FNAs

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

Do you like doing FNAs?

  • I love doing FNAs

    Votes: 5 20.0%
  • I hate doing FNAs

    Votes: 9 36.0%
  • I haven't done any and am dreading it

    Votes: 3 12.0%
  • I haven't done any and I can't wait.

    Votes: 8 32.0%

  • Total voters
    25

yaah

Boring
Moderator Emeritus
20+ Year Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2003
Messages
28,059
Reaction score
441
Who likes doing FNAs?

I have had three days of FNAs and I already feel sick of it. I don't like running around doing these things, and I feel I would learn much more if I could stay back at signout and review the slides. I also feel that since even I managed to extract lesional tissue x3 today it isn't that hard.

I didn't go into pathology to do procedures. If I wanted to do procedures I would have gone into surgery or radiology. I prefer to use my brain.

We also have had two visiting professors this year who claim that FNA is a superior diagnostic procedure to biopsy. The first claimed it for sarcomas. The second claimed it for lymph nodes with all of the possible diagnoses this entails. I am not so sure about this (particularly with the sarcomas).
 
yaah said:
We also have had two visiting professors this year who claim that FNA is a superior diagnostic procedure to biopsy. The first claimed it for sarcomas. The second claimed it for lymph nodes with all of the possible diagnoses this entails. I am not so sure about this (particularly with the sarcomas).
I've HAD an FNA (of the thyroid and worst than labor)) so I'm glad to hear you don't enjoy doing them! 👍

However I wondering, isn't there an inherent risk when doing FNA's of seeding malignant cells to other areas of tissue? 😕
 
yaah said:
Who likes doing FNAs?

I have had three days of FNAs and I already feel sick of it. I don't like running around doing these things, and I feel I would learn much more if I could stay back at signout and review the slides. I also feel that since even I managed to extract lesional tissue x3 today it isn't that hard.

I didn't go into pathology to do procedures. If I wanted to do procedures I would have gone into surgery or radiology. I prefer to use my brain.

We also have had two visiting professors this year who claim that FNA is a superior diagnostic procedure to biopsy. The first claimed it for sarcomas. The second claimed it for lymph nodes with all of the possible diagnoses this entails. I am not so sure about this (particularly with the sarcomas).

Don't you stain the slides at the bedside and look at them?

I don't have a lot of experience with cytology vs. biopsy for sarcomas or lymph nodes, but I would say that, for lymph nodes at least, biopsy would be far superior. Even when we've had an FNA of a lymph node that turned out to be Hodgkin's (during my cytotech days), the definitive dx. was made on excisional biopsy. A reactive lymph node aspirate is fairly easy to diagnose, though.
 
Reality check: FNA are DAMN good money. I dont care if you dont like doing them, I dont like scrubbing my toliet bowl after my relatives visit, but I do it anyway.

FNA billing shortcut guide
1 charge for doing the FNA
1 charge for immediate evaluation
1 charge for aspirate smear interpetation
1 charge for cell block (I think, not sure about completely whether this one is legal)

Im sure pathdawg knows the CPTs for these and the medicare reimbursements.

ANYWAY, thats alot of charges if you can get a FNA done in 15 minutes!
 
I had a choice of who could do my FNA. To me, a pathologist (Dr. Ortega, Washington Hospital Center the absolute BEST, IMHO) was a no brainer.

Anyone have opinions as to whether or not other specialities should be allowed to do them, ie endocrinologist in the case of FNA of thyroid?? I think I heard somewhere that there is a push to NOT allow pathologists reinbursement for them or something like that. 😕
 
1Path said:
I had a choice of who could do my FNA. To me, a pathologist (Dr. Ortega, Washington Hospital Center the absolute BEST, IMHO) was a no brainer.

Anyone have opinions as to whether or not other specialities should be allowed to do them, ie endocrinologist in the case of FNA of thyroid?? I think I heard somewhere that there is a push to NOT allow pathologists reinbursement for them or something like that. 😕

No possible way that could fly. Maybe they could argue a pathologist couldnt do FNA under U/S guidance without special training but I for one was in charge of TEACHING endocrine fellows how to do thyroid FNAs at a prior job.
 
yaah said:
Who likes doing FNAs?

I have had three days of FNAs and I already feel sick of it. I don't like running around doing these things, and I feel I would learn much more if I could stay back at signout and review the slides. I also feel that since even I managed to extract lesional tissue x3 today it isn't that hard.

I didn't go into pathology to do procedures. If I wanted to do procedures I would have gone into surgery or radiology. I prefer to use my brain.

We also have had two visiting professors this year who claim that FNA is a superior diagnostic procedure to biopsy. The first claimed it for sarcomas. The second claimed it for lymph nodes with all of the possible diagnoses this entails. I am not so sure about this (particularly with the sarcomas).


My cytopath rotation involved doing FNA’s on inmates in a prison hospital, and we were encouraged (?!) to use the FNA “gun.” One of the more memorable FNA’s I had to do was on a neck mass of a inmate, with chains and tattoos, who noticed the gun with the needle, gave me an intimidating look and said: “you think I’m gonna let that thing come close to my neck?”
Made my decision not to pursue cytopath easier.
 
LADoc00 said:
Reality check: FNA are DAMN good money. I dont care if you dont like doing them, I dont like scrubbing my toliet bowl after my relatives visit, but I do it anyway.

FNA billing shortcut guide
1 charge for doing the FNA
1 charge for immediate evaluation
1 charge for aspirate smear interpetation
1 charge for cell block (I think, not sure about completely whether this one is legal)

Im sure pathdawg knows the CPTs for these and the medicare reimbursements.

ANYWAY, thats alot of charges if you can get a FNA done in 15 minutes!

Testify, my brother. Don't forget the charge for the special stain (DiffQuik), which is an 88313.

I don't get the bitching about fna's. "I have to get consent like a real doctor--wahhhhh!!"; "I have to run around the hospital with an fna cart--wahhhhh!!"; "I have to go to radiology--wahhhhh!!!!".

Take off the skirt and be a man, already. Fna's are simple, easy and quick procedures that can potentially be lucrative. It would be in your best interests to learn how to do them proficiently. It would be in all of our collective interests to take back this procedure from surgeons and radiologists.
 
pathdawg said:
Testify, my brother. Don't forget the charge for the special stain (DiffQuik), which is an 88313.

I don't get the bitching about fna's. "I have to get consent like a real doctor--wahhhhh!!"; "I have to run around the hospital with an fna cart--wahhhhh!!"; "I have to go to radiology--wahhhhh!!!!".

Take off the skirt and be a man, already. Fna's are simple, easy and quick procedures that can potentially be lucrative. It would be in your best interests to learn how to do them proficiently. It would be in all of our collective interests to take back this procedure from surgeons and radiologists.

Hahahahaha, the only thing is a majority of path trainees are women now! I completely agree tho, pathologists and residents who whine about FNAs are one (of the many) reasons why the field is in decline.
 
pathdawg said:
Testify, my brother. Don't forget the charge for the special stain (DiffQuik), which is an 88313.

I don't get the bitching about fna's. "I have to get consent like a real doctor--wahhhhh!!"; "I have to run around the hospital with an fna cart--wahhhhh!!"; "I have to go to radiology--wahhhhh!!!!".

Take off the skirt and be a man, already. Fna's are simple, easy and quick procedures that can potentially be lucrative. It would be in your best interests to learn how to do them proficiently. It would be in all of our collective interests to take back this procedure from surgeons and radiologists.

Pathdawg- I had no trouble getting good material, but some of those vatos didn’t make it any easier.

LA doc- How about bone marrow biopsies… do you like doing those too?

I can see how some people enjoy doing procedures. As for the financial issues, I agree, pathologists should be the ones doing these procedures and billing for them. I just prefer to read slides, and bring in more money for my group doing that, than I probably would if I were doing fna’s, bone marrow biopsies, or autopsies for that matter.
 
LADoc00 said:
Reality check: FNA are DAMN good money. I dont care if you dont like doing them, I dont like scrubbing my toliet bowl after my relatives visit, but I do it anyway.

FNA billing shortcut guide
1 charge for doing the FNA
1 charge for immediate evaluation
1 charge for aspirate smear interpetation
1 charge for cell block (I think, not sure about completely whether this one is legal)

Im sure pathdawg knows the CPTs for these and the medicare reimbursements.

ANYWAY, thats alot of charges if you can get a FNA done in 15 minutes!

As an fyi, the charge for the cell block (88305) is completely and totally legit. What is more murky is billing multiple 88305's for multiple cell blocks done on a single case (i.e. separate passes). That manuver I don't personally do, but I am honestly not sure if its kosher or not.
 
LADoc00 said:
Hahahahaha, the only thing is a majority of path trainees are women now! I completely agree tho, pathologists and residents who whine about FNAs are one (of the many) reasons why the field is in decline.

My comment applies to all, whether male or female. Figure of speech.
 
torero said:
Pathdawg- I had no trouble getting good material, but some of those vatos didn’t make it any easier.

LA doc- How about bone marrow biopsies… do you like doing those too?

I can see how some people enjoy doing procedures. As for the financial issues, I agree, pathologists should be the ones doing these procedures and billing for them. I just prefer to read slides, and bring in more money for my group doing that, than I probably would if I were doing fna’s, bone marrow biopsies, or autopsies for that matter.

Bone marrows are NO WHERE near as leet as FNAs. There is no stat read charge (this is essential!), they are far more dangerous, the equipment is disposable and FAR MORE expensive thus you run a big risk if you get a non-payment because you have to eat the jamshidi tray costs, people have in fact died from BMs so you have to list whether you do them on your malprac insurance (at least for my company you do), you have to consent the patient with written documentation (I usually did verbal consent for FNA because its similar to a blood draw), you have do nearly a full PE in some states/medical boards or run the risk of malprac AND all you end up getting is the BM procedure charge which reimburses like caca.

Totally different situation than FNAs. Totally.

FNA>>>>BMs
 
LADoc00 said:
Bone marrows are NO WHERE near as leet as FNAs. There is no stat read charge (this is essential!), they are far more dangerous, the equipment is disposable and FAR MORE expensive thus you run a big risk if you get a non-payment because you have to eat the jamshidi tray costs, people have in fact died from BMs so you have to list whether you do them on your malprac insurance (at least for my company you do), you have to consent the patient with written documentation (I usually did verbal consent for FNA because its similar to a blood draw), you have do nearly a full PE in some states/medical boards or run the risk of malprac AND all you end up getting is the BM procedure charge which reimburses like caca.

Totally different situation than FNAs. Totally.

FNA>>>>BMs

I would highly recommend getting consent for fna, just for cya purposes. I see your point about the venopuncture comparison, but I always get consents for fna anyway.
 
pathdawg said:
I would highly recommend getting consent for fna, just for cya purposes. I see your point about the venopuncture comparison, but I always get consents for fna anyway.

You get a written consent statement signed for each FNA? I just have a form sticker with consent obtained verbally where I check off, then slap it in the patient's chart. I never been a place where they required the big azz form consent signed for FNA, but it is mandatory for BMs.

Remember this all about efficiency and SPEED. You need numbers, so filling out a written consent form and having them sign it etc. would be adding precious minutes to your overall goal of 15-20min/FNA.

I usually do 3 passes and then Im done, no matter what. Maybe in unusual circumstances Ill do 4-5 passes but if you make that a habit you are blowing the efficiency possible here.

Your entire consent speech with risks and post procedure care should be under 3 minutes, you are gonna be talking FAST. If the patient is a non_english speaker then whip out a spanish, chinese or whatever written form, if they are illiterate AND a nonEnglish speaker, they are SOL, pure and simple, send em off with instructions to bring back an interperter, you dont have time to mess around with that. If they ask question, direct them to their PMD, you dont have time to talk about their hemorrhoids because ideally you have 3 dozen 88305s on your desk locked and loaded for when you return.

Be lean and mean, it is the only way to survive.
 
LADoc00 said:
You get a written consent statement signed for each FNA? I just have a form sticker with consent obtained verbally where I check off, then slap it in the patient's chart. I never been a place where they required the big azz form consent signed for FNA, but it is mandatory for BMs.

Remember this all about efficiency and SPEED. You need numbers, so filling out a written consent form and having them sign it etc. would be adding precious minutes to your overall goal of 15-20min/FNA.

I usually do 3 passes and then Im done, no matter what. Maybe in unusual circumstances Ill do 4-5 passes but if you make that a habit you are blowing the efficiency possible here.

Your entire consent speech with risks and post procedure care should be under 3 minutes, you are gonna be talking FAST. If the patient is a non_english speaker then whip out a spanish, chinese or whatever written form, if they are illiterate AND a nonEnglish speaker, they are SOL, pure and simple, send em off with instructions to bring back an interperter, you dont have time to mess around with that. If they ask question, direct them to their PMD, you dont have time to talk about their hemorrhoids because ideally you have 3 dozen 88305s on your desk locked and loaded for when you return.

Be lean and mean, it is the only way to survive.

I like your style, LA. 15-20 min/fna is a good goal. Its just that sometimes, stuff happens. I once saw a ctyo fellow do a breast fna on a tiny, skinny old lady. He actually caused a pneumothorax. Sounds crazy, but stuff like that happens all the time if you're busy enough. Its for reasons like that why I recommend a consent.

But, I do agree with your overall point, bro.
 
1Path said:
I've HAD an FNA (of the thyroid and worst than labor)) so I'm glad to hear you don't enjoy doing them! 👍

However I wondering, isn't there an inherent risk when doing FNA's of seeding malignant cells to other areas of tissue? 😕

There have been a bunch of papers written on this subject. The short answer is no, seeding of tumor cells, while a theoretical concern, does not appear to be a practical problem.

Fna of the thyroid worse than labor? Either you had the easiest labor in the history of easy labors or someone used a knitting needle to fna your neck.
 
pathdawg said:
Fna of the thyroid worse than labor? Either you had the easiest labor in the history of easy labors or someone used a knitting needle to fna your neck.

Oh that's the new WTNA. Whole Thyroid Needle Aspiration. The suck out the whole thing, via a big needle, it is like the new laproscopic. Or a liposuction for your neck. :laugh:
 
pathdawg said:
I don't get the bitching about fna's. "I have to get consent like a real doctor--wahhhhh!!"; "I have to run around the hospital with an fna cart--wahhhhh!!"; "I have to go to radiology--wahhhhh!!!!".
.

Waaaahhhh. Why don't pathologists just go up and draw everybody's blood sample too? I don't whine about FNAs because I am not a real man. Real men don't need to do procedures to prove their manliness 😉 If you think I'm going to get marginalized as a physician because i don't stick needles in people, I can't stop you. I'm sure PAs will start doing them soon anyway.

Here, we have to go on FNA runs to radiology and clinics where someone else is doing the FNA and wants us to stain the slides and give an immediate read. Maybe you learn a lot by doing this, but I don't really.
 
yaah said:
Waaaahhhh. Why don't pathologists just go up and draw everybody's blood sample too? I don't whine about FNAs because I am not a real man. Real men don't need to do procedures to prove their manliness 😉 If you think I'm going to get marginalized as a physician because i don't stick needles in people, I can't stop you. I'm sure PAs will start doing them soon anyway.

Here, we have to go on FNA runs to radiology and clinics where someone else is doing the FNA and wants us to stain the slides and give an immediate read. Maybe you learn a lot by doing this, but I don't really.

First off, if I was able to bill a venopuncture as a procedure, I'd do them. However, they remain the domain of techs and nurses, so there is no need comparing them to fna, which is a valued skill performed by physicians and not mindless gruntwork performed by a nurse's aid.

I agree with you that real men don't need to do procedures to prove their manliness. If I was insecure about my manhood, I would have gone into general surgery.

I also agree that rapid assessments in radiology aren't the most efficient use of physician time. I have my cyto techs do them and they do a good job. A potential utilization however would be to do a rapid assessment/rapid dx (kind of like a frozen section). That might entice me to go to radiology if it was worth the wasted time of watching them reposition needles for an hour.
 
djmd said:
Oh that's the new WTNA. Whole Thyroid Needle Aspiration. The suck out the whole thing, via a big needle, it is like the new laproscopic. Or a liposuction for your neck. :laugh:

Yup. Its diagnostic AND therapeutic! Its two for one.
Win-win.
 
yaah said:
Waaaahhhh.
Here, we have to go on FNA runs to radiology and clinics where someone else is doing the FNA and wants us to stain the slides and give an immediate read. Maybe you learn a lot by doing this, but I don't really.

I almost forgot. This is what I hear when I read the above:

"I have to do radiology runs--waahhhhh!"

"I have to do rapid paps and diffquiks for immediate assessment--waaahhhhh!!"

"I'm not learning alot by hanging in radiology--waahhhh!!"

Just teasing, man.

peace out.
 
I just don't like FNAs. Like how some people don't like looking at prostate biopsies. Don't have to like everything! There is plenty else for me to do. If I end up going into practice and having to do a few FNAs, so be it. But I also anticipate I will be trying to get out of doing them until the day I retire. In return I shall look at your 18 core prostate biopsy series. Let us celebrate this new arrangement with the adding of chocolate to milk.

Now watch, in three years I will be posting from my desk as I celebrate the winding down of my own cyto fellowship. Maybe I can just specialize in urines. I will be the best piss pathologist the world has ever seen.
 
yaah said:
In return I shall look at your 18 core prostate biopsy series. Let us celebrate this new arrangement with the adding of chocolate to milk.

Done and done.
 
if they are illiterate AND a nonEnglish speaker, they are SOL, pure and simple, send em off with instructions to bring back an interperter, you dont have time to mess around with that.

If you practice in a hospital, you might want to check with their risk management guys regarding this strategy.
 
f_w said:
If you practice in a hospital, you might want to check with their risk management guys regarding this strategy.

No, this is outpatient, lil padawa learner, it is all about the stand alone clinic/outpatient lab. Must have technical component....cannot surrender technical component....
 
No, this is outpatient, lil padawa learner, Must have technical component....cannot surrender technical component....

Still, as a slave to the federal goverment (recipient of medicare $$), you are obliged to provide reasonable accomodation to 'LEP persons'. And sending someone away to get their own interpreter might be construed to represent 'discrimination based on national origin' (based on title VI of the civil rights act). It's no big deal really, what is the worst that could happen ? Exclusion from the medicare program, who cares really 😉 .
 
f_w said:
Still, as a slave to the federal goverment (recipient of medicare $$), you are obliged to provide reasonable accomodation to 'LEP persons'. And sending someone away to get their own interpreter might be construed to represent 'discrimination based on national origin' (based on title VI of the civil rights act). It's no big deal really, what is the worst that could happen ? Exclusion from the medicare program, who cares really 😉 .


In an outpatient setting, Im certain "reasonable accomodation" is met by providing written consent material. If that wasnt true, then every single business in the U.S. would have to have a translator for every language known or risk violation of the law. Heck, even the hospital is not obligated to have translators, its a service offered. Also, another obvious point you are missing is if someone is a non-english speaker and is illiterate, they are HIGHLY unlikely to be insured by anyone, let alone medicare! :laugh:

But yes as a general rule, you want to think about your legal obligations are before you start a clinic-type set up. But on this point, you are definitely way off base.
 
If that wasnt true, then every single business in the U.S. would have to have a translator for every language known or risk violation of the law.
You are not a business. You are the 'recipient of federal assistance'. A business is to some extent free to send someone away if they don't speak english, a slave to the goverment is not.
Heck, even the hospital is not obligated to have translators, its a service offered.
Ahem, yes they are required to provide translation services. Most will contract with a phone conference service for anything but spanish.
Also, another obvious point you are missing is if someone is a non-english speaker and is illiterate, they are HIGHLY unlikely to be insured by anyone, let alone medicare!
Oh is that so ? Plenty of legal immigrants bring their parents in once they become citizens. Some of them are in fact either illiterate or at least not literate in any of the languages we know about. And after the 2 year period that the sponsor can be held liable for the parents becoming 'a public charge' is over, the parents go on medicaid. There are enough people out there whose only english language documents are their green-card, their medicaid card and their attorneys business card.

Having read the respective goverment documents a couple of years ago, it left me with the impression that the goverment doesn't limit your obligations to actual beneficiaries of the respective goverment programs (medicaid/medicare) but rather to anyone who walks into your practice. It is the fact that you receive goverment money that indentures you to their rules, not the question whether the individual patient is medicare/medicaid eligible.
But yes as a general rule, you want to think about your legal obligations are before you start a clinic-type set up. But on this point, you are definitely way off base.
If you are a 'small practicitioner' in the goverments lingo, they will let you get away with more in that respect than lets say a large multispecialty practice. But if some shyster specializing in your local immigrant community is able to collect a number of cases that show that you systematically discriminated against 'LEP persons', you (or more likely your lab organization) are in a world of hurt.


P.S.
In my humble opinion anyone seeking goverment services should be required to inquire in one of the 'native' languages of the US (english, spanish, hawaian or whatever local native american dialect applicable). By twisting the civil rights act into a pretzel, the supreme court has driven up the expense of doing business in the US without a measureable benefit for anyone but some low-end neighbourhood shysters. I personally think that your approach is reasonable, my limited experience with the goverment buerocrats makes me think that they possibly wouldn't agree.

As for whether HHS regulations on translation services apply to you, you might want to peruse the revised policy on this (emphasis added):

http://www.hhs.gov/ocr/lep/revisedlep.html

4. Q. Who is covered by the guidance?

A. Covered entities include any state or local agency, private institution or organization, or any public or private individual that (1) Operates, provides or engages in health, or social service programs and activities, and (2) receives Federal financial assistance from HHS directly or through another recipient/covered entity. Examples of covered entities include but are not limited to the following entities, which may receive federal financial assistance: hospitals, nursing homes, home health agencies, managed care organizations, universities and other entities with health or social service research programs; state, county and local health agencies; state Medicaid agencies; state, county and local welfare agencies; federally-funded programs for families, youth and children; Head Start programs; public and private contractors, subcontractors and vendors; physicians; and other providers who receive Federal financial assistance from HHS.
 
Well if that's true then that's why this country is going into the crapper.

I say screw u medicare, Im going home.
t_202_cartmanend



Okay new plan:

1.) Open FNA clinic
2.) Post large sign outside that says: Medicare NOT accepted.
3.) Have a waiting room atm machine.
4.) Post second sign that says: Cash Discount provided, please inquire.
5.) Collect cash
6.) Do FNA
7.) Document
8.) Rinse and repeat.
 
1.) Open FNA clinic
2.) Post large sign outside that says: Medicare NOT accepted.
3.) Have a waiting room atm machine.
4.) Post second sign that says: Cash Discount provided, please inquire.
5.) Collect cash
6.) Do FNA
7.) Document
8.) Rinse and repeat.

Great plan !
If you can find enough cash-paying patients to make a living, all the better. Around here, most boobs are attached to women with either commercial insurance or medicare. The slice of cash paying surgical patients is pretty slim. And good luck getting on HMO commercial panels if you drop out of the medicare program. Unless you are the only 'FNA master' in a 90mile radius, they are not very likely to keep you around.

(I liked your lay-away biopsy plan. Anytime I need something fixed on my car, I marvel at the car-repair shop business model: You come in, you get an estimate, they do the work, you pay, you get your car back. Compare that wth medicine. You come in, nobody can tell you how much its gonna cost, you go ahead anyway, 3 weeks later you get an outragous bill, and another one, and another one, and nobody is available to make payment arrangements.)
 
f_w said:
Great plan !
If you can find enough cash-paying patients to make a living, all the better. Around here, most boobs are attached to women with either commercial insurance or medicare. The slice of cash paying surgical patients is pretty slim. And good luck getting on HMO commercial panels if you drop out of the medicare program. Unless you are the only 'FNA master' in a 90mile radius, they are not very likely to keep you around.

(I liked your lay-away biopsy plan. Anytime I need something fixed on my car, I marvel at the car-repair shop business model: You come in, you get an estimate, they do the work, you pay, you get your car back. Compare that wth medicine. You come in, nobody can tell you how much its gonna cost, you go ahead anyway, 3 weeks later you get an outragous bill, and another one, and another one, and nobody is available to make payment arrangements.)

Im going to give out complimentary wine in my clinic tho, it will be healthcare with a spa-like feel....Im going to be a gizzillionare! muhahahahaha
 
And offer botox and sclerotherapy for spiderveins in the same setting. Not as attractive as a FNA with rigged billing, but it tends to work well with the spa like atmosphere.
 
Just call all the FNAs non diagnostic so you have to do more. Or do a bunch more passes and collect that way. First one was just blood. So was the second. So was the third. Fourth one we got something...fifth one was blood...
 
yaah said:
Just call all the FNAs non diagnostic so you have to do more. Or do a bunch more passes and collect that way. First one was just blood. So was the second. So was the third. Fourth one we got something...fifth one was blood...

Dayum, our secret is out.
 
Not having done any FNAs, I can't say whether I would love it or hate it. There should be a fifth option in the poll though that reads, "I haven't done any yet and I feel indifferent about doing them."
 
Personally, I think FNAs are fun. Sticking people with needles is A-OK, and then the bedside quick read is just like a frozen, only if you dont know the answer yet, thats no problem! At my place, we have to get written consent from the patient, but you just have to fill in the name of the patient and the procedure on the form and you can give over the risks verbally, so it takes 1-2 minutes tops.
 
Top