Forensic Pathology Anyone

[Postmord81]

I have just began taking classes to earn my Bachlor's in Chemistry and get on my way to becoming a Forensic Pathologist. I have been interested in it since high school. Anyone have any insight into this field or share the interest?

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[yaah]

Well, sounds like you have a loooooooong way to go. You have to know what you are interested in - the real world of forensic path is very unlike tv, and there are many possible jobs. Doesn't mean you have to go all the way through med school to do them. You have to do 4 years of med school, then 4 years of path residency (very little of which will have to do with forensics), then a FP fellowship.

 

[Postmord81]

Well, sounds like you have a loooooooong way to go. You have to know what you are interested in - the real world of forensic path is very unlike tv, and there are many possible jobs. Doesn't mean you have to go all the way through med school to do them. You have to do 4 years of med school, then 4 years of path residency (very little of which will have to do with forensics), then a FP fellowship.

I have been doing some reading up on the at least 13 years of school I will have to go through. I know that I definately want to be a forensic pathologist rather than a coroner. The thing that I am interested in most is just getting the details from the body of the victim of whatever and the whodunnit of the case from that viewpoint. I found alot of valuable information on the homepage of the Chief Medical Examiner of VA, Marcella Fierro. I have been in contacted her in the past regarding my interest.
I am very excited to just be on my way now.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Well, sounds like you have a loooooooong way to go. You have to know what you are interested in - the real world of forensic path is very unlike tv, and there are many possible jobs. Doesn't mean you have to go all the way through med school to do them. You have to do 4 years of med school, then 4 years of path residency (very little of which will have to do with forensics), then a FP fellowship.

that's if he does AP/CP

 

[yaah]

Lots of CP stuff is important to forensics, I know some people have thought about doing AP only and forensics, but if I was running things I wouldn't let people do that.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Lots of CP stuff is important to forensics, I know some people have thought about doing AP only and forensics, but if I was running things I wouldn't let people do that.

i know dude...i was just presenting another option

 

[deschutes]

Twelve years of school instead of thirteen!

 

[Postmord81]

Does anyone have any real specifics of what the education track is? I have found you know some basic stuff.Will I be able to go to any med school or will I have to find one that offers forensic pathology study?
Any links or information is helpful.

 

[beary]

Any med school would be fine. Basically all med schools teach the same curriculum, and you don't choose a specialty until your residency. So go to a med school you like (there are some differences in curriculum and stuff, and of course location), and then you will go to a pathology residency. That could be at the same place you did med school or a different place. Then you will need to do a forensics fellowship. I think that there are a limited number of these around.

 

[njac]

I have a similar question - I've applied to pharmacy school but at the moment I am working in the state veterinary diagnostic lab - down the hall from the medical examiner. hot damn I love playing with dead stuff. be it human, canine, equine, guinea pig. if I don't get into pharmacy school I may seriously step back and look at things and find a way to get into path - be it via med school or vet school.

our veterinary pathologists do histopath, cytology and necropsies regularly and occassionally we get interesting enough mycology or bacteriology cases that they get involved in those as well (like the coccidioidies mycosis outbreak in a pack of alpacas in the southern part of the state)

so yeah - I am really enjoying reading the path forum and maybe one day I'll be doing it as well.

 

[Postmord81]

Any med school would be fine. Basically all med schools teach the same curriculum, and you don't choose a specialty until your residency. So go to a med school you like (there are some differences in curriculum and stuff, and of course location), and then you will go to a pathology residency. That could be at the same place you did med school or a different place. Then you will need to do a forensics fellowship. I think that there are a limited number of these around.

Thank you for your input. Now I can start some real contemplation. I have looked at any schools so far b/c I wasn't sure what I needed to be looking for. It's good to know that I have more than a few options for med school anyways available. Thank you again.

 

[N-toxicologist]

Does anyone have any real specifics of what the education track is? I have found you know some basic stuff.Will I be able to go to any med school or will I have to find one that offers forensic pathology study?
Any links or information is helpful.

Only recently has the US Dept of Justice attempted to really put forth any criteria. The National Institute of Justice (NIJ) put out a report in June 2004 sort of outlining basic criteria for Forensic Scientists and their formal training. From the pdf.: "Forensic pathologists.........are licensed physicians who have completed medical school, 5 years of pathology internship and residency, and 1 year of forensic pathology fellowship....."

May I ask why you're taking chemistry courses instead of biology for this track? Do you have a good advisor who's knowledgeable on this subject? Do you have a specific undergrad track at your school, or is this a do-it-yourself type thing you're putting together? The reason I ask, is because, it's a fairly new idea for some colleges to be offering an actual forensics degree. My school will be starting their charter class this fall (to which I have an acceptance, BTW)

I'll tell you what's on MY degree plan: since toxicology is my main interest, and I have already done all my backelor's work for biology, I will essentially be earning a BS in chemistry, plus a certification. To get the certification, I have to take classes in criminalistics, criminal investigation, forenseic microscopy, forensic biology, medicinal chemistry, among others, an internship at various crime labs around this area, AND pass the exam. The certification is given by the AAFS (American Academy of Forensic Sciences), whose website I will link below. WHen you visit the website, look on the left for the pdf. from the NIJ that I quoted above. It will tell you what the academy is looking for as far as standards for forensic scientists, as well as classes you should be taking. Also, look under "becoming a member" and look under the pathology section. There are e-mail addresses for the heads of each specialty. I bet you could glean a lot of good info from them. Unfortunately, you can't get onto the discussion forums without a membership, but a student membership is only $55, with a $15 app fee. I highly recommend it. I'm in the process of applying now. I think there's a bunch of flase information and disorganization out there, because of CSI and TV, and it's such a growing interest that the schools are scrambling and trying to get programs into place. This report by the NIJ only came out this past summer, if that tells you anything. Good luck to you. I'm lucky in that I go to a school that has an awesome Forensic Ph.D on faculty.

Check out this site:
http://www.aafs.org/

 

[yaah]

The above needs to be modified now because pathology residency is only 4 years required, not 5. So residency plus fellowship would be 5 years total.

I also like that you used the word "glean." Hot.

 

[bananaface]

I have a similar question - I've applied to pharmacy school but at the moment I am working in the state veterinary diagnostic lab - down the hall from the medical examiner. hot damn I love playing with dead stuff. be it human, canine, equine, guinea pig. if I don't get into pharmacy school I may seriously step back and look at things and find a way to get into path - be it via med school or vet school.

our veterinary pathologists do histopath, cytology and necropsies regularly and occassionally we get interesting enough mycology or bacteriology cases that they get involved in those as well (like the coccidioidies mycosis outbreak in a pack of alpacas in the southern part of the state)

so yeah - I am really enjoying reading the path forum and maybe one day I'll be doing it as well.

Path as a backup to pharm. I have to quote this!



Seriously though, do what you enjoy the most. If you really want path more, go for that. If you want pharm more, you'll improve your application and reapply if you are really dedicated. If your job doesn't interest you, you miss out on quality of life. Don't settle.

 

[N-toxicologist]

The above needs to be modified now because pathology residency is only 4 years required, not 5. So residency plus fellowship would be 5 years total.

Noted. Since it came straight from the site, I don't want to misquote, but those reading should take note of yaah's note.

I also like that you used the word "glean." Hot.

you're such a sweet talker.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

yeah mousey, i can imagine that he's a sweet talker. but he gets quite sloppy after having a few steins of kickass german beer.

 

[N-toxicologist]

this, coming from M. inebrius himself?

 

[b&ierstiefel]

this, coming from M. inebrius himself?

dehhh

 

[bananaface]

Hey Andy, can you drop the kids off for me?

 

[b&ierstiefel]

I don't have any children.

 

[bananaface]

I meant at the pool, *******.

 

[Postmord81]

Only recently has the US Dept of Justice attempted to really put forth any criteria. The National Institute of Justice (NIJ) put out a report in June 2004 sort of outlining basic criteria for Forensic Scientists and their formal training. From the pdf.: "Forensic pathologists.........are licensed physicians who have completed medical school, 5 years of pathology internship and residency, and 1 year of forensic pathology fellowship....."

May I ask why you're taking chemistry courses instead of biology for this track? Do you have a good advisor who's knowledgeable on this subject? Do you have a specific undergrad track at your school, or is this a do-it-yourself type thing you're putting together? The reason I ask, is because, it's a fairly new idea for some colleges to be offering an actual forensics degree. My school will be starting their charter class this fall (to which I have an acceptance, BTW)

I'll tell you what's on MY degree plan: since toxicology is my main interest, and I have already done all my backelor's work for biology, I will essentially be earning a BS in chemistry, plus a certification. To get the certification, I have to take classes in criminalistics, criminal investigation, forenseic microscopy, forensic biology, medicinal chemistry, among others, an internship at various crime labs around this area, AND pass the exam. The certification is given by the AAFS (American Academy of Forensic Sciences), whose website I will link below. WHen you visit the website, look on the left for the pdf. from the NIJ that I quoted above. It will tell you what the academy is looking for as far as standards for forensic scientists, as well as classes you should be taking. Also, look under "becoming a member" and look under the pathology section. There are e-mail addresses for the heads of each specialty. I bet you could glean a lot of good info from them. Unfortunately, you can't get onto the discussion forums without a membership, but a student membership is only $55, with a $15 app fee. I highly recommend it. I'm in the process of applying now. I think there's a bunch of flase information and disorganization out there, because of CSI and TV, and it's such a growing interest that the schools are scrambling and trying to get programs into place. This report by the NIJ only came out this past summer, if that tells you anything. Good luck to you. I'm lucky in that I go to a school that has an awesome Forensic Ph.D on faculty.

Check out this site:
http://www.aafs.org/

I chose to major in Chemistry after reading a couple of Forensic Science sites saying that a degree in a physical science is better to have than a criminal justice degree and most places prefer Chemistry. So I am just teying to stack my deck alittle. I am minoring in Biology also. No and about the advisor. Mine had no freakin' idea that I would have to even got to med. school. Frightening and a bit frustrating so I have an advisor but am seemingly on my own. There aren't any schools in my area that offer a forensics track, although if there were I would definately be there. I am also an avid visitor to the NIJ web page and have emailed a few of the contacts there. I have yet to recieve any type of a reply though.