special just because you have 7 badges. :p

Though, as usual, you're right.
 
KHE said:
God Almighty these threads are so incredibly laaaaame!

The fact is that NOT A SINGLE SOLITARY ONE OF YOU OUT THERE, INCLUDING MYSELF HAS ANY IDEA HOW INTENSIVE OR DIFFICULT THE TRAINING IS, HOW BROAD THE KNOWLEDGE BASE IS, HOW COMPETITIVE THE ADMISSIONS PROCESS IS, OR HOW MUCH MONEY IS MADE BY ANY OTHER PROFESSION OUT THERE OTHER THAN YOUR OWN UNLESS YOU HAVE GONE THROUGH BOTH PROGRAMS AND PRACTICED/WORKED IN EACH OF THOSE PROFESSIONS. THAT EXCLUDES 99.99% OF EVERYONE ON THIS FORUM AND IT DOES NOT MAKE A SINGLE SOLITARY LICK OF DIFFERENCE HOW MANY FRIENDS YOU HAVE OR RELATIVES YOU HAVE WHO ARE ODS/MDS/DDSS/PODIATRISTS/PHARMACISTS BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH SO FOR THE LOVE OF JESUS H CHRIST CAN YOU ALL JUST SHUT UP WITH YOUR LIMP PLAYGROUND CHEST THUMPING ABOUT HOW SMART YOU ALL ARE, OR HOW MUCH MONEY YOU ALL MAKE BECAUSE THE FACT IS THAT NO ONE GIVES A FIDDLER'S FART!!!!!
Click to expand...

Agreed. :thumbup:
 
Enough, ODs and pharmacists are both overworked and underappreciated.

Corporate practice is sucking the life out of both.

Lets save the vitrol for the MDs and their "god" complex. :D
 
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Aznfarmerboi said:
While we might know more about medicines, in order for us to understand how the medicine works properly, when it is appropriate for usage, how to optimize it, we have to have an intensive (although not as intensive as a MD) knowledge of medicine. For example, a poison control pharmacist/ER pharamcist usually is advance cardiac life support certified and understands, toxicology certified, etc and will know more about the human body disease state than an OD. Your study of systemic medicine is nothing compared to what we have to go through. You might study hypertension and diabetes plus eye diseases, but we study anywhere from intensive microbiology courses (infectious disease control), anti viral therapy (a pharmacist who specializes in AIDS/HIV will probably know more only next to a HIV specialist), cardiovascular hemodynamics, respiratory functions (we manage asthma/COPD also), to say neuro states. For example, lets use oncology as an example. Most hospitals would have tumor board. The tumor board will consist of an attending, a radiologist, a surgeon, a pharmacist, and maybe the PCP. You would bet that the pharmacist knows more about chemotherapy (the main course of treatment for most stages of cancer), than any of the other 4. The pharmacist would make that recommendation based on his knowledge of how other appoaches such as surgery might or might not be better as opposed to chemotherapy. Remember that there are clear guidelines but medicine is still an art in the end. I can go on and on, but lets admit it. . . there is no way you know more about medicine then we do. You guys specialize in the eyes, just like how dentists specialize in the mouth. Yet a dentist would not be able to come up with a summary (or probably even know where to look for it) based on lab values and what each tests means.

You guys dont even do rotations in a general hospital where you round with a general healthcare team (the team at my unit right now is an attending, a resident, and a pharmacy student). Other teams consists of nurses and PAs.

For your statement that a doctor chuckles when a pharmacist questions them, where are you getting this from? Pharmacist never questions doctors (although there are a lot of mistakes out there). I can confidentially say that for most parts, the doctors usually go with our recommendations. If they dont, we kindly refer them to an Infectious disease consult (renal dosing on most antibiotics), cardiology consult, psych consult, etc. At the end, i would say 50-60 pecent of our recommendations are followed since the department would agree with us. We dont question them because we want to practice medicine. We question them because we are held liable the same way they are if anything goes wrong. In court, the lawyer will be sure to ask, you went through 6 years of pharmacy school making you an expert on drugs. Why did you fill a normal dose of vanco when you clearly saw that his kidneys are not up to par? Isnt it your responsibility to check his kidneys, the most sensitive organ in the body since the information is available to you before giving out the vano? Another example would be why did u give 60mg of methadone when the recommended guideline is 20.

About commercial opt. . , that 35 pecent is what, compared to 5 percent commercial doctors? Our percentage is 65 pecent. To not respect pharmacy as a profession based on that is saying that it is okay for nurses, PAs, and doctors to not respect you guys. Even more, what is to say that for ODs, that number wont change in the future? Numbers are dictated by money and pretty much, that leads to insurance companies. For you to say that your profession wont be commercialize is a dream. To look down on pharmacy because they have a large number of commercial pharmacists, even though these phamacists provide valuable services to the community is unprofessional. Maybe one day if you or a close family member/friend needs an asthma inhaler beacuse their pump is empty, you can value this.



To sum it up eyedoc, for somebody who has no idea what a pharmacist do, you sure are confident of your statements. Pharmacy has gone a long way since 1999. . if that is when you graduated.

Still confused, I agree with you. If ODs becomes like dentists, your profession can be said to be successful. However, pharmacy is a different profession than OD. Without commercial pharmacy, there would be no way that the majority of pharmacists are as well paid as they are now. Only in commercial pharamcy can they work three to four times a week and make 120k + for a starting graduate. That and they dont have to worry about vacation (3 weeks paid vacation for me) coverage, sick + holiday days, retirement, etc.
Click to expand...

I wish I was a pharmacist now. If I can get paid that well counting pills for CVS and Walgreens, then I would be so happy.
 
ODhopeful said:
I wish I was a pharmacist now. If I can get paid that well counting pills for CVS and Walgreens, then I would be so happy.
Click to expand...

Are you joking or are you truly serious ?
 
ahhh.... why is this thread still active!??! :mad:
 
the topic has been beaten to death. pharmacy and optometry are very close in $ being salaried employed. If you own your own office/ retail private practice or your own pharmacy - the sky is the limit with both.
This thread is getting mundane.
 
Aznfarmerboi said:
While we might know more about medicines, in order for us to understand how the medicine works properly, when it is appropriate for usage, how to optimize it, we have to have an intensive (although not as intensive as a MD) knowledge of medicine. For example, a poison control pharmacist/ER pharamcist usually is advance cardiac life support certified and understands, toxicology certified, etc and will know more about the human body disease state than an OD. Your study of systemic medicine is nothing compared to what we have to go through. You might study hypertension and diabetes plus eye diseases, but we study anywhere from intensive microbiology courses (infectious disease control), anti viral therapy (a pharmacist who specializes in AIDS/HIV will probably know more only next to a HIV specialist), cardiovascular hemodynamics, respiratory functions (we manage asthma/COPD also), to say neuro states. For example, lets use oncology as an example. Most hospitals would have tumor board. The tumor board will consist of an attending, a radiologist, a surgeon, a pharmacist, and maybe the PCP. You would bet that the pharmacist knows more about chemotherapy (the main course of treatment for most stages of cancer), than any of the other 4. The pharmacist would make that recommendation based on his knowledge of how other appoaches such as surgery might or might not be better as opposed to chemotherapy. Remember that there are clear guidelines but medicine is still an art in the end. I can go on and on, but lets admit it. . . there is no way you know more about medicine then we do. You guys specialize in the eyes, just like how dentists specialize in the mouth. Yet a dentist would not be able to come up with a summary (or probably even know where to look for it) based on lab values and what each tests means.

You guys dont even do rotations in a general hospital where you round with a general healthcare team (the team at my unit right now is an attending, a resident, and a pharmacy student). Other teams consists of nurses and PAs.

For your statement that a doctor chuckles when a pharmacist questions them, where are you getting this from? Pharmacist never questions doctors (although there are a lot of mistakes out there). I can confidentially say that for most parts, the doctors usually go with our recommendations. If they dont, we kindly refer them to an Infectious disease consult (renal dosing on most antibiotics), cardiology consult, psych consult, etc. At the end, i would say 50-60 pecent of our recommendations are followed since the department would agree with us. We dont question them because we want to practice medicine. We question them because we are held liable the same way they are if anything goes wrong. In court, the lawyer will be sure to ask, you went through 6 years of pharmacy school making you an expert on drugs. Why did you fill a normal dose of vanco when you clearly saw that his kidneys are not up to par? Isnt it your responsibility to check his kidneys, the most sensitive organ in the body since the information is available to you before giving out the vano? Another example would be why did u give 60mg of methadone when the recommended guideline is 20.

About commercial opt. . , that 35 pecent is what, compared to 5 percent commercial doctors? Our percentage is 65 pecent. To not respect pharmacy as a profession based on that is saying that it is okay for nurses, PAs, and doctors to not respect you guys. Even more, what is to say that for ODs, that number wont change in the future? Numbers are dictated by money and pretty much, that leads to insurance companies. For you to say that your profession wont be commercialize is a dream. To look down on pharmacy because they have a large number of commercial pharmacists, even though these phamacists provide valuable services to the community is unprofessional. Maybe one day if you or a close family member/friend needs an asthma inhaler beacuse their pump is empty, you can value this.



To sum it up eyedoc, for somebody who has no idea what a pharmacist do, you sure are confident of your statements. Pharmacy has gone a long way since 1999. . if that is when you graduated.
Click to expand...

Tell you what Skippy, let's go ahead and put this to bed...why don't you try doing ONE exam or write ONE prescription and we'll see how that goes. Be sure to tell the plantiff's attorney how much you know about medicine.

FWIW, I'm not beating anyone up for working in a commercial environment given that I work in one myself...I'm just a bit adverse to someone telling me how much more they know about medicine than someone who spends four years learning to assess patients clinically.
 
Why do pharmacists get paid so much money?

Because we get 6-7 years of intensive education (may not be as intensive as your education, but still intensive), and have to stand 12 hours a day, get treated like gas station clerks, get absolutely no respect, held liable for anything that the technicians do incorrectly, held responsible for profits/loses, deal with angry customers, and being told what to do by a store manager that probably has a high school education. Although according to you guys, we are not highly "educated" in medicine, we get paid for the other crap that we have to go through. Its the same reason why some nurses get paid more than medical technologists or even ph.d.'s. If pharmacists were to be paid much lower than what they are paid now, who would want to work at CVS and Walgreens?
 
Eyedoc1999 said:
Tell you what Skippy, let's go ahead and put this to bed...why don't you try doing ONE exam or write ONE prescription and we'll see how that goes. Be sure to tell the plantiff's attorney how much you know about medicine.

FWIW, I'm not beating anyone up for working in a commercial environment given that I work in one myself...I'm just a bit adverse to someone telling me how much more they know about medicine than someone who spends four years learning to assess patients clinically.
Click to expand...

Let's take this one step further - why don't you do a complete H&P and write for a systemic Rx (a diuretic or a TCA, let's say) and see how the attorney likes that one. Simple fact is everyone fills a different need in this whole health care nonsense. ODs know more about vision than anyone else, and that's that. Pharmacists know more about drugs than I am ever likely to learn, which is fine: that's their job. Conversely, in 3 years time I'll be able to do a full physical exam (with the obvious exception of eyes) better than either of you. Simply put, neither of you will be able to get away with doing a full physical and writing for a drug outside your area of training. Same way with me, until I'm trained to do this properly I also have no business trying. If everyone just sticks to what they are trained and licensed to do we'll be in a good place.
 
JackFruitLover said:
Why do pharmacists get paid so much money?

Because we get 6-7 years of intensive education (may not be as intensive as your education, but still intensive), and have to stand 12 hours a day, get treated like gas station clerks, get absolutely no respect, held liable for anything that the technicians do incorrectly, held responsible for profits/loses, deal with angry customers, and being told what to do by a store manager that probably has a high school education. Although according to you guys, we are not highly "educated" in medicine, we get paid for the other crap that we have to go through. Its the same reason why some nurses get paid more than medical technologists or even ph.d.'s. If pharmacists were to be paid much lower than what they are paid now, who would want to work at CVS and Walgreens?
Click to expand...


It seems there could be a couple levels of pharmacists. A retail pharmacist probably uses a much different and perhaps smaller skill set than a clinical or hospital pharmacist. I know some pharmacists are very integrated into the medical team compared to retail phamacists.

Perhaps like many commercial ODs (and to a much lesser degree some private) do little more than refract and refer out anything that doesn't end up 20/20. You dont need 8 years of school to do that.

Does a spin and grin OD use the same skill set as a full scope OD? Does a retail phamacist use the same skill set as a hospital pharmacist? I'll admit though, I'm still not sure what a retail phamacist does.

I know they recommend OTC meds to some people and answer questions that patients have. When I see them they are always messing with insurance crap and looking at the computer. I'm sure they do more, but like I said I'm not educated.

ODs thinking they are better than pharmacists is just as bad as MDs thinking they are better than DOs and ODs. We are all better than the others at certain things.
 
in the end, only lawyers and insurance wins.
 
IndianaOD said:
It seems there could be a couple levels of pharmacists. A retail pharmacist probably uses a much different and perhaps smaller skill set than a clinical or hospital pharmacist. I know some pharmacists are very integrated into the medical team compared to retail phamacists.

Perhaps like many commercial ODs (and to a much lesser degree some private) do little more than refract and refer out anything that doesn't end up 20/20. You dont need 8 years of school to do that.

Does a spin and grin OD use the same skill set as a full scope OD? Does a retail phamacist use the same skill set as a hospital pharmacist? I'll admit though, I'm still not sure what a retail phamacist does.

I know they recommend OTC meds to some people and answer questions that patients have. When I see them they are always messing with insurance crap and looking at the computer. I'm sure they do more, but like I said I'm not educated.

ODs thinking they are better than pharmacists is just as bad as MDs thinking they are better than DOs and ODs. We are all better than the others at certain things.
Click to expand...

Better?????????????????????????

Who said that ?
 
oh my gosh, a bunch of o.d thinking that they're all that. c'mon, you guys are not real doctors...get over yourself....I'm sick of filling prescriptions written by o.d because at least 7 out of 10 are written incorrectly...Please, let the diagnoses be done by an opthalmologist because you guys are not qualify to do them ok....
 
you are such a lier. OD's do not write Rx's wrong. total bull. We know how to write scripts. And since we are not real doctores, then why do we deal with so much primary care- refractions and CL's and people coming to see us for wanting to have their eyes examined?
If i don't trust an OD to have my eyes checked why are millions of Americans visiting optometrists every single day?
 
VA Hopeful Dr said:
Let's take this one step further - why don't you do a complete H&P and write for a systemic Rx (a diuretic or a TCA, let's say) and see how the attorney likes that one. Simple fact is everyone fills a different need in this whole health care nonsense. ODs know more about vision than anyone else, and that's that. Pharmacists know more about drugs than I am ever likely to learn, which is fine: that's their job. Conversely, in 3 years time I'll be able to do a full physical exam (with the obvious exception of eyes) better than either of you. Simply put, neither of you will be able to get away with doing a full physical and writing for a drug outside your area of training. Same way with me, until I'm trained to do this properly I also have no business trying. If everyone just sticks to what they are trained and licensed to do we'll be in a good place.
Click to expand...

The difference is that I'm not saying I know more about treating systemic disease than an MD.
 
JennyRx2007 said:
oh my gosh, a bunch of o.d thinking that they're all that. c'mon, you guys are not real doctors...get over yourself....I'm sick of filling prescriptions written by o.d because at least 7 out of 10 are written incorrectly...Please, let the diagnoses be done by an opthalmologist because you guys are not qualify to do them ok....
Click to expand...

Give me a break...:rolleyes:

Are there as many errors in our rxs as there are in your post? Maybe they should offer some grammar classes in pharmacy school.
 
:(

More limp playground insults being hurled about by two groups who have no clue what the other does on a daily basis. How pathetic.

SDN is supposed to be a resource for students in the field or people considering the field, not a virtual forum for the most immature and petulant to sling their mud like a bunch of second graders.

You should all be ashamed of yourselves, really.
 
More limp playground insults being hurled about by two groups who have no clue what the other does on a daily basis. How pathetic.
Click to expand...

yep
 
KHE said:
:(

More limp playground insults being hurled about by two groups who have no clue what the other does on a daily basis. How pathetic.

SDN is supposed to be a resource for students in the field or people considering the field, not a virtual forum for the most immature and petulant to sling their mud like a bunch of second graders.

You should all be ashamed of yourselves, really.
Click to expand...

Lighten up, KHE...just having a little harmless fun with the kids.
 
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