Faculty vs. Residents

[penguins]

Hey Guys,
Have a question. When you guys are evaluating programs and your "rating" of the faculty and residents don't match, what is more important to you?
Example: the faculty seems solid, many years there, approachable, and likeable, enthusiastic about the program and learning. Then you meet the residents who maybe say they are happy there but you don't really like most of them and they don't seem enthusiastic.
My thinking is that residents come and go but faculty stays the same. At smaller programs it wouldn't be as important because you as an incoming PGY-2 would be making up a larger percentage of the personality whereas at a bigger program you would be more likely to be overpowered/ overwhelmed by the current existing tone.
Are faculty just better at faking and residents are too tired to fake it?
Does this question make sense? Sometimes there seems to be a dichotomy between residents and faculty and I am having trouble deciding which is more important.
Any imput would be great. Obviously, it is best when they match up but as I get farther down my rank list, #2 , it gets harder.

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[TruTrooper]

Hey Guys,
Have a question. When you guys are evaluating programs and your "rating" of the faculty and residents don't match, what is more important to you?
Example: the faculty seems solid, many years there, approachable, and likeable, enthusiastic about the program and learning. Then you meet the residents who maybe say they are happy there but you don't really like most of them and they don't seem enthusiastic.
My thinking is that residents come and go but faculty stays the same. At smaller programs it wouldn't be as important because you as an incoming PGY-2 would be making up a larger percentage of the personality whereas at a bigger program you would be more likely to be overpowered/ overwhelmed by the current existing tone.
Are faculty just better at faking and residents are too tired to fake it?
Does this question make sense? Sometimes there seems to be a dichotomy between residents and faculty and I am having trouble deciding which is more important.
Any imput would be great. Obviously, it is best when they match up but as I get farther down my rank list, #2 , it gets harder.

I say go with the Residents. They basically represent what it is like to continue training at a program no matter how often they turn over. This advice was given to me by a faculty member during an interview which I will post about soon as I can in the Feedback and Prep thread.

This is why programs allow you to have lunch with the Residents. The faculty will always try hard to sell their program and almost everyone of them seem very nice and ethusiastic but the Residents tell the whole story.

 

[penguins]

Thanks for your input, appreciate it. I know there is no way to like everyone and you make the best of it, but I mean more not liking the residents as people. Personality.

 

[Museless]

I'm going to post the opposing viewpoint - faculty is more important to me. I feel they more accurately reflect the prevailing tenor of a program as well, because they have been there longer and because they actively chose to join that program after a more extensive recruitment process than residents go through. The institution gave a direct offer, and they directly accepted - unlike the convoluted match we're subject to.

In neuro, the pgy3 and pgy4 residents will be gone by the time you get there, and even in integrated programs, I have yet to have the opportunity to meet any pgy1s. That leaves just the pgy2s, and then you're basing an important part of a major career decision on the personalities of just a couple people, when their behavior that day may've been influenced by their patient load, the fight they had with their girlfriend, whatever.

Of course it'd be ideal to like both, but I think a good faculty will have more influence on your years there (since they have more authority over you and are in a position to help you career-wise, or not) and because you can always find socialization elsewhere if you prefer not to hang out with your resident colleagues during free time.

 

[traveler]

Some programs have you call the attending directly, others have an upper level resident to consult. If I will be calling the attending directly in the middle of the night, my opinion of the faculty is more important.

 

[neglect]

You're going to be a resident, NOT a faculty member. Therefore, go with the residents. Sure, life may be great as a faculty person - but they are not taking call, doing scut, dealing with other services. When you interview for faculty spots, why would you take the resident's happiness into account?

 

[Mollaret]

...When you interview for faculty spots, why would you take the resident's happiness into account?

I disagree. If I knew that residents were unhappy, I would be concerned about taking a faculty position at an institution. Also, when applying for a faculty position in an academic program, the size and quality of the residency may be a factor.

When applying for a residency position, you need to take into account BOTH the faculty and residents, becuase you will work closely with both groups.

What did you specifically find concerning when talking to the residents? Did the residents seem unhappy and they were passing along their angst about the program?

I would explore this issue first. Decide whether you like the residency (hospital, structure, electives, call schedule, happiness of residents, board pass rate, city, etc.) and focus less on a few bad apples among the residents. As someone already stated, the senior residents you may not have liked will be long gone by the time you are a junior resident.

 

[TruTrooper]

I disagree. If I knew that residents were unhappy, I would be concerned about taking a faculty position at an institution. Also, when applying for a faculty position in an academic program, the size and quality of the residency may be a factor.

When applying for a residency position, you need to take into account BOTH the faculty and residents, becuase you will work closely with both groups.

What did you specifically find concerning when talking to the residents? Did the residents seem unhappy and they were passing along their angst about the program?

I would explore this issue first. Decide whether you like the residency (hospital, structure, electives, call schedule, happiness of residents, board pass rate, city, etc.) and focus less on a few bad apples among the

residents. As someone already stated, the senior residents you may not have liked will be long gone by the time you are a junior resident.

I find it hard to go much by faculty because they all seem to be nice and courteous. I admit (to my disappointment) that a couple didn't have much pep at all during the interviews but they still were nice. So I personally don't put much stock into the faculty unless they are just nasty to me which fortunately hasn't been my experience.

I think the residents represent future "us." As long as they seem satisfied with their residency I feel that I can be satisfied too if I liked the program features.

When I was interviewing for medical school, I was at one school where the faculty were outstanding then we reached lunch time with the M1s there. One student basically tried to fake happiness for a while but then just gave up and gave us the real deal. He gave a couple of us a detailed account why he wasn't happy at the school. I really looked more into his concerns and decided that the place wasn't for me. I was going to go there since it was my first choice. I eventually went to my second choice which I am glad I did.

Moral of the story - treat your residents and students well!