Dreading my volunteer experience....

[bumpy]

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I know this sounds terrible, but I really dread going to my volunteer position at an inpatient ward. I know that many people do not have good volunteer experiences, but I just wanted to vent a bit. I know it's all about "what you make of it," but I have honestly tried my best to make the whole thing a meaningful experience and it's still been pretty underwhelming. I can keep myself busy for an hour or so cleaning carts, making beds, stocking linens, etc. However, the next two hours are absolutely painful, as the only place to sit down is at the central nursing station and, well, I get the distinct feeling that some of the nurses and (especially) the front desk lady are annoyed by my presence. I repeatedly ask CNAs or RNs if there is anything I can do and 99% of the time the answer is a curt "No, not now." I do go into the patients' rooms and ask them if they need anything and occasionally they do, but more often than not they just want to watch TV and be left alone. It's just a very awkward time every week. I've had a few interesting experiences, and I guess that's enough to make the whole thing worthwhile, but I'm often bored out of my mind or feel uncomfortable bc the staff isn't super friendly and I get the feeling they'd rather have me not be there.

Also, I was wondering...on the AMCAS application, do you have to specify exactly how many hours you've volunteered or is it simply a matter of saying you volunteered 3x/week? What happens if you miss a week of volunteering due to other responsibilities? How specific and detailed do you have to be about reporting your hours? I've missed a week here and there (not regularly) due to family or school events. Do I need to report that on the application?

Ughh...anyway, I do feel as though I gained some insight into the working of the hospital environment...talked with a few docs and some nurses and was able to have some interesting conversations with some of the patients. But, overall, it hasn't been the most rewarding or comfortable experience. Is there something wrong with me?

 

[popopopop]

Nahh, I commend your sincerity in this. I've seen dozens of premeds who are perfectly happy coasting during their hours and checking a box off their applications. I've even worked a place where the volunteers aren't even at the nurses stations, but are in an office downstairs. The most they ever do is a transport a patient here and there, then spend the rest of their time studying or on a laptop. So let's get a group of 5-6 of them signing up so a few of them can dodge any work at all.

I don't know how much you've invested in this place, but I personally quit 2 places throughout the last 2 years because I felt the same way you do. I don't regret it at all and honestly couldn't talk much about the experience if you added a few extra 0's after the hours I spent there. I can't believe even the CNAs do not have much for you to do, that is a rare thing. The volunteers at my current place help CNAs with a lot of simple patient care stuff. One of them became our secretary and another became a CNA. It sounds like you just picked a bad floor, so is there any way volunteer services will allow you to transfer floors? Every floor has their own management and can be quite different from each other.

 

[Kochanie]

No, I feel you. Actually, the first thing I thought when I read your post was, "I'm jealous, an hour of work". I literally restock a few things and then walk around over and over until someone needs me. Have you tried volunteering at a clinic? It's a lot better in my opinion.

 

[poopsicle]

I felt the same way, then i think that at least i dont have to clean poop

 

[baxt1412]

Choices are to 1) deal with it or 2) find a new gig.

 

[deleted407021]

I'd recommend looking around for a better opportunity. Look for a free clinic.

 

[PreciousHamburgers]

It is much easier to write about an experience on your applications and to talk about it in interviews when you genuinely enjoy it. I would find something else.

 

[Omppu27]

Free clinic is definitely the way to go. They will actually use you and you'll get great exposure to some diverse populations.

I volunteered at a hospital guiding patients about 30 feet to a scale where they would get weighted by a nurse... Awful. Quit that so fast.

Also, on AMCAS you list total hours expected by the time of matriculation if it's an on going activity. I think you estimate the number of hours per week if i remember correctly.

 

[areserine]

Did you agree to volunteer a certain number of hours with them? Have you hit those hours? There's something to be said for honoring your commitment.

Either way, your best option may be to try to transfer within the hospital. I know where I am, there is about an 8 month waiting list to volunteer in any clinical setting. If you've paid your dues, and don't want to transfer, then quitting is probably best. If you hate your experience, it's going to be pretty clear to adcoms when you talk about it, and that is going to hurt you rather than help.

 

[Doudline]

Jeez Louise. Why are people so apathetic?

If you feel like you don't get anything out of the experience, LEAVE and find something that suits you better. Small institutions (not necessarily in a hospital - it could be a nursing home or something else) generally give more responsibilities to volunteer.

 

[Lamel]

That's sort of the issue with hospital volunteering for pre-meds. We look to do it to benefit our application primarily, and wouldn't necessarily do it out of the goodness of our hearts because there really isn't much for us to gain; most actual volunteers (senior citizens) are genuinely doing it to stay busy and help out. As mentioned above, free clinics are likely much better for the type of exposure you are looking for.

I'd still get at least 50 or so hours of hospital volunteering in though, it does expose you to an inpatient environment which is useful.

 

[Planes2Doc]

I know this sounds terrible, but I really dread going to my volunteer position at an inpatient ward. I know that many people do not have good volunteer experiences, but I just wanted to vent a bit. I know it's all about "what you make of it," but I have honestly tried my best to make the whole thing a meaningful experience and it's still been pretty underwhelming. I can keep myself busy for an hour or so cleaning carts, making beds, stocking linens, etc. However, the next two hours are absolutely painful, as the only place to sit down is at the central nursing station and, well, I get the distinct feeling that some of the nurses and (especially) the front desk lady are annoyed by my presence. I repeatedly ask CNAs or RNs if there is anything I can do and 99% of the time the answer is a curt "No, not now." I do go into the patients' rooms and ask them if they need anything and occasionally they do, but more often than not they just want to watch TV and be left alone. It's just a very awkward time every week. I've had a few interesting experiences, and I guess that's enough to make the whole thing worthwhile, but I'm often bored out of my mind or feel uncomfortable bc the staff isn't super friendly and I get the feeling they'd rather have me not be there.

I was in a similar position as you. After doing scut work, I would either go to the nurses station and ask if there was anything to do, or would wander aimlessly going into patients room or waiting to be stopped by a tech or nurse. If you're okay with it, this might be a good opportunity to spend that time studying.

Also, I was wondering...on the AMCAS application, do you have to specify exactly how many hours you've volunteered or is it simply a matter of saying you volunteered 3x/week? What happens if you miss a week of volunteering due to other responsibilities? How specific and detailed do you have to be about reporting your hours? I've missed a week here and there (not regularly) due to family or school events. Do I need to report that on the application?

The application has changed since I applied. It used to ask you for hours per week. It now only asks for the total number of hours. This makes doing some sporadic activities more attractive. You aren't asked to put in any breaks you took, so I would leave that out. There's no sense in volunteering additional information that not only isn't asked for, but could end up harming you as well.

Ughh...anyway, I do feel as though I gained some insight into the working of the hospital environment...talked with a few docs and some nurses and was able to have some interesting conversations with some of the patients. But, overall, it hasn't been the most rewarding or comfortable experience. Is there something wrong with me?

There's absolutely nothing wrong with you! So many others are in the same boat. I'm volunteering currently as a medical student, and it's a night and day difference compared to pre-med! As a pre-med, you're treated like garbage, while as anyone else, you're treated well.

Nahh, I commend your sincerity in this. I've seen dozens of premeds who are perfectly happy coasting during their hours and checking a box off their applications. I've even worked a place where the volunteers aren't even at the nurses stations, but are in an office downstairs. The most they ever do is a transport a patient here and there, then spend the rest of their time studying or on a laptop. So let's get a group of 5-6 of them signing up so a few of them can dodge any work at all.

In my opinion, the journey to medical school should be whatever the applicant wants to make of it. Remember, you're making huge sacrifices (essentially putting the rest of your life on the line for some people) in a highly-competitive environment. If you fail to get into medical school as a hard science major, you might be underemployed for the rest of your life. Perhaps this isn't the best time to try and make a meaningful journey. Look, you have the rest of your life to do service, especially as a physician! If pre-meds want to strategically check the boxes to give them the best possible chances for getting into medical school, then who can blame them? If you spend a majority of your shift getting studying done (or even shadowing during this time too), then I'd say it's a pretty damn good use of your time! You have the rest of your life as a physician to volunteer, yet you only have this small window to get into medical school.

That's sort of the issue with hospital volunteering for pre-meds. We look to do it to benefit our application primarily, and wouldn't necessarily do it out of the goodness of our hearts because there really isn't much for us to gain; most actual volunteers (senior citizens) are genuinely doing it to stay busy and help out. As mentioned above, free clinics are likely much better for the type of exposure you are looking for.

I couldn't have said it better myself... In a sense, the pre-med volunteers aren't really helping the hospitals, it's the hospitals that are helping them because volunteering is an unwritten requirement for medical school admissions. But as I said before, the medical school admissions process doesn't need to be some meaningful journey. There's nothing wrong with checking the boxes because the ultimate goal is to get into medical school, not become the next Mother Teresa. That's why anyone who is trying to get into medical school should take a long realistic look at themselves, and figure out exactly what they are trying to do. Hence, these supposedly "crappy" volunteer experiences are actually the best ones for getting into medical school. I would have killed to have extensive study time during my volunteer shifts. Remember, volunteering is like Vegas my 99% of the fun. What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas, and same with volunteering. You only need a few good experiences to talk about on your PS and with ADCOMs, and those are easy to come by when you're doing hundreds of hours worth of volunteer work.

Now you can call me a bad person or what not. But seriously, if you screw up the pre-med process by putting all of your eggs in one basket, you might end up underemployed for the rest of your life. I've seen this personally happen to people I know. Some of them are now working jobs as college graduates where you only need a high school diploma. Is this what you want to do for the rest of your life? I'm guessing not. In that case, it's best to make strategic decisions that will best benefit yourself and your medical school application. As a pre-med, you're volunteering to help yourself, and not others. You should look for an experience that has minimal negative impact on grades firstly through a convenient schedule. After that, being able to study or shadow during shifts is an added bonus. After you get into medical school, you have the rest of your life to volunteer as a physician if you choose to do so, because volunteering should be just that, something you do through your own free will, not something you're forced to do against your will.

 

[popopopop]

^I agree with what you're saying to some extent, but it can't be that black and white. I know your intentions are good, but all I'm reading from you is that you're advising people to "take the easy way out." It's not cool to purposely game the system so you can cruise. Yes, we all need clinical hours, but sometimes the path of least resistance is not always correct. Is it ok if a volunteer picks a graveyard shift at an ER knowing that he/she can study all night? That's exactly what a poster here did. Is it ok if a volunteer leaves and go watch a movie knowing no one will find him? Again, that's what another poster here did. Imagine if you work with a group of volunteers who only signs up at the slowest hours of the day, leave early, avoid any work at all, lie to your face about what they're actually doing during that time, basically being a ****ty volunteer in general, and knowing they're getting the same hours you do. I'm just saying there are different attitudes you can take as a volunteer and some of the most annoying ones are the slackers or the ones that can't fake it until they make it. Imagine if your future attending coworkers did the same thing!

I work at a fairly new free clinic and even though I do menial work in comparison to my scope of practice, I stay because the attitudes of the staff have been excellent and I believe in what the founders of clinic are trying to do. We have mid-levels who have arranged day-care around clinic days so they can volunteer. We have med techs, nurses, and several doctors who are working full-time come weekly to keep the clinic running. They aren't box checking. I just think it's a slap in the face knowing that premeds simply use the clinic as a resource with a clock-in/clock-out attitude and being so very apathetic about it. OP is feeling bad about having downtime and hostile staff. I advise OP to transfer floor, which I think could be a good solution if it can be arrange. Even if the staff allows her to sit and study, he/she would probably want to leave since it's such a burden. Bottom line is that OP can have a much fruitful experience than the one he/she is having right now.

 

[AspiringERMD]

Definitely find something else. There are SO many opportunities out there. I'm in a similar boat; I've worked at a free clinic for about a year. It was GREAT experience at first, but they've switched the pre-med volunteers from clinical work over to more secretarial/computer work and I'm bored out of my mind. I miss seeing patients. Just two more shifts over the next week and I'm quitting.

 

[Planes2Doc]

^I agree with what you're saying to some extent, but it can't be that black and white. I know your intentions are good, but all I'm reading from you is that you're advising people to "take the easy way out."

That's precisely my intention, given the fact that the medical school admissions process is cut-throat competitive, and can be very unforgiving.

It's not cool to purposely game the system so you can cruise. Yes, we all need clinical hours, but sometimes the path of least resistance is not always correct.

I never tell people to game the system or do anything unethical. I'm just telling pre-meds that they can be non-proactive during their shifts, which can be more beneficial for them. If a pre-med is usually sitting around studying but will always respond to requests by the medical staff, then they are doing their responsibilities adequately. They aren't going to win the "Volunteer of the Year" award or anything like that, but as long as they aren't doing anything to piss off the staff, it's all Kosher. This is just like a non-proactive office employee. Let's say you have someone who does only what they are supposed to and watches the clock every day... Are they doing unethical? No. Are they a good employee? Well, they probably won't get any promotions but they are fulfilling their duties. It's the same way with pre-med volunteering. The system is set up in a way where it doesn't make a difference whether you are proactive or not, and thus not being proactive in this case is beneficial to you. Remember, this is a forum devoted to getting yourself into medical school, not becoming the next Mother Teresa or anything like that. Therefore, you should do everything to benefit yourself as long as it's ethical, and being an average non-proactive volunteer is ethical.

Is it ok if a volunteer picks a graveyard shift at an ER knowing that he/she can study all night? That's exactly what a poster here did.

Yes, this is totally okay. My ex-girlfriend is a nurse, and told me that a lot of nurses enjoyed working graveyard shifts because they get paid more and also there is usually less to do. A volunteer picking up a graveyard shift to study all night is thinking strategically. As long as the volunteer does their duties when asked, it's okay.

Is it ok if a volunteer leaves and go watch a movie knowing no one will find him? Again, that's what another poster here did.

No, this is not okay. I never advocated for anyone to do this. This is lying and unethical. But as for the examples before this, those are fine since you're simply being a non-proactive volunteer.

Imagine if you work with a group of volunteers who only signs up at the slowest hours of the day, leave early, avoid any work at all, lie to your face about what they're actually doing during that time, basically being a ****ty volunteer in general, and knowing they're getting the same hours you do. I'm just saying there are different attitudes you can take as a volunteer and some of the most annoying ones are the slackers or the ones that can't fake it until they make it. Imagine if your future attending coworkers did the same thing!

This is why I suggest implementing changes to the current system... As I always say, volunteering is like Vegas minus 99% of the fun. What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas, same with volunteering. Therefore, an ADCOM can only go by what applicants tell them. Therefore, if you have two applicants with 300 verifiable hours each, they can't realistically tell the difference between someone who slacked off the entire time, versus someone who was pretty much an honorary part of the medical team. And the former will definitely BS their personal statements and during interviews to the best of their abilities. Yeah it sucks, but until there is oversight, this will continue to happen.

I work at a fairly new free clinic and even though I do menial work in comparison to my scope of practice, I stay because the attitudes of the staff have been excellent and I believe in what the founders of clinic are trying to do. We have mid-levels who have arranged day-care around clinic days so they can volunteer. We have med techs, nurses, and several doctors who are working full-time come weekly to keep the clinic running. They aren't box checking. I just think it's a slap in the face knowing that premeds simply use the clinic as a resource with a clock-in/clock-out attitude and being so very apathetic about it.

Don't blame the pre-meds, blame the ADCOMs for making this a requirement. If volunteering wasn't a requirement, then a majority of pre-meds would not do it unless they were the rare few that actually do it for genuine reasons. Think about it, with the amount of hours that pre-meds put in, they should get a collective Nobel Peace Prize, right? Well actually, they have a horrible reputation among volunteer circles, as you have just mentioned. This is ultimately what happens when you force these people to commit to doing something they don't want to do. So don't take it personally, and I'm guessing that any staff members familiar with pre-meds aren't.

OP is feeling bad about having downtime and hostile staff. I advise OP to transfer floor, which I think could be a good solution if it can be arrange. Even if the staff allows her to sit and study, he/she would probably want to leave since it's such a burden. Bottom line is that OP can have a much fruitful experience than the one he/she is having right now.

This is good advice, but of course, to each their own. The OP should find what makes them happy. What makes someone happy doesn't make another person happy, and so on...

 

[popopopop]

^I think we agree to disagree. None of those examples were pointed at you btw, just me ended up ranting a bit. I don't blame the premeds, but I just know that there are still good premeds and good people out there in general and there are those who aren't willing to put in the work (again, at least fake it please). "Nonproactive, but ethical" is ok and all, but those that are proactive I will hope to proudly call my future colleague one day. Nobel prize? No way, volunteering is a privilege and premeds aren't entitled to anything. Look again at my example of the free clinic. Those truely altruistic people and my experiences with them is what I personally have gotten out of my volunteering gig, even despite the fact I do menial job that a monkey can probably do. I think you're unintentionally describing a gunner-esque way of approaching this.

 

[Planes2Doc]

^I think we agree to disagree. None of those examples were pointed at you btw, just me ended up ranting a bit. I don't blame the premeds, but I just know that there are still good premeds and good people out there in general and there are those who aren't willing to put in the work (again, at least fake it please). "Nonproactive, but ethical" is ok and all, but those that are proactive I will hope to proudly call my future colleague one day. Nobel prize? No way, volunteering is a privilege and premeds aren't entitled to anything. I think you're unintentionally describing a gunner-esque way of approaching this.

Well said, I think we can definitely agree to disagree. And no problem, I know those examples weren't pointed at me. I wanted to add though that you're correct about this being a black & white issue. There are pre-meds of all types that will be good or bad volunteers, and this will likely not impact them as future physicians. Who knows, maybe some of the finest attendings you know today may have fabricated their ECs when they applied to medical school?! 😱 If ECs were considered more important, then there would be more oversight. It's funny how you're treated like a criminal when taking the MCAT, yet are free to completely fabricate volunteer experiences. It sucks. 🙁

Also, I don't really think I'm describing this in a gunner-esque way. Gunners usually go out of their way to screw people over. If anything, I feel like I'm describing this from the perspective of someone who takes a good pre-med adviser's advice. They aren't telling you to do what you're passionate about which you hear all the time on SDN... They're telling you to do the things that get you into medical school. Boom. Done!

 

[SoonToBeDrG]

I felt the same way, then i think that at least i dont have to clean poop

It's not as bad as you think. Unless there's blood and c-diff in the feces, then it can be quite the stank.

 

[popopopop]

Well said, I think we can definitely agree to disagree. And no problem, I know those examples weren't pointed at me. I wanted to add though that you're correct about this being a black & white issue. There are pre-meds of all types that will be good or bad volunteers, and this will likely not impact them as future physicians. Who knows, maybe some of the finest attendings you know today may have fabricated their ECs when they applied to medical school?! 😱 If ECs were considered more important, then there would be more oversight. It's funny how you're treated like a criminal when taking the MCAT, yet are free to completely fabricate volunteer experiences. It sucks. 🙁

Also, I don't really think I'm describing this in a gunner-esque way. Gunners usually go out of their way to screw people over. If anything, I feel like I'm describing this from the perspective of someone who takes a good pre-med adviser's advice. They aren't telling you to do what you're passionate about which you hear all the time on SDN... They're telling you to do the things that get you into medical school. Boom. Done!

I'm already past this. I'm stuck on the fantasy that you're a "happy Chinese girl" with a "girlfriend" as you stated .

 

[Planes2Doc]

I'm already past this. I'm stuck on the fantasy that you're a "happy Chinese girl" with a "girlfriend" as you stated .

LOL! Okay, I really need to change it. Only veteran users would get it. 😛 http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...d-medical-school-with-a-26-on-my-mcat.880229/

 

[NYCdude]

I think the problem lies in volunteers not really even being needed in some places.

 

[Planes2Doc]

I think the problem lies in volunteers not really even being needed in some places.

Usually the pre-meds need the volunteer sites far more than the volunteer sites need pre-meds. 😉

It creates an odd combination...

 

[Doudline]

The problem I have with your suggestions, Planes2Doc, is that you apparently cannot fathom the possibility of volunteering being a learning experience.

Altruism is a personal quality that can be developed like any other. Do you know people who grew up with family members or friends who had disabilities? All the ones that I know are very empathetic, and generally warm/supportive to the less fortunate of society. It's not about genetics, it's about exposure and experience.

When you advice people to do the least possible while volunteering, you're actively advocating for the "box-checking" phenomenon that's so prevalent in this community (and that you despise yourself). You're preemptively giving people the idea there is nothing to take away from volunteering, and creating a self-realizing prophecy (and bitter individuals).

 

[ThisCouldBeYou]

I never tell people to game the system or do anything unethical.

What?!! P2D, that's your MO. Game the system. (I don't even think that way, and yet, you bring it up everywhere you can.)

 

[Planes2Doc]

The problem I have with your suggestions, Planes2Doc, is that you apparently cannot fathom the possibility of volunteering being a learning experience.

It definitely can be a learning experience. It's great when people who have no intention of doing it end up doing it for the sake of box-checking, and then end up enjoying it tremendously. This is always a great thing, but seems to be in the minority, which is evident by most pre-meds creating a horrible reputation for themselves as volunteers.

Altruism is a personal quality that can be developed like any other. Do you know people who grew up with family members or friends who had disabilities? All the ones that I know are very empathetic, and generally warm/supportive to the less fortunate of society. It's not about genetics, it's about exposure and experience.

That's a very good point and I agree with you.

When you advice people to do the least possible while volunteering, you're actively advocating for the "box-checking" phenomenon that's so prevalent in this community (and that you despise yourself). You're preemptively giving people the idea there is nothing to take away from volunteering, and creating a self-realizing prophecy (and bitter individuals).

This is true as well... I guess that I am creating a self-realizing prophecy in some individuals. But long before I ever officially joined SDN, there have been box-checkers doing things for the sake of it. Long after I'm gone, there will be box-checkers unless the system changes dramatically. I see that the majority of people on SDN are telling others to "do things you're passionate about." I hear that all the time. Sometimes this is good advice, and sometimes this can be bad advice. If a pre-med does a lot of things they are passionate about, but ends up screwing up their grades and MCAT, and becomes underemployed; then will they be happy about the things they did as a pre-med? I doubt it... Secondly, I'm not saying anything unique here. I'm actually telling people what pre-med advisers usually tell their students; yet people on SDN typically bash pre-med advisers.

I realize that the medical school admissions process is cut-throat competitive. So are others, like investment banking (check out wallstreetoasis.com) and getting into a top law school (check out top-law-schools.com). Yet when you go to these websites, no one is telling you to do things you're passionate about, or any of that sweet loving cozy stuff. They tell it like it is, and will let you know exactly what you need to know. On SDN you'll have an ADCOM telling pre-meds not to do anything they aren't passionate about... Yet they can't have it both ways. You can't tell pre-meds not to do anything they aren't passionate about, yet reject them when they didn't do what you wanted them to do.

I agree with you that volunteering should be a special learning experience. But ****, it got ruined a long time ago by pre-meds. So with the current system in place, I can only tell them to do what's best for them (with the ultimate goal of getting into medical school and only that). I believe that the best thing for most pre-meds is following the path of least resistance with ECs, because there's already enough resistance and dangers without it. But everyone needs to make their own choices. I'm not putting a gun to anyone's head and telling them what to do. I'm just giving them another perspective which isn't the popular opinion here on SDN, and while you might not find it valuable, others do. If you want to follow the typical SDN gospel, then do it. If you want to follow what I preach, then do it. As long as you get into medical school, you're successful.

What?!! P2D, that's your MO. Game the system. (I don't even think that way, and yet, you bring it up everywhere you can.)

Okay, if you want to call my advice "gaming the system," then so be it. I guess that's reasonable... But as for doing anything unethical, no... I don't tell people to do any of it.

 

[poopsicle]

-

 

[ems2doc]

Sometimes you don't know exactly how many hours you've volunteered and then it becomes a moot point. For instance, I volunteered at a hospital and didn't have regular shifts. It was really hard to know exactly how many hours I volunteered so I included an estimate of how many cumulative hours per week. On the other hand, I was also an EMT and we had very regular 12-hour shifts and the management keeps close track of the number of hours we've worked. In fact, it's public data. If you knew my name and where I'm from you could find out exactly how many hours I've volunteered, how successful I am at starting IVs, and how many patients I've treated. You could even do an NREMT search and find license information, disciplinary action, and affiliated rescue agencies.