Former 3rd Year Dental Student needing advice

[FormerD3]

Hello! I just made this account so I can remain incognito due to my very sensitive situation. If my name and title haven't given it away, I WAS a 3rd year dental student who was dismissed due to a couple accumulations of simulation lab and didactic course failures. However, I was able to remediate them (and passed them with FLYING colors). At the time, I was irresponsible and didn't take those classes seriously (people I associated myself with had the whole mantra "C's get degrees" mindset). The difference was, they were able to barely pass those classes with C's and I barely missed the cutoffs. Now, they just walked the stage for graduation while I am stuck in a rut that seems to be too deep to get out (btw, CONGRATS to all those in the class of 2019! Huge accomplishment).

Due to me having a limited number of remediations, I was put on the grounds for dismissal and ultimately let go from the program. You can imagine how debilitating it can be BOTH mentally and financially. However, what makes this case unique is that I passed the National Boards Part 1 examination and I feel there is some leverage for me to either find another dental school program that can look into my case and MAYBE consider me a chair in a 2nd or 3rd year setting, or simply just consider my case. I have heard a few stories of those who were offered a chair at another school, but their cases appeared to be more extreme/severe.

I come to you all in hopes of finding advice, experiences and any information that can help me in the correct direction and if any of you have heard of similar cases where another dismissed dental student found a different school (or even let back into the same school). After a lot of time to reflect and reconsider switching career paths, my heart and passion is still in dentistry. I hope someone within this field can reach out because I am lost 😒 Thanks for any and all constructive replies and advice.

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[Big Time Hoosier]

However, I was able to remediate them (and passed them with FLYING colors).

No surprise since it was more or less the second time you’d seen the material.

dismissed due to a couple accumulations of simulation lab and didactic course failures

Due to me having a limited number of remediations

Let’s not sugarcoat it, how many courses did you fail and how many course credits were they? People usually aren’t dismissed for a “couple” or “limited number” of failures, though they very likely will be forced to repeat an entire year.

You’re going to have a real hard time getting back into a dental school. Literally every other school is going to wonder what’s going to keep you from failing out again. History has a tendency to repeat itself.

If by some miracle you are able to get in somewhere, at best you’ll come in as a new D2. You very likely may have to start entirely over since it’ll be a few years since you were dismissed. Almost certainly this will likely be to a school with lower stats and ridiculous tuition. Ridiculous as in $600,000. How much do you already owe now? Do you really think you’ll be able to handle $800,000+ in student loans? I don’t.

Big Hoss

 

[321931]

I had actually one dental classmate flunk out first year. Person went back did a masters, and got into another Dental School. Said person is graduating this year.

I guess the point I'm trying to say is that....

It's a long journey. I graduated in 2014 and ....this person is graduating 2019. In the span of the time I graduated, I paid off loans, have a practice, have a house, and about to start a family. This person is just now graduating...and they are balls deep in debt. It might be literally impossible to pay off.

I don't know what the solution is- but if you still want to pursue dentistry- you can do it. It might take a masters and reapplying and a strong support behind you (family) that will help you out...but no guarantees. I'm sorry you are going through this, can you not appeal anymore? Repeating one more year would be better then repeating 4 years at a new school.

 

[dPseh]

What a tough situation.

I would try to appeal with the school that kicked you out. If there is absolutely zero chance of you getting back in, I doubt any other school would take you at this time.

I’m sure you’re in a lot of debt, and after hearing the stories from Big Hoss and Rainee, does that deter you from wanting to go back for another couple years of dental school?

If dentistry really is something you can’t let go, I’d look into hygiene school. You have the hand skills, the science knowledge, dental knowledge... school would probably be a walk in the park. According to ADEA, average tuition cost for RDH programs are around 22-36k depending on AA or BA degrees.

Loans are still going to be tough to pay back, but you’re probably going to be stuck in a rut in any situation.

 

[321931]

dPseh has a great solution: hygiene school. Totally agree. My 4 day a week hygienist is nearing 100k benefit package/bonuses. Currently making about 90k give or take with benefits. If she wanted to sub in 1-2 or days for a 5-6 day week- can easily push 100k.

Everyone likes a good hygienist, plus when they have seniority in an office- they tend to hold a lot of weight because patients follow them.

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

I'm sorry you are going through this, can you not appeal anymore?

If their cohort is just now graduating and it looks like they were dismissed shortly after starting D3, it’s been almost 2 years since they were dismissed. It’s probably a bit late to just now start any kind of appeal process.

Big Hoss

 

[periopocket]

I’ve heard down the grapevine that Midwestern AZ takes a lot of dismissed students call them ASAP gl

 

[FormerD3]

I had actually one dental classmate flunk out first year. Person went back did a masters, and got into another Dental School. Said person is graduating this year.

I guess the point I'm trying to say is that....

It's a long journey. I graduated in 2014 and ....this person is graduating 2019. In the span of the time I graduated, I paid off loans, have a practice, have a house, and about to start a family. This person is just now graduating...and they are balls deep in debt. It might be literally impossible to pay off.

I don't know what the solution is- but if you still want to pursue dentistry- you can do it. It might take a masters and reapplying and a strong support behind you (family) that will help you out...but no guarantees. I'm sorry you are going through this, can you not appeal anymore? Repeating one more year would be better then repeating 4 years at a new school.

This was recommended to me by an assistant dean of admissions. Take a masters, then reapply. You do have a good point in saying it is a long journey. And no need to be sorry, you didn't bring this upon me; I did. I do appreciate you posting though!

I can't appeal as the Dean's decision is final (bummer). She does have a track history of dismissing people from the dental school though. However, I just learned she is stepping down as Dean and leaving the program so looks like my timing couldn't have been any worse. But it is what it is.

What a tough situation.

I would try to appeal with the school that kicked you out. If there is absolutely zero chance of you getting back in, I doubt any other school would take you at this time.

I’m sure you’re in a lot of debt, and after hearing the stories from Big Hoss and Rainee, does that deter you from wanting to go back for another couple years of dental school?

If dentistry really is something you can’t let go, I’d look into hygiene school. You have the hand skills, the science knowledge, dental knowledge... school would probably be a walk in the park. According to ADEA, average tuition cost for RDH programs are around 22-36k depending on AA or BA degrees.

Loans are still going to be tough to pay back, but you’re probably going to be stuck in a rut in any situation.

It's the toughest situation I've encountered in my whole life, and honestly I would never wish this on anyone in any professional field. I can't appeal due to Dean's decision being final, and trust me it is quite a bit of debt. It slightly does deter me from wanting to go back, but honestly I'm all for it if the SLIGHTEST opportunity arises miraculously.

RDH program was another option given to me by the assistant admissions dean. It does sound promising, but I wonder if my credentials would be enough without a RDH program being bias towards my dismissal from dental school. Would you think that?

dPseh has a great solution: hygiene school. Totally agree. My 4 day a week hygienist is nearing 100k benefit package/bonuses. Currently making about 90k give or take with benefits. If she wanted to sub in 1-2 or days for a 5-6 day week- can easily push 100k.

Everyone likes a good hygienist, plus when they have seniority in an office- they tend to hold a lot of weight because patients follow them.

Good point. Again, I ask for your opinion from my comment I made above: Do you think a RDH program would have bias towards my dismissal from dental school?

I’ve heard down the grapevine that Midwestern AZ takes a lot of dismissed students call them ASAP gl

I have read about a dismissed student getting accepted there after being dismissed from his dental school on the grounds of him stealing dental school equipment. That's probably the dismissed student you are referring to.

Just unsure if this was a serious comment or just trying to be funny...

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

OP, might be worth checking out the prospects of becoming a nurse practitioner. Maybe contact some programs and see if your dismissal from dental school is a deal breaker.

Also, have you done anything over the past two years that would strengthen your application to another degree program?

You’re definitely in a tough spot. Best of luck to you.

Big Hoss

 

[deleted961052]

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[FormerD3]

OP, might be worth checking out the prospects of becoming a nurse practitioner. Maybe contact some programs and see if your dismissal from dental school is a deal breaker.

Also, have you done anything over the past two years that would strengthen your application to another degree program?

You’re definitely in a tough spot. Best of luck to you.

Big Hoss

I'll definitely be asking around you. In terms of anything that would strengthen my application the past 2 years, no. Nothing to write home about.

It's a tough spot, but we are all given our greatest challenge in life one way or the other. And there's no way around it but to go through it. Thank you for the kind words. I'll definitely look into nurse practitioner.

Not a dental student yet (starting D1 this august), but have you looked into PhD programs instead? There's lots of fields of research in dentistry, and you could go that route if you're interested. Many PhD programs even pay you a stipend, so that will help put a dent in your debt right out the door. The cycle will open up soon, see if you can get a job with your bachelor's degree in a related field while you apply.

There's also programs where you enroll as a master's student, and can decide down the line if you want to continue to pursue your PhD or graduate with a master's degree and then reapply to dental school.

Or as mentioned by other commenters, becoming a hygienist is also a great career choice! You'll be more of an employee than a business owner, but it pays well, less stress on the job, and benefits are great.

Either way, if I were in your situation, I would think about tackling your loans first, because it just feels like your chances of being accepted into a DMD/DDS program elsewhere seem slim, I'm so sorry! Look into related fields, I'm sure there will be something that works for you.

And remember: Just because it could have been different, doesn't mean it could have been better.

Good luck this upcoming year and congrats. Don't listen to those in dental school who think sitting back and doing the least to scrape by per semester is the answer. I know I was strong minded coming into my 1st year and told myself I wouldn't be one of those people, but here I am: I had the wrong vertical upper classman, and all the didactic, lab work and clinic piled up to where I did just enough to try and scrape by but couldn't.

I will look into PhD programs. That seems to be a very smart approach. And the more I talk to you guys and other deans of admissions, the more I may consider a Masters/RDH and see where my mindset is after. Thanks again for the reply.

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

OP, my brother is a sales rep for a dental supply company. He makes more money than many of the general dentists he serves. Might also be a decent gig for you.

Big Hoss

 

[2TH MVR]

How about Dental Therapist? Employment may come with some loan forgiveness.

 

[desertrat12]

OP, my brother is a sales rep for a dental supply company. He makes more money than many of the general dentists he serves. Might also be a decent gig for you.

Big Hoss

This. Or some other good job, lots out there...

I like dentistry, I’ve enjoyed school, but if something happened today that would make graduation not possible without jumping through more degrees, more years, more loans, etc, I would very likely eat the loss and move on to something else. Look up the sunk cost fallacy and ask yourself honestly if it applies to you or not.

Dentistry is an awesome field, but if you are smart enough to get into dental school (and do well in dental school when you actually apply yourself), you can excel in other arenas. Just some examples I can think of off the top of my head, ALL of these are people I know personally:

- information systems working in computer engineering, 6 figure salary with bachelors degree, has lots of freedom with where he works as long as work gets done and doesn’t spend extended periods of time out of the office. Company pays for ski passes, mountain bike passes, all sorts of cool stuff

- nursing degree followed by nurse anesthetist training making good 6 figures in a stable job

- bsn in nursing and transitioning into administration making 6 figures with just bachelors degree

- salesman for pharmaceutical company, makes excellent money but does have to be on the road a lot

These are people I know personally, none of which are incredibly gifted, just hard workers. It’s amazing what can happen in the real world when you show up for your job and work hard. If you haven’t worked in the real world outside of dentistry you might be nervous to pursue the unknown, but there are lots of opportunities for people willing to put in the work.

 

[frozenicecreamDMD]

you said the dean is stepping down and has a history of dismissing students and you said vertical upper classman aka this school is using a vertical system.

is your previous dental school UNLV?

 

[schmoob]

you said the dean is stepping down and has a history of dismissing students and you said vertical upper classman aka this school is using a vertical system.

is your previous dental school UNLV?

I'm sure if the OP wanted to identify his school, he would have done so.