ethic question: how to deal w/ ferrets in CA?

[icanhascheezbur]

I had been thinking of ethical questions and one is dealing w/ ferrets in California where it is illegal to have one. However, ferrets are legal in many other states. One website says that ferrets are illegal in CA because Fish and Game Dept fears that ferrets may overrun endogenous species. However, it's been estimated that thousands of ferrets are illegally being kept as pets in CA. If a ferret were presented to you (as a theoretical vet) in CA, how would you approach it?

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[HopefulAg]

I'd imagine that you'd have to deny it treatment since it is technically illegal, despite what other states do. They can always cross state lines to get it treated.

Only exception I would think is if you deem the ferret as dying and you're able to render care, and this might be a loophole to be able to treat them regularly that vets use (I don't know, just a thought).

I'm no lawyer, but I'd imagine that since they are illegal, if you're 'caught' treating one you could be brought up on charges. Also if you don't report someone as owning one, you may also be able to be charged with something like 'obstruction of justice' since, again, it's illegal to own one. I think that'd be frivolous but it could happen if the cop is pissed off, doesn't like you, was told he smells like a ferret, or what have you. It would be the same in the letter of the law as not reporting any other crime.

 

[VeganSoprano]

Your obligation is to treat the patient, not enforce the law.

On a similar note, lots of communities have pet limit laws. You wouldn't refuse to treat the fifth pet in a household if there is a five pet limit, would you?

And from a public health standpoint, it is only harmful to refuse to treat an animal that is presented to you. Think about it: you refuse to vaccinate a ferret, a bat gets in the house and exposes the ferret to rabies, the ferret gets rabies and exposes the family. It would be a devastating scenario, and so easily prevented.

Nowhere in the veterinarian's oath is there anything about an obligation to "enforce arbitrary laws". The obligation to promote animal and public health, however, is clear.

 

[dgm]

On a similar note, lots of communities have pet limit laws. You wouldn't refuse to treat the fifth pet in a household if there is a five pet limit, would you?

No, because the fifth pet is still within the limit
(Just messing around, I know what you meant)

 

[dyachei]

Your obligation is to treat the patient, not enforce the law.

On a similar note, lots of communities have pet limit laws. You wouldn't refuse to treat the fifth pet in a household if there is a five pet limit, would you?

And from a public health standpoint, it is only harmful to refuse to treat an animal that is presented to you. Think about it: you refuse to vaccinate a ferret, a bat gets in the house and exposes the ferret to rabies, the ferret gets rabies and exposes the family. It would be a devastating scenario, and so easily prevented.

Nowhere in the veterinarian's oath is there anything about an obligation to "enforce arbitrary laws". The obligation to promote animal and public health, however, is clear.

You are in fact obligated to follow the laws as a member of that community. The only loophole is the one that was already mentioned by hopefulAg. Even if you disagree with the laws it doesn't mean that you should ignore them. And you're not obligated to enforce them, you're absolutely right. But legal liability for you and your practice isn't something I'd want to mess around with.

 

[rugbychick16]

Because you would be treating the ferret under a confidential VCPR, you would in fact have to tell no authorities about the fact that you are treating an "illegal species". Many, many vets in california do this. Yes, there might be a danger of your staff turning you in, but its unlikely, and there are so many vets in california that treat ferrets anyway, its unlikely you would get disciplined for it. Anyway, thousands of people in california have ferrets, and they are mostly cared for by veterinarians within the state.

*knowledge obtained from a classmate from california who worked at a clinic that routinely saw ferrets and an interesting VIN discussion on this topic. (all the vets who replied to that topic on VIN said they would not let the law stop them from treating the ferret).*

Like said previously, its a law against OWNING then, there is no law saying its illegal to TREAT them.

 

[rugbychick16]

Same applies to sugar gliders, degus, and hedgehogs, all of which are technically illegal to own in CA.... (I mean really-cute little hedgies???)

Think about it-all the Petsmarts, etc in California sell ferret supplies. Should the store get in trouble with the law for "promoting" ferret ownership?

 

[No Imagination]

Like said previously, its a law against OWNING then, there is no law saying its illegal to TREAT them.

Thats a good point! Many people bring in feral cats which are not their own to vaccinate/sterilize then release.

In terms of ferrets, and I don't know the details of the laws... What if the person A) Didn't own the pet, merely was having it 'treated' B) Didn't live in CA (or any state were they were illegal to own).

In NYC, for a while anyway (may still be the case) - Green Iguana's were illegal. By law you had to bring them into the CACC (Center for Animal Care and Control) where they would be euthanized. Many vets still treated them however.

In terms of treating the ferret - thats another issue. Again, in NYC, it was illegal? for a vet to treat what the city coined as 'wildlife' without some sort of certification (beyond being a licensed vet). The guy I worked for turned away everything from squirrels, wild birds, chimpmonks... that sort of thing.

 

[Shanomong]

.

 

[Minnerbelle]

If I remember correctly, if a ferret ends up in the humane society as a "stray" in Cali, then even if the owners shows up... they're not allowed to take them home.

 

[VAgirl]

There's actually been a change in CA, and vets are allowed to treat ferrets. People are still not allowed to own ferrets, but vets won't get in any trouble for treating them and you don't have to report the owner. I don't know anything more about it because it isn't my area of interest. I just know this because it's what the UC Davis VMTH staff told us last year during our companion exotics handling class while we were learning about ferrets.

So, no dilemma! Not sure where you can go to read more on it, but there must be resources somewhere out there that specifically outline this policy.

 

[StayingHopeful]

The law in CA is that you cannot "own" a ferret or have one in your possession for non-medical reasons. In our ethics class we talked about ferrets a week ago and the professor said that you can treat them and that you and your staff are not in any risk of breaking laws because the law covers you for that (but that you also aren't obligated to treat them if you feel uncomfortable). As the vet and staff you are protected but he said that technically he isn't sure it's okay to board a ferret that doesn't need care because then it is in your "possession." So it sounds like it is totally legal to treat them (as patients) or to keep them in your clinic if they are "hospitalized" as long as they are not just "boarding."

I hope that helps!

 

[icanhascheezbur]

Thanks for your replies! They've been very helpful!

I haven't seen a ferrret in CA but when I was living in St. Louis I saw a couple ferrets. I couldn't think of euthanizing them just because they are illegal in CA. But I'm glad to know that it's okay to treat them!

 

[chris03333]

I had been thinking of ethical questions and one is dealing w/ ferrets in California where it is illegal to have one. However, ferrets are legal in many other states. One website says that ferrets are illegal in CA because Fish and Game Dept fears that ferrets may overrun endogenous species. However, it's been estimated that thousands of ferrets are illegally being kept as pets in CA. If a ferret were presented to you (as a theoretical vet) in CA, how would you approach it?

It is legal to treat a ferret like any other patient in CA. It is illegal to own one, but a veterinarian can treat any ferrets. They cannot board them though.

 

[cowgirla]

On a similar note, I know there are areas that don't allow Wolf-hybrids to be kept as pets, and yet, every vet I've worked with has had no issue treating these dogs.

There are some small towns and neighborhoods around here that have breed restrictions as well--and yet the pitties and rotties and dobies have no problem finding vet care.

I would think this would partially covered under the AVMA guidelines-- how confidentiality of records should be maintained in the ideal practice, etc.

 

[PigsRock]

Same applies to sugar gliders, degus, and hedgehogs, all of which are technically illegal to own in CA.... (I mean really-cute little hedgies???)

Think about it-all the Petsmarts, etc in California sell ferret supplies. Should the store get in trouble with the law for "promoting" ferret ownership?

This made me look up what a degu is. Adorable!!!

 

[natalieises]

Random but sort of on topic about the wildlife thing: I know in illinois you cannot treat wildlife unless you have special permits. We've had to turn people away that have brought us crazy stuff before like a fox. I'm guessing it has something to do with the disease risk, but I should look into that!

 

[sofficat]

Random but sort of on topic about the wildlife thing: I know in illinois you cannot treat wildlife unless you have special permits. We've had to turn people away that have brought us crazy stuff before like a fox. I'm guessing it has something to do with the disease risk, but I should look into that!

From what I've been told, a vet is allowed to take in, perform any treatments to stabilize the wildlife, but they have to contact the appropriate places to pick up the critters. I know this specifically for raptors (eagles, hawks, owls etc), since they are protected under federal laws. As a vet you can accept a raptor (and can treat it) but must call the state/fed whoever within 24 hours.

 

[natalieises]

interesting. I just know that when people have brought things the vet always tells them they can't do anything by law without permits for wildlife. Maybe there are different laws on protected species though. Thanks for the info I will have to do some researching

 

[GeeQued]

The law in CA is that you cannot "own" a ferret or have one in your possession for non-medical reasons. In our ethics class we talked about ferrets a week ago and the professor said that you can treat them and that you and your staff are not in any risk of breaking laws because the law covers you for that (but that you also aren't obligated to treat them if you feel uncomfortable). As the vet and staff you are protected but he said that technically he isn't sure it's okay to board a ferret that doesn't need care because then it is in your "possession." So it sounds like it is totally legal to treat them (as patients) or to keep them in your clinic if they are "hospitalized" as long as they are not just "boarding."

I hope that helps!

How much I hate our ethics class... At least its useful in answering SDN questions.

 

[Bill59]

How much I hate our ethics class... At least its useful in answering SDN questions.

Don't worry, these theoretical question will become real questions soon enough.

 

[jpeterman13]

On a similar note, I know there are areas that don't allow Wolf-hybrids to be kept as pets, and yet, every vet I've worked with has had no issue treating these dogs.

I've often wondered the same thing. Even though I am 100% against the ownership of hybrids, I can't help but think it'll be something that comes up once or twice...the danger to doctors and staff would be my #1 concern.

 

[badcats]

I've often wondered the same thing. Even though I am 100% against the ownership of hybrids, I can't help but think it'll be something that comes up once or twice...the danger to doctors and staff would be my #1 concern.

I don't agree with this mindset of wolf dogs being a higher risk than a typical dog breed. Would you really worry more about the "hybrid" than some of the other dog breeds that are stereotyped as aggressive? What about the dog breeds NOT known for aggression,you still see ones that try to take off your fingers. The point is you can't judge a dog by its breed or heritage, and common sense should be used around all strange animals.
Legally it would be a similar situation to the ferrets I believe, where you are allowed to treat but not to possess, and confidentiality prevents you from having to report owners. I have also heard of people just representing their "hybrids" as husky or malamute crosses to their vets or vets writing it in the chart this way, and most of the time no one is any wiser because unless the dog is super high content, they don't look any different.

 

[jpeterman13]

I don't agree with this mindset of wolf dogs being a higher risk than a typical dog breed. Would you really worry more about the "hybrid" than some of the other dog breeds that are stereotyped as aggressive? What about the dog breeds NOT known for aggression,you still see ones that try to take off your fingers. The point is you can't judge a dog by its breed or heritage, and common sense should be used around all strange animals.
Legally it would be a similar situation to the ferrets I believe, where you are allowed to treat but not to possess, and confidentiality prevents you from having to report owners. I have also heard of people just representing their "hybrids" as husky or malamute crosses to their vets or vets writing it in the chart this way, and most of the time no one is any wiser because unless the dog is super high content, they don't look any differentl

There is obviously a reason that they are illegal in so many states. Now, I totally agree that there are other high risk breeds, but they come from long lines of domesticated animals and are not a handful of generations away from a wild animal. But I truly believe that crossing an animal that gets fed canned food nightly with an animal that takes down his meals by going straight for the neck results in an increased risk of aggression. I've come into contact with countless pitbulls, rotties, g. shepards, and many other breeds that tend to be labeled as high risk breeds; and I can tell you that the 3 hybrids that I've come into contact with were by and far the most intimidating. They look at you completely different than other dogs, big surprise, they're half wild animal. Now am I saying that these animals should not be treated.. OF COURSE NOT! They deserve to live long and healthy life just as any dog does, it's not their fault. I'm just saying that I feel that there is an increased danger (Maybe I'm alone on this one); and am wondering what the convention is when they are brought into a clinic. P.S. This may come off as confrontational, but that's not intentional.

 

[cowgirla]

There is obviously a reason that they are illegal in so many states. Now, I totally agree that there are other high risk breeds, but they come from long lines of domesticated animals and are not a handful of generations away from a wild animal. But I truly believe that crossing an animal that gets fed canned food nightly with an animal that takes down his meals by going straight for the neck results in an increased risk of aggression. I've come into contact with countless pitbulls, rotties, g. shepards, and many other breeds that tend to be labeled as high risk breeds; and I can tell you that the 3 hybrids that I've come into contact with were by and far the most intimidating. They look at you completely different than other dogs, big surprise, they're half wild animal. Now am I saying that these animals should not be treated.. OF COURSE NOT! They deserve to live long and healthy life just as any dog does, it's not their fault. I'm just saying that I feel that there is an increased danger (Maybe I'm alone on this one); and am wondering what the convention is when they are brought into a clinic. P.S. This may come off as confrontational, but that's not intentional.

If the owner admits that it is a hybrid, my old clinic used to require a muzzle.
The problem comes when the owner does what another poster pointed out--they label their dog has a husky x, or whatever similar breed they come up with. The "good ones" are under their owners control and never presented a problem. These were people who did their research, had the experience to keep one of these, etc. I think it would be a totally different story if the hybrid wasn't kept well--they arent dogs and have completely different needs and requirements, which most people don't realize. I've met a few that were wonderful, obedient animals, and the cutest pups you'll ever see. I've also seen a few that I wouldn't trust alone in a room with me. They have no issues making and keeping eye contact with you, which can be a little disconcerting.

Part of the problem is that the commonly used rabies vaccines aren't listed for the wolf--we have no idea if that vaccine is even effective on them.

 

[badcats]

There is obviously a reason that they are illegal in so many states. Now, I totally agree that there are other high risk breeds, but they come from long lines of domesticated animals and are not a handful of generations away from a wild animal. But I truly believe that crossing an animal that gets fed canned food nightly with an animal that takes down his meals by going straight for the neck results in an increased risk of aggression. I've come into contact with countless pitbulls, rotties, g. shepards, and many other breeds that tend to be labeled as high risk breeds; and I can tell you that the 3 hybrids that I've come into contact with were by and far the most intimidating. They look at you completely different than other dogs, big surprise, they're half wild animal. Now am I saying that these animals should not be treated.. OF COURSE NOT! They deserve to live long and healthy life just as any dog does, it's not their fault. I'm just saying that I feel that there is an increased danger (Maybe I'm alone on this one); and am wondering what the convention is when they are brought into a clinic. P.S. This may come off as confrontational, but that's not intentional.

No worries about possible confrontation, tone is really hard to determine through text and depending on the time of day something can be horribly offensive or hilarious.
I get what you are saying about them being the most intimidating dog type that you have encountered, and yes some high content wolfdogs behave much more like wolves than dogs even though they are half. But I still feel that judgment of how to treat an animal should be based on how it is behaving, not on its breed. If it is staring you down in challenge by all means put a muzzle on it, regardless of it being a pit, dobie, or doxie.

I also agree with cowgirlLA saying that educated owners are the best thing for these dogs, and believe that laws exist because of that fact that the needs of these animals are so different from a domestic dog and many want them to prove their machismo or think they will be a good guard dog.

 

[No Imagination]

I can tell you that the 3 hybrids that I've come into contact with were by and far the most intimidating. They look at you completely different than other dogs...

I know exactly what you are talking about. We boarded (at a kennel) 4 Timber Wolves that were someones pet - they were awaiting transport to another facility in the Midwest. While I am pretty sure we legally should not have boarded them - it was an amazing experience.

And yes, those eyes. These guys were not at all aggressive, but I was scared ****less of them nonetheless. An aggressive Pit or Shep., I can "handle" in the sense that I knew what they were about.

But the wolves... yeah, something in the way they look at you. Not pets.

P.S. Never knowingly been around any hybrids, but I can only imagine

 

[No Imagination]

But I still feel that judgment of how to treat an animal should be based on how it is behaving, not on its breed. If it is staring you down in challenge by all means put a muzzle on it, regardless of it being a pit, dobie, or doxie.

I know what you are saying, but not sure I agree with you. Perhaps I should, but from experience, I treat Chows and Sharpie's different then Golden's and labs... regardless of how they are outwardly behaving.

Yes, i know any dog is capable of anything at any time... just speaking from experience

 

[cowgirla]

I know what you are saying, but not sure I agree with you. Perhaps I should, but from experience, I treat Chows and Sharpie's different then Golden's and labs... regardless of how they are outwardly behaving.

Yes, i know any dog is capable of anything at any time... just speaking from experience

Worst bite I ever got was from golden. I didn't even see it coming--he gave no warning signs at all, just clamped down on my wrist when I moved to restrain him. At least the horrible rotties and chows I've seen growl their fool heads off to warn you.

And I'd rather restrain a pittie than than a pug any day!

 

[CatVet2Be]

I don't agree with this mindset of wolf dogs being a higher risk than a typical dog breed. Would you really worry more about the "hybrid" than some of the other dog breeds that are stereotyped as aggressive?

We just discussed this in our animal behavior class last week and yes I would absolutely worry more about the hybrid breed. There's a reason it's never recommended to take in a wild animal and try to make it a pet. They don't make good pets because they're unpredictable. A wolf hybrid may have some tame dog in him but he also has a wild and very dangerous part to him as well. In most dogs if you trigger "prey drive" they can stop without having to complete it. If you trigger that in a wild animal their instincts are to follow that pattern of behavior all the way through to kill. Yes there are domestic dogs out there who are capable of killing but those account for a very small percentage, whereas I would say the majority of wolves will do this.
Also, as much as I hate to stereotype dogs there is a reason for a lot of the stereotypes. I'm going to be extra cautious when dealing with a chow because they tend to give less warning prior to biting. I'll be more careful with the rottie and pits because if they do bite, they can cause more severe damage. And I'll never let anyone hand me a chihuahua face first. No explanation needed for that one.

 

[cowgirla]

We just discussed this in our animal behavior class last week and yes I would absolutely worry more about the hybrid breed. There's a reason it's never recommended to take in a wild animal and try to make it a pet. They don't make good pets because they're unpredictable. A wolf hybrid may have some tame dog in him but he also has a wild and very dangerous part to him as well. In most dogs if you trigger "prey drive" they can stop without having to complete it. If you trigger that in a wild animal their instincts are to follow that pattern of behavior all the way through to kill. Yes there are domestic dogs out there who are capable of killing but those account for a very small percentage, whereas I would say the majority of wolves will do this.
Also, as much as I hate to stereotype dogs there is a reason for a lot of the stereotypes. I'm going to be extra cautious when dealing with a chow because they tend to give less warning prior to biting. I'll be more careful with the rottie and pits because if they do bite, they can cause more severe damage. And I'll never let anyone hand me a chihuahua face first. No explanation needed for that one.

Chihuahuas, also known as landsharks...
A few of my techs used to laugh whenever I called them that. Needless to say, they've converted to my way of thinking!

 

[badcats]

We just discussed this in our animal behavior class last week and yes I would absolutely worry more about the hybrid breed. There's a reason it's never recommended to take in a wild animal and try to make it a pet. They don't make good pets because they're unpredictable. A wolf hybrid may have some tame dog in him but he also has a wild and very dangerous part to him as well. In most dogs if you trigger "prey drive" they can stop without having to complete it. If you trigger that in a wild animal their instincts are to follow that pattern of behavior all the way through to kill. Yes there are domestic dogs out there who are capable of killing but those account for a very small percentage, whereas I would say the majority of wolves will do this.
Also, as much as I hate to stereotype dogs there is a reason for a lot of the stereotypes. I'm going to be extra cautious when dealing with a chow because they tend to give less warning prior to biting. I'll be more careful with the rottie and pits because if they do bite, they can cause more severe damage. And I'll never let anyone hand me a chihuahua face first. No explanation needed for that one.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the issue was the dog biting a tech or vet, not chasing down a smaller animal because it has high prey drive. In a veterinary situation, biting would usually stem from fear. I get what you mean, and it is true that there are reasons for the stereotypes, but not all will behave this way as I am sure you know.

 

[DVMDream]

I haven't seen a wolf hybrid in a clinic setting. I did see one at a PetsMart once; the owner was walking it on a rope. I have dealt with many aggressive dogs from chows to g. shepards to rotties and of course chihuahuas. I have to agree with cowgirla, chihuahuas are landsharks. I have encountered a rather large coyote. I was walking my little sister to a friend’s house down the street. The coyote was on one side and we were on the other. (Imagine neighborhood with houses on both sides and only 15 feet from one side to the other.) It never stopped staring at us. This coyote had to of been 45 to 50 pounds, if not bigger. It did not look at you the same way an aggressive dog would. It was a very creepy feeling having an animal stare at me the way that coyote did. I would have to say that I would also be a little more cautious if a wolf-hybrid came into the clinic. Better to error on the side of caution, than to get bit.

 

[sumstorm]

Chihuahuas, also known as landsharks...
A few of my techs used to laugh whenever I called them that. Needless to say, they've converted to my way of thinking!

We call them Chi-whoppers. Many seem to think they can whop anything.

However, having one in my home now, I can easily see why they are adored. Luckily, she is an angel with humans (even for blood draws and such)...but she backs the 70+ lb shepherd up on a regular basis.

As for the original question; consult a lawyer specializing in that field in the state of concern. I think giving legal advice here is as risky as giving medical advice. Then, with the legal facts and the parameters of the profession and your own personal beliefs, make a decision about what to do. I didn't think it was illegal to treat wildlife as long as the wildlife is then surrendered to the proper people, but each state will vary, so hard to know. Same with ferrets and other 'illegal' pets.

 

[icanhascheezbur]

Hmm... I like where this discussion is going.

I have actually met a wolf hybrid in St. Louis at a wedding reception. (I know it sounds really weird, and it's kinda a long story, but in short, the owner of the reception hall lived in the basement w/ his two dogs.)

I'd never met a wold hybrid ever, but when I met him I just thought he was like any other dog except I could definitely see the wolf resemblance. And he was humongous--when standing up, he reached 7 feet literally. Despite his big size, he was pretty calm and I didn't fear him. In fact, I was more bothered by the owner's other dog, a pit bull, that was literally pummeling me w/ his body and tail from being so excited at seeing a stranger. (I love friendly pits)

But anyway, that was my wolf hybrid experience. In treating this kind of dog, I would most likely use a muzzle during treatment--I hate it say it because it's 'dog breed profiling'. But if the dog proves itself to be submissive, then I might feel more comfortable and be more lenient.

 

[CatVet2Be]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the issue was the dog biting a tech or vet, not chasing down a smaller animal because it has high prey drive.

That's part of the point though, I imagine a small child or a person in a vulnerable position could trigger this and the attack that could ensue could be lethal. In a veterinary setting most dogs bite out of fear and most will give adequate warning. A wild animal that feels cornered is much more likely to lash out than an animal who over centuries has been bred to be more tolerant of human interactions. A lot has to do with socializing but I think you have more to overcome with a wild or hybrid animal.

 

[Walsh1122]

I found this article on DVM 360 today. I thought it related well to the original topic. http://veterinarynews.dvm360.com/dv...Article/detail/638791?contextCategoryId=38114

 

[sumstorm]

One thing to remember about hybrids is that they are 'cool' in some circles these days...which means that some fool goes out and finds a dog that looks a bit like a wolf, breeds it to another dog that might look a bit like a wolf, then charges really high prices for a 'genuine' wolf hybrid. Just like the super duper hypoallergenic designer labradoodle (we had one recently come in that had wire hair...like wire haired terrier hair....hmmm...I wonder...)

When people talk about hybrids, I first take it with a grain of salt and use my personal judgement to assess the animal and decide if I am willing to deal with it. When people tell me they know of hybrids that are just giant lap dogs that adore children and live peacefully with rabbits, I wonder just how hybrid those animals actually are.

 

[icanhascheezbur]

Thanks for the interesting read Walsh1122!

 

[Electrophile]

During our virology class last year, we discussed wolf dogs. Our professor was VERY strongly against them and warned us quite sternly to not knowingly vaccinate them for rabies because it is not legal to do so in a private practice setting. In a zoo setting, they do indeed use the standard dog rabies vaccine for wolves and other canids (I saw them given to an African wild dog and a maned wolf at the Omaha Zoo), but they cannot be given otherwise except the vaccine baits they have tried, but that's a different story. I personally disagree with this because I feel that an owner will be less likely to report a bite incident because they know the animal's head must come off, whereas with a dog, it can simply be quarantined if it was vaccinated. If a wolfdog owner hides the bite, I think this can be a bigger potential problem because they won't seek treatment as quickly. JMHO.

I've had some experience with wolfdogs and lots of experience with Northern breeds. Wolfdogs are kind of a bit like dairy bulls. You can work with them and there's some "nice" ones out there that won't always kill you as soon as look at you, but don't trust them. I even fostered one for a weekend from the shelter (they were told it was a GSD/Malamute cross, but I am pretty experienced with both German shepherds and huskies and Malamutes, and this was not one). I don't know if he was high content or not, but he was just different. I didn't have my $550 escape proof aluminum crate at the time, but he popped off the door of my standard plastic crate in no time at all. I slept on the couch that night with him leashed to my wrist so he wouldn't destroy my house or kill my dogs. Here was Colorado (since I couldn't crate him, he ended up going back to the shelter and onto a rescue):

Beautiful animals and I think there are certain folks who can safely own them if they have proper containment (i.e.-a digproof 8 foot tall enclosure, perhaps with hotwire), but I've met a couple wolfdog people who were either 1) in it for the status symbol and/or 2) just bat**** crazy. I also don't think they should be intentionally bred either. There's just too many of them which end up homeless because their owner just wasn't prepared to deal with them.

 

[Bill59]

During our virology class last year, we discussed wolf dogs. Our professor was VERY strongly against them and warned us quite sternly to not knowingly vaccinate them for rabies because it is not legal to do so in a private practice setting.

That depends on the individual state's practice act. In some states it's legal for veterinarians to treat wolf hybrids, including vaccinating them for rabies.

 

[sumstorm]

That depends on the individual state's practice act. In some states it's legal for veterinarians to treat wolf hybrids, including vaccinating them for rabies.

I think (could be wrong) that is still off label use and the animal will likely be ordered destroyed for testing if an incident occured. So while it may not be illegal to treat or to use the rabies vaccine (I would think it would be odd to be illegal to use a rabies vaccine off label) on a hybrid the end result may be very different if the hybrid is either the victim or the perpetrator of an incident.