VentdependenT said:
Can you elaborate?
Thanks!
DO's matching Anesthesia?????.....
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Can you elaborate?
Thanks!
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by going for osteo TY's you dump the possiblity of matching to categorical positions which typically are anywhere from 1/4 to 2/3 of match spots at yer allo training institution.
VentdependenT said:
So I shouldn't look at my TY as a bad thing then? In theory it would make me a good candidate? Would I still be required to do another year of internship before string my 3 of anesthesia?
Thanks again
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doc3341 said:
no.
but if you are applying for anesthesiology spots through the allopathic match during your intern year then you will have to sit on your butt (if you'd like) for 365 days. Why you ask. Example:
Osteo TY: 2006-2007
allo match for advanced spots in 2007: match for 2008 as a CA-1
Vent
brisk80 said:
Im just trying to figure out how it all works after you graduate an osteopathic school and try to match an allopathic or osteopathic anesthesiology residency. Im just not quite sure how the transitional year plays a role in all of this. Does it count as my 1st internship year and can I then just do my last 3 of gas...or do I have do do another year of internship through the anesthesiolopgy program before doing my last 3 of anesthesiology???
thanks
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doc3341 said:
I just went through the same scenario this year during the match process, however I am only going through the Allopathic Gas route. As Vent mentioned previously a lot of anesthesiology positions are categorical and this number should be increasing over the coming years as this appears to be the future trend for anesthesiology programs. Whether or not your internship year through an osteopathic match will count towards your PGY1 is dependent on the Anesthesiology program and the state in which you reside. There are currently 5 states that require an AOA approved internship year in order to obtain a medical license and thus you will not be able to match into an anesthesiology program in one of these states if you do not obtain AOA approval for your internship year. In the past "hardships" have been granted but recently getting approval has been more difficult. Also, the anesthesiology programs themselves, although few, may only accept an ACGME approved internship year. I came across this on my interview trail where the PD made certain to tell me they will not accept an AOA approved internship year. Programs that are categorical in one of the 5 states that require AOA approval must be dually accredited for at least your first year of training in order to get licensed. My solution to all of this non-sense was to match at an AOA and ACGME approved, dually accredited, transitional year program however I had to withdrawl from the available categorical spots because of taking the osteopathic internship match. Just to give you an idea; out of 13 interviews this season ~40 of ~120 spots I was interviewing for were categorical. Since I do not know where I will be living in the future and it may be in one of those five states I only applied dually approved internship programs. If you never plan on residing in one of these states you can skip the AOA completely and find an internship year in the allopathic match.
I am not sure if this is more confusing or if it helps. Nothing with the AOA is straight forward.
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What if you intend on moving back to one of the five states after residency in another state? I would really like to get a allopathic categorical position, or at least apply since that will greatly increase my chances of getting a spot. Is it very hard to get the first year of a allopathic categorical appoved as an AOA approved internship, assuming it is at a larger university program? I would really hate to not be able to move back when Im done.
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joshua_msu said:
You will not get a license to practice medicine (anesthesiology) in the state you move back to if that state requires an approved AOA internship. I would suggest you call or e-mail the AOA first because you do not want to annoy the University and if that does not help try getting some advice from the residency program. Usually residents in the past have gone through similar situations so the departments secretary will have some knowledge on the issue. Worst case scenario, no approval from the AOA for your PGY1 year and you decide to move into one of these states, you can do an osteopathic internship as a PGY5. I have heard of this happening to some misfortunate souls. But like you said if matching a categorical greatly increases your chances for anesthesia then you may have to sacrifice a year or just don't practice in one of those states.
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Wow! I was under the impression that advanced programs only didn't really care that much what or where your pgy1 year was. In the past people have done TY, traditional rotating (DO), surgery, medicine, even family practice. I know I didn't interview there - just wondering if you would mind saying which program that was.brisk80 said:
To the OP - looks like you are from michigan - if you want to stay there to train and practice you have to get an advanced spot outside the match and do an AOA approved internship. In the other 4 states you are allowed to complete your training without the prior approval of your intern year, but you can't practice in those states until you get your intern year approved. In Michigan you can't even FINISH your training until your intern year is approved.
I am not doing an AOA intern year. I will try to make sure I catch rotations in all of the areas required by that resolution (i think it is 19) and then submit for approval - i don't have any connections to the 5 states so I am not worried about it. It is becoming a bigger issue in anesthesiology as more programs are moving to categorical positions.
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How do you go about finding out which traditional rotationg/transitional year programs are AOA/ACGME acredited? FREIDA does not state specifics.
Nevermind, found it.
Nevermind, found it.
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Found the answer...five states are: Michigan, W.Virginia, Pennsylvania, Florida, and Oklahoma. If this is wrong, feel free to correct me.
So my question is: Have there been DOs that did not complete an AOA internship year and still went to a gas program in one of the above states knowing that they were certain that they didn't want to practice in any of those 5 states.
I ask b/c ,come next year, i want to apply far and wide and Florida and Penn are two states that i wouldn't mind spending my residency years at. However, i'm completely certain i want to come back to the west coast to practice and settle down.
Is this possible?
So my question is: Have there been DOs that did not complete an AOA internship year and still went to a gas program in one of the above states knowing that they were certain that they didn't want to practice in any of those 5 states.
I ask b/c ,come next year, i want to apply far and wide and Florida and Penn are two states that i wouldn't mind spending my residency years at. However, i'm completely certain i want to come back to the west coast to practice and settle down.
Is this possible?
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Ologist said:
Yes in the four states except michigan. In the other four states you can complete your training and then practice somewhere else. In Michigan you are not allowed to progress to pgy2 (ca1) until you have completed an AOA rotating internship.
and YES as a DO you can go straight into an allopathic residency without completing an AOA rotating internship. A lot of this info is addressed on the osteopathic forum - look there too for more info.
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joshua_msu said:
A woman from my class last year matched to a program with dual accreditation which is located in Michigan (Kalamazoo, I think). They had AOA spots and ACMGE spots and she matched into the allopathic spot (through the allopathic match vs osteopathic match) She found out a couple of months in that the AOA would not give her approval for her intern year because it was not an official AOA spot - even though her curriculum was exactly the same. So be carefull in Michigan to get into an official AOA spot.
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Stupid backwards AOA. This is why many people abandon them for residency and never look back.
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doc3341 said:
Anesthesiology is a 3 yr residency program; As a resident during this process you are referred to as a CA-1, CA-2 and CA-3 depending on where you fall in the training process. However, like most specialties you are required to complete a medical, surgical, etc transitional year as a PGY-1. Residency programs that link a PGY1 year with the Anesthesiology program are referred to as a Categorical program. An Advanced program only provides the match possibility into the 3 yr Anesthesia compononent beginning as a CA-1 thus you would have to apply elsewhere for the PGY1 year prior to starting this stage of your training.
Hopefully this is right and makes sense.
