Future of Pathology for Medical Students to Consider

[fecalith]

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This is, and has been, a fact as re need for F.P’s for decades. One of the main reasons I did an FP fellowship with the military at Baltimore ME office and AFIP was
job security. It has not changed.

Got to spend time at Baltimore ME while at University of Maryland. One of the best experiences !

 

[KeratinPearls]

Some have relocation benefits, good state retirement plans, good vacation time and even though majority of salaries are between 200-250K for straight out of fellowship, there are a couple of listings for 300K or more, maybe not as lucrative as other specialties overall but not too bad either!

Yeah good lifestyle....do autopsies in the morning and chill later in the day.

 

[EMH Mark V]

You can actually cold-call some offices that don't even have postings because so many are overloaded from the opioid crisis, and now covid. They'll try and create a position if they can.

 

[coroner]

This is what I'm talking about - approx. 30-40 jobs (as per NAME+AAFS) for 40 graduating fellows annually (as per ASCP surveys).
I do understand that it is still better then general surgpath, but isn't it a bit overambitious to call it "huge deficit"? Unless you have some other numbers from more or less reliable sources.

If you're interested in numbers, here's a thread I started a couple of years ago. The sources are the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal, if you consider "mainstream media" reliable (or at least more than the CAP) 😉.

https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/the-undisputed-most-in-demand-field-in-pathology.1187031/

 

[Hope2BDrG]

The answer is multifactorial. This was published late last year and regards a presentation from NAME in 2019.

Opinion | Dirty, Smelly, Raw: The Future of Forensic Pathology

How can we encourage young doctors to join the field?

www.medpagetoday.com

I’m a nurse taking prerequisites for med school because I want to be a Forensic Pathologist.

 

[deleted314957]

I’m a nurse taking prerequisites for med school because I want to be a Forensic Pathologist.

Get into medical school first. i am quite sure fp’s will be in demand 10 yrs from now. Pays not great. Also, remember that somethings very cold and very hot can change easily within 10 yrs. think psych and radonc.

 

[fecalith]

Get into medical school first. i am quite sure fp’s will be in demand 10 yrs from now. Pays not great. Also, remember that somethings very cold and very hot can change easily within 10 yrs. think psych and radonc.

Forensic Pathologist III Level: Up to $274,677.10 annually

Eligible for certification in Forensic Pathology by the American Board of Pathology.

OR

Forensic Pathologist IV Level: Up to $302,129.98 annually

Certification in Forensic Pathology by the American Board of Pathology.

Invites applications for

ASSISTANT MEDICAL EXAMINER-CORONER
$301,579 - $366,600 Annually, DOE

I wouldn't call this 'bad' pay.. And these are some recent examples. The average for an entry level position is still around 220-250K.

 

[deleted314957]

Forensic Pathologist III Level: Up to $274,677.10 annually

Eligible for certification in Forensic Pathology by the American Board of Pathology.

OR

Forensic Pathologist IV Level: Up to $302,129.98 annually

Certification in Forensic Pathology by the American Board of Pathology.

Invites applications for

ASSISTANT MEDICAL EXAMINER-CORONER
$301,579 - $366,600 Annually, DOE

I wouldn't call this 'bad' pay.. And these are some recent examples. The average for an entry level position is still around 220-250K.

That is nice to see. up substantially since i was around. because the government (of some type) always controls the money, free market supply and demand are hampered.

 

[Napoleon1801]

I'm currently sweating bullets regarding job prospects and salary. I'm a first year CP-only resident with a few different subspecialty interests. BB/Transfusion and Hemepath are at the top of the list right now. My goal is/was to start in academics and try to work my way into industry. I want to be involved with research, clinical trials, drug development and such. I knew coming in that academic salaries are lower than PP, but I just realized that most of the new hires at my program start off as assistant instructors.

If I go this route will I really be making 80 to 100k for a few years after fellowship?

CP blood bank is definitely a viable career path. Be prepared to move and keep your options open though.

 

[Iceman24]

If you're interested in numbers, here's a thread I started a couple of years ago. The sources are the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal, if you consider "mainstream media" reliable (or at least more than the CAP) 😉.

https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/the-undisputed-most-in-demand-field-in-pathology.1187031/

I have much more believe in this

Reevaluation of the US Pathologist Workforce Size

This analysis assesses the accuracy of current pathologist workforce estimates in the US by examining why divergency appears in different published resources.

jamanetwork.com

Can't believe that minting more than 40 FPs per year we still have 500 of them, doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

 

[deleted314957]

I have much more believe in this

Reevaluation of the US Pathologist Workforce Size

This analysis assesses the accuracy of current pathologist workforce estimates in the US by examining why divergency appears in different published resources.

jamanetwork.com

Can't believe that minting more than 40 FPs per year we still have 500 of them, doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

One reason is that many, many boarded FP’s are/were like me. Your have the contract as the district ME or associate ME and you also maintain a hospital practice, usually as a member of a group but i’ve known of several who have gone it alone. But, in my case, i left the forensic aspect after first 2 years with my group and then became solo med director at a community hospital (same group).
The point is, there were/are a whole boatload of folks trained in FP who don’t do it any longer because they move on to the “traditional” stuff.

 

[fecalith]

One reason is that many, many boarded FP’s are/were like me. Your have the contract as the district ME or associate ME and you also maintain a hospital practice, usually as a member of a group but i’ve known of several who have gone it alone. But, in my case, i left the forensic aspect after first 2 years with my group and then became solo med director at a community hospital (same group).
The point is, there were/are a whole boatload of folks trained in FP who don’t do it any longer because they move on to the “traditional” stuff.

This is true.
For example, one of the senior residents at my program is doing a forensics fellowship next year and the year after that is doing a woman's health one (breast+gyn). It appears that he thought he wanted to do forensics initially but then realized he enjoyed breast etc more. So in the end, he is going to be a boarded FP but I don't think he is going to be practicing FP in the future.

 

[LADoc00]

All of medicine is circling the drain. Picking specialties is like picking which turd you want to have for dinner.

Prepare for nursing to make as much as most physicians in the near term.

 

[fecalith]

All of medicine is circling the drain. Picking specialties is like picking which turd you want to have for dinner.

Prepare for nursing to make as much as most physicians in the near term.

Or just get an online BSN--> NP-->DNP and be golden!

 

[Spikebd]

All of medicine is circling the drain. Picking specialties is like picking which turd you want to have for dinner.

Prepare for nursing to make as much as most physicians in the near term.

How do you think pathology will fare under the new administration?

Health care seems to be a good place for employment going into the future, because a lot of other jobs are going away due to new tech, automation, de-industrialization etc. Also, the current trend in society is to place scientists in a lab coat on the same pedestal that medieval serfs once did for clergymen. Since pathology is by far the most lab coat-y, basic science-y field in clinical medicine, there has to be a way for pathologists to leverage these aspects into better jobs.

Sitting in offices with microscopes and WHO textbooks, are pathologists about to become the new priest class?

 

[Alteran]

How do you think pathology will fare under the new administration?

Health care seems to be a good place for employment going into the future, because a lot of other jobs are going away due to new tech, automation, de-industrialization etc. Also, the current trend in society is to place scientists in a lab coat on the same pedestal that medieval serfs once did for clergymen. Since pathology is by far the most lab coat-y, basic science-y field in clinical medicine, there has to be a way for pathologists to leverage these aspects into better jobs.

Sitting in offices with microscopes and WHO textbooks, are pathologists about to become the new priest class?

If pathologist’s knew how to leverage anything, we wouldn’t have the problems we do.

 

[Allegri]

I don't get the sense that scientists are placed on any kind of pedestal at the moment. Maybe by some segments of society, but there is also a large amount of suspicion out there, without a lot of respect, toward scientists and physicians.

 

[ScubaV]

I don't get the sense that scientists are placed on any kind of pedestal at the moment. Maybe by some segments of society, but there is also a large amount of suspicion out there, without a lot of respect, toward scientists and physicians.

Absolutely agreed. It's been going on way before covid and pertains to more than just science, but there's a rampant strain of anti-intellectualism in the US even amongst some of those who you would otherwise consider educated. Usually it's cast in the light of rebelling against "coastal elites", but it's really a mark of being successfully manipulated by those elites, coastal or otherwise.`

 

[Smoothbrain]

I haven't heard of any resident from my program being unable to secure a job although you might have to be geographically flexible.

 

[WEBB PINKERTON]

The CDC made a great decision allowing for vaccine mixing. No data to prove it is ok, but why not