During clinical rotation..can reject to perform surgeries or touch blood?

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I just checked to see if the date of your post was April 1st (April Fool's!), but it wasn't... Are you serious? If so, I agree with DrMom -- maybe you should reconsider your choice of career.

Being realistic, it's always possible to catch something, but the likelihood is slim if you use Universal Precautions. If the issue is that it grosses you out, you might just have to deal with it until you get past those rotations and into your Psych residency.
 
Good luck trying to pass surgery.

How would you ever perform phlebotomy or start an IV?
 
Well, you can't reject to perform surgery or draw blood, mainly because that is not a logical sentence. You can, however, refuse to perform surgery or draw blood. You most certainly are free to do that.

Your medical school then becomes free to refuse to graduate you...
 
Originally posted by dwstranger
If the issue is that it grosses you out, you might just have to deal with it until you get past those rotations and into your Psych residency.
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Good Response!!! thanx

Womensurg/drmon
they are alot of students like me. They are many specialities where one neiither touches blood nor performs surgery. The only problem(a very minor) is to just get by those stupid classes or rotations where you have to do such stuff. BUT i will try to refrain as much as possible from such stuff during medical school.
 
So Phar what are you going to do during the surgery rotation when all of a sudden you feel a wet sensation on your leg and when you look down it is bright red, are you going to run out of the room screaming.
 
phar, in many of the hospitals i've worked in when the nurses could not get an IV or the lab could not get blood it was the med student/intern/resident who was on that got called.
also, during a code in our place it usually the intern or senior who places the central line, draws femoral gases, drops NGT, etc while the junior resident runs the code.
i think the problem might be there might be some situations when you are 'IT' and there is no one else to call.
i have faith however that while doing surgery might not appeal to you; you will begin more tolerable of the blood thing as your exposure increases. I worked with a med student once who near fainted when he saw the foley bag of a patient who just had urologoical surgery and is now a succcessful urology surgeon. good luck.
 
Originally posted by lizzied2003
phar, in many of the hospitals i've worked in when the nurses could not get an IV or the lab could not get blood it was the med student/intern/resident who was on that got called.
also, during a code in our place it usually the intern or senior who places the central line, draws femoral gases, drops NGT, etc while the junior resident runs the code.
i think the problem might be there might be some situations when you are 'IT' and there is no one else to call.
i have faith however that while doing surgery might not appeal to you; you will begin more tolerable of the blood thing as your exposure increases. I worked with a med student once who near fainted when he saw the foley bag of a patient who just had urologoical surgery and is now a succcessful urology surgeon. good luck.
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And at least at our institution, psych residents had to do half a year of internal med, so will have to do these things. Plus, even as a shrink, you'll be exposed to "disgusting" stuff---people scratching/slicing themselves bloody, throwing ****. If you're a little queasy, that's ok, that eases with time. But if you DO NOT want to do it, don't go to medical school.

mike
 
Originally posted by lizzied2003
in many of the hospitals i've worked in when the nurses could not get an IV or the lab could not get blood it was the med student/intern/resident who was on that got called.
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yeah, and I have to say, that totally cracks me up. --The nurse, who spends a significant amount of time starting IV's and drawing blood, can't get a line, so hey! let's call in the med student! :laugh:
 
Phar, do you have any concept of what is going to be required of you in med school? You can't refrain, avoid, or dodge responsibilities that are so basic to a doctor. Suck it up, stick em, and get used to blood, I did, and I was really queasy at the site of blood when I started.
 
phar,

As you probably know, the reason you are drawing so much criticism from this thread is that you are questioning a basic tenet of what we do and how we do it. Although surgery is not for everyone, it is univerally accepted as a necessary part of health care and vital to the welfare of our sick population. As such, everyone that calls himself or herself a physician should be familiar with what goes on, just as every physician should be aware of what hypertension or diabetes is.

No, not every physician needs to know what a Soave maneuver is, but every physician should know generally what goes on in colon surgery. This is why surgery is a core rotation -- it is performed often enough and has benefit enough that, regardless of what field you are, you need to know what goes on and what can go wrong afterwards. This is why you need to scrub into the OR and visually see it. If you think you can get the same education by reading about it in a book, that makes about as much sense to me as going through anatomy without ever seeing a cadaver (how did you/do you plan to go through that, let alone a surgery rotation???).

As for blood draws, get used to it. There isn't a speciality in the US where, at least as part of your residency training, you don't have to do it. Even Psych.

And for future reference, you are going to anger a lot of people by calling rotations like surgery or classes like anatomy "stupid". Not just surgeons either.
 
Originally posted by Samoa
yeah, and I have to say, that totally cracks me up. --The nurse, who spends a significant amount of time starting IV's and drawing blood, can't get a line, so hey! let's call in the med student! :laugh:
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No doubt. If I get called, the nurse knows s/he's getting a central line, external jugular IV, femoral stick, or some other large vessel approach. I tell them, if you couldn't get a peripheral IV, and the LifeFlight paramedics couldn't get a peripheral IV, then my chance of getting it is about zip.
 
Okay guys!!!.....but I WILL TRY to restrain from such activities. I remember my anatomy class where we had this cadaver which smelled like hell..i don't know if it was the body or the chemical(formaldehyde)...........Since i am not in medical school yet, i guess i don't have to worry about it for right now.
 
Try taking a phlebotomy class. After you poke (and are poked) enough times, it really isn't too bad.

It also helps one get used to the squirting blood issue in a 'relaxed' setting. 😀
 
When I was a kid, I was sick a lot. I had to get blood drawn a lot. I was very squeamish, and nearly passed out every time. (Nearly passed out getting basic immunizations and TB tests as well). Finally, I decided that, since getting blood drawn was going to be a part of my life because of my illness, I had better stop getting so upset over it.

So I gradually desenitized myself to it. I first forced myself to remain seated during a blood draw, instead of lying down. When I got used to that, I started peeking at the blood...first just in the tubes, then as it flowed into the tubes, and finally I was able to watch myself get stuck.

Now I'm about to start a surgery residency. And my absolute favorite kind of operation so far is a damage control laparotomy... that's for a patient who has had some kind of major trauma with severe intraabdominal bleeding, and you go in and just basically try to stop the profuse bleeding (often by putting in and leaving sponges in key areas, or putting in some big clips or doing some quick sewing) Very often these cases involve lots of blood spilling out onto the floor. It doesn't bother me at all any more.

If you really think you want to go to med school, I'd strongly advise you to find a way to desentiize yourself enough to get though these kinds of things. (I shared my story to show you it can be done) No matter what specialty you choose, you cannot get though your training without exposure to blood and unpleaseant smells. You'll have to take gross anatomy and you will be expected to participate in the dissection. You'll have to do a surgery rotation and you will fail if you refuse to scrub. And bad smells come from places other than the gross lab....many of my patients have had odors far worse than anything you'll smell on a cadaver.

All specialties have some time during residency where you are exposed to some blood. For example Radiology and Psych folks have to do time in internal medicine, and have the same thing happen that all of us do...the nurses call you when they can't get IV access (at my school it works the way womansurg described...they know they will get large vessel access...we don't send the med student to try to start a peripheral IV). But whether you do a peripheral IV or a central line, you still have to see some blood in the process.

It's good that you are asking about this now before you make the final decision about applying to med school. It may not be for you.
 
Originally posted by phar
Okay guys!!!.....but I WILL TRY to restrain from such activities. I remember my anatomy class where we had this cadaver which smelled like hell..i don't know if it was the body or the chemical(formaldehyde)...........Since i am not in medical school yet, i guess i don't have to worry about it for right now.
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If you think cadavers smell bad, just wait till you get to the psych ED! 😱
 
what about when you have to manually disimpact a patient.
 
"Is there a doctor in the building? This is an emergency."

"Uh, there MAY be a doc here, but if the person is bleeding, smells or has vomited...then no, there isn't a doc anywhere."

Phar - become a psychologist. If all this stuff is THAT stupid and gross to you - medicine just ain't for you. And there's no shame in that...the shame is in going into medicine and thinking some of the basic tenents of the profession are repulsive.
 
Short answer for your question: NO. Most doctors, residents, and med students deal with blood and guts on a very, very regular basis. You can't opt out of it. You just have to get over it, or else find something else to do, because not only will the attendings give you terrible evaluations for trying to get out of work, your classmates will despise you because they will wind up having to do all the things that you found to be too undesirable. Sorry, but there's no way around it.
 
Sure, thats not really a problem, just tell them that you want to sit out of OB/Gyn, surgery, peds, medicine, family practice, psychiatry and every other roatation of third year and go sit in the doctors lounge and watch TV. Are you serious? WTF?
 
I'm always amazed at the ability with which SDN members are able to criticize people. So the person doesn't want to mess with blood...yeah, it's a basic thing when it comes to medicine, but have a little compassion for someone who is in a pickle.

It would definitely be impossible to get through med school without dealing with surgery, blood, etc. So those of you who criticized phar would have perhaps been better off helping him/her deal with the problem, as opposed to saying, "Medicine isn't for you."

And criticizing someone's grammar or word choice is really annoying, too.
 
Originally posted by Firebird
I'm always amazed at the ability with which SDN members are able to criticize people. So the person doesn't want to mess with blood...yeah, it's a basic thing when it comes to medicine, but have a little compassion for someone who is in a pickle.

It would definitely be impossible to get through med school without dealing with surgery, blood, etc. So those of you who criticized phar would have perhaps been better off helping him/her deal with the problem, as opposed to saying, "Medicine isn't for you."

And criticizing someone's grammar or word choice is really annoying, too.
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thanks firebird. That is one of the reasons why i left SDN. Just an update information. I have started volunteering at a local hospital(ER). So, i have been assisting nurses cleaning beds, talking and other things. I am getting used to it. Also, i have an interview coming up where i will work as a phelobotamist. That should eliminate my all fears. The only thing left is the smelling-side of working with cadavers.
 
With the dumbing down of America, I am all for correcting poor grammar. Correction is not criticizing. One needs to be able to use correct grammar. Correcting mistakes should be considered helpful. The poster who corrected the grammar did not do so in a critical way.

And some posters did suggest that phar try some strategies to desensitize him/herself. However, some of phar's posts read as though s/he was unwilling to do so.

Perhaps some of you have never had to be on a clinical team with a slacker. Those of us who have had a fairly strong reaction to phar's original attitude, which was basically that s/he planned on refusing to do any activity which included the possibilty of seeing blood. A student who would do that on the wards would quickly incur the wrath of his/her fellow students as well as earn a failing grade.

I am glad to see that phar is indeed willing to deal with the issue.
 
I'm glad to see phar is working on finding a way to deal with his fear of blood as well.

As for the cadaver, I couldn't stand the smell myself. A little Vick's Vapo Rub under the nose helps a lot.
 
There needs to be a space in human conversation for telling someone that a comment they made isn't a good one.

Telling someone they should think about another career field if they are averse to a fundamental tenent of this career's training isn't mean-spirited criticism - it's reality. Further, pointing out the fact that the comment itself is absurd - even via light joking - isn't rude and evil either.

The question was the equivalent of asking if you can be a truck driver w/o ever being required to actually drive. We should have some room to find that kind of question surprisingly foolish.
 
Originally posted by phar
thanks firebird. That is one of the reasons why i left SDN. Just an update information. I have started volunteering at a local hospital(ER). So, i have been assisting nurses cleaning beds, talking and other things. I am getting used to it. Also, i have an interview coming up where i will work as a phelobotamist. That should eliminate my all fears. The only thing left is the smelling-side of working with cadavers.
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Good job, phar!

As far as the cadavers go, after a while you get used to it. Formaldehyde is not a great scent, but it is better than having an un-preserved cadaver. 😱
 
Several people in my class fainted or felt sick in the first few days of anatomy - only the first few days, then it was okay. I've really never heard of someone dropping out of med school b/c they couldn't handle the cadavers or the blood or pus or stool or whatever. Everyone some how gets used to it with exposure, and with the RIGHT ATTITUDE that you want to learn to deal with it, rather than that you want to avoid it.

Blood is really the least of your worries. I have seen some things I couldn't even imagine before I went to med school they are so gross, but somehow, you kind of just get used to not thinking about it so much.

When I'm holding my breath to avoid smelling some nastiness, I always try to focus on being nice to the patient (and not letting on that I'm holding my breath), b/c they are probably totally embarrased by the ugly infected wound they have. We're in a compassionate profession, so it may help to focus on the fact that you are performing a valuable medical service for the patient rather than thinking of how yucky you think it is doing that pelvic exam/rectal exam/earwax removal/wart freezing/talking to a schizophrenic patient who is in a rage and is spitting on your face in anger/doing a fine needle aspiration of some gigantic neck tumor as a pathologist (as you can see, this "yucky" stuff affects all specialties!) You've got to love medicine and love doing the right thing for the patient enough to get over your fears.
 
One more point - I can't think of any specialty that doesn't require you to do some kind of internship including at least a few months of medicine (where you WILL see blood and other gross things). Internship is a job, where, unlike a student, you can get fired for refusing to do things that are part of your job like start central lines.
 
Thanks guys.

I think we should retire this forum because i have changed and got the "help" i needed.
 
Originally posted by fourthyear
One more point - I can't think of any specialty that doesn't require you to do some kind of internship including at least a few months of medicine (where you WILL see blood and other gross things). Internship is a job, where, unlike a student, you can get fired for refusing to do things that are part of your job like start central lines.
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Pathology doesn't require any time in medicine. However, you'll have to deal with a lot of blood and guts anyway, because of FNA's, biopsies, marrow transplants, amputations, etc.


I don't think blood or septic fluid will bother me the most. Emesis will be what kills me. Anybody have any problems/experience with this????
 
When you become a doctor, you can never stop to be one.

If you see a guy choking and in need of laryngotomy, you can't even say that you are a retired doctor! And in your condition, what are you going to say?

Just wondering...are you vegetarian? :laugh:
 
ici_cute

I do not think that in the United States that a doctor is required to provide care to a person who is in an emergency outside the physician's normal scope of practice. In the US, providing help is totally up to you...at least that is my understanding. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

I know in France this is not the case. If you witness an emergency, you are required to provide help to someone in need.
 
Originally posted by Firebird
ici_cute

I do not think that in the United States that a doctor is required to provide care to a person who is in an emergency outside the physician's normal scope of practice. In the US, providing help is totally up to you...at least that is my understanding. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

I know in France this is not the case. If you witness an emergency, you are required to provide help to someone in need.
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lol....it cracks me up to think of a physician who can't help because dealing with blood is outside his/her normal scope of practice.... that's ridiculous in my small mind.

And I'm certainly not the most informed person on the issue, but I thought that as physicians we are required to provide care in an emergency.....I'd like to know the answer to that. Heck....I even thought that you were obligated when you're CPR certified.

Hmm....

Peace~
 
I just thought I would share a story I was told by the president of my med school about a recent student.

During Ramadan this year (don't know if I am spelling that correctly) a muslim clinical student doing his surg rotation refused to touch blood or blood products during that period because of his religion. The clinical director flipped out!! The clinical director (who is also muslim) kicked him out of the rotation, obviously failing him, and wrote a letter to the ecfmg that is to be placed in his permenent file saying that in that doctors opinion, that student should NEVER be a doctor. Now, when that student applies for a residency, the PD will see that letter and offer the position to someone else. The student will most likely get the worst residency in the worst city in the world if he gets anything at all. Moral of the story: religion and personal preference come second to patient care.
 
Originally posted by Digginit
And I'm certainly not the most informed person on the issue, but I thought that as physicians we are required to provide care in an emergency.....I'd like to know the answer to that. Heck....I
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Are you a physician? You should know the answer. You are morally, but not legally, obligated to provide care outside of the hospital in an emergency. In the hospital, that's a different story.

mike
 
grammar, grammar, grammar....damn, damn, damn. I am NOT a physician yet, but I do hope to graduate from medical school some day... 🙄

Originally posted by mikecwru
Are you a physician? You should know the answer. You are morally, but not legally, obligated care outside of the hospital in an emergency. In the hospital, that's a different story.

mike
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:
 
Originally posted by bts4202

Moral of the story: religion and personal preference come second to patient care.
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To some of us, religion comes first in our lives...and it doesn't change.

I am not sure, but I suspect that if that student contacted the ACLU, they would take the physician to court. Reasonable concessions should be made for people with conflicting relgious beliefs. I don't know how long Ramadan is, but I suspect that once in practice, he could schedule his vacation completely overtop of the holiday.
 
You are right about how the person could have their vacation scheduled around Ramadan (which is a month long), but that is only if his/her partners allowed it, and they are under NO obligation to honor that... otherwise I could make My own religion and holiday and just say that I have to get the day off. I mean, doctors do not get days off for christmas or whatever holiday because people still get sick and still need help not to mention the fact that if the doctor has inpatients, than the doc has to go and see them. The only way they get off is if they are in a group and have an agreement that someone will work for that specific holiday for the rest of the group. I am sure you have seen that in the hospital so far haven't you?

However, what happens if that person CAN NOT get off work and has to work on their religous holiday? They can not refuse certain aspects of patient care due to their preference. Once you walk into the hospital, personal prejeduce and religous objections do not matter!! What about Jehovah's witnesses... can they refuse to give a patient a blood transfusion because they do not agree with the practice? SO, what if later on, the clinical student is an ER doc or whatever... and they somehow have to work during the MONTH of Ramadan (not hard to see happening) and their is an emergency? what if a patient that got in a MVA comes in and needs to be saved... is that DOCTOR going to refuse and say "I can't touch your blood because it is Ramadan"? No way!! There is a million senarios that could arise where the DOCTOR would have to touch blood and being religous isn't an excuse. I know many many jewish doctors who, against their very strong religous beliefs, drives and works on the sabbath if it is their turn on call. They do not have a choice because the sabbath is friday evening and saturday till sundown... no group in the world will allow one member to have EVRY friday and saturday off call!! Nor would any hospital in the free world give special permission to a single doctor to get every friday and saturday off work!! What kind of unequality would that promote? Ok, and how about the muslims that have to pray at specific times throughout the day? What if they are with a patient who is an emergency? Can they just leave that patient to go pray?? no way!! What if its not an emergency, but they are in the middle of something or if they get paged stat during a prayer... do they get to ignore their duty to satisfy their religous desires? I know they could probably finish up quickly in real life and then do what they have to do, but it still shows that religion and persenal preference have no place in the hospital nor in medicine. Certain consession must be made BY THE DOCTOR once they take that sacred hippocratic oath.

What if your mother was the patient. What if she fell and broke her hip? I am not being a jerk, I am being serious. What if her ER doctor walked in and said "Oh, I am sorry sir, but I have to go find another docotor because I can't touch blood, its Ramadan" Then he proceeded to call another ER doc who is swamped doing the work that his partner won't do and it takes him 20 more minutes to see her while she is screaming in pain (broken hips are a bit painful). During that time she is bleeding from ruptured vessels and increasing her chance of fat embolism every second. Finally someone sees her and refers her to the OR. However, most of the surgeons in that OR are jewish and it is friday night so the only couple surgeons available are busy and your mom has to wait 4 hours. More chance of fat embolism and death plus excrutiating pain. Finally, she gets surgery and is sent to the floor. However, now the surgeon is catholic and saturday is christmas day so he won't work either and none of his partners are working either. Your mom has developed a staph infection and she is starting to get septic. Your moms nurse tries in vain to get her surgeon on the phone finally calling the ER stat when your mom goes into septic shock and subsequent cardiac arrest. I know these circumstances would probably not all happen at once, but on any major holiday there would be chaos if anyone was allowed to set limits on their patient care due to religous beliefs. Don't forget that it is not just doctors I am talking about, there are nurses and techs also that must be considered in the same equation.

I would bet that if that student went to the ACLU they would lose that case. Medicine has always had special rules because it is the only proffesion that deals directly with people in a life and death situation. The only other proffesion that even comes close is Law and they have some special rules also. For someone who belives that they should be able to honor their religion over their proffesion, may I suggest ANY other career. What you do at home is your own buissness, but in the hospital and at work... it MUST come second!!
 
The scenario you provided was absolutely ludicrous. That would never happen, not in a million years...well, maybe once in a MILLION years.

You assume that there are a lot of very deeply religious people out there who are interested in medicine, but not interested in making concessions. In fact, there are not. Most are willing to make any concession they can to be a doctor. The example you bring up about Jewish people working on the Sabbath. This is completely contrary to Jewish law, but most are willing to make an exception. There is, no doubt, a very small group that would not do this.

The point is...there will only be a handful of people who are not willing to budge an inch from their religious beliefs. It would not be incredibly easy to accomodate them, but they deserve the same opportunities as you do. It would certainly be possible to help them out.

Perhaps their specialties could be limited to where they would be more apt to fit within their belief system. For example, Pathology residents typically don't work weekends (good for Jewish people) and unless they were on BB service, they wouldn't be in contact with blood. Such a schedule would be easy to make for a person during the Ramadan season.
 
Like I said:

I know these circumstances would probably not all happen at once, but on any major holiday there would be chaos if anyone was allowed to set limits on their patient care due to religous beliefs. Don't forget that it is not just doctors I am talking about, there are nurses and techs also that must be considered in the same equation.
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I know of lots of nurses who don't work on Sundays because it's against their personal belief. So that argument doesn't apply.

But like I said, choosing a specific specialty would make it possible.
 
Originally posted by Firebird
The scenario you provided was absolutely ludicrous. That would never happen, not in a million years...well, maybe once in a MILLION years.

You assume that there are a lot of very deeply religious people out there who are interested in medicine, but not interested in making concessions. In fact, there are not. Most are willing to make any concession they can to be a doctor. The example you bring up about Jewish people working on the Sabbath. This is completely contrary to Jewish law, but most are willing to make an exception. There is, no doubt, a very small group that would not do this.

The point is...there will only be a handful of people who are not willing to budge an inch from their religious beliefs. It would not be incredibly easy to accomodate them, but they deserve the same opportunities as you do. It would certainly be possible to help them out.

Perhaps their specialties could be limited to where they would be more apt to fit within their belief system. For example, Pathology residents typically don't work weekends (good for Jewish people) and unless they were on BB service, they wouldn't be in contact with blood. Such a schedule would be easy to make for a person during the Ramadan season.
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Actually, that is all nonsense.

And medical students must do everything, not just the specialties that fit in their "belief system."
 
Originally posted by doc05
Actually, that is all nonsense.

And medical students must do everything, not just the specialties that fit in their "belief system."
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It is not nonsense. Nonsense is when you make a statement and provide no argument to its credibility.

Medical School clinicals are different. There is much more leniency (sp?) with schedules. Loma Linda allows its students to go to church and then return to their clerkship on Sundays. I suspect many other medical schools would make similar concessions.
 
Nonsense or not, you still missed the whole point!! If a doctor or student or who ever is allowed to leave the hospital due to religion than that is fine. HOWEVER, if the person is forced to work, than that person CAN NOT refuse to treat a patient based on religion. That is called..... abandonment and is a criminal offense. The student who was repremanded and kicked off the surgical rotation for refusing to touch blood because it was Ramadan was done with just cause. I would want MY doctor to treat me immediately and completely no matter what his/her religous beliefs are. You need to reread the hippocratic oath.
 
Originally posted by bts4202
Nonsense or not, you still missed the whole point!! If a doctor or student or who ever is allowed to leave the hospital due to religion than that is fine. HOWEVER, if the person is forced to work, than that person CAN NOT refuse to treat a patient based on religion. That is called..... abandonment and is a criminal offense. The student who was repremanded and kicked off the surgical rotation for refusing to touch blood because it was Ramadan was done with just cause. I would want MY doctor to treat me immediately and completely no matter what his/her religous beliefs are. You need to reread the hippocratic oath.
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Ok, I will be mature enough to admit it. I did miss the point you were making. If a doctor leaves his patient, that's big trouble. However, a person with such beliefs should take care of the problem before he is put in that situation.

If I am about to leave the wards for church on Sunday morning, I would have no problem whatsoever saving a person's life if there was a problem. My whole point was, that there shoudl be concessions made so that a person with reasonable beliefs and needs can be accomodated into the medical profession.
 
Very interesting discussion, and with minimal flames no less. I'm impressed.
 
Originally posted by Firebird
Ok, I will be mature enough to admit it. I did miss the point you were making. If a doctor leaves his patient, that's big trouble. However, a person with such beliefs should take care of the problem before he is put in that situation.

If I am about to leave the wards for church on Sunday morning, I would have no problem whatsoever saving a person's life if there was a problem. My whole point was, that there shoudl be concessions made so that a person with reasonable beliefs and needs can be accomodated into the medical profession.
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of couse reasonable accomodation is appropriate. But kicking the student off the surgery rotation was entirely appropriate. don't tell me he didn't know about ramadan until he began the rotation? or did he suddenly convert mid-way through the clerkship? Religious observance is an entirely PREDICTABLE thing. Based on the calendar.... In the case you mentioned, the student should not have been taking the surgery rotation during ramadan if that was a problem. Schools tend to be very accomodating if you give them enough time. But -- to allow that same student to not perform his duties IS inexcusable, and would be unfair to every other student rotating with him, because they would have to pick up the slack for this guy.

bottom line -- any personal matter, religious or otherwise, that may interfere with your clinical responsibilites, should be dealt with as soon as you are aware of any conflict. otherwise you are negligent.
 
This thread is taking a different tone.......no probs. Just an update, i quit the phlebotomy job after 3weeks.....as i am in a better position now. :clap: Plus, it is was a low paying job but nice environment.
 
As a student, I was on a rotation with a jewish student (rather unusual at my med school location). This individual requested (and got) off friday sundown to sat sundown for the entire rotation, regardless of when the rest of the team had to show up. Bacially, the person was told, sure work it out with the other students. So that left us stuck..we couldn't really say "no, that's not fair" lest we look like whiners. We had to admit more patients when this person wasn't there, and we had to cover this indivduals pts as well. Furthermore, this individual "made up" the call time by coming for call with another team (on a procedure heavy rotation) thus decreasing the number of procedures available for those students. (However, we got more when he was gone)

No one was happy with the situtation (except the Jewish student) but none of us felt free to complain. All we knew was that a Christain student probably wouldn't be able to get away with requesting to have every sunday off regardless of when the team was there.

So in addition to problems with pt care, someone with a special schedule due to religeous belief also causes unfair distribution of work.

If you must adhere to strict religous guidelines regarding scheduling, you need to be very careful choosing a specialty.
 
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EthylMethylMan
EthylMethylMan
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Any agencies/companies that can provide core clinical rotations for 3rd year med students?
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user94826231234
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greenturtle12
Do patients get grossed out if I touch them with my bare hands?
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PTPuser
PTPuser
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Away rotation in Atlanta
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1
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645
wysdoc
wysdoc
W
any clinical rotation program suggest for Ob/Gyn?
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