Fellowship application process moving to pgy3 year?

[chitown82]

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A PD at a well known IM program mentioned that for the graduating medical school class of 2010, the fellowship application process will move to the PGY3 year (a year later than at present). Applications would go out in the summer, interviews in the fall, match day in December, start in July. Can someone confirm this?

 

[jdh71]

A PD at a well known IM program mentioned that for the graduating medical school class of 2010, the fellowship application process will move to the PGY3 year (a year later than at present). Applications would go out in the summer, interviews in the fall, match day in December, start in July. Can someone confirm this?

It is being talked about. Although I have not heard about things being Implemented so soon

 

[Cards21aceking]

A PD at a well known IM program mentioned that for the graduating medical school class of 2010, the fellowship application process will move to the PGY3 year (a year later than at present). Applications would go out in the summer, interviews in the fall, match day in December, start in July. Can someone confirm this?

I believe that either we had the same interview date, or that PD has mentioned it on more than one occasion. From what i heard from other applicants who spoke with the PD, it was mentioned that the PD was on the committee that was approving the change and that it would be started "for your intern class" ~ PD.

 

[futureres]

I believe that either we had the same interview date, or that PD has mentioned it on more than one occasion. From what i heard from other applicants who spoke with the PD, it was mentioned that the PD was on the committee that was approving the change and that it would be started "for your intern class" ~ PD.

Is this real? I can't imagine this would be mandatory...let's think about this. So basically after completing IM residency you'd be forced to 1) do a year of research before beginning an intense fellowship, which I think is a bad idea since you'd be away from clinical medicine for an extended period of time or 2) you'd have to do a hospitalist year-which I DO NOT want to do at all or 3) be unemployed. Seriously. If applying during your 3rd year is ideal for personal reasons, do it, but there's no reason for those who know what they want to do by their pgy2 year to not be forced to "sit out" a year after residency when they can/should go right into fellowship. I'm interested in the rationale for this.

 

[GMed]

I believe that from what the PD had stated, the PD meant that you do not need to sit out for a year. The new system will be: Apply PGY 3, Get in PGY 3, Start fellowship PGY 4.

 

[chitown82]

I believe that from what the PD had stated, the PD meant that you do not need to sit out for a year. The new system will be: Apply PGY 3, Get in PGY 3, Start fellowship PGY 4.

Yes.

 

[souljah1]

It's fact. Applications will be in the summer of your PGY3 year and you'll match that year. Makes a ton of sense.

 

[chitown82]

It's fact. Applications will be in the summer of your PGY3 year and you'll match that year. Makes a ton of sense.

Cool. So is this official yet?

 

[unimaginative]

I also heard from a IM PD about this and I believe he was also involved in the actual planning but I recall him mentioning that while it was coming it was still a few years away but that it might happen to us.

 

[ResidentMD]

I also heard from a IM PD about this and I believe he was also involved in the actual planning but I recall him mentioning that while it was coming it was still a few years away but that it might happen to us.

I think this is a good move in general, especially for those programs that are front loaded, or those that have a ton of floor months in PGY1. The downside is those who apply for Cards or GI, and who may not match in their first time around, will have to drop a year before applying again.

 

[stillpremed]

which is the same downside that residents are experiencing now if they dont get in the first time around. no difference on that front whatsoever

 

[ResidentMD]

which is the same downside that residents are experiencing now if they dont get in the first time around. no difference on that front whatsoever

true...

 

[gold&black2005]

I believe that either we had the same interview date, or that PD has mentioned it on more than one occasion. From what i heard from other applicants who spoke with the PD, it was mentioned that the PD was on the committee that was approving the change and that it would be started "for your intern class" ~ PD.

heard the exact same thing, verbatim, from the exact same PD. Was surprised no one's mentioned this sooner...maybe we were all on the same interview day??

 

[Aciphex]

heard the exact same thing, verbatim, from the exact same PD. Was surprised no one's mentioned this sooner...maybe we were all on the same interview day??

sounds like the Penn Pd to me

 

[Keg]

Yeah, heard the same thing today, that this will apply for those starting internship July 1, 2010. Makes sense, but will make me completely reevaluate my rank list as residents at programs that got by on name alone (i.e. no or very little research time during first/second year) stand to lose some ability to get residents into the most competitive residencies. Gotta think about this.

 

[Scaredshizzles]

Yeah, heard the same thing today, that this will apply for those starting internship July 1, 2010. Makes sense, but will make me completely reevaluate my rank list as residents at programs that got by on name alone (i.e. no or very little research time during first/second year) stand to lose some ability to get residents into the most competitive residencies. Gotta think about this.

How much research time difference can there be between programs? There are some that have no elective time first year, but then they make up for it second year. Between the first two years, the research-elective time at the vast majority of programs will be about the same.

 

[futureres]

I believe that from what the PD had stated, the PD meant that you do not need to sit out for a year. The new system will be: Apply PGY 3, Get in PGY 3, Start fellowship PGY 4.

Ahhh...makes sense. It does basically work out the same, and you get more opportunities for letters. I'm curious what programs people feel place their residents into good fellowships based on "name alone." Do people expect that this would shift the balance in favor of some lower tier programs? Hmmm...*takes another look at the ROL*...

 

[GiHunter]

Am I the only one who thinks this is truly bad? I'm applying for a fellowship as a pgy-2 now and I can tell you this is a great feeling that after 1.3 years of pain, nobody can make you feel bad. I say 1.3 because you need about 4 months to get your letters That would suck if you had to have your A game on for ALL of internship AND PGY-2 (which is actually more intellectually stressful). I chose IM-->GI knowing that I would only have to put up with the pain for 1.3 years and I convinced myself it was not that different than matching into a ROAD field and doing a medicine internship anyway. I would re-consider IM if this went through.

I can see why PD's want to pass this. I will admit it SHOULD be after PGY-2 because internship and PGY-2 should both be equal factors in your evaluation. Also, applying just based on how you did in internship - most people are going to be the same on paper and fellowships end up looking at med school stuff a lot more.

 

[gutonc]

Am I the only one who thinks this is truly bad? I'm applying for a fellowship as a pgy-2 now and I can tell you this is a great feeling that after 1.3 years of pain, nobody can make you feel bad. I say 1.3 because you need about 4 months to get your letters That would suck if you had to have your A game on for ALL of internship AND PGY-2 (which is actually more intellectually stressful). I chose IM-->GI knowing that I would only have to put up with the pain for 1.3 years and I convinced myself it was not that different than matching into a ROAD field and doing a medicine internship anyway. I would re-consider IM if this went through.

Good point. I matched into the Research Pathway in Onc so actually applied for fellowship in my intern year. It was REALLY hard not to be completely checked out as soon as the Match results were available in June. My PGY2 year was kind of hard to take.

But I agree that it should probably move a little later. The current schedule likely reflects the pre-ERAS/Match need for a longer lead time which is no longer a huge issue.

 

[Mental Gymnast]

Good point. I matched into the Research Pathway in Onc so actually applied for fellowship in my intern year. It was REALLY hard not to be completely checked out as soon as the Match results were available in June. My PGY2 year was kind of hard to take.

But I agree that it should probably move a little later. The current schedule likely reflects the pre-ERAS/Match need for a longer lead time which is no longer a huge issue.

Gutonc,

So do you think this change would also apply for research pathway or ABIM short-track residents? ie would they then be applying for fellowship in the summer after intern year as opposed to four months into internship?

 

[gutonc]

Gutonc,

So do you think this change would also apply for research pathway or ABIM short-track residents? ie would they then be applying for fellowship in the summer after intern year as opposed to four months into internship?

Yes. I don't imagine they'd have a special interview season just for us. That would have been nice for me although my program was very good in setting up my schedule early in the year (a ward month, an ICU month and an Onc month) which allowed me to get good clinical/onc letters early in the year. Other programs are probably not so accomodating though.

 

[Mental Gymnast]

Yes. I don't imagine they'd have a special interview season just for us. That would have been nice for me although my program was very good in setting up my schedule early in the year (a ward month, an ICU month and an Onc month) which allowed me to get good clinical/onc letters early in the year. Other programs are probably not so accomodating though.

Thanks for your reply gutonc 🙂. Just PM'ed you.

 

[dragonfly99]

This would have been a better situation for me personally. I always thought it was still to have to apply so far ahead of time.
However, for people who have to move, sell a house, move their spouse and kids, etc. it will suck.