forum is upsetting me

[tennisplayer21]

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Lately, this board seems to be bashing the profession:
I want to enter a field where I can make a good living, have job security, am not required to work the crazy hours of corporate America, can have a family and maybe take time off/work part time, and have human interaction

tell me if any of the following are unreasonable for most optometrist

1.You CAN find a job relatively easily everyone in the country except maybe certain areas in cali
2. most make at least $75,000/$80,000 if not more (I'm in Boston)
3. you can find part time work easily if the women out there want kids
4. if you hate working for a chain, then you can at least attempt to go into business with other optometrists or at an opthamologist office
5. you are still respected when you tell people that you are an optometrist or eye doctor even if you feel silly working at a mall
6. not nearly as stressful as other 6 figure jobs
7. work in comfortable indoor office
8. while may be routine, not nearly as routine as sitting in front of an Excel screen with no human interaction for 40 hours/week


It seems like everyone I know complains about the their jobs, starting with-
law being stressful, no barriers to entry into bad schools, bad hours for corporate firms, burned out
MDs complain about their salaries being cut in half
Financial field is extremely competitive and no job security, and may have to face decisions based on morality

So maybe every professional job as good and bad points?
Any opinions, good or bad, welcome. Am a senior deciding between optometry, dentistry, and podiatry.
Thanks

 

[Opii]

Yes, alot of bashing... welcome to the profession.
If you want some intellectual reading though you might want to try the other forums. Some people around here don't even know how to diagnose a simple myope.

 

[FutureIrishOD]

I agree with you about this forum becoming upsetting. But all the optometrists, about 12 that I talked to multiple times and 25+ others that I have talked to once or twice, I have talked with, shadowed, and worked with have all thought it was a great field to currently get into and think it will only become a better field to be in. They also have been honest with me about the troubles they have faced and some of the things they dislike about the field. But you will find naysayers in any field. You just have to decide what is important to you. Also, I think if you want to find out what the job market is like in your area and the feeling of the optometrists there is to just go around and ask to talk them. I recently was searching for a job in an optometry office and I blanked the optometry office in my area with resumes. Many of the Doctors (if not with a patient) were willing to talk to me about my career plans and give me opinions on the field and the schools they attended.

 

[idoc2b]

Have you done any shadowing yet? Maybe that will help you decide. I've looked into dentistry and optometry and they're both wonderful professions.

 

[cpw]

yes, I just graduated and haven't been working in optometry very long... but even with the cons... this is the best job I've ever had ! I love it and can't see myself doing anything else.

 

[RLK]

Even with shadowing, you never really can tell all that much until you actually work in the field for a couple months. I was going to do some volunteer pharmacy work because that is my second choice after optometry. I ended up getting a part time job in retail pharmacy. It really took about 2 months for me to really be able to tell whether that was something I wanted to do or not. It doesn't seem as easy to get a job in optometry though like this. I wonder if you get the complaints in retail optometry like you do in retail pharmacy.

 

[stompy]

With any field dealing with the public, you'd get complaints. People in general just naturally like to complain, sometimes justified of course.

 

[sco1styear]

One thing my optometrist has made sure to point out to me is that this job is anything but routine. Many times he asked me "we don't just do refractions all day do we?" With the post surg, eye problems, etc that come in; I never knew what to expect.
Just this summer I got to see things from a firecracker burn (after the 4th of course), an alakine burn (one of the worst kinds!), and a pepper spray burn (don't ask). But one that surprised even the doctor and his assistant (who has worked with him for probably longer than I've been alive) was a patient that felt like she had something in her eye. The doctor could not see anything but flipped the upper lid and then held that up (double eversian) and looked under it while spraying it with saline...and out slid a rice hull that had actually sprouted!!! It was several inches long and would not have been found without the saline washing it down.
So, just some examples of how "unroutine" a day in the office of an optometrist can be. : )

 

[ucbsowarrior]

SOME QUESTIONS ANSWERED:

1.You CAN find a job relatively easily everywhere in the country except maybe certain areas in cali - HIGH CHANCE YOU GONNA GET PIMPED IN THE EARLY YEARS!
2. most make at least $75,000/$80,000 if not more (I'm in Boston) - YOU NEED ABOUT 150K TO LIVE WELL IN BOSTON, SO MARRY RICH
3. you can find part time work easily if the women out there want kids - ADVISE PPL TO START A PRACTICE PRIOR TO HAVING KIDS, OR ELSE YOU MIGHT REDUCE YOUR CHANCES OF HAVING YOUR OWN SOLO PRACTICE (GROUP-P STILL OK)
4. if you hate working for a chain, then you can at least attempt to go into business with other optometrists or at an opthamologist office - 'ATTEMPT' IS THE CORRECT WORD, I AGREE.
5. you are still respected when you tell people that you are an optometrist or eye doctor even if you feel silly working at a mall - RESPECT IS SOMETHING YOU GIVE YOURSELF, NOT WHAT OTHERS GIVE YOU.
6. not nearly as stressful as other 6 figure jobs - MOST NEW GRADS IN THE MAJOR CENTERS DON'T CRACK THE 6 FIGURE MARK.
7. work in comfortable indoor office - THOUSANDS OF JOBS SATISFY THIS CONDITION.
8. while may be routine, not nearly as routine as sitting in front of an Excel screen with no human interaction for 40 hours/week - INTERACTING WITH PATIENTS IS GREAT! DEPENDS ON YOUR MODE OF PRACTICE AND YOUR PRACTICE DEMOGRAPHICS AND GROWTH STAGE.

THE LONGER YOU WORK, THE MORE YOU'LL AGREE

 

[Abner Yokum]

Lately, this board seems to be bashing the profession:
I want to enter a field where I can make a good living, have job security, am not required to work the crazy hours of corporate America, can have a family and maybe take time off/work part time, and have human interaction

tell me if any of the following are unreasonable for most optometrist

1.You CAN find a job relatively easily everyone in the country except maybe certain areas in cali
2. most make at least $75,000/$80,000 if not more (I'm in Boston)
3. you can find part time work easily if the women out there want kids
4. if you hate working for a chain, then you can at least attempt to go into business with other optometrists or at an opthamologist office
5. you are still respected when you tell people that you are an optometrist or eye doctor even if you feel silly working at a mall
6. not nearly as stressful as other 6 figure jobs
7. work in comfortable indoor office
8. while may be routine, not nearly as routine as sitting in front of an Excel screen with no human interaction for 40 hours/week


It seems like everyone I know complains about the their jobs, starting with-
law being stressful, no barriers to entry into bad schools, bad hours for corporate firms, burned out
MDs complain about their salaries being cut in half
Financial field is extremely competitive and no job security, and may have to face decisions based on morality

So maybe every professional job as good and bad points?
Any opinions, good or bad, welcome. Am a senior deciding between optometry, dentistry, and podiatry.
Thanks

Kiss your weekends and a fair number of evenings goodbye for a few years or more (unless you land a job with an ophthalmologist -- they're still perceived as doctors rather than Costco eyeglass pushers, so they can work professional hours. My advice is to get into a trade -- high pay, job security, no debt, and high demand. Do you really want to be saddled with a colossal amount of debt to make what is a decent, but not exorbitant salary while you spin dials at Wal-Mart or spend what should be the best years of your life begging an amused bank loan officer to open the $$$ spigot so you can try to start your own practice?

 

[sco1styear]

Kiss your weekends and a fair number of evenings goodbye for a few years or more (unless you land a job with an ophthalmologist -- they're still perceived as doctors rather than Costco eyeglass pushers, so they can work professional hours. My advice is to get into a trade -- high pay, job security, no debt, and high demand. Do you really want to be saddled with a colossal amount of debt to make what is a decent, but not exorbitant salary while you spin dials at Wal-Mart or spend what should be the best years of your life begging an amused bank loan officer to open the $$$ spigot so you can try to start your own practice?

Some people are just born pessimistic...that's all this boils down to.

 

[q1we3]

RESURRECTION!!! This forum has been depressing for almost a decade.

 

[Shnurek]

People come online to bitch about their problems. Talk to some ODs in real life to give you a perspective.

 

[thecgrblue]

Holy bump, batman. I didn't look at the dates at first b/c I was convinced this was still a present discussion. These are the good types to PM and see where things stand now...if you can pull them out of the woodwork.

 

[Shnurek]

2. most make at least $75,000/$80,000 if not more (I'm in Boston) - YOU NEED ABOUT 150K TO LIVE WELL IN BOSTON, SO MARRY RICH

Dumbest thing I ever heard. My parents make $60,000 after taxes combined and we live well in NYC. We have a 3 bedroom apt., a one year old car, a parking garage spot for the car and we take vacations to Europe every year. Obviously, this is not possible if you want to live 1 block away from Times Square. Its all about finding loopholes/good deals, living under your means and not indebting yourself.

 

[q1we3]

Holy bump, batman. I didn't look at the dates at first b/c I was convinced this was still a present discussion. These are the good types to PM and see where things stand now...if you can pull them out of the woodwork.

Surprised to see you are still interested in daily happenings of optometry forums. Must feel good knowing that you are not one of us.

 

[mclem222]

I rarely complain about optometry but I think that the optometrists who do say stuff here aren't just "coming online to complain". I think the internet offers some anonymity to them to say "Hey I chose a field that kinda sucks". In person that is a lot harder to do when a doe eyed green student in front of you is asking you "Do you love what you do?" or "I have a dream which is what you are doing. Please tell me that my dream is everything I imagined". I think online it is easier to be honest for some people. My brother had an attending who was a cardiothoracic surgeon in med school . He used to encourage everyone to go into CT surgery and tell people "I am living the dream". Right before he retired at his retirement party during his speech he said something shocking when someone asked him if he would do it again. He said "No..I would not. This ruined my marriage, my children don't know me, I am constantly under severe stress and for what?" When a student said " I thought you love this?" he replied "I had to tell you that and myself that to keep myself going everyday for thirty years. what was I going to do. Go to law school all of a sudden?".

I think it is real hard face to face for an optometrist to tell a student the negative things of their profession just as it would be a hard for a judge, policeman, doctor, engineer etc.. They are going to pump it up to keep themselves going. There may be a few but overall I think it is difficult for more people.

I dont agree with the optometrists who say negative things 100% of the time or even 10% of the time but to get on here and say those people are just complaining is silly. Read the medical forums. I don't see any dermatologists complaining about their profession. Is it just they are a less negative bunch of people. Probably not. There is some validity to what they are saying probably. Of course when you talk about money, autonomy. respect in the community, etc.. there will be some subjectivness because those are all subjective concepts. To a middle eastern dicatator being an optometrist probably is their worst nightmare. To a sharecropper from the deep south, it is probably the dream of a lifetime. To ignore however what these people are saying as optometrists who do have the decency to come on here and BE HONEST is doing mostly you and partly them a big disservice.

 

[mclem222]

Where in NYC can you rent a 3 bedroom apartment for making 60K a year? Is this is manhattan? Do they rent or bought a place. If they bought a place how could they afford a 3 bedroom in NYC?
What is your parents savings?

I grew up right outside of NYC and went to HS and college in NYC and I find this very hard to believe unless you lived in washington heights or the boogie down bronx, queems etc... Considering rent is 2K for a small studio in manhattan not sure where you are living and if its possible I want to know where you can do this.

If you look online the "average" family income for someone in manhattan is100K. You parents probably make that before taxes but not sure how they afford a three bedrrom and all this stuff raising kids in the city

 

[thecgrblue]

Surprised to see you are still interested in daily happenings of optometry forums. Must feel good knowing that you are not one of us.

1) SDN is like crack.
2) I have an infant and skim most the forums in the wee-hours when mom needs to sleep.
3) Spent a long time as a pre-opt and am still willing to share what I learned and my perspective when others ask...and when they don't.
4) It feels good when you fully understand your passion and have family that encourages you to pursue it regardless of how inconvenient it is.
5) refer to 1

 

[CL Doc]

I rarely complain about optometry but I think that the optometrists who do say stuff here aren't just "coming online to complain". I think the internet offers some anonymity to them to say "Hey I chose a field that kinda sucks". In person that is a lot harder to do when a doe eyed green student in front of you is asking you "Do you love what you do?" or "I have a dream which is what you are doing. Please tell me that my dream is everything I imagined". I think online it is easier to be honest for some people. My brother had an attending who was a cardiothoracic surgeon in med school . He used to encourage everyone to go into CT surgery and tell people "I am living the dream". Right before he retired at his retirement party during his speech he said something shocking when someone asked him if he would do it again. He said "No..I would not. This ruined my marriage, my children don't know me, I am constantly under severe stress and for what?" When a student said " I thought you love this?" he replied "I had to tell you that and myself that to keep myself going everyday for thirty years. what was I going to do. Go to law school all of a sudden?".

I think it is real hard face to face for an optometrist to tell a student the negative things of their profession just as it would be a hard for a judge, policeman, doctor, engineer etc.. They are going to pump it up to keep themselves going. There may be a few but overall I think it is difficult for more people.

I dont agree with the optometrists who say negative things 100% of the time or even 10% of the time but to get on here and say those people are just complaining is silly. Read the medical forums. I don't see any dermatologists complaining about their profession. Is it just they are a less negative bunch of people. Probably not. There is some validity to what they are saying probably. Of course when you talk about money, autonomy. respect in the community, etc.. there will be some subjectivness because those are all subjective concepts. To a middle eastern dicatator being an optometrist probably is their worst nightmare. To a sharecropper from the deep south, it is probably the dream of a lifetime. To ignore however what these people are saying as optometrists who do have the decency to come on here and BE HONEST is doing mostly you and partly them a big disservice.

You make some excellent points. I am more likely to paint a positive picture in person, even if I don't believe it. I had a talk recently with a student interested in optometry and I told him I don't think it makes sense to spend $200,000 for an OD degree. He thanked me and said he was going to optometry school anyway. It seems that if you don't recommend the profession, everyone assumes you are unsuccessful.

I have made a good living in optometry, but I doubt most of today's students will enjoy the same level of financial return. Yes I am a doctor, but I'm also a business owner and understand the business (undergrad in business and 25 years of practice).

It irritates me when students think they know more about my profession than I do. You will not be able to copy my success, or the success of those ODs you idolize because you will be drowning in debt.

Would I do this again if I had to do things over? I'm not sure. Would I do it today if I had to borrow $200K? Absolutely not.

 

[Shnurek]

Where in NYC can you rent a 3 bedroom apartment for making 60K a year? Is this is manhattan? Do they rent or bought a place. If they bought a place how could they afford a 3 bedroom in NYC?
What is your parents savings?

I grew up right outside of NYC and went to HS and college in NYC and I find this very hard to believe unless you lived in washington heights or the boogie down bronx, queems etc... Considering rent is 2K for a small studio in manhattan not sure where you are living and if its possible I want to know where you can do this.

If you look online the "average" family income for someone in manhattan is100K. You parents probably make that before taxes but not sure how they afford a three bedrrom and all this stuff raising kids in the city

There are many loopholes to not pay rent or pay very low rent in NYC. Rent stabilized apartments, rent controlled apartments, being a superintendent for a building, getting a government "living expenses" subsidy, or others. I love socialism 🙂 I'm not going to tell you exactly where I live but yes it is not an affluent Manhattan residential area. It is about 45 minutes from SUNY. Sure, if you want to live within 15 minutes of SUNY you will spend $2000 on a studio. But if you go ~45 minutes from SUNY you can get a $1500 two bedroom apartment easily even with no loopholes.

I am actually planning to move upstate and further away from Manhattan next year (had enough) and just take the Metro North to school and avoid the nasty subway. The savings of living away from Manhattan more than pay for the increased transportation cost of the Metro North vs. the subway.

 

[The Doctor]

Sure, if you want to live within 15 minutes of SUNY you will spend $2000 on a studio. But if you go ~45 minutes from SUNY you can get a $1500 two bedroom apartment easily even with no loopholes.

Hearing things like this always makes me so thankful I'm a southerner, in med school in the South, and matched for residency in the South. I pay split rent with my one roommate for a three bedroom house with a large kitchen and living room and dining room and it's only 400 bucks a month (about 500 total once utilities are done). I wake up every day with a beautiful view over a pine forest. No way you could ever pay me to go up north to the big city....

 

[Shnurek]

Hearing things like this always makes me so thankful I'm a southerner, in med school in the South, and matched for residency in the South. I pay split rent with my one roommate for a three bedroom house with a large kitchen and living room and dining room and it's only 400 bucks a month (about 500 total once utilities are done). I wake up every day with a beautiful view over a pine forest. No way you could ever pay me to go up north to the big city....

Yup, I'd love to live somewhere else and I will as soon as I get my degree. Taxes, cost of living, quality of living and optometry laws here are terrible. The only thing you pay for is your ego. That you live in "New York City". It should be called "New Hood City". I only stayed because of the low tuition as compared to all other colleges of Optometry and my parents here are already established so I don't have to pay rent. During my year I could not apply to Oklahoma but I would have gone there. 33 months until externships! I am envious of your situation 🙂

 

[Visionary]

Hearing things like this always makes me so thankful I'm a southerner, in med school in the South, and matched for residency in the South. I pay split rent with my one roommate for a three bedroom house with a large kitchen and living room and dining room and it's only 400 bucks a month (about 500 total once utilities are done). I wake up every day with a beautiful view over a pine forest. No way you could ever pay me to go up north to the big city....

Amen, brother. Never understood the big city draw. Fine to visit, but can' t imagine living there. But, hey, different strokes...