Georgetown SMP vs. BU MAMS

[whatwedo]

I know there's been a couple of threads on this, but the most recent (2011) had only one relevant response, and the rest are from 2006.

Georgetown's and Boston's programs are supposedly recognized as SMPs 1 and 1a. How significant is the difference, and why does Georgetown have the edge? Is it just the fact that it's the original SMP? For schools outside of Georgetown and BU, does success in Georgetown's program hold more weight (and how significant)?

From what I've read on these forums, Georgetown's advising is supposedly worse, but they've already sent me a suggestion via email. Boston didn't do so, but their advisor seemed very caring and helpful when I visited.

It seems Georgetown offers more med school courses. I think 3 in the fall for GT and 2 for BU, but GT allows med school classes to be taken in the spring as well. Is the level of difficulty (med and graduate classes) about the same for each?

Finally, location matters. Boston and DC are both great cities, but there are undoubtedly more opportunities in Boston to do medical research, volunteer, etc. (unless you're going to work for the NIH or HHMI).

So, what do SDNers think?

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[giants25]

Im currently a second year BU MAMS student so I can only tell you what I know from here. The biggest and best thing about this program is the faculty. They are quite simply AMAZING. The MAMS faculty also teaches medical students, but the course directors are all full-time educators who are there all the time to help you out. In our physiology course for example, there is no office hours. This is because the professors believe they are paid to help you any time of the day so that you can do well in their course. I've walked in all hours of the day and emailed late at night and got a response within a few hours. And all the professors I've interacted with have been the same way.

The advising is also awesome. You have a group of 5-10 kids from your class, as well as the class before you and any MD or MD/PhD students at BU who came from MAMS. So you get the viewpoints of so many different students in different stages of their careers. 2-3 times a semester we would have group dinners just to talk with each other and get advice from older students and teachers. Other times we had guest speakers come from the medical center to talk about the MD, DO, and even PT pathways. My advisor was excellent and was constantly helping me, even when I was neurotic about the admissions process and emailing her at 2 in the morning. The atmosphere between students and teachers/advisors is so open and they can help you out with anything.

If you do have problems with classes, they offer tutoring services from past students to help out as well. I haven't use this myself but I have heard from others it really helps out.

BU definitely has more than 2 med school courses. In the fall you take Biochemistry/Cell biology, Physiology A, and I even took A histology course (or you can take pharmacology, or even Neuroscience, all med/grad courses). In the spring I took physio B, Pathology, Immunology, and Biostats. All the courses are BCPM and medical school admissions will look favorably upon them. The only class you take with med students is immunology, however the material in physiology course and biochemistry course are absolutely identical. Taking these courses definitely will give you an edge heading into medical school. The level of difficulty is very high for these classes however. Keep in mind that while medical students are on a H/P/F scale, we were trying to get all As. In immunology we could only get 5 questions wrong all semester to get an A while they could've gotten 65/100 and passed.

Boston is filled with opportunities. BMC is a safety net hospital for new england and you see a wide variety of cases volunteering here in their trauma center. Then Childrens, Brighams, MGH, and BIDC are nationally ranked as some of the best hospitals in the country perennially (oh theres Tufts Medical too). You also have dozens of institutesana Farber, Broad, etc as well as Harvard undergrad, MIT undergrad in cambridge, BU/Northeastern/BC in boston. Also the location is amazing, Boston is a great city to be a college/postcollege student and we still had time to go out and have a lot of fun at the hundreds of bars and pubs here. ( I personally think DC is much more expensive from when I used to live in that area).

And lastly, Both schools have excellent reputations. From students I know that went to Georgetown and from just reading through SDN, It seems like Georgetown helps most with getting into georgetown. BU only accepts 30-35 out of 180 from the MAMS program (140 apply, 85 interviews this year, 30-35 acceptances, though the good thing is your in a separate pool from the other 10K applicants. The past few years and including my class have had stellar applicants emerge. I know friends in my program that have gotten into Columbia, Duke, multiple at Case Western, UCLA, Emory, University of Virginia, Pitt, etc the last two classes. Maybe someone else can let you know a little more about Georgetowns program and their graduates. Also it might help that BU is ranked on US News as 31st in Research (rising from the 40-50 spots in 2008 till now), because we have tons of schools accept multiple students each year. From the list my our program coordinator showed me this is what I remember:

Wayne State
SUNY Downstate
EVMS
Tufts
BU
NYMC
Drexel
Temple
VCU
Creighton
Albany
SLU
Loyola
Rush
Rosalin Franklin
Tulane
Michigan State
PCOM
LECOM
NYCOM
UNECOM
Touro NY/NV
Western CA

I was accepted into both Georgetown and BUs programs my senior year. After visiting both schools I thought they were about equal in terms of the education offered. What sealed the deal for me was BU's amazing faculty. A year later and finishing secondaries as they come in, I can say I am very grateful I chose BU and I believe it will help me get into a top tier-middle school. If you have any other questions just shoot me a PM.

 

[whatwedo]

Thanks for the reply, giants25.

I'm leaning toward BU already because of the advising and general opportunities in Boston. I wasn't asking about grad classes, though.

My understanding is that fall semester is Biochemistry, Physio A, Histology and an elective. Is that right? Are the three listed all 1st year medical school courses or just biochemistry and Physiology?

In the spring it's Physio B, Pharmacology and/or Pathology, and Biostats or some other elective, right?

Is Pharmacology a grad course or med? What about Pathology?


Thanks for your help!

 

[giants25]

Fall is biochem physio and an elective. Students usually take either our histo class or pharmacology or a few take Neuroscience. Spring is physio B which includes endocrinology now, pathology, biostats, biomed info for your thesis, and one elective (research based science courses that are basically journal clubs, immuno, other courses as well).

Physio, biochem and immuno are medical school courses. Our histo class used to be a medical school course but they changed it slightly to help you transition to histo during medical school. It's pretty much a med course. I'd consider path and biostats a graduate level course. About pharmacology I'm not sure.

Either way all of these courses are looked favorably by admissions committees if you do well in them, at least for the med schools I contacted.

 

[giants25]

Oh and Pathology is an elective too, but at least 65% of our class took it this last year, if not more.

 

[whatwedo]

Thanks for the info.

 

[michyy]

Thanks for the reply, giants25.

I'm leaning toward BU already because of the advising and general opportunities in Boston. I wasn't asking about grad classes, though.

My understanding is that fall semester is Biochemistry, Physio A, Histology and an elective. Is that right? Are the three listed all 1st year medical school courses or just biochemistry and Physiology?

In the spring it's Physio B, Pharmacology and/or Pathology, and Biostats or some other elective, right?


I'm a first year MAMS right now. They basically enroll you in biochem, physio A, and histology. These 3 core classes are enough for you to be busy all the time (at least that's what the faculty tell us). They advise us to focus on these three classes and worry about everything else after this quarter. If you choose not to take histology, then they allow you to take electives + few classes that help you obtain a masters with a concentration in mental health or something else (sorry I'm drawing a blank as i've been studying for hours on end and this is my break..)

The physio class is the exact class that the med students take, just a different lecture time and spread out through the span of 9 months, whereas med students will finish it in 3.5 months.

i'm still learning the hoops so maybe i can help out more later

 

[MDforMee]

In my opinion, what I'd want to know before deciding to attend one SMP instead of the other would be this:

Which school can I get better grades in?

All other things being equal, I suspect that ultimately admission to medical school will be based on your performance in the classes.

Therefore, grades would be the deciding factor in choosing Georgetown or BU.

I have a friend that went to Georgetown, that's now a physician, tell me in fewer words that he didn't really like it there. Mostly, because it was DC, but also because of what he described as a lack of student resources (advising, what have you). But, he also said that the prestige of the program carries a lot of weight; and, he did get into a California medical school (UC Davis). He had a subpar GPA from UC Davis as an undergrad (<3.3) in physiological science, and got a 35 on the MCAT. He had a year of peace corps, and assorted premedical activities. He's a very smart guy, but didn't do as well in his undergrad classes as he could have (sports, things like that).

This same friend is writing me a recommendation, as well. To further muddle your discussion, here, he said that I should go to Tufts.

 

[Intellex]

Which school has a more impressive match list?

 

[NJD519]

I turned down Georgetown SMP and did not bother with BU. If you are interested why, feel free to PM me. Maybe I can give you a different perspective.

 

[JSReed]

Are you talking about residency matches, or med school matriculation? For residency, I don't think anyone keeps track of that. For med school, I think georgetown probably has a better list, but take that with a grain of salt. Their class gpa is about .25 to .3 higher than BU, and their mcat is probably around 4 points higher (estimating on the mcat). So because GT has a class with higher stats, they'll get in better places-- in comparing to well-established programs, where you get will depend more on your resume than the slight deviations in the programs. Also, keep in mind that the people who end up at any of the top 20 med schools or the UCs generally have a high mcat (36+), a 4.0 in a program with med school courses, and a year or more of service-related stuff (anything from peace corps to army, but we're talking about long-term deployment to a foreign location). So while you can compare who got people into the better schools, you better already have that 38 in hand before you start talking.

Honestly, I think it comes down to this: Georgetown is geared towards applying while you're in the program-- this means you need to have your mcat, LORs, research, volunteering, shadowing, and whatever else at a level that would usually get you into med school, plus a GPA that wouldn't get you into med school but would be able to get you an interview by itself (this is because there is a high probability that you will get most/all of your interview invites before you finish your first semester). BU is different from GT in that they don't want you to apply immediately (they won't stop you, but they make it clear that its a lot to handle). With BU, having that extra year allows you to do well in your classes first year, do research second year if you need it (research is always helpful with low gpa), and do whatever else you need in your summer and free time (volunteer, mcat, travel, whatever). So in the case that you dont' have all your ducks lined up going into the summer (and MOST people don't), you should go with BU. Not to mention cheaper cost of living.

 

[Doc E Brown]

I turned down Georgetown SMP and did not bother with BU. If you are interested why, feel free to PM me. Maybe I can give you a different perspective.

Why don't you just let everyone know your perspective?

Georgetown match lists: http://som.georgetown.edu/prospectivestudents/degrees/faq/match/70796.html

 

[twistedjengki]

Thanks for the information.

 

[MDforMee]

Why don't you just let everyone know your perspective?

Georgetown match lists: http://som.georgetown.edu/prospectivestudents/degrees/faq/match/70796.html

I'm a little confused.

That's the Georgetown School of Medicine residency match lists.

???

 

[NJD519]

Why don't you just let everyone know your perspective?

Georgetown match lists: http://som.georgetown.edu/prospectivestudents/degrees/faq/match/70796.html

Why are you quoting the Georgetown SOM match list when we are talking about SMPs?

 

[JSReed]

Why are you quoting the Georgetown SOM match list when we are talking about SMPs?

Because apparently this guy wants a match list. Anyhow, that list pertains to the entire SOM, not just to the SMP. Most of the SMP kids don't even end up at GT.

 

[MDforMee]

Because apparently this guy wants a match list. Anyhow, that list pertains to the entire SOM, not just to the SMP. Most of the SMP kids don't even end up at GT.

I think he confused the term "matching" with "matriculation," or something to that effect.