Foreign Language in the Workplace

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prowler50

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I want to start this post by stating I am an SDN member whom uses another screen name and I post regularly. I wanted to use this ghostname to address a possible controversial subject. That is foreign languages in the workplace. I am a resident whom works in an environment where there are a ton of Egyptian nationals whom speak Arabic. They speak Arabic all the time around patients, they discuss patients with each other in Arabic. I have had patients whom have approached me and felt threatened because the attendings where speaking in a foreign tongue. I too have felt threatened because they speak to each other in their native tongue work related functions, assigning patients, doing procedures, when they hand of patients to each other. What is your opinions?

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I want to start this post by stating I am an SDN member whom uses another screen name and I post regularly. I wanted to use this ghostname to address a possible controversial subject. That is foreign languages in the workplace. I am a resident whom works in an environment where there are a ton of Egyptian nationals whom speak Arabic. They speak Arabic all the time around patients, they discuss patients with each other in Arabic. I have had patients whom have approached me and felt threatened because the attendings where speaking in a foreign tongue. I too have felt threatened because they speak to each other in their native tongue work related functions, assigning patients, doing procedures, when they hand of patients to each other. What is your opinions?

is it that they are speaking arabic or merely another language which makes you feel "threatened". Sounds more like the former
 
I want to start this post by stating I am an SDN member whom uses another screen name and I post regularly. I wanted to use this ghostname to address a possible controversial subject. That is foreign languages in the workplace. I am a resident whom works in an environment where there are a ton of Egyptian nationals whom speak Arabic. They speak Arabic all the time around patients, they discuss patients with each other in Arabic. I have had patients whom have approached me and felt threatened because the attendings where speaking in a foreign tongue. I too have felt threatened because they speak to each other in their native tongue work related functions, assigning patients, doing procedures, when they hand of patients to each other. What is your opinions?

Cleveland Clinic
 
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That is not professional behavior and is not an acceptable practice. It is also very disrespectful to the patients, unless they were doing it for their benefit. It was explicitly forbidden when I was in the Navy.
Complain up the chain of command daily and encourage any patients who are bothered by this unprofessional practice to do the same, in writing.
P.S. It doesn't matter what the language is, it is still unprofessional behavior in the workplace.
 
I tend to agree that it is unprofessional, especially when it becomes commonplace. I speak Arabic and know firsthand when this occurs that it can be uncomfortable.

Next time it happens, tell them "Ih-ko bil ingleezi" (Speak English). :)

Where I am, it happens in Indian and Pakistani dialects.
 
I have had patients whom have approached me and felt threatened because the attendings where speaking in a foreign tongue. I too have felt threatened because they speak to each other in their native tongue work related functions, assigning patients, doing procedures, when they hand of patients to each other.

Why/how is a foreign language threatening?
 
Why/how is a foreign language threatening?

It's like talking behind your back - just right in front of you.
 
It's like talking behind your back - just right in front of you.

that has nothing to do with being "threatened". If it were spanish, italian, french, I doubt the patients and the OP would feel threatened. While it may be unprofessional/non-curtious, threatening is the last word I would use to describe it
 
I tend to agree that it is unprofessional, especially when it becomes commonplace. I speak Arabic and know firsthand when this occurs that it can be uncomfortable.

Next time it happens, tell them "Ih-ko bil ingleezi" (Speak English). :)

Where I am, it happens in Indian and Pakistani dialects.

And you can tell them
"Aap Ung-rayzi May Baat Karain" :)
 
that has nothing to do with being "threatened". If it were spanish, italian, french, I doubt the patients and the OP would feel threatened. While it may be unprofessional/non-curtious, threatening is the last word I would use to describe it

I probably should have tagged my comment to one of the two posters before Urge. I wouldn't consider it threatening, but it's definitely unprofessional in front of a patient.
 
When I was a med student in Brooklyn, while rotating on pediatrics, there was a parent of a patient who spoke no English; only one of the languages of India, which was not English. Both the intern and resident spoke her language, but spoke English between themselves and with me.

Where I'm at now, there are a LOT of people that speak Polynesian languages, and they try hard to speak English, even if they're not doing it too well.
 
I will agree that "threatened" is either the wrong term or, if it is an accurate descriptor, it is the "wrong" feeling given only the details of the situation in the OP.

The worst is when it is an attending and a resident and you are just the lowly student who doesn't speak any of the Indian dialects :-( Although at least in that situation the patients are not involved.
 
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When I was a resident a had a couple of Italian and Polish attendings who spoke in their language amongst themselves. They were all whinny bishes. Some residents didn't like it because they thought they were talking about them. I couldn't care less. If they are going to talk about you they will do it in any language. I would concentrate in doing a good job and disregard the language issue.

Or, you can get a Rosetta Stone cd and start practicing with them
 
Stupid aside to add, and this isn't my opinion, but I went through some OSHA training a while back and one of the reasons speaking English only in the workplace was mandated at companies in the US is that (follow me here, just repeating what the reasoning is), if you are in the workplace, someone can be speaking a foreign language in front of you and you have no clue as to what they are saying. One possibility is, (in foreign tongue), "I would like to walk over there and take a knife and stab Dr. 712. Actually, I'm going to kill D712 right now, here I come." You have no knowledge of this and no protection...yada yada. Yada. :rolleyes:

And that's the logic behind English only in the workplace. From governmental organizations.

Not saying it would EVER happen, especially in an OR amongst your fellow docs, however, I'm SURE it happened to make it on the books in Washington. Lord knows.

As someone who married a foreigner, and has two 1/2 Brazilian boys, I'm not one who really cares what language is being spoken in my presence. I can tell when my boss is screwing around in regard to me, in Spanish, it usually follows a nice lunch, he's in good spirits, and is making fun of me and he and the nurses are all laughing so hard they are snorting. Whatcha gonna do? :love:

D712
 
I think you should look at the bright side:
Not only you are learning anesthesia but you might learn a new language as well :D

I don't think this is appropriate (ex. you are prohibited to speak any language other than English when you take CS)...but I totally agree with the above. Nothing you can do about it so look at the bright side - this is what I would do.

Or if you so desire, inform them of your concerns in private.
 
I want to start this post by stating I am an SDN member whom uses another screen name and I post regularly. I wanted to use this ghostname to address a possible controversial subject. That is foreign languages in the workplace. I am a resident whom works in an environment where there are a ton of Egyptian nationals whom speak Arabic. They speak Arabic all the time around patients, they discuss patients with each other in Arabic. I have had patients whom have approached me and felt threatened because the attendings where speaking in a foreign tongue. I too have felt threatened because they speak to each other in their native tongue work related functions, assigning patients, doing procedures, when they hand of patients to each other. What is your opinions?


Your post is rather interesting/entertaining in two ways:

1) You seem to allude to the fact that Arabic speakers in your work place frighten you, as you report them to be "threatning." In your mind's eye, perhaps they seem to cloak themselves or their views toward you with their desire to utilize Arabic over English.

2) You self reported to all of us that you are a frequent poster on this forum, yet you chose to cloak your identity by creating another account. Now I ask, what does that say about you? They cloak themselves with another language, yet you shield yourself with another online identity....

Based on the above two points, I can deduce the following about you:
It could be that you are a paranoid delusional human being (maybe a not so well performing resident?) who is unsure about what others think of him/her at the work place. It may also be that you are an Arab hating, neo-lunatic who just hates Arabs for the sake of hating Arabs... Or, more interestingly, a self hating Arab who despises his own language/culture. Lastly, I doubt that you have posted the above based on serious concerns for the patient.
 
Your post is rather interesting/entertaining in two ways:

1) You seem to allude to the fact that Arabic speakers in your work place frighten you, as you report them to be "threatning." In your mind's eye, perhaps they seem to cloak themselves or their views toward you with their desire to utilize Arabic over English.

2) You self reported to all of us that you are a frequent poster on this forum, yet you chose to cloak your identity by creating another account. Now I ask, what does that say about you? They cloak themselves with another language, yet you shield yourself with another online identity....

Based on the above two points, I can deduce the following about you:
It could be that you are a paranoid delusional human being (maybe a not so well performing resident?) who is unsure about what others think of him/her at the work place. It may also be that you are an Arab hating, neo-lunatic who just hates Arabs for the sake of hating Arabs... Or, more interestingly, a self hating Arab who despises his own language/culture. Lastly, I doubt that you have posted the above based on serious concerns for the patient.

And oh, btw, I am not an arab :D
 
This is the way I see it. I speak Spanish fluently. As a medical student I rotated in Miami. If my patients felt more comfortable speaking Spanish, I would speak with them in Spanish. When at work and not in the company of Spanish speaking patients, I try to limit how much Spanish I use. It’s just a tad-bit rude if you do because you are purposely excluding others from your conversation- right in front of their face. A private conversation is a different story. Private conversations occur in private, not in front of people who do not speak the language.

i know... people like to speak in their native tongue... but I do believe you need to be considerate of those who may be wondering “what the hell he or she is saying?” .... especially in a business where information (on your patients) can be of vital importance.

Think about this scenario: How would you feel if you found yourself in the middle of a ruptured AAA with a surgeon and 1st assist speaking to themselves in some foreign language? This is the extreme version of what the OP is speaking of, yet not too far off. I know I wouldn’t like to have to tell one of my colleagues to speak English. This is the USA after all right?

But...

Being a product of 2 different cultures makes me pretty tolerant of this type of thing when I see it. It usually is a benign gesture among people who find themselves in a different land who often feel connected to their roots via a common language. It’s not necessarily malevolent.
 
Being a product of 2 different cultures makes me pretty tolerant of this type of thing when I see it. It usually is a benign gesture among people who find themselves in a different land who often feel connected to their roots via a common language. It’s not necessarily malevolent.

Well put; I agree.

It is also fun when people assume that you do not speak their language and you get to surprise them... I feel like Antonio Banderas in 13th Warrior.
 
Doesn't bother me. It's not like Arabic speakers are somehow privileged at your hospital (if anything, they probably have few friends higher-up). Just ignore it and get on with your life. Your ability to communicate fluently in English is going to be your saving grace, and it will get you much further in your career compared to their imperfect English and their need to communicate with each other in a more familiar language.

Whether or not you see their behavior as rude, the polite thing for you to do is not mention it.
 
:laugh:
Great post!
Did you do psychiatry before anesthesia?

Your post is rather interesting/entertaining in two ways:

1) You seem to allude to the fact that Arabic speakers in your work place frighten you, as you report them to be "threatning." In your mind's eye, perhaps they seem to cloak themselves or their views toward you with their desire to utilize Arabic over English.

2) You self reported to all of us that you are a frequent poster on this forum, yet you chose to cloak your identity by creating another account. Now I ask, what does that say about you? They cloak themselves with another language, yet you shield yourself with another online identity....

Based on the above two points, I can deduce the following about you:
It could be that you are a paranoid delusional human being (maybe a not so well performing resident?) who is unsure about what others think of him/her at the work place. It may also be that you are an Arab hating, neo-lunatic who just hates Arabs for the sake of hating Arabs... Or, more interestingly, a self hating Arab who despises his own language/culture. Lastly, I doubt that you have posted the above based on serious concerns for the patient.
 
I would add that "whom" is an object; "who" is a subject, and the two aren't interchangeable. The subject of the verb is the one actually doing the thing that the verb describes, whereas the object is the target of the verb action. For example, you might have said, "Who is speaking English to whom?" So, technically, you aren't really using English either.
 
I want to start this post by stating I am an SDN member whom uses another screen name and I post regularly. I wanted to use this ghostname to address a possible controversial subject. That is foreign languages in the workplace. I am a resident whom works in an environment where there are a ton of Egyptian nationals whom speak Arabic. They speak Arabic all the time around patients, they discuss patients with each other in Arabic. I have had patients whom have approached me and felt threatened because the attendings where speaking in a foreign tongue. I too have felt threatened because they speak to each other in their native tongue work related functions, assigning patients, doing procedures, when they hand of patients to each other. What is your opinions?

Hated that when I was a resident and my attendings would speak in foreign tongue (always sounded sinister:scared:), can only imagine how the patients felt.:eek: If patients are dissatisfied by this behavior, and I'm sure they are, it will only be a matter of time until they produce formal complaints. :thumbup: Repetitive complaints by patients will hopefully result in warranted disciplinary action. :laugh::smuggrin:
 
So, technically, you aren't really using English either.

Making a grammatical error is not equal to "technically not speaking the language". If an idea is transmitted successfully with words of a certain style, using a specified manner of sentence construction, that person is speaking a certain language.

Or, alternately, if NOT "English", what language would you call it? You can't say it is NOT language, since others understood it (and clearly), and, thus, is not babbling.
 
lighten up Frances

Making a grammatical error is not equal to "technically not speaking the language". If an idea is transmitted successfully with words of a certain style, using a specified manner of sentence construction, that person is speaking a certain language.

Or, alternately, if NOT "English", what language would you call it? You can't say it is NOT language, since others understood it (and clearly), and, thus, is not babbling.
 
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