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Since there is so much negativity around pharmacy right now, do you guys think that in 10-15 yrs the job market will rebound?
Since there is so much negativity around pharmacy right now, do you guys think that in 10-15 yrs the job market will rebound?
Is there any hope of the new schools shutting down? And are they still opening at a rapid rate?Only if all these new schools shut down. Market demand is cyclical, but when you keep ramping up pumping out way too many grads, how do you expect it to rebound? Look at the law field.
Is there any hope of the new schools shutting down? And are they still opening at a rapid rate?
If I recall correctly, it took about 20 years for the pharmacist job market to cover from the saturation in the late 1970s. That's 20 years which you could be in a field that is in demand (i.e. software engineering, physician assistant, etc.) and have good job security and high pay instead of having to scrape by on multiple per-diem jobs. By the time you can reasonably expect the job market to recover, you may be in your 40s or 50s with little in assets and savings. Don't forget that much of what you earn will go toward the astronomical amount of debt you will incur with today's tuition rates.
lmao...there is an astronomical number of new pharmacy schools since then. We're heading the way of the the JD degree.
The job market is "normal". You fools who go to school, sit and spin on your thumb, and cruise through rotations get what you deserve. Pharmacy students worth a damn are getting job offers just like every other profession out there.
If I recall correctly, it took about 20 years for the pharmacist job market to cover from the saturation in the late 1970s. That's 20 years which you could be in a field that is in demand (i.e. software engineering, physician assistant, etc.) and have good job security and high pay instead of having to scrape by on multiple per-diem jobs. By the time you can reasonably expect the job market to recover, you may be in your 40s or 50s with little in assets and savings. Don't forget that much of what you earn will go toward the astronomical amount of debt you will incur with today's tuition rates.
You and software engineering lol. Microsoft is about to lay off 2,800 employees and probably will get the state to authorize thousands of H1B visas to bring more bodies from overseas to do the same job for half the price. This is the reason why software engineers are getting such crappy wages as of late.
You and software engineering lol. Microsoft is about to lay off 2,800 employees and probably will get the state to authorize thousands of H1B visas to bring more bodies from overseas to do the same job for half the price. This is the reason why software engineers are getting such crappy wages as of late.
The job market is "normal". You fools who go to school, sit and spin on your thumb, and cruise through rotations get what you deserve. Pharmacy students worth a damn are getting job offers just like every other profession out there.
I know plenty of kids that did all the right things in school, interned etc from my graduating class this year. Most got employment, sure, but mainly 30hr float. The market isn't as dead as people say on here, but it isn't great either.
umm microsoft is not the only company...every company needs engineering (whether its computer or software). I have friends who work for Goldmansachs with engineering degrees and they make bank. Pharmacy? You got your top 3 big chains (about to be 2) which is retail and your hospitals. These are the majority of your jobs. Any hiccups in reimbursements...which is happening alot now...and you're fuked.
Tell that to:
1) My peers who actually complain about getting bombarded with messages from recruiters left and right. This is something that we as pharmacists would kill for, especially for non-retail positions
2) Job hoppers who increase their compensation by a significant amount, sometimes double that of their last job
3) Coding bootcamp graduates who earn $70k+/year upon graduation
4) Recent CS graduates earning $100k+
5) Employees that get showered with perks, i.e. catered gourmet meals, on-site laundry services, employee shuttles, etc. Good luck getting your chain retail pharmacy to even give you a lunch break, let alone provide you a gourmet lunch or send a shuttle to drive you to a store that is 1 hour away where you'll be floating.
Thats like saying "I have friends who works for the NFL with a PharmD and they make bank." Microsoft isnt the only company that is outsourcing software engineers. Besides, Microsoft is the biggest software company on the planet. If Walgreens laid off 2800 pharmacists just to outsource work to foreigners...wouldn't you say that the job outlook for pharmacists are bad?
healthcare spending (and hence employment) is at its peak b/c of baby boomers. when the baby boomers sadly pass, a gap in spending will occur (and hence reduction in employment).. we are at saturation level right now. what that means in the stock market is that we are at "overbought" territory, and eventually it will decline from there. ...
healthcare spending (and hence employment) is at its peak b/c of baby boomers. when the baby boomers sadly pass, a gap in spending will occur (and hence reduction in employment).. we are at saturation level right now. what that means in the stock market is that we are at "overbought" territory, and eventually it will decline from there. ...
The job market is bad? Seems fine to me. The whole region's been hiring at a pretty rapid clip, all the good students/residents have been snapped up. Tons of open positions for experienced pharmacists.
I suppose the job market sucks if you're bottom quartile new grad, but....that's like every other industry out there.
Since when did people think that a PharmD entitles them to a job? ::rolls eyes::
There's a spectrum for IT programming. It's awesome in the early career, but I dare people to find old programmers outside the civil service or military applications, there aren't many. There's a reason, ageism is quite alive and well in IT, and about the time when you should be hitting your stride in your career (45-55), you get pink slipped as there is always a younger and hungrier group that comes in behind you like those bootcamp programmers and H1B slaves. Like engineering, for the rank and file programmer, it's getting harder and harder to sustain a career as the floor is flooding over with just good enough workers like right now.
'Programmer' also somewhat too broad, like the generalizations about medicine without the pay differentiation in specialty care. There's one other problem though, which is like pharmacy in the early 00s and tech in the 90s, IT has a bunch of VC money that is completely distorting the market right now. It's great when you're spending VC (venture capital) money, but I look to Oracle, Microsoft, Cisco, and IBM as the bellwethers since they are not VC money and they've hung around for long enough. A lot of the recruiters and the companies they work for are trying to go after proven talent and are willing to pay for it as it's not very easy to judge programmer quality outside of seeing their piecework (see Mythical Man Month for more details).
Why I say this is I went to class with a bunch of the late 90s early 00s tech washouts after VC failed the first time to sustain the bubble. Even for the great companies like Amazon, they got rid of a bunch of their staff during the downturn in the early 00s and hired cheaper younger people to replace them. Again, it was awesome when you're young, but it's no way to sustain a family. But when the VC or the economy turns, I expect this to be the 90s Part II, just with another generation. So, if you're into big markets and big risks for bigger rewards, IT is for you. For a solid, boring, and quiet career, choose healthcare as my washouts remarked (and it proved prescient). Even today's harder economy for pharmacists, it's not like the 1970s yet, but healthcare values increased experience over hungrier employees (except retail in the major MSA's right now).
Pharmacy is boring and reliable for a career. But that's not enough for most people, which I consider a shame. The 70s had the same problem but if you were willing to work at it, you could find quite stable employment even in the worst of times. It's just meant you had to move and had to accept starter jobs (particularly if you were from PA/NJ).
Now if you're cross-trained in both, you do write your ticket as my fellows found out. I certainly did well myself.
And the older among us who practiced in SoCal, Vegas, and AZ, remember when Safeway and Osco tried to import South African pharmacists because they could undercut the Americans and the Canadians? Boy, that was a hell of a lawsuit disaster for them, wasn't it? Importing pharmacists has been tried, it doesn't work for cultural considerations oddly enough (this may be an insult to the Canadians, but they blend in well enough that you wouldn't know most of the time, where the SA Afrikaners stood out like sore thumbs). Flooding the market works better.
"It will be cheap labor uber alles", period. It doesn't matter the politics; it is merely the ruthless economy and classical capitalism. You didn't want to be a subsistence farming serf in the age of Social Origins of Democracy and Dictatorship. You don't want to be in an obvious automation target profession in this age. It's better for the consumer this way.
And I'll throw something else out, how many healthcare workers do not get paid directly or indirectly through the federal government? I think you'd be disturbed at the answer if you really see how far CMS gets into the business.