God, I feel silly....

[Buckeye(OH)]

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So, I am a fourth year. ERAS is open, sweet. There is a SLIGHT problem. I have NO idea what I want to do. I was all up on ortho and neuro for a while because I wanted to do spine. Then I spent a month in the ICU and decided I would go for general and attempt a trauma fellowship. Then my gf threw a hissy fit because I said I would probably be leaving Chicago, and she, of course doesn't want to.

That leads me to the following. I have just decided, as of 34 seconds ago, that I should probably look into a TY/Traditional (Im 0.78 DO) and kind of sort things out. I am looking for 1. advice 2. opinions and 3. experiences from people that have done this.

The nice thing about a TY/T is that it doesnt start the clock on my medicare funding which would be quite detrimental. How does an intern applying for first year spots look? Is that what I would be doing? Why would they take me? What if they don't take me.

GOD, so many what ifs😕


Thanks
A


EDIT: This is in the surgery forum because I am set on that, just not what kind.

 

[Buckeye(OH)]

Wait, so your plan is:

1) Apply for a TY internship

2) Take the year to figure out what specialty you want and grow a pair of testicles so you can stand up to your whiny girlfriend

3) Then in 2009, reapply to a categorical internship in the specialty you've decided you want to do, limited of course to the Chicago area because the chick you're dating doesn't like to experience new things

🙄

Yeah, pretty much. I am trying to make everyone happy at once, since my parents love this city too.

Probably not gonna work out for everyone.

My original plan was Osteopathic Ortho/Neuro + Allopathic General.

That was part of my question, I didn't really want to do two intern years, but truth be told, I don't know what I want to do. Im not even sure a year as a TY would help...

 

[Winged Scapula]

While Tired's comments are blunt, frankly he's right.

Chicago is a big city with lots of residency programs but there is no guarantee that you will match there this year or next. Thus, I see the TY as a waste of time when you already know what you want to do.

On the average, graduated physicians do worse in the match than do 4th year medical students. The reasons for this are myriad but in general, doing a non-surgical year doesn't really buff your application for a surgery residency. TYs are also pretty competitive as well so your plan may entail leaving Chicago anyway.

There are very few applicants who can pick and choose and "suicide" into one town for residency, fellowship and beyond. The GF, your family, etc. need to know that while you too would like to stay in Chicago, you want the best program for yourself and your future and that may entail leaving town.

Please explain to them the process of matching and that you may not match into a local program even if you only interview at those types. Finally, if you do end up going into Trauma, the best trauma fellowships are *not* in Chicago, although one may assume that post-training jobs might be available.

I don't see any advantage to the TY. You already know what you want to do and staying in Chicago for a year, doing something that isn't your heart's desire to appease your GF and family doesn't make professional sense. It may be the right decision for you personally, for your relationships but do not kid yourself that you will benefit professionally.

 

[Buckeye(OH)]

Reapplying to Ortho/Neuro/General after a transitional year is what crappy IMGs do when they don't have the numbers to get in the first time around. And they usually fail. Don't be one of those guys.

And in case it wasn't blazingly clear, yes, you will likely have to redo an internship to go from transitional to any of the surgery fields you mentioned. While it is still technically possible to from General to Neuro/Ortho or vice versa, it relies on doing a "Resi-tern" year, which in turn relies on a very understanding program that really really wants you. My understanding is that there is simply not enough overlap between TY and the Surgery/Subspecialty internships to make that transition without redoing the year.

So your plan is ******ed, I'll stop harping.


But that being said, let me offer another (this time unsolicited) opinion.

Presumably if you're seriously considering Ortho/Neuro/General, you're a pretty good student with pretty good numbers. But academics is only part of the equation in the surgical fields, the other half is cojones. Right now, listening to this story, you sound like a *****, which is the opposite of cojones.

You're letting a woman who supposedly loves you prevent you from advancing yourself and doing what you love. You're letting your parents, who supposedly have your best interests at heart, do the same.

The sad thing is that, if you would just man-up and say, "This is what I have to do to become the person I want to be" they would likely complain a little, then deal with it and later be glad that they did. But right now, for whatever reason, you lack the sack to do what you need to do. You need to change that. The character traits you are demonstrating right now aren't all that compatible with the fields you are interested in.

I wish you luck.

Interestingly, this is behind the scenes advice/venting. She knows damn well that I LIKELY wont be here and has mentioned, there's a good chance we won't make it if I move. I said, fine, that's life...doesn't mean I wouldn't want to stay if I could. I have 3 months of ortho aways that I just dropped on her the other night. Its not like I cancelled them.


Thanks for your internet character assessment.

 

[LovelyRita]

1. I can't believe you're a 4th year already.

2. Unless you are married to the person, you shouldn't be involved with ANYBODY when you are a 4th year med student. Like, don't even talk to your friends or family. They're just going to throw a monkey wrench in the gears. Too much uncertainty and variability and you really do not need that stress.

3. Forget all this surgery crap. Quit med school now and become a CRNA. 😉

(Sorry I just had that epiphany-experience where I realized that I work really hard and all my counterparts in ER and IM etc are living cush lives and I fret because it's a long residency only to face diminishing reimbursements and the sense that someday there's not going to be much left for the general surgeon to do. It's what many warned me about when I was in your shoes, but I ignored them. But I press on.)

and STFU.

 

[Buckeye(OH)]

😀

Good luck on your aways. I enjoyed mine immensely, and I'm sure you will as well.

Duh, they are in Columbus, during football season. Heaven? I think so. Plus all my college buddies are there.

 

[roja]

So your plan is ******ed, I'll stop harping.


But that being said, let me offer another (this time unsolicited) opinion.

Presumably if you're seriously considering Ortho/Neuro/General, you're a pretty good student with pretty good numbers. But academics is only part of the equation in the surgical fields, the other half is cojones. Right now, listening to this story, you sound like a *****, which is the opposite of cojones.

You're letting a woman who supposedly loves you prevent you from advancing yourself and doing what you love. You're letting your parents, who supposedly have your best interests at heart, do the same.

The sad thing is that, if you would just man-up and say, This is what I have to do to become the person I want to be" they would likely complain a little, then deal with it and later be glad that they did. But right now, for whatever reason, you lack the sack to do what you need to do. You need to change that. The character traits you are demonstrating right now aren't all that compatible with the fields you are interested in.

Tired may be overtly blunt but he is giving you exceptional advice. If you get past the personal aspect of it, what he is telling you is true.

Surgery, and ANY of its subspecialties, are going to be EXCEPTIONALLY difficult on any and all of your relationships. The only way to cope with the long hours, patient demands, pimping attendings bent on 'building your character' by demeaning you and making you feel stupid, annoying consults, lack of sleep, and no social life is to know that at the end of this incredibly difficult road, you will finally be doing something that you truly love.

First, you need to take a deep breath, remove yourself from all the bs that is surrounding your life and figure out what you want to do in the broad areas that you are looking at: nuerosurgery, GS and ortho. they are all phenomenally different fields in terms of the procedures you do and the types of patients. they all have difficult lifestyles so that kind of washes. Then you need to just decide. Imagine tossing a three sided coin. What side are you hoping it will land on most?

Once you figure this out, you need to figure out if you have what it takes (including the love of what you are doing) to do it.

I loved vascular and trauma. But I *knew* I didn't love it enough for the road it would take to traverse to get there. Not even close. The things I loved about those fields were outweighed by the things I loathed. So, I discovered something else I love.

If you decide to go the surgery route, Tired is right. Location is only one of the many many many things you will be sacrificing in your life over the next 5-10 years.

Best of luck

 

[Buckeye(OH)]

So, what is it you found that you loved?

 

[Winged Scapula]

So, what is it you found that you loved?

roja is an EM attending.

 

[DrDre311]

So, what is it you found that you loved?

Roja loves to ogle plastic surgeons while they're leaning over at crazy angles to fix drunk people's faces.

It's one of the reasons I went into plastics...I find that hovering over some hammered kid's huge facial lac with no way to support my body is a great way to show off my ass.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Roja loves to ogle plastic surgeons while they're leaning over at crazy angles to fix drunk people's faces.

It's one of the reasons I went into plastics...I find that hovering over some hammered kid's huge facial lac with no way to support my body is a great way to show off my ass.

You're too pretty boy for her. Better keep that behind in shape so she has something to ogle. 😉

 

[Winged Scapula]

Stop cavorting with the enemy.

You got it wrong. He's working for us!

While distracting her with his cute bum, she can't call any consults!😉

 

[Buckeye(OH)]

Roja loves to ogle plastic surgeons while they're leaning over at crazy angles to fix drunk people's faces.

It's one of the reasons I went into plastics...I find that hovering over some hammered kid's huge facial lac with no way to support my body is a great way to show off my ass.

Wanna hear something funny? Well, not really. I got jumped by two gang bangers and received an unbroken Corona bottle (which proceeded to break) resulting in a facial laceration through my entire face from my left lip to about my wisdom teeth, 3 days before xmas, and one week before I was to be someones best man.

That was real sweet getting on the plane 12 hours after discharge.

Missed the facial nerve, and my eye, thank God.

 

[McLovin]

One thing you may want to consider in your plan is what happens to your medicare funding if you start out as a transitional intern only.

Maybe Winged Scapula or one of the other mods could weigh in on the topic ie would it be an issue)

 

[Buckeye(OH)]

One thing you may want to consider in your plan is what happens to your medicare funding if you start out as a transitional intern only.

Maybe Winged Scapula or one of the other mods could weigh in on the topic ie would it be an issue)

TY's dont start the clock on Medicare funding👍

 

[Winged Scapula]

TY's dont start the clock on Medicare funding👍

This is true.

Your funding is defined by your categorical match. If you matched into a program that is 1 year TY + 3 years categorical training, your funding is set at 4 years.

If you match into a TY only (ie, without an advanced match), your funding clock doesn't start until you match into your categorical track.

 

[Kubed]

... Then my gf threw a hissy fit because I said I would probably be leaving Chicago, and she, of course doesn't want to. ...

Man that's rough. I can relate because while I still call my SO a "girlfriend," we've been together just shy of 10 years. If she threw an absolute fit about me wanting to go someplace, that too would weigh pretty heavy on my mind when making decisions. I don't envy the position she's putting you in.

While I wouldn't encourage it, you might look at doing a TY at one of the smaller hospitals that has GS, neuro, and ortho in house. It would give you the chance to spend time on all the services and get to know the people. However it's still prob best to bite the bullet and match into something categorical this year.

 

[roja]

Roja loves to ogle plastic surgeons while they're leaning over at crazy angles to fix drunk people's faces.

It's one of the reasons I went into plastics...I find that hovering over some hammered kid's huge facial lac with no way to support my body is a great way to show off my ass.

You're too pretty boy for her. Better keep that behind in shape so she has something to ogle. 😉

You got it wrong. He's working for us!

While distracting her with his cute bum, she can't call any consults!😉

Damn the two of you giving my secrets away!

Of course this is why I went into EM... to call consults all day and oogle them while they do all the work. I just sit back with my head set, call, and watch all the hotties come cavorting through the ED. 😀

Now I have to kill the both of youl

 

[VoiceofReason]

Tired's post had me rolling, even though it probably wasn't meant to be funny. I picture him as looking like schwarzenegger after that. Say "you lack the sack." with an austrian accent.

I don't know it just cracked me up.

 

[PeepshowJohnny]

This is why I always worry about the people who, when they apply to medical school, HAVE to stay in California, or New York, or Chicago etc. because "My whole life is there." It's just going to be harder to leave for residency for a lot of these people.
​

 

[Winged Scapula]

I can assure you, I look nothing like Arnold.

TTIUWP!!!

Maybe you look more like this?

 

[Buckeye(OH)]

This is why I always worry about the people who, when they apply to medical school, HAVE to stay in California, or New York, or Chicago etc. because "My whole life is there." It's just going to be harder to leave for residency for a lot of these people.
​

Applying to medical school and going someone for a five year residency at a later point in your life are two totally different ball games. At least you are worried though, right?

 

[Lamborghini1315]

So, I am a fourth year. ERAS is open, sweet. There is a SLIGHT problem. I have NO idea what I want to do. I was all up on ortho and neuro for a while because I wanted to do spine. Then I spent a month in the ICU and decided I would go for general and attempt a trauma fellowship. Then my gf threw a hissy fit because I said I would probably be leaving Chicago, and she, of course doesn't want to.

That leads me to the following. I have just decided, as of 34 seconds ago, that I should probably look into a TY/Traditional (Im 0.78 DO) and kind of sort things out. I am looking for 1. advice 2. opinions and 3. experiences from people that have done this.

The nice thing about a TY/T is that it doesnt start the clock on my medicare funding which would be quite detrimental. How does an intern applying for first year spots look? Is that what I would be doing? Why would they take me? What if they don't take me.

GOD, so many what ifs😕


Thanks
A


EDIT: This is in the surgery forum because I am set on that, just not what kind.

I go to med school in TN and trust me coming from NY it wasn't easy for me to get the point across to my gf or my family. I put up with a lot of resistance over how a school near home would benefit me...the bottom line i disagreed. I ts hard to be rational when you are arguing with someone you really love, here's the deal just realize that whatever sacrifices you make now will benefit you in the long run. I paid a costly price with my sacrifices but i am damn sure that i will be better off than most who took the most feasible option for their well wishers than themselves. Like tired, i too agree that any surgical field demands less emotions and more work ethic..i want to be a surgeon and i acknowledge the consequences of such a career. Clear up your head, take time to reflect about what you really see yourself doing the next 50 years and last but not the least anyone who truly loves you will not give up on ya because you moved to mars. They will wait for you to return...corny i know!