Does this seem like a smart application choice

[woltej1]

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So after going through the MSAR and looking at the colleges I might stand a chance at(which are either my in state public or OOS private as my MCAT is good at a 33 but my GPA at 3.6 is on the low end of most schools accepted list so going OOS public puts me at a massive disadvantage) I really think I'd just rather just apply to only my instate MD and then apply to DO for "safety nets".
My reasoning is that I think I stand a good chance at my instates. I got an interview at U of Minn Duluth with a 27MCAT last time I applied and got waitlisted. Now I've upped my MCAT a lot while also adding a lot of scribing experience under internal medicine which I didn't have before(Duluth focuses on primary care). Also, there just aren't schools I feel like I'd be a good match for in areas that I'd want to live. I was looking west but finding a lot of New York/PA schools that seemed like good fits. There are more DO schools in areas I'd want to live and obviously my stats are stronger for DO.

My main concern is come match time, does simply having gone DO put you at any disadvantage? I know there are specific DO match spots and etc, but overall does DO make you a weaker applicant.

 

[Oso]

So I kind of just skimmed your post because I have to go soon, but I think a 3.6/33 + solid EC's will be fine for several mid to low-tier MD private schools (ex. Loyola, SLU, Drexel, MCW). So apply to your state school, but also apply to other MD schools. I wouldn't apply to many OOS public schools.

Also, idk much about DO, but I think many of them require DO shadowing and perhaps a letter of rec from a DO. So idk how much of a 'safety' it would be, even if with your stats.

So take another look at the MSAR and examine the accepted range of GPA's (not just median), because I doubt the low end is 3.6 for most schools. Good luck.

 

[Goro]

No and no.

You can ask my students who have gone to residencies in ophthalmology, orthopedics, anaesthesiology, neurology, and radiology, among others. I'd list some of the places they've gone but I'm afraid it's revealing too much info. Let's just say residencies associated with 20 med schools. And spare me the "DO's can't practice overseas" bleat, how many of you are going to go practice in Bangladesh? The devleoped countries recognize the DO degree.

OP, your numbers are fine for many for the low-tier and new MD programs too.


My main concern is come match time, does simply having gone DO put you at any disadvantage? I know there are specific DO match spots and etc, but overall does DO make you a weaker applicant.[/QUOTE]

 

[gettheleadout]

No and no.

You can ask my students who have gone to residencies in ophthalmology, orthopedics, anaesthesiology, neurology, and radiology, among others. I'd list some of the places they've gone but I'm afraid it's revealing too much info. Let's just say residencies associated with 20 med schools. And spare me the "DO's can't practice overseas" bleat, how many of you are going to go practice in Bangladesh? The devleoped countries recognize the DO degree.

You understand that this doesn't say anything about whether these applicants were disadvantaged by their DO background or not, right? The fact that some DO graduates successfully pursue competitive fields says nothing about the issue when it's presented out of context.

 

[About28]

I think your stats are competitive for mid-tier schools as well. I would write them off so quickly

 

[Goro]

If they were disadvantaged by the DO backgrounds, would they have made it into such competitive residencies?

The days of "DOs only do Family Practice" are ending, and it's time to end the misinformation.

You understand that this doesn't say anything about whether these applicants were disadvantaged by their DO background or not, right? The fact that some DO graduates successfully pursue competitive fields says nothing about the issue when it's presented out of context.

 

[Ace-Co-A]

If they were disadvantaged by the DO backgrounds, would they have made it into such competitive residencies?

The days of "DOs only do Family Practice" are ending, and it's time to end the misinformation.

GTLO gets #Goroed.

Finally I get to say that.

 

[gettheleadout]

If they were disadvantaged by the DO backgrounds, would they have made it into such competitive residencies?

The days of "DOs only do Family Practice" are ending, and it's time to end the misinformation.

Quite possibly, in fact! Making a statement about disadvantage as a result of a DO education and degree alone requires, for example, a comparison between peer groups of similar qualification apart from their MD or DO educational background, or a comparison between groups of DO graduates and MD graduates, stratified by various residency selection criteria (grades, scores, pubs, etc.), because the case could very well be that 1) residency programs in competitive programs preferably rank MD applicants over DO applicants despite equal qualifications or 2) a greater percentage of qualified MD graduates successfully match into competitive residency fields than similarly qualified DO residents.

Further, not only do we not know the context in which these students of yours have matched in competitive fields (e.g. as implied above, is only every 1 out of 10 qualified DO grads from your school that applies to ortho programs actually matching?), we do not know the context of these students' success in their own individual cases! How often do your students match to their top programs? And as a necessary offshoot of that, do DO students differently select programs to apply to compared to MD students of similar qualifications when interests and goals are controlled for? (e.g. what if DO students interested in academic medicine self-select to apply to less competitive academic residency programs than similarly qualified MD students?) The answer to this question is important in the context of evaluating the answer to the previous one. Are DO students receiving a lower proportion of interviews from competitive residency programs to which they applied relative to equally qualified MD students? What if the cases in which your students matched were unusual?

Bear in mind that while I have certain expectations and beliefs about this issue, I am not asserting evidence demonstrating a disadvantage to DO graduates in the match. What I am asserting is that your experience is absolutely not evidence to the contrary, and I believe that is quite clear upon critical consideration.

 

[type12]

Bravo gettheleadout! I'm glad people aren't scared to voice truths here. The reality and the idea are not one in the same.

 

[Ace-Co-A]

Quite possibly, in fact! Making a statement about disadvantage as a result of a DO education and degree alone requires, for example, a comparison between peer groups of similar qualification apart from their MD or DO educational background, or a comparison between groups of DO graduates and MD graduates, stratified by various residency selection criteria (grades, scores, pubs, etc.), because the case could very well be that 1) residency programs in competitive programs preferably rank MD applicants over DO applicants despite equal qualifications or 2) a greater percentage of qualified MD graduates successfully match into competitive residency fields than similarly qualified DO residents.

Further, not only do we not know the context in which these students of yours have matched in competitive fields (e.g. as implied above, is only every 1 out of 10 qualified DO grads from your school that applies to ortho programs actually matching?), we do not know the context of these students' success in their own individual cases! How often do your students match to their top programs? And as a necessary offshoot of that, do DO students differently select programs to apply to compared to MD students of similar qualifications when interests and goals are controlled for? (e.g. what if DO students interested in academic medicine self-select to apply to less competitive academic residency programs than similarly qualified MD students?) The answer to this question is important in the context of evaluating the answer to the previous one. Are DO students receiving a lower proportion of interviews from competitive residency programs to which they applied relative to equally qualified MD students? What if the cases in which your students matched were unusual?

Bear in mind that while I have certain expectations and beliefs about this issue, I am not asserting evidence demonstrating a disadvantage to DO graduates in the match. What I am asserting is that your experience is absolutely not evidence to the contrary, and I believe that is quite clear upon critical consideration.

If they were disadvantaged by the DO backgrounds, would they have made it into such competitive residencies?

The days of "DOs only do Family Practice" are ending, and it's time to end the misinformation.

@gettheleadout I agree with your argument as you've presented it, but I think the two of you are talking past each other.

I think @Goro is saying that having a DO won't won't disqualify them from competitive residencies. Goro's use of ''disadvantaged by" as opposed to "disqualified from" is distracting from what I think he intends to do (i.e., to downplay the stigma attached to the DO degree). The second sentence ("The days of "DOs only do Family Practice" are ending, and it's time to end the misinformation.") makes his intention of addressing the stigma associated with the DO degree clearer. It seems to me that his two sentence reply was not intended to be a rigorous demonstration of the DO degree's comparability to the MD degree in the residency matching process.

Then again, maybe I shouldn't speak for @Goro ...