DO's matching Anesthesia?????.....

doc3341

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    Hi, I was just wondering if anyone had any input on the difficulty level fo DO's matching in Anesthesia??? Does anyone know about the UM Jackson memorial Program in Miami?? Are they Do unfriendly? Thanks!
     

    ecf1975do

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      As a 4th yr DO student who recently matched in anesthesiology and interviewed at many programs in the north east , including some "top programs" I can honestly tell you that the door is closing to the top programs for DOs. I think it all has to do with swigns in the job market, etc, just look at gas and radiology . In the mid 90's you could walk into any program , now for radiology , forget it. I interviewed at u of chicago where there are some DOs there. This year they took 1 and i know of a handful that were there with me on interview day. I was at Beth Isreal Deaconess with another DO interviewing. 2 of the chiefs there now are DOs. How many did they take this year? zero. just my point, aim high but dont have too high expectations. with the current interest in anesthesia i wouldnt expect this trend to change. dont get me wrong, there were some Dos that got into top programs this years match, but they are FAR and Few between compared to recent years. PM me if you have any questions or want to know where else i interviewed. I also feel an interview doesnt mean **** when everyone is ranking the top programs their #1.
      just my 2 cents..
       

      pakijiga

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        that may not be entirely true... from nycom i know that 2 years ago there were 20+ anesthesia matches (3 at harvard), last year we had almost 30 (at yale, CCF and a good handful of top names)
        this year we have so far 17 anes matches (only MD so far) the entire list isnt complete. this year we had 8 at beth isreal, hopkins, temple.

        personally i feel that anes is very D.O. friendly..
         
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        VentdependenT

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          30 matches...wow. Gas is big at DO schools I guess.

          EDIT: Out of a class of 300 that isn't too crazy. Yes gas was harder to match at highly competitive places for DO's this year....pretty common amongst all specialties for DO's, especially when they become in demand. Glad I matched at Rush. However I seriously thought I was in at NW. Don't matter to me. You get worked like a mule, live in Chicago, and come out strong at either place. Sort of shocked by IOWA even there were only 5 spots for advanced. Great program but I figured that nobody would want to live in that "city." Myself included. Its all gotta be part of some master plan.

          For DO's applying, as I previously stated, seriously reconsider matching through DO for intern TY year if you really want to match at your top program. By "prematching" for DO intern year you remove yourself from 1/2-2/3rds of available positions. I can honestly say things worked out for the best, but I would hate for some of you future doc's to smoke yourself out of going to your top picks.

          Vent
           

          ecf1975do

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            sorry dude but your info is wrong. i interviewed at beth israel in boston this year. they took ZERO DO's. this is a trend that is not likely to change there in the near future, according to one of the chief residents who I know. you also have to put things into perspective. NYCOM is probably the biggest money hungry DO school. how do you explain a class size of over 300?? that is rediculous. it seems to be getting bigger every year. yes you are right about the list being good 2 years ago, but a big difference with this years match and the increase in interest and strength of allo students. I met at least 10 different NYCOM students interviewing for gas. no one knew anyone. according to that list, and I dont knwo if its final but there were 17 matches total. I know a NYCOM student who I interviewed with... he said quite a few went unmatched...

            PM if you havge any questions
             

            thegasman

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              The trend in gas programs is going toward having an integrated intern year, usually transitional in nature. I've hear rumors that in the future this will be a acgme requirement. Where I matched the intern year stresses medicine, surgery, and icu. Most of the programs where I interviewed have both, ie advanced and categorical spots. For example a program might offer 15 spots, 10 starting pg1 and the other 5 in pg2 after doing a separate internship. Someone earlier asked why anesthesia is getting more competitive for do's. Well, the answer is obvious. Anesthesia is more competitive for everyone. More people are interested now than have been for quite some time. DO's and IMG's are at more of a disadvantage now because in general, they are less attractive to programs than US MD grads. This means DO's who want to do gas must either be stellar applicants (w/ USMLE to rival MD grads or away rotation) or consider a wide variety of programs. See this year's unmatched programs. There were a lot of available spots, some at quality programs. But there were also quality applicants unmatched. Gas is still possible for pretty much anybody out there. But no one should take anything for granted.
               

              JP2005

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                what does "this year we had 8 at beth isreal, hopkins, temple. " mean?

                we def DID NOT match any at BID this year......i am not sure where paki got his info from.......

                1 to hopkins......i think 1 to temple....1 to stony.....1 to strong memorial (maybe 2..i can be wrong).........seemed like the rest went to montefiore....... ( i think almost 7 or 8)....... or elsewhere......

                (sorry i do not have the list out in front of me)
                 

                pakijiga

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                  jay ur rite, my mistake i meant to write "einstein" but wrote beth isreal..

                  anyway here is a "cut and paste" from our gas match list
                  Anesthesia:
                  Albert Einstein, NYC (6)
                  Johns Hopkins- Baltimore, MD
                  St Lukes Roosevelt/University Hospital of Columbia University - NYC (2)
                  University of Rochester/ Strong Memorial, Rochester NY
                  SUNY Brooklyn- NYC (2)
                  University Hospital- Jackson, MS
                  Westchester Medical Center (2)
                  Stony Brook University Hospital, NY
                  University of Maryland
                  Temple

                  i was lookin at IM and saw 8 matching at beth isreal

                  i wouldnt say that the door is closed for top notched programs.. its a matter of how much you want it.. the only way the door is completely shut is if you dont make an effort to open it yourself.
                   
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                    Originally posted by sethco
                    Vent,

                    Do you know where your fellow graduates went for Anesthesia? I like the last posting by pakijiga. Does anybody else have any info about where their fellow DO grads went for Anesthesia?

                    Seth

                    Indiana U, Mizzou, UColorado, UArizona X2, Yale, Baystate, Cleveland Clinic, UT Galviston. A total of 11. One matched at an osteopathic program in Grandview Ohio. I have no idea what it is about. Congrats to those who matched.
                     

                    Arch Guillotti

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                      Obviously it is harder for DO's to match, simply because of the level of interest rising in anesthesia lately. However if you are a decent applicant and apply to a wide range of programs, chances are that you will match. At least 4 programs on my ROL had unmatched spot(s). I would have been glad to go to any of these places. I do think that the hype is a little much. Just do what everyone on this board says - make good grades, TAKE THE USMLE, do away rotations and act interested and don't be a tool, get good letters, etc. You might get some interviews at places that surprise you. You might also not get some interviews that you might expect. In a lot of ways it is one great big crap shoot for those of us mere mortals that are not AOA with 250+ board scores and tons of research.

                      You may match at a great program.

                      I did.
                       

                      lh2004

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                        PCOM (Philadelphia) had students match in Anesthesia at Univ. of Pennsylvania (2), Thomas Jefferson (2), Univ. of Maryland, Wake Forest, Penn State/Hershey (2), Mercy Hospital of Pittsburgh.
                         

                        lh2004

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                          PCOM (Philadelphia) had students match in Anesthesia at Univ. of Pennsylvania (2), Thomas Jefferson (2), Univ. of Maryland, Wake Forest, Penn State/Hershey (2), Mercy Hospital of Pittsburgh.
                           

                          BigSkyDreams

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                            Howdy,

                            Here are some of the places that folks match at this year, 2004, for anesthesia from KCOM:

                            Johns Hopkins
                            Chapel Hill
                            Des Peres Hospital, St Louis (Osteo)
                            Oklahoma University
                            Riverside County Regional Medical Center (Osteo)
                            University of Florida
                            NE Regional Medical Center, Kirksville (Osteo)
                            Nassau University Medical Center

                            Class size is approx 150.
                             
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                            snowman8

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                              Hey Molly, better watch out w/ those DO comments, esp in Anesthesia b/c if you are going into the field they will be you're colleagues. Besides, if these "ivy league" schools are taking DO's, they must be just as qualified, ya think!
                               
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                              Brachial_Plexus

                                Originally posted by Molly Maquire
                                Hey,

                                What's the deal with Yale? For an ivy league school, it seems like they take a lot of DOs. How many DOs are in their program overall?

                                The simple answer is that they are interested in attracting the highest caliber residents, which they obviously did.

                                Peace
                                 

                                OldManDave

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                                  BigSkyDreams said:
                                  Howdy,

                                  Here are some of the places that folks match at this year, 2004, for anesthesia from KCOM:

                                  Johns Hopkins
                                  Chapel Hill
                                  Des Peres Hospital, St Louis (Osteo)
                                  Oklahoma University
                                  Riverside County Regional Medical Center (Osteo)
                                  University of Florida
                                  NE Regional Medical Center, Kirksville (Osteo)
                                  Nassau University Medical Center

                                  Class size is approx 150.



                                  How many from KCOM matched gas? Where did Sweaty Paul end up?
                                   

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                                    Molly Maquire said:
                                    Hey,

                                    What's the deal with Yale? For an ivy league school, it seems like they take a lot of DOs. How many DOs are in their program overall?

                                    Molly,

                                    Can't really speak to specifics, but I sorta know one of the Admin Docs there - Roberta Hines (don't recall if she is the Chair or the PD) - but she is a very sharp lady!!! As I understnad it, she is working to rebuild a once very strong gas program there at Yale. And, knowing her, in an effort to succeed at this, she is taking the strongest folks she can attract w/o consideration to their degree.

                                    I did not even apply to Yale due to the rumor mill. Having worked with Roberta now, I can see that was a mistake to merely accept the rumors & not investigate on my own. However, I landed a slot at my #1 & would not trade it for love nor $$.

                                    Dartmouth is the $hit!
                                     

                                    Intubater_X

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                                      I graduated from KCOM, did my residency at Rush have a job where I STARTED at $300k! I am very personable, a hard worker, and proud of my osteopathic education. When you ask how D.O.s did in the match, the answer is: very well indeed!

                                      Remember, kids..........Life is good to those who excel.


                                      Peace, love, and happiness :love:
                                       
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                                      Aloha Kid

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                                        Does anyone know how the DO training at Riverside, California is. Really not much information. Is it a linked internship and residency. Are things stable there? What's the teaching like? :confused:

                                        Thanks
                                         

                                        timtye78

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                                          For the "newbie"

                                          University of Oklahoma College of Medicine (allopathic/dual accredited) matched FOUR of their SIX new categorical interns as DOs!

                                          2 from TCOM-UNTHSC
                                          1-OSU COM
                                          1-KCOM

                                          As a side note, by the numbers, I did not consider myself a "stellar" applicant. Excellent clinical grades, AWESOME LORs, big number of places applied to, etc. Email me for any further questions.

                                          Yes Anesthesiology is competitive, but not unreachable. I would encourage any DO (or MD for that matter) who likes anesthesiology to:
                                          1. Do rotations where you think you want to go
                                          2. Take the USMLE Step 1 at least-I took it as a fourth year, and had no problem with a little review of basic science
                                          3. Apply to many programs-I personally applied to 35 programs
                                          4. Go to every interview

                                          This advice was given to me by multiple gas residents, and it worked for me!
                                          My two cents!
                                           

                                          InductionAgent

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                                            timtye78 said:
                                            For the "newbie"

                                            University of Oklahoma College of Medicine (allopathic/dual accredited) matched FOUR of their SIX new categorical interns as DOs!

                                            2 from TCOM-UNTHSC
                                            1-OSU COM
                                            1-KCOM

                                            As a side note, by the numbers, I did not consider myself a "stellar" applicant. Excellent clinical grades, AWESOME LORs, big number of places applied to, etc. Email me for any further questions.

                                            Yes Anesthesiology is competitive, but not unreachable. I would encourage any DO (or MD for that matter) who likes anesthesiology to:
                                            1. Do rotations where you think you want to go
                                            2. Take the USMLE Step 1 at least-I took it as a fourth year, and had no problem with a little review of basic science
                                            3. Apply to many programs-I personally applied to 35 programs
                                            4. Go to every interview

                                            This advice was given to me by multiple gas residents, and it worked for me!
                                            My two cents!

                                            Tim,

                                            I've been kind of curious about this:

                                            Why is University of Oklahoma's gas program on probation, and what honestly are its long-term prospects? I heard good things about the PD, Dr. Fitch, from her old stomping grounds at U-Wash. From what they said, she took over after OU was already on probation.
                                             

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                                              SB said:
                                              @ Western we had several matches in gas this year including: UPenn, USC (4), UCI (2), UCDavis, WashU, Baystate, Riverside County (Osteo) and a few others I cannot remember off the top of my head!

                                              I believe that the others from Western were University of Mississippi, University of Massachusetts, Boston University, and Medical College of Georgia.
                                               

                                              timtye78

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                                                InductionAgent said:
                                                Tim,

                                                I've been kind of curious about this:

                                                Why is University of Oklahoma's gas program on probation, and what honestly are its long-term prospects? I heard good things about the PD, Dr. Fitch, from her old stomping grounds at U-Wash. From what they said, she took over after OU was already on probation.

                                                No problem.
                                                When I interviewed there, this was certainly a topic of discussion. I do not have a list of all specifics, but I do know of some.
                                                First, the critical care specialist(s) needs to be anesthesiology CCM vs a surgery CCM specialist. Secondly, there was a problem in research area. This has been corrected by adding I believe 2-3 MD/PhDs for FT research and I think two RN assistants. These are the only deficiencies I know and according to the dept, these have been corrected. Also, I do believe the next inspection has been done, yet the report/decision is still pending.

                                                The overall message we recieved is 1)probation status was for easily-correctable deficiencies 2)OU "has plenty of funding" and determination to fix what was wrong; and seriously do not want to lose their program 3) Dr Fitch has a reputation for being a person who comes in and "cleans up" programs and who is nationally known 4) as soon as they get the "clean bill of health," they plan on expanding the program from 6 interns per year to 10-15 "we can definitely handle more manpower." 5) Dr. Fitch assures us she is absolutely confident the status will be lifted most likely this fall, probably during interview season.

                                                Conclusion, none of the residents are worried about this.In fact, we are anticipating more and more interns each year. OU is confident that this will be lifted. The intern year at Baptist Medical Center has been critically acclaimed by the inspectors "as one of the best intern years in the nation."
                                                They are increasing and expanding didactics, they are hiring more and more staff/faculty and CRNAs. OU Medical Center is huge, and the anesthsiology dept is spread thin all over campus-they need more people, let alone keep their gas program!
                                                I would be happy to answer any other questions you or anyone else has.
                                                Tim
                                                 

                                                smaroof

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                                                  How do you guys think your background in Osteopathic Med has helped you in Anesthesiology? Do you feel you may have some advantage over MD's from the holistic point of view?

                                                  (I'm just curious as I am applying to DO med schools and am interested in Anesth.)
                                                   

                                                  pescaDr

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                                                    OldManDave said:
                                                    How many from KCOM matched gas? Where did Sweaty Paul end up?

                                                    OldManDave---

                                                    Quick question...did you take the USMLE. Just curious to know if all the MD programs want scores or will they like at COMLEX equally? Thanks.

                                                    pescaDr
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                                                    pescaDr

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                                                      smaroof said:
                                                      How do you guys think your background in Osteopathic Med has helped you in Anesthesiology? Do you feel you may have some advantage over MD's from the holistic point of view?

                                                      (I'm just curious as I am applying to DO med schools and am interested in Anesth.)

                                                      I have to respectfully disagree with the VentdependanT DO who didn't feel that his osteopathic training was of much use...granted, you probably are not going to be using the manipulative techniques on your patients all to often..(if ever in anesthesia) but there is much more encomapssed within the training than just hundreds of hours of hands on care.

                                                      I have to say that I learned to approach every patient as a whole person whether I was in Surg clinic, IM wards or ICU as an intern...and I don't mean doing exhaustive H&P's, I just approached (and still do) every patient by taking into account their mind, body and spirit...you'd be amazed at how many people appreciate this approach. Taking an extra minute or two to assess beyond the body is critical...your patient's truly appreciate it and this is what makes medicine truly rewarding.

                                                      any way, I don't start anesthesia until June, but my intern year and 3 years as a generalist Flight Surgeon in the Navy have been tremendous. Clinically, in comparison to my allopathic counterparts, I'd have to say that I am every bit as able...and they refer to me for OMT. So, from my humble perspective osteopathic medicine is where it's at...we are just simply a minority, but we shouldn't feel less adept.

                                                      pescaDr
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                                                      CaliGirlDO

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                                                        Molly Maquire said:
                                                        Hey,

                                                        What's the deal with Yale? For an ivy league school, it seems like they take a lot of DOs. How many DOs are in their program overall?

                                                        It probably is progressively getting harder each year for DO's to rank at top 10 programs because more MD's seem to be applying this year. The applicant pool is growing. Programs that in the past took DO's just to fill spots with a US grad rather than an FMG will now show their true colors in regards to discrimination against DO's. The question is does that program REALLY believe that a DO is equally as good as an MD with the same qualifications?

                                                        Yale does consistently take DO's each year. They usually have 2-3 in each class (out of 18-20 residents per class), regardless of the degree of competition for spots that particular year. It's an overall institutional philosophy to embrace diversity. I really am very happy I'm here because I have never once been treated differently because I'm a DO and there are no subtle undertones every made in reference to DO's. I believe Yale is historically a program that will not overlook good DO candidates when the applicant pool gets more competitive.

                                                        There are programs out there that will barely read the rest of your application once they read you're a DO. The other caveat....hard to find good data on which programs are DO friendly and not. So my advice, apply to a wide range of programs. Go on as many interviews as possible and rank them. Better to match somewhere mediocre than to scramble into whatever might be left later. Even mediocre programs produce competent anesthesiologists.
                                                         

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                                                          CaliGirlDO said:
                                                          It probably is progressively getting harder each year for DO's to rank at top 10 programs because more MD's seem to be applying this year. The applicant pool is growing. Programs that in the past took DO's just to fill spots with a US grad rather than an FMG will now show their true colors in regards to discrimination against DO's. The question is does that program REALLY believe that a DO is equally as good as an MD with the same qualifications?

                                                          Yale does consistently take DO's each year. They usually have 2-3 in each class (out of 18-20 residents per class), regardless of the degree of competition for spots that particular year. It's an overall institutional philosophy to embrace diversity. I really am very happy I'm here because I have never once been treated differently because I'm a DO and there are no subtle undertones every made in reference to DO's. I believe Yale is historically a program that will not overlook good DO candidates when the applicant pool gets more competitive.

                                                          There are programs out there that will barely read the rest of your application once they read you're a DO. The other caveat....hard to find good data on which programs are DO friendly and not. So my advice, apply to a wide range of programs. Go on as many interviews as possible and rank them. Better to match somewhere mediocre than to scramble into whatever might be left later. Even mediocre programs produce competent anesthesiologists.

                                                          Does my school name make different when I am applying to residency?
                                                           

                                                          DreamJob

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                                                            How important is it to rotate at the hospital before applying for a residency spot?

                                                            I am a second year who is attempting to schedule some 3rd year rotations. I find most of the hospitals don't allow 3rd years, especially for anesthesiology. Any suggestions on where to call? or what to do?
                                                             

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                                                              smaroof said:
                                                              How do you guys think your background in Osteopathic Med has helped you in Anesthesiology? Do you feel you may have some advantage over MD's from the holistic point of view?

                                                              (I'm just curious as I am applying to DO med schools and am interested in Anesth.)

                                                              I actually used OMT today on one of the nurses who had back spasms.
                                                               

                                                              smgilles

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                                                                DreamJob said:
                                                                How important is it to rotate at the hospital before applying for a residency spot?

                                                                I am a second year who is attempting to schedule some 3rd year rotations. I find most of the hospitals don't allow 3rd years, especially for anesthesiology. Any suggestions on where to call? or what to do?


                                                                I am rotating at Cleveland Clinic as a 3rd year. You just have to have all the core rotations finished (IM, surgery, OB, Peds, etc).
                                                                 

                                                                Sugar72

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                                                                  DreamJob said:
                                                                  How important is it to rotate at the hospital before applying for a residency spot?

                                                                  I am a second year who is attempting to schedule some 3rd year rotations. I find most of the hospitals don't allow 3rd years, especially for anesthesiology. Any suggestions on where to call? or what to do?

                                                                  Most people do their audition rotations at the very beginning of their 4th year - so don't stress out about getting it done in your 3rd year. You will know a little more your 4th year and will be able to impress them with your medical chops!
                                                                   

                                                                  DreamJob

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                                                                    smgilles said:
                                                                    I am rotating at Cleveland Clinic as a 3rd year. You just have to have all the core rotations finished (IM, surgery, OB, Peds, etc).


                                                                    Everything I had read about Cleveland Clinic says you must be in your fourth year? Did they make an exception for you? If you have a number I should call, I would appreciate it (private message).
                                                                     
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