Filing a complaint against RFU BMS Program

[Johnny R]

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I am considering filing a complaint to the illinois board of higher education against Rosalind Franklin University. While I was in the progam I was tacitly assured by the faculty advisors that I would be accepted in their medical school after I successfully complete the program. The completely mislead me into finishing the program while I could have dropped out early on. At this point I am 50,000 dollars in debt with a degree that has no real value. And, I haven't been granted admission in their medical school.

I wanted to know if anyone has faced a similar situation and could give me some advice. My ultimate goal is to get my tuition + housing costs refunded to me.

Also, if anyone knows of a good lawyer that will work on contigency, please let me know


Thank you,

John

 

[trueBelief]

I am considering filing a complaint to the illinois board of higher education against Rosalind Franklin University. While I was in the progam I was tacitly assured by the faculty advisors that I would be accepted in their medical school after I successfully complete the program. The completely mislead me into finishing the program while I could have dropped out early on. At this point I am 50,000 dollars in debt with a degree that has no real value. And, I haven't been granted admission in their medical school.

I wanted to know if anyone has faced a similar situation and could give me some advice. My ultimate goal is to get my tuition + housing costs refunded to me.

Thank you,

John

I am sorry about your situation but you should realize that getting the money back is not going to give you a solution with what you want to do with your future. Think about what you can do to get into a medical school if that is still what you want to do. Undergrads from pretty much any university can gain admission to medical school if they have a good academic record and a well balanced set of EC's that show interest and passion in medicine. If you did all these things you could apply to other places and get in there. Also, ask yourself if you did the rest of the things applicants are supposed to do to see if they want to go into medicine like research, volunteering, etc because an absence of good experiences is grounds for rejection anywhere no matter what some advisor tells you.

 

[kia ora]

did you get this promise in writing? (let me guess...no)

was this promise...or "tacit assurance" as you call it, made before you enrolled in the program and if so, did you enroll in the program in reliance on this promise (again, I'm guessing no)

easy win for the school's lawyers
easy money for your lawyer

 

[Johnny R]

did you get this promise in writing? (let me guess...no)

was this promise...or "tacit assurance" as you call it, made before you enrolled in the program and if so, did you enroll in the program in reliance on this promise (again, I'm guessing no)

easy win for the school's lawyers
easy money for your lawyer

no promise in writing. But at the very least if i file a complaint to the accredition board, some other poor student wouldn't have to share my faith. Even if I can't win the lawsuit. Also the school is very shady given that they have been put on probation before for misaapropriating funds.

 

[XRanger]

When exactly did they promise you? in the beginning of the program, middle, end? and how did you do gradewise?

i dont know any medical postbac program that guarantees its student acceptance...maybe you should talk to the school's dean or your faculty advisor.

 

[njbmd]

The literature of this program clearly states that admission and completion of this program does not guarantee a seat in any other school at the university. My guess is you have a degree so now you have to figure out how to use that degree to do something. If you successfully completed this program, then you should be able to utilize you grades, LORs etc to apply to other schools much the same as any SMP/Masters degree.

Unless you were enrolled in a specific SMP with linkage (the Rosalind Franklin program is clearly not one of these), then you misunderstood the mission of that program. Right now, if medicine is your goal, you need to get to work on getting your application materials together and out.

Check with your local bar association as there are plenty of lawyers who do this type of work. I am sure that you can find someone to take your case if you have one.

 

[Mattabet]

You can file your complaint, but I think it'll be really, really difficult to get much of your money back through legal avenues or otherwise. But if filing the complaint gives you some piece of mind; go for it.

 

[MaybeADoc]

Hey John,

Granted I don't know you, but I am an M3 at RFU. I can tell you that they do indeed accept many people from the BMS program. It is well known among M1's even that you basically have to get A's in the BMS program to get into the med school. The classes you took WERE M1 classes, and you only had about half the workload of a normal M1 schedule. How were your grades? If they were not very good, I would just ask you to think about how you would have faired under a substantially more demanding year for M1 and M2 years. If your grades were good, you might consider talking with the admissions committee to address weaknesses in your application.


All-in-all, you might have wanted to do more research on the program. You would have seen that not everybody in the BMS program makes it into med school and yes, that is why 95% of people enroll in it. Anyway, I don't want to come off as a jerk but if they did tell you it was a guarantee that sucks. I don't think you'd have any ground for a lawsuit without written proof.

 

[koennen]

What does "tacitly assured by faculty advisors" mean? What exactly did they say to you? Legally, there is a world of difference between expressing an opinion and making a promise. Which did the admission counselors do?

 

[Johnny R]

Hey John,

Granted I don't know you, but I am an M3 at RFU. I can tell you that they do indeed accept many people from the BMS program. It is well known among M1's even that you basically have to get A's in the BMS program to get into the med school. The classes you took WERE M1 classes, and you only had about half the workload of a normal M1 schedule. How were your grades? If they were not very good, I would just ask you to think about how you would have faired under a substantially more demanding year for M1 and M2 years. If your grades were good, you might consider talking with the admissions committee to address weaknesses in your application.


All-in-all, you might have wanted to do more research on the program. You would have seen that not everybody in the BMS program makes it into med school and yes, that is why 95% of people enroll in it. Anyway, I don't want to come off as a jerk but if they did tell you it was a guarantee that sucks. I don't think you'd have any ground for a lawsuit without written proof.

I'm not looking to sue them, I'm looking for a way to get a refund and possibly file a complaint with the accrediting body that accredits this school

 

[sustentacular]

I'm not looking to sue them, I'm looking for a way to get a refund and possibly file a complaint with the accrediting body that accredits this school

I think suing is how you would go about getting the refund. How do you think the suing and filing a complaint against this school is going to reflect on you in the references you'll need from them when applying to other schools?

It certainly sucks to feel misled in this way but if you don't have it in writing (even in an e-mail maybe?) it's your word against theirs. If these advisors indicated they thought you would get an acceptance they must think you are a good student and could give you good LORs for some other program.

Have you talked specifically to the people who made it seem like you'd get in? Are there other students in your position?

 

[GoLakers310]

The classes you took WERE M1 classes, and you only had about half the workload of a normal M1 schedule.

No wonder, most people do well in SMP programs. No wonder, I still did better than most students my first year than those that previously did SMP 😎

 

[kia ora]

No wonder, most people do well in SMP programs. No wonder, I still did better than most students my first year than those that previously did SMP 😎

well done on the self-congratulatory and non-responsive post. go, you

to the original poster, it really is difficult to determine based on your brief take on the events whether you truly have a cause of action here, but I strongly suspect that you do not. file a complaint with the accreditation board if it will be cathartic to do so, but as for the $ consider is an expensive lesson learned. channel your anger and energy into getting into med school rather than getting into court. best of luck

 

[MedicFL]

Was it in writting? If not it didnt happen. Second I can promise you that they will never give you your housing expenses back. But lets say that they give you your tution money back for classes you already took. Are you going to give the degree back? If they give you your money back they should erase the record of you taking the classes then. But I assure promise you they owe you nothing nor is filing any kind of complaint going to get your anywhere..

 

[Poliscidoc]

Even if you were promised a spot in the medical school I am assuming that this offer was based on certain standards being met. But if you had money to blow, you attorney could argue that the verbal offering from ________ person is valid. But ______ person would have to be someone that can actually grant or deny admission to the medical school. So unless someone high up promised you a spot then I would say your screwed.

Also, how did this program not help you? What were your stats and grades pre-program and post-program?

 

[shiftingmirage]

There is always fine print somewhere. Granted, I'm not familure with the RFU BMS program, as someone who lives in Chicago, if they had a guarenteed acceptance program, I kinda think I would have heard about it. I know people that applied and unfortunately didn't get it. If acceptance was guarenteed, most would be in the program.

Even if you apply through AMCAS and are accepted to an MD program, it is a conditional acceptance. At any time the school can renig. 99.9% of the time they do not, but they still maintain the right to do so. So even when you have an acceptance letter, you aren't necessarily 'guarenteed' to be there the first day of classes.

 

[kia ora]

Even if you were promised a spot in the medical school I am assuming that this offer was based on certain standards being met. But if you had money to blow, you attorney could argue that the verbal offering from ________ person is valid.

maybe...that's a tough argument to win. the biggest problem here, however, is that the original poster already had enrolled in the program - he did not enroll in the program/pay the tuition in reliance on a promise of a place in the medical school. that right there blows a huge hole in any cause of action. what are his damages?

 

[Poliscidoc]

Three Elements of a Verbal Contract

In order to be considered valid, a verbal contract must contain three elements: offer, acceptance, and consideration.

• Offer: The person making the offer in a verbal contract must communicate their intent to enter into a contract. A verbal contract is not considered valid if all parties do not agree to the terms of the offer. Also, verbal contracts are only valid for a specified period of time and not indefinitely.

• Acceptance: A verbal contract is not valid until the offer is accepted. The acceptance of a verbal contract occurs when the person to whom the contract is offered voluntarily indicates agreement to its terms and conditions.

• Consideration: In addition to an offer and acceptance, verbal contracts must contain consideration. This means that each side must give the other something of value for the agreement to be binding. In most verbal contracts, this is an exchange of money, such as a down payment. However, in some cases, it is not money but a promise that is exchanged.


Find a really good attorney and you might have a shot. But in all likely hood they (the Med. School) will just delay until either you run out of money or just give up.

 

[235009]

You need to take responsibility for your life and your decisions and stop passing the buck once you realize you're not successful.

QFT

👍

 

[Thrombomodulin]

.

 

[ILikeDrugs]

This reminds me of a story from New York that came out on the news not to long ago. Some person took a business administration program and later sued the college because the college was not doing enough to help her get a job. She said something along the lines of, "The college should be calling potential employers and telling them, 'Hey, we got a great potential employee for you. She graduated with a 2.4 GPA and would be a really great candidate.'"

I couldn't believe she actually thought she was some sort of "top dog" with a 2.4 GPA. As if she was some sort of stellar stand-out.


Anyways, it's the ops word against the university's disclaimer which is specifically stated on the university's website. You've already spent $50k on the school. Why bother spending $3k for a lawyer that won't win your case.

 

[ILikeDrugs]

Sounds a lot like that case where the graduate sued her alma mater after job searching for a few months after graduating and not finding a job. You need to take responsibility for your life and your decisions and stop passing the buck once you realize you're not successful.

I think this is the same story that I was talking about. Since you're in AZ and I'm in CA, I think this story was aired nation-wide.

 

[kia ora]

• Consideration: In addition to an offer and acceptance, verbal contracts must contain consideration. This means that each side must give the other something of value for the agreement to be binding. In most verbal contracts, this is an exchange of money, such as a down payment. However, in some cases, it is not money but a promise that is exchanged

yeah. OP, did you give the guy a peppercorn? if so, you're good

thanks for the cut and paste from the contract law wiki or whatever. but if you take at face value the OP's characterization of the statement as a "tacit assurance" the OP does not have a good case...he doesn't even have a mediocre case. hopefully he has already moved on...

 

[MaybeADoc]

Nevermind. Not a helpful Post.

 

[Poliscidoc]

• Consideration: In addition to an offer and acceptance, verbal contracts must contain consideration. This means that each side must give the other something of value for the agreement to be binding. In most verbal contracts, this is an exchange of money, such as a down payment. However, in some cases, it is not money but a promise that is exchanged
[/QUOTE]

yeah. OP, did you give the guy a peppercorn? if so, you're good

thanks for the cut and paste from the contract law wiki or whatever. but if you take at face value the OP's characterization of the statement as a "tacit assurance" the OP does not have a good case...he doesn't even have a mediocre case. hopefully he has already moved on...[/QUOTE]



If he has money to waste then I say let him do it.. I mean crazier things have happened in terms of "dumb" judgements... But your right he doesn't have a shot in hell.

 

[Johnny R]

I'm probably not going to do anything. Just bite the bullet and move on I guess.

I had a 3.0 in the program by the way

 

[redsquareblack]

I'm probably not going to do anything. Just bite the bullet and move on I guess.

I had a 3.0 in the program by the way

FWIW, anyone who gave you assurance, tacit or otherwise, with a 3.0, was being silly.

But for that matter, if their assurances truly were "tacit", then might not your interpretation have come into play a bit?

 

[Johnny R]

On second thought, **** it, if my only shot of attaining a medical education at this point is going to the carrib, might as well expose what this school is to the premedical community for what it really is.

Johnny

 

[greatnt249]

On second thought, **** it, if my only shot of attaining a medical education at this point is going to the carrib, might as well expose what this school is to the premedical community for what it really is.

Johnny

Wow...just wow. You're like the pre-med who grade-grubs his/her professors and then wonders why none of them will write a letter of recommendation.🙄

Suck it up; improve your GPA through postbac and apply next cycle. It's not the school's fault you came out with a less-than-stellar GPA for this cycle. If you want to get into medical school, you need to put in the work instead of banking on whatever "safety net" you think you were offered.

 

[sustentacular]

On second thought, **** it, if my only shot of attaining a medical education at this point is going to the carrib, might as well expose what this school is to the premedical community for what it really is.

Johnny

You'll still need LORs for Caribbean medical school.

 

[ILikeDrugs]

I'm probably not going to do anything. Just bite the bullet and move on I guess.

I had a 3.0 in the program by the way

You had a 3.0 GPA. You can't expect them to work miracles. The point of that program was for YOU to get a high GPA and prove YOURSELF to the med schools. That university/program did their part -- they gave you the opportunity to improve your academic record. You didn't do that. You still got a GPA that is well below average. What was you MCAT score?

 

[shiftingmirage]

You'll still need LORs for Caribbean medical school.

Even if one doesn't do med/grad school, surely LOR's are needed for a job search. Maybe everyone wont ask for them, but somewhere somebody's going to want a reference or something. Gotta be cautious when burning bridges.

 

[sustentacular]

Even if one doesn't do med/grad school, surely LOR's are needed for a job search. Maybe everyone wont ask for them, but somewhere somebody's going to want a reference or something. Gotta be cautious when burning bridges.

👍

 

[Johnny R]

👍

I really don't give a ****. They took ******s over me, which completely perplexes my mind as to what my application lacked. Oh by the way I had a 3.0 in the med school classes and As in the bull**** nonmedical school classes so my GPA was around a 3.3.

I really want them to burn in hell. If I can display what the school is really like, it'll burn their reputation. I want them to suffer.

 

[Poliscidoc]

3.3 well dear god you should get in at any medical school you apply to. I cannot believe the school would not accept you.

 

[shiftingmirage]

I really don't give a ****. They took ******s over me, which completely perplexes my mind as to what my application lacked. Oh by the way I had a 3.0 in the med school classes and As in the bull**** nonmedical school classes so my GPA was around a 3.3.

I really want them to burn in hell. If I can display what the school is really like, it'll burn their reputation. I want them to suffer.

When you use words like '******s' it is hard for people to believe/share your opinion of the school. You have some respect issues, and it also seems that you feel you are entitled to get what you want.

As for what your application lacked, if your essays/PS were as arrogant as your posts on this thread, it's not hard to see why they didn't select you.

 

[greatnt249]

I really don't give a ****. They took ******s over me, which completely perplexes my mind as to what my application lacked. Oh by the way I had a 3.0 in the med school classes and As in the bull**** nonmedical school classes so my GPA was around a 3.3.

I really want them to burn in hell. If I can display what the school is really like, it'll burn their reputation. I want them to suffer.

Get a grip; you're not garnering any sympathy for your situation when you show no understanding that you bear the blame of not earning the best grades you could. That's YOUR fault, not the school's. Quit deflecting blame to others and take some g*****n responsibility for yourself.🙄

 

[Johnny R]

They took people with lower GPAs than what I had.

 

[Compass]

They took people with lower GPAs than what I had.

What about their attitudes?

 

[womp]

They took people with lower GPAs than what I had.

Maybe they had higher MCAT's. Look buddy, I have a 38 MCAT and I'm still sweating trying to get into ANY medical school, because I know where my application is weak. Maybe it's not even your grades or MCAT, maybe it's your entitled attitude.

 

[Poliscidoc]

So the moral of the story little pre-meds


DON'T BE A DICK AND OR PRICK

 

[BerlinDude]

Maybe they had higher MCAT's. Look buddy, I have a 38 MCAT and I'm still sweating trying to get into ANY medical school, because I know where my application is weak. Maybe it's not even your grades or MCAT, maybe it's your entitled attitude.

Preach on brother.

OP, frankly, it seems really gullible that you would believe completing a post-bac program guarantees you a slot in the medical school. Like, really gullible.

I have recommendations from top dogs at my dream school AND I graduated from their university AND I have an MCAT way above their average - yet I don't demand a slot at their school. Why? Because everyone knows there are no guarantees in medical school admissions.

 

[RogueUnicorn]

maybe they had higher mcat's. Look buddy, i have a 38 mcat and i'm still sweating trying to get into any medical school, because i know where my application is weak. Maybe it's not even your grades or mcat, maybe it's your entitled attitude.

+1000000000000

 

[ILikeDrugs]

LOL.
Johnny R turned into typical snotty nosed little kid who thinks he's sooooooo spechul and should get spechul tweatment because wittle johnny boy's mom said so.

Get over yourself kid.

I'm glad you didn't get accepted . We don't need anymore little johnnys high up the ladder. You're being kept where you belong. Know your place.

 

[Johnny R]

I guess its the carrib for me then...this thread was a waste of time

 

[BerlinDude]

I guess its the carrib for me then...this thread was a waste of time

I'm sorry if complaining on an anonymous internet forum didn't help you get 50K in tuition refunded. Try writing a comment on a youtube video, that should get you at least a partial refund.

 

[greatnt249]

I guess its the carrib for me then...this thread was a waste of time

Yeah, it was; did you really expect anyone to feel sorry for you after the way you came off? Good luck even getting into the Caribbean.

 

[Johnny R]

Yeah, it was; did you really expect anyone to feel sorry for you after the way you came off? Good luck even getting into the Caribbean.

I didn't expect anybody to feel sorry for me thats not the whole point. The point is that when you went to go see an advisor in the middle of the program, I asked them if I was on my way of getting accepted into the medical school, and they assured me that if I keep up the grades that I had I would get in. I'm not trying to whine about anything. I'm just pissed that I could have dropped early on and saved a whole bunch of money if they had been truthful to me.

I didn't expect a bunch of piece of **** premeds and med students under the cover anonymity to completely blast me for no reason.

I didn't feel I was I was entitled to anything. Y'all should stop pretending like your house M.D in trying to uncover my motives and life history from the two or three posts I've made on this thing. The average at this med school was 80% and my grades were well above average tho I was unable to get an A in any of the classes.

 

[mechtel]

I recently emailed my PI to update her on the application process and she told me "I'm sure you will get in somewhere." If I don't, should I then suggest that my undergraduate institution (ranked at very top of national universities) lose its accreditation?

The point is that mentors, advisors, etc. try to encourage. I did this myself as an academic advisor working with a group of premeds.

Assuming one advisor did in fact tell you halfway through the year "I'm sure you will get in to this medical school," it's a huge leap to accept that as a tacit agreement. Is the advisor even on the admissions committee?

I understand you must have worked hard and it comes as a huge discouragement not to be accepted. But, maybe you could learn from experience? Any complaint would simply make you sound bitter. It would be best I think to portray your experience in the best light possible to DO schools. If a Caribean school "tacitly" promises you a residency and you can't match, I doubt there is a Caribean board of accreditation to which you could complain.

 

[greatnt249]

Y'all should stop pretending like your house M.D in trying to uncover my motives and life history from the two or three posts I've made on this thing.

And you should really quit using strawman arguments to deflect away from the core problem.