Does having a family during medical school mean anything during EM residency application/interviews?

[DadBod]

As a medical student looking forward to residency I'm realizing how important all the "extra-curricular" activities are. There are research experiences, volunteering, leadership, etc. on top of grades, rank and STEP scores.
My question is this: does it mean anything to residency directors that I have a family during medical school?
I see it this way:
1. good grades/rank/STEP score
2. research
3. volunteering/leadership
4. social life
5. family life
You can choose 3/5 of the above, and the more kids you have the harder it becomes.
I see my classmates with 3 or 4 kids and they are working their a$$es off so they have time to spend with their family, but it makes it almost impossible to volunteer or do much research. They have great time management skills and work ethic, and it's amazing to see how they do so well.
I see my single classmates out there volunteering in clinics 4 nights a month and running clubs and interest groups while partying on the weekends. It seems like their medical school experience is vastly different-- its just a continuation of undergrad.
So, does having a family and kids carry any weight when applying to residency?

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[gutonc]

As a medical student looking forward to residency I'm realizing how important all the "extra-curricular" activities are. There are research experiences, volunteering, leadership, etc. on top of grades, rank and STEP scores.

You are realizing this incorrectly...or someone is doing a poor job of advising you. Research is nice. And in some specialties, a virtual requirement, but for EM, it seems to be much less important. Likewise ECs (for virtually all residencies). Do that stuff if you want to do it and it means something to you, not so you can check off a box on your ERAS app.

 

[DadBod]

You are realizing this incorrectly...or someone is doing a poor job of advising you. Research is nice. And in some specialties, a virtual requirement, but for EM, it seems to be much less important. Likewise ECs (for virtually all residencies). Do that stuff if you want to do it and it means something to you, not so you can check off a box on your ERAS app.

Oh definitely, I understand that. For EM, research isn't a big deal like it is for more competitive specialties, but my question still remains unanswered. In general, people with family have less time for other resume-building activities, and thats what I'm trying to get at. Having an answer to my question won't really change anything for my classmates or I, but it's something we all talk about.

 

[gutonc]

Oh definitely, I understand that. For EM, research isn't a big deal like it is for more competitive specialties, but my question still remains unanswered. In general, people with family have less time for other resume-building activities, and thats what I'm trying to get at. Having an answer to my question won't really change anything for my classmates or I, but it's something we all talk about.

Except that I did answer your question. You already know that people without kids have more time for that crap than people with kids generally do. There's no question there. You were asking whether it mattered or not. The answer is, not really.

 

[surely]

So, does having a family and kids carry any weight when applying to residency?

I don't think that any PD is going to explicitly give weight to or be particularly impressed by an applicant who was a successful student while raising kids. It's not going to give you a competitive edge. However, ECs are much less important than you seem to think they are, so that's reassuring in that you're unlikely to be at a major disadvantage because of your relative lack of ECs. Do a couple things that make you happy, and that's plenty. People way on the other end of the EC engagement spectrum might get some mileage out of it on the interview trail, especially if they do nationwide EM leadership stuff, but not everyone needs to aspired to such extreme involvement.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

I don't think that any PD is going to explicitly

Well time to weigh in... lol

Obviously, no one can officially even ask you about whether you have a family or discriminate against you about it on the interview trail, but it comes up all the time. You are free to bring it up, and many people with a family list it in their interests or during the interview when asked about what they are interested out of medicine. So it does come up all the time. I enjoy talking to people about their lives no matter what stage they are at. We don't discriminate against people with a family, and we don't rank people higher because they have a family. It's a non-factor to me, much in the same way as most extra-curricular stuff is a non-factor to me. Really, it's all about how YOU fit into our ED team and how you will be in terms of working and trainability. That's 99% of what I'm trying to figure out. That being said, being at a program in a smaller family friendly town where cost of living is low, we get a lot of applicants who either have families or are planning them, so from a program recruiting standpoint you certainly have to be accommodating and family friendly, because that's a decent number of your applicants.

 

[Angry Birds]

Oh definitely, I understand that. For EM, research isn't a big deal like it is for more competitive specialties, but my question still remains unanswered. In general, people with family have less time for other resume-building activities, and thats what I'm trying to get at. Having an answer to my question won't really change anything for my classmates or I, but it's something we all talk about.

So, a few things:

1) Right off the bat, I think you will rub people the wrong way with that verbiage (in bold above). EM is fairly competitive and getting more and more so, from what I understand. There isn't simply a correlation between competitiveness and weight given to research. EM, for example, gives a LOT of weight to SLOR (your letter of recommendation), probably more than many other very competitive specialties. This is because we are looking for specific qualities that have nothing to do with research abilities. Additionally, to some extent it has to do with the personality-type that goes into and thrives in EM.

2) Secondly, I don't think you can expect to be given an "edge" due to having family...not during the application process. However, once you are admitted to a program, those with kids are usually given more leeway than those without. I had a buddy with kids who was going through a nasty divorce during his residency, and from what I know, the program gave him some leeway during this difficult time. And yes, sometimes swaps were given more freely in one direction than another due to someone having kids to take care of and babysitter issues. But yeah, that's after admission, not before.

3) EM is a field where you have to plan ahead of time. You have lots of flexibility as to how you schedule your shifts (after residency), but once you're on the schedule, you are expected to show up and finding coverage is a big pain in the butt.

TL;DR: No, the fact you have kids and a family makes no difference in the admission process.

 

[TheComebacKid]

I see it this way:
1. good grades/rank/STEP score
2. research
3. volunteering/leadership
4. social life
5. family life

You're doing it wrong. Correct answer:

1. SLOE
2. Rock climbing experience
3. Craft beer expertise
4. Everything else.

To summarize: Get a killer SLOE. For everything else, prioritize whatever is important to you. Whether that's family, research, rock climbing, craft beer etc. Preferably prioritize rock climbing and craft beer if possible.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

1. SLOE
1.5. Video games
2. Rock climbing experience
3. Craft beer expertise
4. Everything else.

Fixed it for you

 

[Jlaw]

It doesn't make a difference. Its something to talk about, your interviewers will be interested, specially if they have kids, and they may ask about or bring up integrating your family into the move to city XYZ for residency. Once you get in some places definitely give preferential scheduling to those with family and may be less likely to pester you to do lectures and be on committees if the know you have a couple kids at home.

 

[Angry Birds]

I'll weigh in as someone who had 2 kids in medical school and now 2 more on the way in residency. Yes, I had to develop excellent time management skills and could not be as broadly involved in medical school as others. No, no one on the application trail thought it was impressive to make it through medical school with children. In fact, my impression was that the majority were concerned about an incoming resident with kids.

This.

 

[engineeredout]

2) Secondly, I don't think you can expect to be given an "edge" due to having family...not during the application process. However, once you are admitted to a program, those with kids are usually given more leeway than those without. I had a buddy with kids who was going through a nasty divorce during his residency, and from what I know, the program gave him some leeway during this difficult time. And yes, sometimes swaps were given more freely in one direction than another due to someone having kids to take care of and babysitter issues. But yeah, that's after admission, not before.

The thing about this, is do not go in with the expectation that everyone will work everything around you just because you have a child. Your co residents might be willing to help out when you really need it and that's fine, but there is nothing more obnoxious than the resident who believes they are entitled to have schedules changed, get excused from things, because they have a kid. Those of us without children have lives too - your decision to have them does not need to impact my life.

 

[Angry Birds]

The thing about this, is do not go in with the expectation that everyone will work everything around you just because you have a child. Your co residents might be willing to help out when you really need it and that's fine, but there is nothing more obnoxious than the resident who believes they are entitled to have schedules changed, get excused from things, because they have a kid. Those of us without children have lives too - your decision to have them does not need to impact my life.

I agree with you, but only to an extent. For the record, I don't have kids. But, I don't subscribe to the "you decided to have kids, so now deal with it" philosophy. Whereas I 100% agree with you that you should never go into a residency thinking people will work around you just because you have kids, at the same time I think that people without kids should be understanding towards those who do. This is especially true since for many people residency is a time when they--or their spouse--is/are in the biological window for having kids (and nearing the end of that window).

As a resident without kids, I was already stressed out enough with residency and how brutal the schedule is. To take on someone else's burden on top of this would seem backbreaking and unfair. On the other hand, I can only imagine what it would be like with kids and other such responsibilities. So, all in all, I think it's a balancing game. Perhaps it can be balanced by the program being understanding of those who have kids, and not necessarily dolling out extra work to the rest of the residents to compensate.

P.S. I'm also a man, and maybe you are too, EngineeredOut. I think the "you had kids, your choice" philosophy is especially problematic because it targets women, who are expected to have kids, or may want to have kids, and who see their biological window closing during residency... We had a pregnant resident. It sucked for the rest of us. But, that's life. We have to propagate our species, right?

 

[boomshaketheroom]

You're doing it wrong. Correct answer:

1. SLOE
2. Rock climbing experience
3. Craft beer expertise
4. Everything else.

To summarize: Get a killer SLOE. For everything else, prioritize whatever is important to you. Whether that's family, research, rock climbing, craft beer etc. Preferably prioritize rock climbing and craft beer if possible.

The rock climbing thing was so crazy to me. I mean there's craft beer everywhere now, but I've never been around so many rock climbing enthusiasts in my life.

 

[theSmurfette]

I guess I had a very different experience on the interview trail. I am female, I also have 3 kids. The youngest was born 2 weeks into MS1, he was born on a Tuesday, I was back at school for a mandatory lab Friday.

I never asked for special treatment. I was the one who had kids, not my classmates. So when kids were sick, my husband stayed home. That played through my residency PS. I didn’t want to play the “mom” card so there was no mention of it in my PS. It WAS mentioned in my dean’s letter as well as my home SLOE (I think). I think one of them acknowledged that I never played the family card (something to the effect that I didn’t give myself enough credit).

I brought my kids up in every interview. They are large part of who I am. I was very blunt in asking about the school system. A program in a poor school district is really not an option. It was my choice to go to med school; they shouldn’t have to suffer because of MY choices.

Most interviewers seemed impressed, mainly I couldn’t have done it in med school. Some asked how I will adjust/how I did it. I don’t know any difference. I came to school with kids (my older 2 are in upper elementary/middle school).
When asked about extracurriculars/research, I told them I made the choice to go home and be a mom over those things. I never got the impression they viewed that opinion in a negative view. I guess I’ll see how they really felt when Match comes in a few weeks. ‍♀️


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