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For Non-Trads: Things I Wished I Knew
- Thread starter jblil
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Riseboi and jblil, thank you for that. This info is invaluable and helping me understand what I'm getting into.
I've read a lot of the commentary on families, relationships, marriages, etc. re PT school. I've been in a relationship the last 3 years and my opinion is if the relationship is meant to be, it should be able to survive PT school. As for starting something new, that's a different story. You probably have to have some history and previous time invested, as well as a strong bond before your time is strained in order to keep something going. I'd imagine it would be hard to start a relationship when your free time is immediately and constantly limited, unless you're both PT/health care students with similar constraints. However, I'm also gonna guess it would be ill-advised to date someone from your class for many obvious reasons.
I've read a lot of the commentary on families, relationships, marriages, etc. re PT school. I've been in a relationship the last 3 years and my opinion is if the relationship is meant to be, it should be able to survive PT school. As for starting something new, that's a different story. You probably have to have some history and previous time invested, as well as a strong bond before your time is strained in order to keep something going. I'd imagine it would be hard to start a relationship when your free time is immediately and constantly limited, unless you're both PT/health care students with similar constraints. However, I'm also gonna guess it would be ill-advised to date someone from your class for many obvious reasons.
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If you're already in a relationship, then do your best to stay connected and spend time with your SO. It's hard to juggle both. The worst thing you could do is to stat a romantic relationship while in school, especially with one of your classmates. A couple of my classmates are doing that. It seems to be going fine so far, but it's not a good idea. I highly discourage seeing classmates or even co-workers. Don't use your school as a marriage market.
Kevin
Agreed. That's why I started to run half-marathons in 2011, and did my 6th one yesterday. Next year (2nd year of PT school) I hope to have more free time and plan to start training for full marathons.
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This is so amazing! Congrats on your 6th one BTW, I'm a runner also and thought about signing up for a marathon that's in October this year, but I don't know if I'll be able to train and go through my 1st semester at the same time without going insane. I think I'll just do some smaller races, just so I don't get overwhelmed. I've trained for a marathon while working full-time and it's pretty much like having a part-time job, so maybe I'll just stick to smaller distances during my 1st year.
How is balancing half marathon training while in PT school?
It's not too bad, I now have time to put in 15-20 miles a week. I have recently switched to doing more intervals, so am no longer training over long distances. That cuts down on the time required.
I went to school for my PhD after working for a year after college. And then went back for my PT degree about 15 years later. All the things you know to do well in college (reading textbooks, taking notes, writing papers, etc.) are learned skills. If you don't use them, you do start losing those skills. So this is one advantage of going directly from college to PT school.
My other suggestion for studying is to teach your fellow classmates or people in your study group. It will be a little bit stressful, and I think we learn better under mild stress. It also helps you organize your thoughts.
And keep up with studying. Study every night, not just for 8 hours the day before the test.
For anatomy:
1. make charts and tables to organize the material. And then rewrite them.
2. draw pictures
3. Palpate structures, and perform muscle actions
Have to go give a test, but this is an interesting forum topic. I agree with most of what the first two posters have said.
My other suggestion for studying is to teach your fellow classmates or people in your study group. It will be a little bit stressful, and I think we learn better under mild stress. It also helps you organize your thoughts.
And keep up with studying. Study every night, not just for 8 hours the day before the test.
For anatomy:
1. make charts and tables to organize the material. And then rewrite them.
2. draw pictures
3. Palpate structures, and perform muscle actions
Have to go give a test, but this is an interesting forum topic. I agree with most of what the first two posters have said.
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@HughLee,
I will be starting my DPT school in the June and was intrigued by your post. What other advice do you have to prepare for the first year? I am trying to do what I can now to help prepare like reviewing my kinesiology, anatomy, and physiology. What other things could you recommend, being a current faculty member? Thanks!
I will be starting my DPT school in the June and was intrigued by your post. What other advice do you have to prepare for the first year? I am trying to do what I can now to help prepare like reviewing my kinesiology, anatomy, and physiology. What other things could you recommend, being a current faculty member? Thanks!
The advice I gave above was more for once you are in PT school.
In terms of a student starting this fall:
1. Be prepared to work hard, so go to your school relaxed and energized. Several people above talked about taking some time off before schools starts, and that sounds like a good idea.
2. Get on a regular schedule.
3. Some people above mentioned a book that they thought was useful. I have not read it, but it might be a good idea.
4. If you were to review or learn information, I would tend to concentrate more on pre-requisite information rather than PT information. Review anatomy, physiology, levers and electrical currents. Someone on another thread who was a pre-PT student was asking for content from PT classes. I looked at some of my handouts, and thought that they do not make much sense without an instructor. The content that your instructor uses may vary somewhat from what you read, even if you look at the required textbook. The last thing you want to do is need to unlearn something, and then learn what your instructor wants you to know.
In terms of a student starting this fall:
1. Be prepared to work hard, so go to your school relaxed and energized. Several people above talked about taking some time off before schools starts, and that sounds like a good idea.
2. Get on a regular schedule.
3. Some people above mentioned a book that they thought was useful. I have not read it, but it might be a good idea.
4. If you were to review or learn information, I would tend to concentrate more on pre-requisite information rather than PT information. Review anatomy, physiology, levers and electrical currents. Someone on another thread who was a pre-PT student was asking for content from PT classes. I looked at some of my handouts, and thought that they do not make much sense without an instructor. The content that your instructor uses may vary somewhat from what you read, even if you look at the required textbook. The last thing you want to do is need to unlearn something, and then learn what your instructor wants you to know.
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This whole thread is so helpful even for non-non-trads (aka traditional students? haha). Keep up the juicy tidbits! I'm gonna look into "Moonwalking with Einstein" since I have an Amazon gift card I've had since X-mas that I've been meaning to use.
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I'm 27 and finishing my BS in exercise science. I have been a personal trainer for 3 years. I went back to school in 2010 and had to take a semester and a half of prep classes before I could even get to statistics or anatomy. My GPA was a 1.5 when I came back,and now 3 years later it's a 3.1(all grades) or a 3.6 (higest). Took the GRE and scored below the minimums that I need lol I hate standardized testing! I will have to do better the next time I take it in may. The last three semesters I have taken 16-18 credits each semester and have summer 13 fall 13 and an internship spring 14. I'm applying via PTCAS this summer and only have about 60 hours volunteer. Should I wait a year to strenghten my app or just keep on trucking and see what happens this cycle?
Select some schools that you are interested in and talk to them.
Some things to potentially ask about.
Do you need to have completed a Bachelors degree before you start the program? Since you are doing an internship in the Spring of 2014, I am assuming that you will not have your BS till then.
What is their retake policy? Since you give a GPA for all grades and a GPA for highest grades, I am assuming that you retook some courses.
What are their specific qualifications for entry into their program?
Would you be considered a competitive applicant? Why or why not? What can you do to make your application more competitive?
If several schools say that you have a good chance, then go for it. If not, then look to strengthen your application.
Some things to potentially ask about.
Do you need to have completed a Bachelors degree before you start the program? Since you are doing an internship in the Spring of 2014, I am assuming that you will not have your BS till then.
What is their retake policy? Since you give a GPA for all grades and a GPA for highest grades, I am assuming that you retook some courses.
What are their specific qualifications for entry into their program?
Would you be considered a competitive applicant? Why or why not? What can you do to make your application more competitive?
If several schools say that you have a good chance, then go for it. If not, then look to strengthen your application.
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Traditional students may know life intellectually, but it is rare for them to have experienced the hardships and joys of adult life. I recommend that non-traditional students use the perspective that comes with their experience to make themselves stand out. As a non-trad myself, I have had the opportunity live through great difficulty and disappointment, which made the application and interview process less imposing. This allowed me to write and speak clearly and directly about myself and the PT profession, which seems to have been attractive to schools. It also helped me to maintain an even keel, and enjoy interviews without being overly nervous. In my essays I explained that I am driven to help heal others because I consider myself to be a citizen of the world, and a part of the great tide of humanity. The confidence to write in such a grandiose way, and to really show my true self in my applications, is a hard-earned benefit of my age and experience. I urge any non-traditional students who read this to focus on what you have learned since you were the age of a traditional student. Those lessons may be your greatest strength, and certainly can be used to set your application apart from the crowd.
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For non-traditionals, I believe we KNOW we want to do DPT because for whatever reason, something has changed our minds to go that route and diverge from our previous path or career. In my case, I had a 3 major life changing in events in 2 years; when I tell people my story, they think I am making it up (TRUST me you cant make this stuff up or would you ever wish it upon someone!)
The first one made me stop and realize - do I really like the life I am living, the career I have chosen? So, I moved across the country and was very happy with my new job in my current career. The second one, a year later made me realize my job making "material things better", was not what I wanted to do anymore. Material things do not buy me even one once of happiness. 3 months later I developed life changing health problems and have been a patient of PT for a consistant 3 years(if you want to know what this condition this is PM me) . These life changing events, have brought me to where I am today and have given me the driving edge to become a PT. I want to help relieve the suffering of people with the condition I have in the only way I know how, become a PT to treat this, and continue to research to provide more evidence based research on this condition.
So use those life changing or difficult events you might have faced as a non-trad in your personal statements and interviews. I know I will be a more empathatic PT and PT student because I KNOW more than ever what I WANT In my life. When I was 22 and graduated from school, I had no idea how cruel the world can be, but it makes you a stronger person. I might not have the 4.0 GPA, but I know I will be a great PT because of what I have been through.
Good luck everyone
The first one made me stop and realize - do I really like the life I am living, the career I have chosen? So, I moved across the country and was very happy with my new job in my current career. The second one, a year later made me realize my job making "material things better", was not what I wanted to do anymore. Material things do not buy me even one once of happiness. 3 months later I developed life changing health problems and have been a patient of PT for a consistant 3 years(if you want to know what this condition this is PM me) . These life changing events, have brought me to where I am today and have given me the driving edge to become a PT. I want to help relieve the suffering of people with the condition I have in the only way I know how, become a PT to treat this, and continue to research to provide more evidence based research on this condition.
So use those life changing or difficult events you might have faced as a non-trad in your personal statements and interviews. I know I will be a more empathatic PT and PT student because I KNOW more than ever what I WANT In my life. When I was 22 and graduated from school, I had no idea how cruel the world can be, but it makes you a stronger person. I might not have the 4.0 GPA, but I know I will be a great PT because of what I have been through.
Good luck everyone
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If a non-trad student wants to stand out and set himself apart from traditional students, then they need to write an excellent essay, and parlay their experience. They usually are more sure that PT is what they want to do. Traditional students sometimes don't know, and only find out that they don't want to be a PT school until they actually complete a semesters and have wasted thousands in tuition. Non-trad students usually struggle academically more than traditional students, but might have more perseverance because they're absolutely sure about what they want to study.
When you write your LOR, as a non-trad student, talk about the various routes you have taken in life, and why those routes didn't pan out. You need to explain how your life led to PT, and why nothing else will satisfy you. You've tried other vocations and they weren't for you. Explain why.
Kevin
When you write your LOR, as a non-trad student, talk about the various routes you have taken in life, and why those routes didn't pan out. You need to explain how your life led to PT, and why nothing else will satisfy you. You've tried other vocations and they weren't for you. Explain why.
Kevin
Do you guys really think non-trads struggle more academically? I keep hearing that, but I've spent the last 2 years taking 2-3 science courses (with labs) per semester with no breaks. I'm assuming that's the case for a lot of non-trads, seeing as we received unrelated degrees that mostly did not cover the prerequisites. I feel like my study skills are at their peak coming off of this. What is it exactly that we're lacking that traditional students have?
I do not think so. Mentally, I feel just as alert and sharp as I was in undergrad. It's just that non-trads usually have more responsibilities and worries outside of school that may impinge on study time. I have a mother in very poor health who lives on the other side of the country. When she was sick last year, I had to take several days off to fly out and be with her. Luckily my daughter is already out of high school so I do not have to worry (too much) about her. But other non-trads who have younger kids will certainly see it impact their study time. Yesterday, I left my house at 7:30 am and came home at 10:30 pm. Except for an hour for lunch, I spent the whole day studying for a couple of upcoming tests. It'd be hard to do if you had a toddler at home.
Nope, not IMO. Half of my class graduated with at least a 3.8 GPA. Of the 9 or 10 non traditionals in my class, around two-thirds were a part of that group. Grade wise, I think "we" did just fine. Did some of them have to study more? Maybe, but I believe that has to do more with the individual, themselves, than whether they were traditional or non-traditional.
Just curious why you decided to pursue DPT??
I'm in a situation where I'm trying to choose between DPT and PTA. Money wise it makes sense to pursue a PTA degree. But I know there are more career choices down the line as a DPT.
my girlfriend and I are talking about marriage and we're saving to buy a house. I know that if I get accepted to PT school we will be down to one income. She makes a very good money but the thing is that she has a 9 year old son so she would be supporting 2 people.
Coming out of PT school i would be about 150k in debt(on the low end) spread over 10 years thats about 1800 a month with 8% and about 1300 over 20 years. Kind of in the same boat we are now but with more debt.
I really enjoy working with patients in the PT setting its the best part of my day when I get a chance to do that and I really do enjoy learning how the body works in my opinion the best machine in the world. My passion is there but with other factors in my life coming up I'm having a tough time deciding between DPT and PTA and what makes sense in the long run for me and my family. I'm 33 and she's 32 so having kids is in the future as well.
any advice would be appreciated
No, going 150k into debt for PT school is not even remotely worth it, in my opinion. But why do you have to go to such an expensive school? Can't you opt for an in-state school or at least a cheaper school? There are more affordable options to pursue a DPT degree.
Not everyone gets a choice about where they get in to. It's easy to say "oh go to your state school." Doesn't always go that way. And then what, reapply for the next 1,2,3 years? By that time you could be graduated or at least well into your DPT. I'll be going under around 130K and I'm not worried about it. At the end of the day I'll be doing something I absolutely love and will live within my means to steadily pay it back. Cost is definitely something to consider when applying/deciding, but at the end of the day do you want to matriculate with a more expensive school and get on with it or wait and risk not getting in the next year and starting that cycle all over for the third time? It's getting more and more competitive. Jesus that was rambling.
Honestly if you can't go to a less expensive school, I would go for PTA. You will still make a decent income, and if she makes good money as well, you'll still have a good quality of life and be able to own a home and support a family.
Congratulations on the upcoming marriage, by the way!
I don't think I can give you advice because I don't know the details of your personal situation. What if you had very rich parents who would leave you a considerable amount of money as inheritance? If so, the $150K for PT school wouldn't matter at all. OTOH, what if your SO's job, though it pays well now, is at risk of being eliminated in a year or two? In that case I'd tell you to get a PTA degree.
What you can do is play out each scenario (PT or PTA) over the next 5 or 10 years, and see which one would be more appropriate for you, keeping in mind your personal situation. Also keep an eye out for the changing medical environment (how Medicare's reimbursement policy would affect PTAs' and PTs' pay).
Thanks to everyone for the responses. My parents aren't rich and so I don't have any money coming my way in the near future. I would love to go to a state school (UIC) which would be the cheapest, I'm avoiding more expensive schools like NU. But I know I can't be picky. the future of the PTA profession scares me I don't want to spend another 2 years in school just to come out and the jobs not be there. In the Chicagoland area there is a good demand for PTA's RIGHT NOW. but you never know. The starting salary for PTA's in chicago is about 40-45k with the PTA i work with making about 54k and thats with 14 years of exp.
You guys are absolutely right I have to play it out for the next 5 years and 10 years and see what makes sense to me. Funny thing is when I started to talk about PT vs PTA school some of the therapists I work with started to suggest PA school instead.
but I'm more of a hands on type person and plus the extra chem's would kill me LOL!
The one thing that never appealed to me about PA school was the fact that you are essentially working under someone your whole life. At least with pt you have the option to own your own clinic.
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Well it's a financial investment. I'll be make more money over the long run than I make now. I love my PTA career (and I admit there's still room for improvement in it as I think I could be earning and doing more depending on where i go) but a PT career would be better and I have the opportunity to do it now so I'm going to take the chance while I still have it. If I wait any longer I could loose this opportunity to be a PT. Right now I'm single, fairly young(30), no kids, no debt, savings, good paying job, prerequisites are still all fairly recent but a couple approaching over 10 years, and I've been accepted to the best DPT school for me (cheap[$75,000 tuition total], local[less than 1hour drive] and weekend program) and all that can change in the future so I'm taking the chance of going to PT school now while I can.
As far as your situation, I'm not big on taking out large amounts of debt so I would probably choose PTA over PT. Then if the opportunity presents itself in the future, I'd go in to PT after years working as a PTA. Regardless if you go to PTA school or PT school you will be down to one income anyway because PTA school requires that time and work and clinicals also where you won't really have time for a job while in school. But PTA school would be cheaper although it would pay a lot less than a PT in the long run. So it's really a difficult decision. And of course there is the difference in the jobs themselves as a PTA vs a PT, although the difference isn't much from my experience. Wow I don't know what to tell you, you may have to make a sacrifice. You probably can't have it all. It may come down to DPT school vs the new house at least for the time, both probably can't happen at the same time. But the obvious thing to spend money on first is the thing that would generate money and that's not the house, so it should be either PTA school or DPT school before the house. PTA would still be my choice if I were you, since you have other loves that cost a chunk of money (a house plus it seems you're already in debt), you can't have the best of both worlds. I'm just not fond of going in to so much debt.
P.S. I just read this article that surprised me about a Communication degree which is what I received in undergraduate. I was unaware that I could make so much with the degree.
This is the article: http://education.yahoo.net/articles/degrees_employers_want_2.htm?kid=1MNEO
Five degrees employers want the most
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If you believe those "best-degrees" or "best-careers" articles that appear regularly on Yahoo and MSN, I got some swampland in the Sahara you may be interested in... I am surprised they haven't done an article touting a typewriter-repair career yet.
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lol
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Since a list was posted on here, CNN Money has listed Physical Therapy as the eighth highest 'best job' in the country and the sixth highest Fastest Growing Job in the country. The list came out last year
PTs are in high demand and in 10 years this demand will be even higher. Logically, PT salaries should become higher too. Unles we already have tons of financial debt and responsibility, I do not think that it will be a problem for us to pay off the school debt! I am planning to pay it off within 5 years.
I wish I could share your optimism.
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Same here. Very soon the price of a DPT will exceed the salary it pays. I know we want to do what we love, but you have to be pragmatic and weigh the cost of everything. Just because you love playing the piano doesn't mean you should play the piano for a living.
Kevin
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Dunno... If the USPS is any measure of what's to come, the new healthcare reform could bankrupt us and we may end up in trouble salary wise. Our salary is highly dependent on how much we are reimbursed. Auxiliary services are what they are. However, I do believe the need for PT services will remain stable due to the baby boomer generation. We may have to see more, do less and delegate more often.
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I was busy with exams and projects for the last couple of weeks.
Many PT classes will have "practical" tests in addition to the traditional written tests: that's where you treat a patient (usually one of your classmates, sometimes the prof him/herself) while the prof observes and grades you. Make sure you practice these practicals to the point where they become automatic. It's like rehearsing a piano piece or a judo move: do it often enough and it's ingrained in muscle memory, you perform it without having to think about it.
Practicing those moves may take some time but believe me, it's well worth the effort: you can score 95% or 100% fairly easily on the practicals. This would help balance out your written test scores if you unfortunately bomb those. Doing well on the practicals saved my behind a couple of times. Most reputable PT schools have rather strict policies on failing a class: do it twice and you may get dropped from the program.
Find a classmate who's willing to practice, and go for it.
Slightly off-topic, but still related to PT: this is the kind of analysis you should do as you contemplate leaving your career to go back to school:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=997753
bnwj89 - I hope you don't mind my redirecting folks to your post.
Many PT classes will have "practical" tests in addition to the traditional written tests: that's where you treat a patient (usually one of your classmates, sometimes the prof him/herself) while the prof observes and grades you. Make sure you practice these practicals to the point where they become automatic. It's like rehearsing a piano piece or a judo move: do it often enough and it's ingrained in muscle memory, you perform it without having to think about it.
Practicing those moves may take some time but believe me, it's well worth the effort: you can score 95% or 100% fairly easily on the practicals. This would help balance out your written test scores if you unfortunately bomb those. Doing well on the practicals saved my behind a couple of times. Most reputable PT schools have rather strict policies on failing a class: do it twice and you may get dropped from the program.
Find a classmate who's willing to practice, and go for it.
Slightly off-topic, but still related to PT: this is the kind of analysis you should do as you contemplate leaving your career to go back to school:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=997753
bnwj89 - I hope you don't mind my redirecting folks to your post.
Also practice on people who are not your classmates. They (and you) have a tendency to subconsciously guide the test. For example, student A is told to demonstrate a Manual Muscle test, and student B puts themself in the correct position for that test. Also non-students are more likely to use substitution movements
I think a good anatomy book is something you should have as you go through PT school. Lots of folks buy the Netter book but it's rather expensive.
This one is just as good, and much much cheaper:
http://www.amazon.com/Atlas-Human-Anatomy-Clinical-Edition/dp/1603110445
I found a copy (like-new condition) at a thrift shop for $1.50!
This one is just as good, and much much cheaper:
http://www.amazon.com/Atlas-Human-Anatomy-Clinical-Edition/dp/1603110445
I found a copy (like-new condition) at a thrift shop for $1.50!
Personally, I preferred Rohen's Atlas vs. Netter's. I think, mainly due to the actual photographs of cadaveric dissections.
http://www.amazon.com/Color-Atlas-A...?ie=UTF8&qid=1367401575&sr=8-1&keywords=rohen
A simple google search and you should be abe find the complete 7th edition in PDF format.
http://www.amazon.com/Color-Atlas-A...?ie=UTF8&qid=1367401575&sr=8-1&keywords=rohen
A simple google search and you should be abe find the complete 7th edition in PDF format.
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I also found the pdf.
I would still spring the $7 and buy a hard-copy of the Tillmann book though (since it is the cheapest). Flipping back and forth between the pages of a real book is a lot easier than scrolling through a bunch of screens on your laptop.
BTW, the pdf I downloaded has a few pages in Arabic script at the very beginning and the end of the book. I sure hope they are innocuous...
I would still spring the $7 and buy a hard-copy of the Tillmann book though (since it is the cheapest). Flipping back and forth between the pages of a real book is a lot easier than scrolling through a bunch of screens on your laptop.
BTW, the pdf I downloaded has a few pages in Arabic script at the very beginning and the end of the book. I sure hope they are innocuous...
I suppose it depends on the end user. I used the 6th edition book while in school, but I now keep the new edition pdf on my ipad. I've grown comfortable enough with the search feature on my reader app that the differences between flipping thru pages on my hardcopy vs the pdf are negligible. The ability to zoom in is an additional benefit. But, to each his own.
My copy of the pdf does not have any arabic
My copy of the pdf does not have any arabic
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Does the Tillman book have cadaveric images? I also find those helpful.
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I haven't posted on here in a while (you know, since I started PT school last August and all), but I just came across this thread when looking for some advice on residencies, so I figured I would share my story considering I am also a "non-traditional" student:
I am 27, I have a husband and a four-year-old daughter and I graduated in 2007 with a degree in Business and Marketing.
Soooooo, the first half of the first semester SUCKED. I failed my first anatomy exam because I had no idea how to study, my husband and I were at each other's throats all the time because we couldn't lock down a schedule that allowed me ample time to study as well as family time, I NEVER saw my daughter, and my house was a mess...always.
I have no idea when it changed, but things just got better:
1. You get used to the pacing, and you get more efficient at studying. For the first anatomy exam, I studied by myself. After that I made it a point to study in groups. It just worked better for me at that point. I went from failing to getting over 90% on every subsequent anatomy exam (including the remediation of the first exam). Now, in my third semester, I've actually transitioned into studying solo again (or with just one other person). As someone else stated before, larger groups tend to lend themselves to social hour, and I started to find that I was spending 4-5 hours in a group, and only actually studying for maybe 2 of those hours. And no one ever wants to study the same thing. So, again, it just goes back to efficiency and time management. No one wants to spend 8 hours with their classmates in the library, no matter how much you like them. Trust me. All that being said, I'm sure that once we get into our MSK/neuro/pediatric patient management classes this Fall I'll be back to working in groups.
2. At the beginning of the school year I completely stopped doing anything unrelated to the academics of PT school and I honestly feel like my performance actually suffered because of it. Now I play intramurals, am co-chair of our Neuro SIG, and I go to Bikram every day. I go out on the weekends with my classmates, make it a point to have date nights with my husband and girls' days with my daughter, and dinner every single night with the both of them. Sure, I stay up WAYYYY too late sometimes studying because I chose to spend this time with them, but as a non-trad, I have chosen to sacrifice sleep if it means that I can spend some time with my family. I definitely found that I needed the balance in my life to stay sane and on the right track with school. Don't focus entirely on school all the time. You will burn out, make yourself crazy, and then rub your crazy off on everyone around you.
3. As for the debt:income ratio, I go to Duke. It is expensive ($35,000ish/year). I have a husband who makes a decent salary as a mechanic, but we still take out the maximum amount of student loans because my daughter goes to preschool. My rationalization for the whole debt:income ratio in regards to my own situation is, thus: I am in love with this profession. In almost a year of struggling academically, emotionally and personally, I am still in love with this profession and I am only getting more confident that this is what I want to do with my life. I've even started to realize exactly what I want to do regarding specialization (eventually get my NCS and work with TBI/SCI pts. most likely at the VA). I will most likely have $200,000 in loan debt by the time I'm in the workforce. It is a HUGE sum of money, however, it's not an impossible debt to overcome! There are a lot of repayment options as well as incentives for joining the military or working for the VA or low-income areas, or signing bonuses or loan incentives, etc. The income will come with experience and time and enthusiasm. Not every school offers in-state tuition. In fact, I'm guessing about 1/4 of the programs in the country offer tuition of less than $50,000 for the entire program (correct me if I'm wrong), and not everyone can go there. I think that whichever school you want to go to, go to it and go to it with open arms and make the most of it because you won't get anything out of it if you just go to classes and that's not even where you learn the most. I went to Duke because of the clinical affiliations offered, the high number of specialty certified staff members, and the ridiculous number of opportunities afforded to us outside of the classroom (and basketball, duhhhh). In the past two weeks alone I have been to an open-house at a local hospital demonstrating the advances in neurorehab technology, participated in the Valor Games for wounded warriors, attended a neuro lecture from a leading NCS, participated in Bridge II Sports (adaptive rec), and started planning some events for our Neuro SIG. I LOVE that Duke has offered me so much and I've only been here for a year. Yes, the debt is daunting and I'm sure it will only be more so when I graduate, but I will not regret that I spent that money getting a degree in a field that I am passionate about at a school that has given me so much. Just my opinion on THAT.
So, to give you a bit of a rundown of my life currently: I have dinner with my family every evening, I tuck my daughter into bed and read her a book every night, I spend quality time with them on the weekends, I exercise often, I eat well, I sleep when I have time, I study until the wee hours of the morning (sometimes), I play intramural soccer, I go out and get hammered with my classmates (sometimes), I take afternoon naps when I don't have class (even though I'm sure I should be studying), I don't always do all of the required reading, I attend extracurricular events on the regular, I stress out over stupid stuff, I don't stress out enough over important stuff, I drink way too many Rockstar energy drinks, I laugh A LOT....and I just ENJOY it. Three years is nothing. Hell, I can't believe my first year is almost gone! I feel like I just started! It's rough and it sucks in the beginning whether you are a traditional student or a non-traditional student, but they put us in cohorts for a reason--so we can get each other through it. Don't act like just because you are a non-traditional student, that you are ipso-facto superior to the "youngin's". You may be more mature, but you're all there for the same reason and you will all have your own struggles whether it's kids or husbands or boyfriends or your ailing mom or the job you are trying to juggle or...etc. Everyone is non-traditional in their own way so don't assume that because you are older with a kid or that you have previously had a career that you will be treated differently. You won't be. And you shouldn't be. I haven't asked for, nor do I expect any special consideration because I have a daughter (I'm only 1 of 3 parents in my class). You're in it together regardless of your circumstances. So, pretty much throw the trad. vs. non-trad. thing out the window, embrace each other, and ride it out.
Finally, no matter how much advice and planning and preparation you do, you will not be ready for PT school because you've never done it before. It will be a struggle that you will get through and hopefully when you do you will see that the struggle made the triumph that much sweeter.
oh, and p.s. my house is still a mess...always.
I am 27, I have a husband and a four-year-old daughter and I graduated in 2007 with a degree in Business and Marketing.
Soooooo, the first half of the first semester SUCKED. I failed my first anatomy exam because I had no idea how to study, my husband and I were at each other's throats all the time because we couldn't lock down a schedule that allowed me ample time to study as well as family time, I NEVER saw my daughter, and my house was a mess...always.
I have no idea when it changed, but things just got better:
1. You get used to the pacing, and you get more efficient at studying. For the first anatomy exam, I studied by myself. After that I made it a point to study in groups. It just worked better for me at that point. I went from failing to getting over 90% on every subsequent anatomy exam (including the remediation of the first exam). Now, in my third semester, I've actually transitioned into studying solo again (or with just one other person). As someone else stated before, larger groups tend to lend themselves to social hour, and I started to find that I was spending 4-5 hours in a group, and only actually studying for maybe 2 of those hours. And no one ever wants to study the same thing. So, again, it just goes back to efficiency and time management. No one wants to spend 8 hours with their classmates in the library, no matter how much you like them. Trust me. All that being said, I'm sure that once we get into our MSK/neuro/pediatric patient management classes this Fall I'll be back to working in groups.
2. At the beginning of the school year I completely stopped doing anything unrelated to the academics of PT school and I honestly feel like my performance actually suffered because of it. Now I play intramurals, am co-chair of our Neuro SIG, and I go to Bikram every day. I go out on the weekends with my classmates, make it a point to have date nights with my husband and girls' days with my daughter, and dinner every single night with the both of them. Sure, I stay up WAYYYY too late sometimes studying because I chose to spend this time with them, but as a non-trad, I have chosen to sacrifice sleep if it means that I can spend some time with my family. I definitely found that I needed the balance in my life to stay sane and on the right track with school. Don't focus entirely on school all the time. You will burn out, make yourself crazy, and then rub your crazy off on everyone around you.
3. As for the debt:income ratio, I go to Duke. It is expensive ($35,000ish/year). I have a husband who makes a decent salary as a mechanic, but we still take out the maximum amount of student loans because my daughter goes to preschool. My rationalization for the whole debt:income ratio in regards to my own situation is, thus: I am in love with this profession. In almost a year of struggling academically, emotionally and personally, I am still in love with this profession and I am only getting more confident that this is what I want to do with my life. I've even started to realize exactly what I want to do regarding specialization (eventually get my NCS and work with TBI/SCI pts. most likely at the VA). I will most likely have $200,000 in loan debt by the time I'm in the workforce. It is a HUGE sum of money, however, it's not an impossible debt to overcome! There are a lot of repayment options as well as incentives for joining the military or working for the VA or low-income areas, or signing bonuses or loan incentives, etc. The income will come with experience and time and enthusiasm. Not every school offers in-state tuition. In fact, I'm guessing about 1/4 of the programs in the country offer tuition of less than $50,000 for the entire program (correct me if I'm wrong), and not everyone can go there. I think that whichever school you want to go to, go to it and go to it with open arms and make the most of it because you won't get anything out of it if you just go to classes and that's not even where you learn the most. I went to Duke because of the clinical affiliations offered, the high number of specialty certified staff members, and the ridiculous number of opportunities afforded to us outside of the classroom (and basketball, duhhhh). In the past two weeks alone I have been to an open-house at a local hospital demonstrating the advances in neurorehab technology, participated in the Valor Games for wounded warriors, attended a neuro lecture from a leading NCS, participated in Bridge II Sports (adaptive rec), and started planning some events for our Neuro SIG. I LOVE that Duke has offered me so much and I've only been here for a year. Yes, the debt is daunting and I'm sure it will only be more so when I graduate, but I will not regret that I spent that money getting a degree in a field that I am passionate about at a school that has given me so much. Just my opinion on THAT.
So, to give you a bit of a rundown of my life currently: I have dinner with my family every evening, I tuck my daughter into bed and read her a book every night, I spend quality time with them on the weekends, I exercise often, I eat well, I sleep when I have time, I study until the wee hours of the morning (sometimes), I play intramural soccer, I go out and get hammered with my classmates (sometimes), I take afternoon naps when I don't have class (even though I'm sure I should be studying), I don't always do all of the required reading, I attend extracurricular events on the regular, I stress out over stupid stuff, I don't stress out enough over important stuff, I drink way too many Rockstar energy drinks, I laugh A LOT....and I just ENJOY it. Three years is nothing. Hell, I can't believe my first year is almost gone! I feel like I just started! It's rough and it sucks in the beginning whether you are a traditional student or a non-traditional student, but they put us in cohorts for a reason--so we can get each other through it. Don't act like just because you are a non-traditional student, that you are ipso-facto superior to the "youngin's". You may be more mature, but you're all there for the same reason and you will all have your own struggles whether it's kids or husbands or boyfriends or your ailing mom or the job you are trying to juggle or...etc. Everyone is non-traditional in their own way so don't assume that because you are older with a kid or that you have previously had a career that you will be treated differently. You won't be. And you shouldn't be. I haven't asked for, nor do I expect any special consideration because I have a daughter (I'm only 1 of 3 parents in my class). You're in it together regardless of your circumstances. So, pretty much throw the trad. vs. non-trad. thing out the window, embrace each other, and ride it out.
Finally, no matter how much advice and planning and preparation you do, you will not be ready for PT school because you've never done it before. It will be a struggle that you will get through and hopefully when you do you will see that the struggle made the triumph that much sweeter.
oh, and p.s. my house is still a mess...always.
kcrat - good to see you back. I was also at the Neuro Rehab expo last weekeend - we could have run into each other without knowing it.
I was accepted at Duke and UNC and picked UNC, mainly because of the cost. At Duke, are students part of a team (for team-based learning) for all 3 years? And are you planning to do a residency after you graduate? I know one person at UNC who is going to Duke for an orthopedic residency. And UNC is also opening up a few residency slots. There should be more by the time we graduate.
I was accepted at Duke and UNC and picked UNC, mainly because of the cost. At Duke, are students part of a team (for team-based learning) for all 3 years? And are you planning to do a residency after you graduate? I know one person at UNC who is going to Duke for an orthopedic residency. And UNC is also opening up a few residency slots. There should be more by the time we graduate.
It was a good event! I ended up speaking with the PVA guy for most of it--he was awesome and gave me a lot of info about working for the VA and with PTSD/TBI patients/vets in general. Did you participate in the Valor games as well? I know the first day was held at UNC...It was such an amazing day, I was so inspired!
At Duke we are in our TBL teams for the entire two years (our last year is our clinical experiences, with no classroom time). And we pretty much do EVERYTHING in our teams. We are in groups of 6, and I adore my teammates. They are super supportive and we get along well. I don't know how Duke decides what teams to put its students on (because we are assigned to them before we even get there) but it worked really well for us.
And because we don't do any of our individual clinical rotations until our last year, we do a program called STEPs, where we go to the clinic for a total of 4 weeks per year in groups of 4. Those STEPs groups are the same for the entire two years as well, but they consist of entirely different members than our TBL teams. This first year we've been going to an outpatient neuro clinic and next year I believe we are doing an inpatient cardiopulm rotation.
I do plan on doing a neuro residency after graduation. A couple of the clinical rotations we are offered have an affiliated residency, so I'm looking into doing a 36-week rotation followed by a residency at the same site. I'm not sure how competitive residencies are because there isn't a ton of information on them, so we'll see. Are you planning on doing a residency?
At Duke we are in our TBL teams for the entire two years (our last year is our clinical experiences, with no classroom time). And we pretty much do EVERYTHING in our teams. We are in groups of 6, and I adore my teammates. They are super supportive and we get along well. I don't know how Duke decides what teams to put its students on (because we are assigned to them before we even get there) but it worked really well for us.
And because we don't do any of our individual clinical rotations until our last year, we do a program called STEPs, where we go to the clinic for a total of 4 weeks per year in groups of 4. Those STEPs groups are the same for the entire two years as well, but they consist of entirely different members than our TBL teams. This first year we've been going to an outpatient neuro clinic and next year I believe we are doing an inpatient cardiopulm rotation.
I do plan on doing a neuro residency after graduation. A couple of the clinical rotations we are offered have an affiliated residency, so I'm looking into doing a 36-week rotation followed by a residency at the same site. I'm not sure how competitive residencies are because there isn't a ton of information on them, so we'll see. Are you planning on doing a residency?
It's interesting that you get to do all of your clinicals in one year. Ours are spread out over the entire 3 years; in fact, I'll be starting my first one in late June, and it'll last 2 months. I keep looking for one in Hawaii...
I don't think residencies are very competitive (yet), because they are relatively new and many folks are eager to start making a living after 3 years of school. But as jobs get scarcer, residencies will certainly make a difference. The exact same situation happened in Pharmacy over the last 10 years. I have at least a dozen pharmacists in my extended family so am well aware of what's going on there (that's all we talk about in family gatherings!). The parallels between it and PT are numerous and unsettling..
I don't think residencies are very competitive (yet), because they are relatively new and many folks are eager to start making a living after 3 years of school. But as jobs get scarcer, residencies will certainly make a difference. The exact same situation happened in Pharmacy over the last 10 years. I have at least a dozen pharmacists in my extended family so am well aware of what's going on there (that's all we talk about in family gatherings!). The parallels between it and PT are numerous and unsettling..
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Thanks, kcrat21! I'm a little anxious to start PT school in August, but all the advice here helps so much.
