Endovascular Surgical Neuroradiology Fellowship

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M

mehamo

Other than UMDNJ-NJMS, Pitt, Cleveland Clinic and Johns Hopkins, are there any other fellowships of the sort open to neurologist and/or under the department of neurology rather than radiology?

Do you believe that there will be more fellowships open to neurologists and run by neurology-trained interventionalists within the next 5-10 years?

How difficult is it to get into such a fellowship?

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In short, yes many more programs accept neurology-trained fellows today than just a few years ago and more programs will in the near future. Here's a list I verified from directly from interventional neuroradiology fellowship directors at each institution that consider neurologists for INR training:

UMDNJ
Michigan State
Pittsburgh
Cleveland Clinic
MGH
Emory
UT-Houston
UCLA
Barrow NI
Boston University
Minnesota
NYU
WashU
Tufts
Medical College of Wisconsin


These have previously trained neurologists but I have not verified it yet directly from their fellowship directors:

Duke
Columbia
Cornell
UCSD
and am sure there are others but I haven't had a chance to look into them.

You can get more information about interventional neurology at:

http://www.svineuro.org

The society of vascular and interventional neurology will have its 1st annual meeting in Boston on 4/28 and 4/29. You can register via their website under the events page.
 
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Anyone know approximatly how many hours these interventionalists work a week and how much they make in a yr?

Also, what is the job outlook for someone who completes a behavioral neurology/neuropsychiatry fellowship following a neurology residency and incorporates eeg, etc in a private practice?
 
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Thanks for the info neurosign.

Here's another question for the forum, how much general neurology do "interventional neurologists" do? Are they stuck in the cath lab all day? Ward time? nonvascular clinic time?

I'm assuming it varies, just wondering what people are doing & what their impressions are?
 
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At my institution, several of the neuroIR people with a neuro background also did neuroICU fellowships, and so they attend on the neuroICU from time to time. Some of the neuroIR folks also have clinics where they see people for elective coilings and stentings, but that isn't really a "general neurology" clinic.
 
That's a good question. Neurointerventionalists do not practice a lot of general neurology as most patients are referrals from stroke and general neurologists.

I can tell you that after rotating with an interventionalist recently in a busy academic setting, the routine schedule is comprised of elective/planned procedures during the weekdays (such as carotid stenting, tumor embolizations, vertebral kyphoplasties, and diagnostic angiographies) and emergent interventions while on call in the evenings and weekends (strokes/symptomatic aneurysms/AVMs). The work hours thus vary on a weekly basis depending on the amount of emergent cases.

On certain afternoons, maybe 1-2 per week, the interventionalist will see follow-up patients in their clinic post stenting, tumor embo, for future procedure planning, or staged interventions. The neurological background is applied throughout, from initial evaluation, peri-procedure, and on followups so its critical to have solid neuro training which also gives neurointerventionalists an inherent clinical advantage among their colleagues from radiology and neurosurgery (who have their own strengths).

Regarding the salary issue, it depends on private vs academic, amount of diagnostic neuroradiology vs interventional procedures, and if private the strength of the interventional unit. In private practice, a neuro-interventionalist generally starts out around $400,000 with income potential as high as $900,000. This is not something I read somewhere, but based on interactions with INR fellows I worked with who are assessing the job market and the numbers they've been quoted/offered.
 
I would also add to the list Case-Western (done so in the past) and UBuffalo (Dr. Qureshi the president of the SVIN trained there).

Below is the official SVIN link for neurology based ESN programs. But as many have already stated, there are many that are accepting neurologists, since interventional stroke modalities will most likley become the standard of care in the next several years.

http://www.svineuro.org/fellowships/default.asp?id=20
 
checked out the web site. i know neurinterventional has been discussed often...

anyone else find these fellowship requirements extremely interesting?

a) neurology + neurocritical care or vascular
vs.
b)rads + neurorads
vs.
c)neurosurg

even with fellowship after neuro, and rads etc, coming into neurointerventional these fellows will have _vastly_ different backgrounds and qualifications. i'm sure people have given some thought to this? have people from each background already made their way into neurointerventional? i wonder what the strengths and weak points of each path are... im thinking about the field, i really like neuroicu right now and may pursue fellowship..still another year to decide..

are the typical fellowships _after_ neurology + 1 yr of neuro ICU, one or two years more of neurointerventional? i see some of them are combined 3 year neuroicu/endovascular? hard to sort out..

anyone know a list of good neuroicu fellowships?

scm
 
have people from each background already made their way into neurointerventional? i wonder what the strengths and weak points of each path are... im thinking about the field, i really like neuroicu right now and may pursue fellowship..still another year to decide..

are the typical fellowships _after_ neurology + 1 yr of neuro ICU, one or two years more of neurointerventional? i see some of them are combined 3 year neuroicu/endovascular? hard to sort out..

People from all three backgrounds are in ESN...with the current majority coming from Radiology. They all have respective strengths and weaknesses. Waning interest among Radiologists and large overlap of Neurological subject matter have opened the door for the additional two specialties.

Neurologists typcially complete a minimum of two years of Neurocritical care and/or Vascular/Stroke before starting ESN. Another year (or two) of Neuroimaging can also be tacked on, though Neuroimaging requirements can actually be satisfied during the course of residency if you are aggressive and document your Neuroradiology caseload. Various journals and websites publish the formal educational criteria.

The fellowship is definitely cool, though it remains less popular among Neurologists, Neurosurgeons, and Radiologists than might be considered at first blush - largely secondary to protracted education time, and real-world lifestyle.
 
For clarification, the training pathway from neurology consists of:

neurology (3 years) -->
vascular/stroke (1 year) OR neuro-critical care (2 years)-->
neuroradiology* (6 monthts to 1 year) -->
neuro-interventional (1 year)

*the neuroradiology portion at some programs is integrated into the interventional fellowship.

TOTAL YEARS in TRAINING after NEUROLOGY: 3 years, equivalent to most medicine fellowships. It seems longer because it involves training in stroke then neuroimaging then interventional but its actually no different in duration than training in medicine then doing interventional cards, for example.
 
For clarification, the training pathway from neurology consists of:

neurology (3 years) -->
vascular/stroke (1 year) OR neuro-critical care (2 years)-->
neuroradiology* (6 monthts to 1 year) -->
neuro-interventional (1 year)

*the neuroradiology portion at some programs is integrated into the interventional fellowship.

TOTAL YEARS in TRAINING after NEUROLOGY: 3 years, equivalent to most medicine fellowships. It seems longer because it involves training in stroke then neuroimaging then interventional but its actually no different in duration than training in medicine then doing interventional cards, for example.


At UMDNJ and Minn the ESN fellows spend two years in the angio suite. The first year is geared towards proficiency in diagnostic cerebral angiography and the second year is aimed at giving the fellow competence in interventional procedures.

The actual neuroradiology training is pretty much limited to angiography. I do believe that other programs have devoted neuroradiology reading time (I think the MGH program is one of these?)??
 
For clarification, the training pathway from neurology consists of:

neurology (3 years) -->
vascular/stroke (1 year) OR neuro-critical care (2 years)-->
neuroradiology* (6 monthts to 1 year) -->
neuro-interventional (1 year)

*the neuroradiology portion at some programs is integrated into the interventional fellowship.

For the vascular/stroke or Neuro cc step, do you think doing 2 years of Neuro CC puts you at a better advantage than 1 yr of vascular?
The ACGME guidelines mention 1 year of vascular prior to ESN fellowship. What are your thoughts on this?
Thanks.
 
Thanks but I probably wasn't clear in my question.
At this stage of fellowship - vascular/stroke (1 year) OR neuro-critical care (2 years) - is it easier to obtain a ESN fellowship if one does Neuro CC instead of vascular? Or does it not matter?
 
Thanks but I probably wasn't clear in my question.
At this stage of fellowship - vascular/stroke (1 year) OR neuro-critical care (2 years) - is it easier to obtain a ESN fellowship if one does Neuro CC instead of vascular? Or does it not matter?

Sorry, my previous reply was to the question above yours. Regarding vascular vs ncc, the applicant will not be at a disadvantage either way. Its based on your interest in the field and whether you have sought out opportunities learn about interventional neuro, ie, by doing elective rotations and clinical research. Both fellowship tracks to neuro-interventional training are accepted paths based on the guidelines.
 
As of now, Tufts does not have active fellowship program (based on what I was told).

Is there anyone going to SVIN Practicum?
 
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I believe Tufts' INR program is run by its affilliate Lahey Clinic.
 
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