goose83

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hey guys,

i am new to this forum, but was told that it was really helpful. so hopefully, someone will be able to give me some insight...

i am currently an incoming stanford student, but am having my doubts regarding the program. dont get me wrong, i know that it is a great place to be, but as far as the cost and also the lack of focus on the clinical side has gotten me a bit worried.

i thought about sending this out to the listserv, but decided not to...is there anyone out there in the same position as me? if so, i would love to talk to you...maybe via the private messages...

thanks a lot
goose83
 

QuantumMechanic

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goose83 said:
hey guys,

i am new to this forum, but was told that it was really helpful. so hopefully, someone will be able to give me some insight...

i am currently an incoming stanford student, but am having my doubts regarding the program. dont get me wrong, i know that it is a great place to be, but as far as the cost and also the lack of focus on the clinical side has gotten me a bit worried.

i thought about sending this out to the listserv, but decided not to...is there anyone out there in the same position as me? if so, i would love to talk to you...maybe via the private messages...

thanks a lot
goose83
cost: isn't it on par with most other private med schools?

clinical rotattions: the consistently excellent match list qualms my fears of applying to stanford. obviously if the clinical training was so poor then residency directors would feel apprehensive about accepting stanford grads.
 
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goose83

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cost: isn't it on par with most other private med schools?

clinical rotattions: the consistently excellent match list qualms my fears of applying to stanford. obviously if the clinical training was so poor then residency directors would feel apprehensive about accepting stanford grads

>>>match list are not the only thing i use as indication of good clinical training. generally, these high profile residencies want people that are going to become leaders in their field...thus, their main focus will prob not even be practicing medicine.

i guess that i am wondering how this program stacks up (as far as balance between research and clinical) to other programs such as UCSF, Johns Hopkins, UCLA, UPENN, Harvard etc.
 
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I've heard a couple bad things about their program from physicians at Mayo. Since Stanford doesn't separate their students out based on grades (just P/F rotation years, right?), Mayo is very reluctant to take them. I can only speak from knowledge in orthopedics, but I think they decline stanford applicants automatically. I even recall Mayo sending Stanford and a couple other schools letters saying that they are doing a "great disservice" to their students by lumping them all together.

But heck, Stanford was still my #1 choice throughout the application year because it still is a wonderful school and in a great location. I wouldn't hesitate on going if I got accepted (which I didn't).
 

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you would have to be a moron to automatically reject an applicant from what is arguably the most selective medical school in the country.
 

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etf said:
you would have to be a moron to automatically reject an applicant from what is arguably the most selective medical school in the country.
I agree. Many of the top medical school use P/F. Yale doesn't even grade the first two years (and tests are optional). I highly doubt residency directors are actively not considering top tier programs with a P/F system.
 

QuantumMechanic

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Dov said:
I agree. Many of the top medical school use P/F. Yale doesn't even grade the first two years (and tests are optional). I highly doubt residency directors are actively not considering top tier programs with a P/F system.
its what the boards are for....
 
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goose83

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i must say that getting into residency program from a place like Stanford is the least of my worries. Or at any of the other medical schools that I mentioned. My concerns reflect the experience that I would like to have. At the end of the day, all the medical students will become doctors of some kind. my question to you all, especially to those who are in a similar position as me, is should this be a concern for me or not?
 

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Dov said:
I agree. Many of the top medical school use P/F. Yale doesn't even grade the first two years (and tests are optional). I highly doubt residency directors are actively not considering top tier programs with a P/F system.

Stanford is the only school I know of that is TRULY P/F because they are P/F throughout the clinical years. Yale and the other top schools may be P/F for the sciences but are not P/F for the clinics. Clinical grades are extremely important during residency applications, and because Stanford students lack them, residencies have a very hard time evaluatiing them. I was highly considering Stanford because I think it has the best location of all the top schools, and so I did quite a bit of looking into this issue. I actually talked to a residency director AT Stanford, and even he said that it is really hard to judge Stanford applicants. He said that they still accept them but that it is much more hit or miss. He said he would recommend Harvard, Yale, Hopkins, or Penn over Stanford if the only deciding factor was competitiveness for residency. Also, because most Stanford students take 5 years to finish, they generally have lots of research on their resumes, and since the resumes are the only thing you can use to distinguish them, Stanford students are held to pretty high standards...

All of that said, I still applied to Stanford and might have gone there if I had gotten in....because the location is awesome and the students seem really happy.
 

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I really don't think it should be a concern for you at this juncture. If you were going to be attending Stanford for your residency training, it might be a bigger deal depending on what you're interested in (I'm not sure you'd get the training you were looking for, if say, you wanted to work in an inner-city ER environment for the rest of your life), but nevertheless Stanford has a great med school program and they place students in some of the most selective residencies in the country.

Also, from what I've heard, any clinical skills you lack at the beginning of residency will be made up for within the first couple months of your internship year. So don't worry. Good luck!
 
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goose83

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thanks for the replies. i completely agree with you that ultimately we will all get the clinical training that we hope for. Indeed, there is not question on that, especially if one ends up in a decent residency.

but, i must go back to what I was saying before...Its the training NOW that I am wondering about. I have no doubt that I will be well trained at Stanford, but within that experience, will the clinical aspects take a back seat. there are some schools that are just better at integrating than others. and it seems as though stanford is tends to the research side.
 

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I would probably say that Duke takes more of the research side than even Stanford. From what I hear, the first two years of medical school (the basic sciences) is covered within 11 months instead of 2 years, you rotate in 2nd and 3rd year, and the 4th year is a mandatory research requirement. I wouldn't be too worried about the research stuff... it sounds as if you are someone who wants to go into clinical medicine (as opposed to academic) and if this is the case, I am sure you can incorporate clinical skills and exposure during your research experience at Stanford.
 

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Do you have any other options at this point? Stanford seems like a really awesome place to be for medical school in every aspect-- maybe you could ask the admission office for the contact info of a current student who would openly discuss this with you. Also, Elastase seems really knowledgeable about the schools he applied to, and is going to Stanford too, so maybe try PMing him-- On another note, if you around Palo Alto currently, I have lived about 5 minutes from Stanford all my life, and work in a private medical office at Stanford, so I'd be happy to meet with you and talk about the living aspects/ show you around the town if you're not from here.
Congrats on getting into such a great program:)




goose83 said:
thanks for the replies. i completely agree with you that ultimately we will all get the clinical training that we hope for. Indeed, there is not question on that, especially if one ends up in a decent residency.

but, i must go back to what I was saying before...Its the training NOW that I am wondering about. I have no doubt that I will be well trained at Stanford, but within that experience, will the clinical aspects take a back seat. there are some schools that are just better at integrating than others. and it seems as though stanford is tends to the research side.
 

Compass

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How is this P/F system set up? 70% higher, P? lower F? :(
 

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Sign me up! :D
 

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goose83 said:
Its the training NOW that I am wondering about. I have no doubt that I will be well trained at Stanford, but within that experience, will the clinical aspects take a back seat. there are some schools that are just better at integrating than others. and it seems as though stanford is tends to the research side.
Goose- It is for reasons like this that I actually reluctantly ruled out Stanford. Well, that, and the fact that they would laugh at my application or invite me for an interview for comic relief.

If you're an incoming med student, I'll assume that you turned down all other offers so you're pretty committed to Stanford. I would raise your concerns with the other med students at Stanford and see what they think. I don't think you'll get too much good info here.

At the end of the day, I personally think Stanford is a bit research focused, but UCSF is very strong on research and still has a kick a$$ clinical component. Stanford would not have the rep they have if they weren't able to train clinicians well enough to get great residencies. You'll be fine.

Better to be worried about how your Stanford education will affect you than worried about how far your University of Fresno degree will go.
 
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