*fierce hip thrusts*

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3rd year is much better than the basic sciences.. if your goal is to be a clinical supastar not a mcq test taker.

but this thread is not about MS3, which does, in fact, suck a lot.

this thread is about 4th year........ which i will be living after 2 more weeks of waking up at 0445 for OB and a few pesky exams. living the dream. 👍
 
DrBowtie said:
You don't get it now, but you will. You've bought into the lie that 3rd year is so much better than basic sciences and that if you can just make it to 3rd year, you'll be much happier.
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Well in all fairness I'd much rather feel like I'm trying to accomplish something rather than listen to these godforsaken lectures all day every day. And I'm sure there's gonna be some really boring/horrendously malignant rotations. But at least I'll learn some of what I'm supposed to be able to know.
 
DrBowtie said:
You don't get it now, but you will. You've bought into the lie that 3rd year is so much better than basic sciences and that if you can just make it to 3rd year, you'll be much happier.
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He's an M4, I'm an about-M3. I was joking.

Though I do admittedly want to believe that M3 is at least "better" in some way despite being way more demanding. Like how, for me, M2 >>> M1 based entirely on content even though it was more difficult than M1.
 
ArcGurren said:
Well in all fairness I'd much rather feel like I'm trying to accomplish something rather than listen to these godforsaken lectures all day every day. And I'm sure there's gonna be some really boring/horrendously malignant rotations. But at least I'll learn some of what I'm supposed to be able to know.
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Don't worry. I agree with you and I'm a fourth year.
 
FauxGEEK said:
I'm going to be starting third year soon as well. I know I don't completely understand the suckiness of it because I have yet to experience it, but I'm for sure not looking forward to it. I do not understand why most of my classmates are so excited about third year starting. Of course I've wanted to go into Rads since I started med school sooo ... that may something about how I feel about the clinical aspect of medicine. haha
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I'm a Rads guy and 3rd year is just hit or miss. There are times where I feel it is awful and other times where I look at the 2nd years and am very happy. Of course every rotation has its drawbacks but I've seen benefits or enjoyed aspects of every rotation.

Medicine - intellectually stimulating and challenging (at my school scut work and dealing with social issues was minimal)

Surgery - trauma call is just exciting and fun and I found the laparoscopic cases interesting

Psych - dealing with PT schizos and manics is stressful yet exciting at the same time

Peds - saw some pretty rare stuff on inpatient and outpatient got repetitive but great patient population (except for some annoying parents)

FM - had it early on the year and just used it to practice my H&P skills and get more proficient

OB - only 2 weeks into it but I believe the ability to handle an uncomplicated SVD is a skill that every doc should have
 
Law2Doc said:
More like an apology for what's to come in the following years. Enjoy it. You are going to earn it later.
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It's too bad that the worst pain can't be contained the in the first year any longer. It used to be intern year was hell, but then it got better. New work hours really spread the pain around quite a bit, especially for you g-surg guys. In fact, I'd guess, and I'd only be guessing, but probably the least affected by the new hours would be ER, because its all shifts, and next by IM just because there are usually so many fleas crawling the hospital anyway, they have the numbers to absorb some of those shortages, even if it means 3rd years pitch in a little.

4th year is nice.
 
jdh71 said:
It's too bad that the worst pain can't be contained the in the first year any longer. It used to be intern year was hell, but then it got better. New work hours really spread the pain around quite a bit, especially for you g-surg guys. In fact, I'd guess, and I'd only be guessing, but probably the least affected by the new hours would be ER, because its all shifts, and next by IM just because there are usually so many fleas crawling the hospital anyway, they have the numbers to absorb some of those shortages, even if it means 3rd years pitch in a little.

4th year is nice.
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Yeah god forbid we make intern year bearable and not want to make people kill themselves from overwork 🙄
 
jdh71 said:
It's too bad that the worst pain can't be contained the in the first year any longer. It used to be intern year was hell, but then it got better. New work hours really spread the pain around quite a bit, especially for you g-surg guys. In fact, I'd guess, and I'd only be guessing, but probably the least affected by the new hours would be ER, because its all shifts, and next by IM just because there are usually so many fleas crawling the hospital anyway, they have the numbers to absorb some of those shortages, even if it means 3rd years pitch in a little.

4th year is nice.
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with the new work hours do you think prelims (who have matched into an advanced position in a diff specialty) will catch more flak than categoricals from upper level residents?
 
2012mdc said:
with the new work hours do you think prelims (who have matched into an advanced position in a diff specialty) will catch more flak than categoricals from upper level residents?
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In medicine, I doubt it. We treat medicine pre-lims the same as categorical first years (ie we CRAP on everyone!! - No discrimination!! [I joke]). I think it will definitely make those cushy transitional spots that much more cushy and competitive.
 
Did medicine interns usually hit the 80 hour mark? On frieda, it seems that the avg. work week is between 55-70 hours.

I feel like Intern year will be like the third year of med school except with responsibilities lol. We worked about 60 hours, then had to study for a shelf. I dunno, I have a feeling intern year will be a rude awakening.
 
DrVanNostran said:
Did medicine interns usually hit the 80 hour mark? On frieda, it seems that the avg. work week is between 55-70 hours.

I feel like Intern year will be like the third year of med school except with responsibilities lol. We worked about 60 hours, then had to study for a shelf. I dunno, I have a feeling intern year will be a rude awakening.
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I was usually over 70 but under 80. And it got better towards the end of the year when you get more efficient and don't have to come in quite as early, or can get out in the evening sooner. The programs that moved to a night-float type of system were able to cut way back on hours when you look at it averaged. Those programs that kept tradional call had higher hours. Add at least one 30 hour call onto the 40-50 or so hours and you've got your 80.
 
jdh71 said:
I was usually over 70 but under 80. And it got better towards the end of the year when you get more efficient and don't have to come in quite as early, or can get out in the evening sooner. The programs that moved to a night-float type of system were able to cut way back on hours when you look at it averaged. Those programs that kept tradional call had higher hours. Add at least one 30 hour call onto the 40-50 or so hours and you've got your 80.
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The real problem is that most medicine happens, most learning happens, most of the stuff you're there to do happens in the first 24 hours of admission. The diagnosis, the tests, the decisions, they are all there at admit. Once the diagnosis is known its just "follow up with social work, waiting for placement."

The new work hours are going to make dumber residents on the other end. This thinly veiled guise of "tired residents make more mistakes" is going to be overwhelmed by the "antsy residents trying to leave giving ****ty handoffs" is actually going to get more people hurt (IMO). Not to mention the lack of preparedness when its the intern's time to run a team. "Hey, you have to do a 30 hour call because your interns cant. Remember when you learned to do that? Oh that's right. Well, now you have no safety net. Ready? Set? LEARN!"

Destructocons for medical education. All so interns can sleep 🙁
 
2012mdc said:
I'm a Rads guy and 3rd year is just hit or miss. There are times where I feel it is awful and other times where I look at the 2nd years and am very happy. Of course every rotation has its drawbacks but I've seen benefits or enjoyed aspects of every rotation.

Medicine - intellectually stimulating and challenging (at my school scut work and dealing with social issues was minimal)

Surgery - trauma call is just exciting and fun and I found the laparoscopic cases interesting

Psych - dealing with PT schizos and manics is stressful yet exciting at the same time

Peds - saw some pretty rare stuff on inpatient and outpatient got repetitive but great patient population (except for some annoying parents)

FM - had it early on the year and just used it to practice my H&P skills and get more proficient

OB - only 2 weeks into it but I believe the ability to handle an uncomplicated SVD is a skill that every doc should have
Click to expand...

Thanks, this gives me hope! 👍
 
jdh71 said:
I was usually over 70 but under 80. And it got better towards the end of the year when you get more efficient and don't have to come in quite as early, or can get out in the evening sooner. The programs that moved to a night-float type of system were able to cut way back on hours when you look at it averaged. Those programs that kept tradional call had higher hours. Add at least one 30 hour call onto the 40-50 or so hours and you've got your 80.
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With the new intern rules, a lot of the lighter rotations are getting scaled back/ eliminated, so from what ive heard, a lot more people are going to average in the 70-80 range for more of their intern year. Lots of places can't afford the loss of man hours to give someone a cushy outpatient rheum month any more.

Also night float with 6 nights of 13 hours a week puts you at 78, so a lot of us who did night float this way sure didn't cut way back on hours. One code at the end of your shift could put you over 80 hours pretty frequently.
 
Maalik Ashtaar said:
I think everything is a lie now.... "nothing is true, everything is permitted" *jumps off of a ledge 100ft off the ground with a bird circling*
1 more year and I'll be like you guys
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LOL. Awesome. Did you see the trailer for Revelations from E3? It's sick.

jdh71 said:
Don't forget your binkie and sippie cup, homie . . .
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Incoming MS-1 here, but I agree with you. I would have rather had the harshest hours come during intern year and get it over with. Now it sounds like it'll be worse PGY-2 and beyond.

And IMHPMO (in my humble pre-med opinion), 2nd year > 3rd year or 3rd year > 2nd year seems entirely dependent on individual preferences, and also possibly how much scut you end up saddled with on rotations. I have no idea which I'll prefer.
 
Law2Doc said:
With the new intern rules, a lot of the lighter rotations are getting scaled back/ eliminated, so from what ive heard, a lot more people are going to average in the 70-80 range for more of their intern year. Lots of places can't afford the loss of man hours to give someone a cushy outpatient rheum month any more.

Also night float with 6 nights of 13 hours a week puts you at 78, so a lot of us who did night float this way sure didn't cut way back on hours. One code at the end of your shift could put you over 80 hours pretty frequently.
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It all depends on how many residents there are in the program and how many are necessary for the core services (university med or ICU or CCU for instance). So for some people the new hours will make for MORE hours per week with fewer in a row, but I think the way most IM programs are approaching it (at least the ones where I'm privy to some gossip), the hours will probably be fewer for the interns.
 
Only thing that stands between me and 4th year is one more shelf exam tomorrow.

SO glad to be done with third year rotations. For the most part I had good experiences and positive interactions with fellow students, but there were a small handful of people who are just insufferable to be around. I'm hoping I don't run into any of them this coming year.

I really like most of my classmates, but there are still a few among the bunch that remind me that medical students really can be some of the biggest douches in the world.
 
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